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Reply #60 posted 11/04/21 6:48pm

Free2BMe

SantanaMaitreya said:

Free2BMe said:



😂😂 Are you on drugs? In Darling Niki, Prince is calling her a sex fiend and says she’s masturbating with a magazine, etc. In other words he is shitting on this woman. He is being misogynistic. In Dirty Diana, Michael is describing a groupie who wants to have sex with him. She does everything to seduce him and finally Michael relents by calling his girlfriend/wife and tells her to “unlock the door” and leave it open because he will be late coming home. In the background you hear Diana say ..”because he’s sleeping with me”. I don’t find those lyrics misogynistic. Maybe YOU are just looking for ANYTHING to criticize or find fault. I do know that I find the song and video for Dirty Diana, sexy as hell. The live performance for the BAD tour was even sexier. Btw, I also like Prince’s performance of Darling Niki from the Purple Rain movie.

Stop trying to tear down Michael, in order to elevate Prince. It makes you seem immature and insecure. 😎
[Edited 11/4/21 14:20pm]

Both songs are about a femme fatale who seduces the man. In Prince's case, she simply asks if he wants to grind and he does and becomes obsessed with her. In Jackson's case she is more agressive and he runs away from her. Whatever that says about the two men, I don't know, but I think there's nothing wrong with comparing two songs with a more or less similar theme.


You are correct about both songs being about femme fatales. However, I have to correct you on Michael’s Dirty Diana. He TRIES to resist her at first, and then his desires and her persistence pays off, and he sleeps with her. I the song, he calls his wife /girlfriend and tells her he forgot the key, so leave the door unlocked. In the song, Diana is heard saying” cause he’s sleeping with me”.

You are also correct that there is nothing wrong with comparing songs with similar themes. However, That poster called Michael’s song misogynistic and said he “shitted on women.” I say that person didn’t know what he/she was saying. Darling Niki was actually misogynistic because Prince was embarrassing Appolonia in the movie by basically calling her a whore because she went with Morris Day. There was nothing misogynistic about Dirty Diana.
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Reply #61 posted 11/05/21 1:05am

JorisE73

Free2BMe said:

RODSERLING said:
That's not BS and you know it. By the way, MJ didn't die in a car accident. He died because he was an addict to painkiller. He did the same during the TII rehearsals he did after each show of the History Tour. He was on drug every night. He could have died many times during that era. From what I collected over the years, two nights were particularly dangerous for MJ because of his painkillers abuse. The night he learned from his accusations in 1993 during the Dangerous Tour during the Toaster introduction. And the night after Lady Diana died, he took more drugs than usual amd it was almost lethal to him. Of course there were many others signs, ssuch as the aborted HBO show, the MSG shows, etc. It was completely predictable from am objective point of view, from which you seem lacking to this day concerning MJ. MJ himself told in 2003 in his own documentary that if he would have to tour again, he would assuredly die. But surely, MJ was a moron, an asshole, etc. Saying that of himself.
Damn, I thought you were one of the few in this forum that relied on facts.


lol lol This guy only speculates.

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Reply #62 posted 11/05/21 1:08am

Vannormal

-

Michael Vs Prince = an old dead cow since 1985, that makes 36 years of gossipy bullshit.

A thread like this has 1089 views.

Says a lot about most Prince fans here.

The need for more gossip and wouldbe stories...

biggrin

-

S U P P O R T --- U K R A I N E --- N O W --- 4 --- MORE PEACE !!!
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves. And wiser people so full of doubts" (Bertrand Russsell 1872-1972)
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Reply #63 posted 11/05/21 1:22am

TrivialPursuit

avatar

Vannormal said:

-

Michael Vs Prince = an old dead cow since 1985, that makes 36 years of gossipy bullshit.

A thread like this has 1089 views.

Says a lot about most Prince fans here.

The need for more gossip and wouldbe stories...

biggrin

-


You didn't read the first post. I get it. But next time - maybe read it through first? kthxbai

"eye don’t really care so much what people say about me because it is a reflection of who they r."
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Reply #64 posted 11/05/21 4:40am

Vannormal

TrivialPursuit said:

Vannormal said:

-

Michael Vs Prince = an old dead cow since 1985, that makes 36 years of gossipy bullshit.

A thread like this has 1089 views.

Says a lot about most Prince fans here.

The need for more gossip and wouldbe stories...

biggrin

-


You didn't read the first post. I get it. But next time - maybe read it through first? kthxbai

-

Oh I read it.

-

S U P P O R T --- U K R A I N E --- N O W --- 4 --- MORE PEACE !!!
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves. And wiser people so full of doubts" (Bertrand Russsell 1872-1972)
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Reply #65 posted 11/05/21 4:43am

WhisperingDand
elions

avatar

TrivialPursuit said:

Vannormal said:

-

Michael Vs Prince = an old dead cow since 1985, that makes 36 years of gossipy bullshit.

A thread like this has 1089 views.

Says a lot about most Prince fans here.

The need for more gossip and wouldbe stories...

biggrin

-


You didn't read the first post. I get it. But next time - maybe read it through first? kthxbai

The people dictate the thread, not OP...



And you seem net privy enough to know it's all about the title these daysc'mon.

[Edited 11/5/21 4:45am]

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Reply #66 posted 11/05/21 7:17am

Vannormal

TrivialPursuit said:

Vannormal said:

-

Michael Vs Prince = an old dead cow since 1985, that makes 36 years of gossipy bullshit.

A thread like this has 1089 views.

Says a lot about most Prince fans here.

The need for more gossip and wouldbe stories...

biggrin

-


You didn't read the first post. I get it. But next time - maybe read it through first? kthxbai

-

Here, a more proper answer. smile

Prince and Michael Jackson only had this in comon,

both musicians (but then again completely different ones), eighties popular popstars, black,

were both unearthly weird (in their own way), and that's about it.

For the rest they were pure competition,

partly created by the media, themselves, and by the fans.

They did nothing together - had nothing in comon.

Nothing! Not even musically.

Prince made rock and funk (with a slight lyrical sauce of incest, masturbation and loads of all kinds of sex), and prince lost his street credibility by becomin a (rock)star.

Michael couldn't play any instrument, sang about love and longed for street credibility in nearly every video he made - never had it.

You said;

''Both were trying to stay current and try new things, I believe.''

I personally think Prince didn't stay 'current'; ''The Rainbow Children was so off the charts and all.. He did not made this album for neither radio nor charts.

It was by then his own translation of convinced believes (imho).

Michael on the contrary did with his ''Invincible'' what Prince tried with ''Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic''.
Their competition was everything but friendly though - mind Prince's blurry comments in general (at the time) about Michael.

And I'm aboslutely not convinced that "they appreciated each other as people, as Black men, and as an artist", like you say. I truely don't believe that. Certainly not from Prince's side. He was a mean (in the positive sense of the word) competitive musician.

They couldn't do anyting else than staying in each's own lane.

Prince could never be Michael Jackson, vice versa.

And I believe neither of them tried to be the other.

At least that's my humble opinion. wink

And as usual, i could be completley wrong, as i don't know any of them personally.

-

S U P P O R T --- U K R A I N E --- N O W --- 4 --- MORE PEACE !!!
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves. And wiser people so full of doubts" (Bertrand Russsell 1872-1972)
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Reply #67 posted 11/05/21 8:43am

SantanaMaitrey
a

I wouldn't go so far as to say that the two men had nothing in common musically, they both made funky pop music (or poppy funk) and shared the same influences like Stevie Wonder and James Brown, with a bit more Jimi Hendrix and Santana in Prince's case.
If you take any of this seriously, you're a bigger fool than I am.
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Reply #68 posted 11/05/21 10:04am

ThatWhiteDude

avatar

Free2BMe said:

ThatWhiteDude said:

I'm talking overall theme. But MJ tended to shit on women and their sexual desires, while Prince embraced them more often and fancied that even. In darling nikki, prince is longing for nikki while MJ tried to make the misogynistic lyrics "sexy". Dirty diana is cringe inducing for that very reason to me. And you cannot tell me that MJ wasn't inspired by Prince's style as well. The only thing Prince didn't wear was a shirt.

😂😂 Are you on drugs? In Darling Niki, Prince is calling her a sex fiend and says she’s masturbating with a magazine, etc. In other words he is shitting on this woman. He is being misogynistic. In Dirty Diana, Michael is describing a groupie who wants to have sex with him. She does everything to seduce him and finally Michael relents by calling his girlfriend/wife and tells her to “unlock the door” and leave it open because he will be late coming home. In the background you hear Diana say ..”because he’s sleeping with me”. I don’t find those lyrics misogynistic. Maybe YOU are just looking for ANYTHING to criticize or find fault. I do know that I find the song and video for Dirty Diana, sexy as hell. The live performance for the BAD tour was even sexier. Btw, I also like Prince’s performance of Darling Niki from the Purple Rain movie. Stop trying to tear down Michael, in order to elevate Prince. It makes you seem immature and insecure. 😎 [Edited 11/4/21 14:20pm]

First of all, while prince does have some misogynistic songs, darling nikki isn't one of them. Calling someone a sex fiend and explaining how they masturbate isn't sexist and he clearly got the hots for her. He's begging her to come back cause he wanna grind.

And then you should stop claiming that everyone is trying to tear MJ down by simply critizing him for some shit he clearly did. He was a misogynist, wether you like that or not. He cleary had a problem with women who displayed their sexuality and that was a flaw of his. He was a human being with flaws and highlighting them while they fit the topic doesn't equal tearing him down. I didn't sit here and claimed shit about him that I can't prove.

"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."

Poppys, Shanon319, Number23, Kares. #lifttheban
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Reply #69 posted 11/05/21 10:36am

Free2BMe

ThatWhiteDude said:



Free2BMe said:


ThatWhiteDude said:


I'm talking overall theme. But MJ tended to shit on women and their sexual desires, while Prince embraced them more often and fancied that even. In darling nikki, prince is longing for nikki while MJ tried to make the misogynistic lyrics "sexy". Dirty diana is cringe inducing for that very reason to me. And you cannot tell me that MJ wasn't inspired by Prince's style as well. The only thing Prince didn't wear was a shirt.



😂😂 Are you on drugs? In Darling Niki, Prince is calling her a sex fiend and says she’s masturbating with a magazine, etc. In other words he is shitting on this woman. He is being misogynistic. In Dirty Diana, Michael is describing a groupie who wants to have sex with him. She does everything to seduce him and finally Michael relents by calling his girlfriend/wife and tells her to “unlock the door” and leave it open because he will be late coming home. In the background you hear Diana say ..”because he’s sleeping with me”. I don’t find those lyrics misogynistic. Maybe YOU are just looking for ANYTHING to criticize or find fault. I do know that I find the song and video for Dirty Diana, sexy as hell. The live performance for the BAD tour was even sexier. Btw, I also like Prince’s performance of Darling Niki from the Purple Rain movie. Stop trying to tear down Michael, in order to elevate Prince. It makes you seem immature and insecure. 😎 [Edited 11/4/21 14:20pm]

First of all, while prince does have some misogynistic songs, darling nikki isn't one of them. Calling someone a sex fiend and explaining how they masturbate isn't sexist and he clearly got the hots for her. He's begging her to come back cause he wanna grind.

And then you should stop claiming that everyone is trying to tear MJ down by simply critizing him for some shit he clearly did. He was a misogynist, wether you like that or not. He cleary had a problem with women who displayed their sexuality and that was a flaw of his. He was a human being with flaws and highlighting them while they fit the topic doesn't equal tearing him down. I didn't sit here and claimed shit about him that I can't prove.



I don’t consider Dirty Diana misogynistic; however, I noticed you didn’t address what that poster said. I wonder why? You people always have a problem when someone defends Michael, AS IF we are SUPPOSED to sit back and ALLOW you to spew BULLSHIT. Not going to happen. If I or any other MJ fan don’t agree with what you are spewing, we are going to call you out on it. Get used to it, you people would do the same if someone said something about a Prince and you didn’t agree with it, whether it was on this forum or ANY OTHER FORUM. FTR, you people are NOT entitled to say what you want about Michael. Most of you are biased as @#$&. So you better get used to MJ fans either rebuking your biased rhetoric silently or speaking out as I do. I don’t suffer fools lightly. You should know that by now.😎
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Reply #70 posted 11/05/21 10:51am

EmmaMcG

Free2BMe said:

ThatWhiteDude said:



Free2BMe said:


ThatWhiteDude said:


I'm talking overall theme. But MJ tended to shit on women and their sexual desires, while Prince embraced them more often and fancied that even. In darling nikki, prince is longing for nikki while MJ tried to make the misogynistic lyrics "sexy". Dirty diana is cringe inducing for that very reason to me. And you cannot tell me that MJ wasn't inspired by Prince's style as well. The only thing Prince didn't wear was a shirt.



😂😂 Are you on drugs? In Darling Niki, Prince is calling her a sex fiend and says she’s masturbating with a magazine, etc. In other words he is shitting on this woman. He is being misogynistic. In Dirty Diana, Michael is describing a groupie who wants to have sex with him. She does everything to seduce him and finally Michael relents by calling his girlfriend/wife and tells her to “unlock the door” and leave it open because he will be late coming home. In the background you hear Diana say ..”because he’s sleeping with me”. I don’t find those lyrics misogynistic. Maybe YOU are just looking for ANYTHING to criticize or find fault. I do know that I find the song and video for Dirty Diana, sexy as hell. The live performance for the BAD tour was even sexier. Btw, I also like Prince’s performance of Darling Niki from the Purple Rain movie. Stop trying to tear down Michael, in order to elevate Prince. It makes you seem immature and insecure. 😎 [Edited 11/4/21 14:20pm]

First of all, while prince does have some misogynistic songs, darling nikki isn't one of them. Calling someone a sex fiend and explaining how they masturbate isn't sexist and he clearly got the hots for her. He's begging her to come back cause he wanna grind.

And then you should stop claiming that everyone is trying to tear MJ down by simply critizing him for some shit he clearly did. He was a misogynist, wether you like that or not. He cleary had a problem with women who displayed their sexuality and that was a flaw of his. He was a human being with flaws and highlighting them while they fit the topic doesn't equal tearing him down. I didn't sit here and claimed shit about him that I can't prove.



I don’t consider Dirty Diana misogynistic; however, I noticed you didn’t address what that poster said. I wonder why? You people always have a problem when someone defends Michael, AS IF we are SUPPOSED to sit back and ALLOW you to spew BULLSHIT. Not going to happen. If I or any other MJ fan don’t agree with what you are spewing, we are going to call you out on it. Get used to it, you people would do the same if someone said something about a Prince and you didn’t agree with it, whether it was on this forum or ANY OTHER FORUM. FTR, you people are NOT entitled to say what you want about Michael. Most of you are biased as @#$&. So you better get used to MJ fans either rebuking your biased rhetoric silently or speaking out as I do. I don’t suffer fools lightly. You should know that by now.😎


"If I, or any other MJ fan..."

Please don't lump in all other MJ fans with you. I don't agree with ThatWhiteDude's assessment of Michael Jackson as a misogynist but I also know that he's a good guy who wouldn't just put MJ down to elevate Prince. There's obviously a reason for him to have come to the conclusion that MJ was a misogynist so rather than attacking him like you have done, I'd rather have a conversation with him so that we both may learn something we didn't previously know. It's called being an adult. You should try it.
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Reply #71 posted 11/05/21 10:56am

EmmaMcG

ThatWhiteDude said:



Free2BMe said:


ThatWhiteDude said:


I'm talking overall theme. But MJ tended to shit on women and their sexual desires, while Prince embraced them more often and fancied that even. In darling nikki, prince is longing for nikki while MJ tried to make the misogynistic lyrics "sexy". Dirty diana is cringe inducing for that very reason to me. And you cannot tell me that MJ wasn't inspired by Prince's style as well. The only thing Prince didn't wear was a shirt.



😂😂 Are you on drugs? In Darling Niki, Prince is calling her a sex fiend and says she’s masturbating with a magazine, etc. In other words he is shitting on this woman. He is being misogynistic. In Dirty Diana, Michael is describing a groupie who wants to have sex with him. She does everything to seduce him and finally Michael relents by calling his girlfriend/wife and tells her to “unlock the door” and leave it open because he will be late coming home. In the background you hear Diana say ..”because he’s sleeping with me”. I don’t find those lyrics misogynistic. Maybe YOU are just looking for ANYTHING to criticize or find fault. I do know that I find the song and video for Dirty Diana, sexy as hell. The live performance for the BAD tour was even sexier. Btw, I also like Prince’s performance of Darling Niki from the Purple Rain movie. Stop trying to tear down Michael, in order to elevate Prince. It makes you seem immature and insecure. 😎 [Edited 11/4/21 14:20pm]

First of all, while prince does have some misogynistic songs, darling nikki isn't one of them. Calling someone a sex fiend and explaining how they masturbate isn't sexist and he clearly got the hots for her. He's begging her to come back cause he wanna grind.

And then you should stop claiming that everyone is trying to tear MJ down by simply critizing him for some shit he clearly did. He was a misogynist, wether you like that or not. He cleary had a problem with women who displayed their sexuality and that was a flaw of his. He was a human being with flaws and highlighting them while they fit the topic doesn't equal tearing him down. I didn't sit here and claimed shit about him that I can't prove.




What makes you say that MJ was a misogynist? Is it just the lyrics to Dirty Diana or were there other things? I've always had the impression that MJ was probably the exact opposite of a misogynist. But, to be honest, I'm judging him purely by his music. His personal life doesn't interest me in the slightest so if he's ever expressed any misogynist leanings, I've never heard it. I don't even see Dirty Diana as being especially misogynist though. I mean, he's talking about this one woman, not all women.


Having said all that, one of my favourite songs, and music videos, is Motley Crue's Girls Girls Girls. Now THAT is misogynist! lol
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Reply #72 posted 11/05/21 11:48am

Free2BMe

EmmaMcG said:

Free2BMe said:



I don’t consider Dirty Diana misogynistic; however, I noticed you didn’t address what that poster said. I wonder why? You people always have a problem when someone defends Michael, AS IF we are SUPPOSED to sit back and ALLOW you to spew BULLSHIT. Not going to happen. If I or any other MJ fan don’t agree with what you are spewing, we are going to call you out on it. Get used to it, you people would do the same if someone said something about a Prince and you didn’t agree with it, whether it was on this forum or ANY OTHER FORUM. FTR, you people are NOT entitled to say what you want about Michael. Most of you are biased as @#$&. So you better get used to MJ fans either rebuking your biased rhetoric silently or speaking out as I do. I don’t suffer fools lightly. You should know that by now.😎


"If I, or any other MJ fan..."

Please don't lump in all other MJ fans with you. I don't agree with ThatWhiteDude's assessment of Michael Jackson as a misogynist but I also know that he's a good guy who wouldn't just put MJ down to elevate Prince. There's obviously a reason for him to have come to the conclusion that MJ was a misogynist so rather than attacking him like you have done, I'd rather have a conversation with him so that we both may learn something we didn't previously know. It's called being an adult. You should try it.


You are correct, SOME MJ fans are more docile than others, therefore, you wouldn’t fit into the group that I was speaking of. Btw, your idea of being an adult and agreeing with the person that I disagreed with is just that, YOUR idea. It’s like a kid trying to tell a parent what to do just because you’re 13 years old and in the 7th grade. Sweetie, please stay in YOUR lane.When you have experienced what I have in life, career, etc., then MAYBE you can TRY to tell an ADULT what to do.

Seriously, you have a LONG way to go in life before you try to tell another person how to respond to a statement or someone that you feel is a “good guy”. I consider you basically a kid trying to act “grownup”. I’m not mad at you, it’s just laughable that you( a 20+ year old) would TRY to advise another person on how to be an “adult” or how to respond to a person in YOUR way. That’s what you need to do with YOUR kids. You can’t dictate what another adult does to try and mold them like you. Let me tell you a secret, “ It doesn’t work that way.”😃 Good luck, Sweetie, you will need it in life. As the little girl told her father, “worry about yourself.”😃
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Reply #73 posted 11/05/21 12:34pm

EmmaMcG

Free2BMe said:

EmmaMcG said:



"If I, or any other MJ fan..."

Please don't lump in all other MJ fans with you. I don't agree with ThatWhiteDude's assessment of Michael Jackson as a misogynist but I also know that he's a good guy who wouldn't just put MJ down to elevate Prince. There's obviously a reason for him to have come to the conclusion that MJ was a misogynist so rather than attacking him like you have done, I'd rather have a conversation with him so that we both may learn something we didn't previously know. It's called being an adult. You should try it.


You are correct, SOME MJ fans are more docile than others, therefore, you wouldn’t fit into the group that I was speaking of. Btw, your idea of being an adult and agreeing with the person that I disagreed with is just that, YOUR idea. It’s like a kid trying to tell a parent what to do just because you’re 13 years old and in the 7th grade. Sweetie, please stay in YOUR lane.When you have experienced what I have in life, career, etc., then MAYBE you can TRY to tell an ADULT what to do.

Seriously, you have a LONG way to go in life before you try to tell another person how to respond to a statement or someone that you feel is a “good guy”. I consider you basically a kid trying to act “grownup”. I’m not mad at you, it’s just laughable that you( a 20+ year old) would TRY to advise another person on how to be an “adult” or how to respond to a person in YOUR way. That’s what you need to do with YOUR kids. You can’t dictate what another adult does to try and mold them like you. Let me tell you a secret, “ It doesn’t work that way.”😃 Good luck, Sweetie, you will need it in life. As the little girl told her father, “worry about yourself.”😃


I'm 31 years old and have already reached a point in my life and career where I've earned enough to retire on and live very comfortably for the rest of my life. But if whatever you've experienced in your life and career has led you to become what you are now, then I'm glad I never experienced it wink
But I'm glad you're not mad at me though. I don't think I'd be able to sleep tonight if I thought you were mad at me. What a relief!

But you're right about one thing. It's pointless to attempt to advise people like you how to treat others. But you're wrong about something else. I never agreed with WhiteDude about MJ. I just don't verbally attack people who dislike my favourite pop stars.
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Reply #74 posted 11/05/21 12:48pm

RODSERLING

Some people here clearly need a psychiatric treatment. I didn't think there were still people like that, so many years after his death.
That didn't miss me.
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Reply #75 posted 11/05/21 12:58pm

Free2BMe

EmmaMcG said:

Free2BMe said:



You are correct, SOME MJ fans are more docile than others, therefore, you wouldn’t fit into the group that I was speaking of. Btw, your idea of being an adult and agreeing with the person that I disagreed with is just that, YOUR idea. It’s like a kid trying to tell a parent what to do just because you’re 13 years old and in the 7th grade. Sweetie, please stay in YOUR lane.When you have experienced what I have in life, career, etc., then MAYBE you can TRY to tell an ADULT what to do.

Seriously, you have a LONG way to go in life before you try to tell another person how to respond to a statement or someone that you feel is a “good guy”. I consider you basically a kid trying to act “grownup”. I’m not mad at you, it’s just laughable that you( a 20+ year old) would TRY to advise another person on how to be an “adult” or how to respond to a person in YOUR way. That’s what you need to do with YOUR kids. You can’t dictate what another adult does to try and mold them like you. Let me tell you a secret, “ It doesn’t work that way.”😃 Good luck, Sweetie, you will need it in life. As the little girl told her father, “worry about yourself.”😃


I'm 31 years old and have already reached a point in my life and career where I've earned enough to retire on and live very comfortably for the rest of my life. But if whatever you've experienced in your life and career has led you to become what you are now, then I'm glad I never experienced it wink
But I'm glad you're not mad at me though. I don't think I'd be able to sleep tonight if I thought you were mad at me. What a relief!

But you're right about one thing. It's pointless to attempt to advise people like you how to treat others. But you're wrong about something else. I never agreed with WhiteDude about MJ. I just don't verbally attack people who dislike my favourite pop stars.


I’m glad that you’ve already reached a point in your life and career where you’ve earned enough to retire and live very comfortably for the rest of your life. At least that’s One thing that we have in common. I have also reached a point in my life where I’ve earned enough to live comfortably for the rest of my life. Thank God, I’m not surrounded by people who TRY to tell another person how they should respond or act. People like that are annoying, condescending and HYPOCRITICAL.Those kind of people ALWAYS conveniently twist and manipulate things to fit THEIR rhetoric. Btw, I was being sarcastic when I said “I’m not mad at you.” It wouldn’t matter to me, if you were or weren’t. We are not friends or associates. You are some unknown person on the internet that I will never meet in real life. Therefore, you really do need to stop taking yourself too seriously.😏
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Reply #76 posted 11/05/21 1:25pm

Vannormal

-

Uhm, wait !!!

I'll grab a bucket of popcorn and a couple of beers first.

..rush rush, bam!...

Now please go on

biggrin

-

S U P P O R T --- U K R A I N E --- N O W --- 4 --- MORE PEACE !!!
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves. And wiser people so full of doubts" (Bertrand Russsell 1872-1972)
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Reply #77 posted 11/05/21 1:36pm

TrivialPursuit

avatar

For fuck's sake. I give up.

"eye don’t really care so much what people say about me because it is a reflection of who they r."
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Reply #78 posted 11/05/21 1:43pm

Vannormal

TrivialPursuit said:

For fuck's sake. I give up.

-

Have a beer too. wink

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S U P P O R T --- U K R A I N E --- N O W --- 4 --- MORE PEACE !!!
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves. And wiser people so full of doubts" (Bertrand Russsell 1872-1972)
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Reply #79 posted 11/05/21 2:06pm

SantanaMaitrey
a

drink beer popcorn pc
If you take any of this seriously, you're a bigger fool than I am.
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Reply #80 posted 11/05/21 2:08pm

EmmaMcG

Free2BMe said:

EmmaMcG said:



I'm 31 years old and have already reached a point in my life and career where I've earned enough to retire on and live very comfortably for the rest of my life. But if whatever you've experienced in your life and career has led you to become what you are now, then I'm glad I never experienced it wink
But I'm glad you're not mad at me though. I don't think I'd be able to sleep tonight if I thought you were mad at me. What a relief!

But you're right about one thing. It's pointless to attempt to advise people like you how to treat others. But you're wrong about something else. I never agreed with WhiteDude about MJ. I just don't verbally attack people who dislike my favourite pop stars.


I’m glad that you’ve already reached a point in your life and career where you’ve earned enough to retire and live very comfortably for the rest of your life. At least that’s One thing that we have in common. I have also reached a point in my life where I’ve earned enough to live comfortably for the rest of my life. Thank God, I’m not surrounded by people who TRY to tell another person how they should respond or act. People like that are annoying, condescending and HYPOCRITICAL.Those kind of people ALWAYS conveniently twist and manipulate things to fit THEIR rhetoric. Btw, I was being sarcastic when I said “I’m not mad at you.” It wouldn’t matter to me, if you were or weren’t. We are not friends or associates. You are some unknown person on the internet that I will never meet in real life. Therefore, you really do need to stop taking yourself too seriously.😏


lol
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Reply #81 posted 11/05/21 2:54pm

ThatWhiteDude

avatar

EmmaMcG said:

ThatWhiteDude said:

First of all, while prince does have some misogynistic songs, darling nikki isn't one of them. Calling someone a sex fiend and explaining how they masturbate isn't sexist and he clearly got the hots for her. He's begging her to come back cause he wanna grind.

And then you should stop claiming that everyone is trying to tear MJ down by simply critizing him for some shit he clearly did. He was a misogynist, wether you like that or not. He cleary had a problem with women who displayed their sexuality and that was a flaw of his. He was a human being with flaws and highlighting them while they fit the topic doesn't equal tearing him down. I didn't sit here and claimed shit about him that I can't prove.

What makes you say that MJ was a misogynist? Is it just the lyrics to Dirty Diana or were there other things? I've always had the impression that MJ was probably the exact opposite of a misogynist. But, to be honest, I'm judging him purely by his music. His personal life doesn't interest me in the slightest so if he's ever expressed any misogynist leanings, I've never heard it. I don't even see Dirty Diana as being especially misogynist though. I mean, he's talking about this one woman, not all women. Having said all that, one of my favourite songs, and music videos, is Motley Crue's Girls Girls Girls. Now THAT is misogynist! lol

He expressed some on the shmuley tapes if I remember correctly and give in to me is another song with an atleast sexist undertone. I still listen to his music, but it oftem seemed like he had a problem with women who expressed their sexuality confidently, like madonna. here's a quote from the tapes:It is hard because the women today can do a good job of faking it. I mean a real good job. They are so smooth. Look in the Bible. Women have taken the most powerful men down to nothing because of what is between their legs.

But I also can see how others might see it differently. I just never liked that he generalized a whole gender. I mean if the woman didn't wanna claim that he's her baby daddy then the woman was just chasing him for sex. That was the overall theme in his songs about women.

[Edited 11/5/21 14:57pm]

"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."

Poppys, Shanon319, Number23, Kares. #lifttheban
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Reply #82 posted 11/05/21 3:02pm

Free2BMe

EmmaMcG said:

Free2BMe said:



I’m glad that you’ve already reached a point in your life and career where you’ve earned enough to retire and live very comfortably for the rest of your life. At least that’s One thing that we have in common. I have also reached a point in my life where I’ve earned enough to live comfortably for the rest of my life. Thank God, I’m not surrounded by people who TRY to tell another person how they should respond or act. People like that are annoying, condescending and HYPOCRITICAL.Those kind of people ALWAYS conveniently twist and manipulate things to fit THEIR rhetoric. Btw, I was being sarcastic when I said “I’m not mad at you.” It wouldn’t matter to me, if you were or weren’t. We are not friends or associates. You are some unknown person on the internet that I will never meet in real life. Therefore, you really do need to stop taking yourself too seriously.😏


lol

😇
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Reply #83 posted 11/05/21 4:16pm

EmmaMcG

ThatWhiteDude said:



EmmaMcG said:


ThatWhiteDude said:


First of all, while prince does have some misogynistic songs, darling nikki isn't one of them. Calling someone a sex fiend and explaining how they masturbate isn't sexist and he clearly got the hots for her. He's begging her to come back cause he wanna grind.

And then you should stop claiming that everyone is trying to tear MJ down by simply critizing him for some shit he clearly did. He was a misogynist, wether you like that or not. He cleary had a problem with women who displayed their sexuality and that was a flaw of his. He was a human being with flaws and highlighting them while they fit the topic doesn't equal tearing him down. I didn't sit here and claimed shit about him that I can't prove.



What makes you say that MJ was a misogynist? Is it just the lyrics to Dirty Diana or were there other things? I've always had the impression that MJ was probably the exact opposite of a misogynist. But, to be honest, I'm judging him purely by his music. His personal life doesn't interest me in the slightest so if he's ever expressed any misogynist leanings, I've never heard it. I don't even see Dirty Diana as being especially misogynist though. I mean, he's talking about this one woman, not all women. Having said all that, one of my favourite songs, and music videos, is Motley Crue's Girls Girls Girls. Now THAT is misogynist! lol

He expressed some on the shmuley tapes if I remember correctly and give in to me is another song with an atleast sexist undertone. I still listen to his music, but it oftem seemed like he had a problem with women who expressed their sexuality confidently, like madonna. here's a quote from the tapes:It is hard because the women today can do a good job of faking it. I mean a real good job. They are so smooth. Look in the Bible. Women have taken the most powerful men down to nothing because of what is between their legs.




But I also can see how others might see it differently. I just never liked that he generalized a whole gender. I mean if the woman didn't wanna claim that he's her baby daddy then the woman was just chasing him for sex. That was the overall theme in his songs about women.


[Edited 11/5/21 14:57pm]



Yeah that's a good point. I'd guess that would come across as being misogynistic. Personally, I see it more a case of him being an older man from a religious background. A lot of men from his generation and background tend to have, let's say, "outdated" ways of looking at the world. Especially for someone like Michael Jackson who always came across as a bit... inexperienced with regards to the opposite sex. I never took his more questionable lyrics that seriously and was certainly never offended by them. But I love all those old hair metal bands so maybe I'm kind of numb to misogynistic viewpoints in music lol
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Reply #84 posted 11/06/21 10:22am

SantanaMaitrey
a

To answer the question, I don't know all that much about Michael Jackson, but I don't think there is a lot in Prince's music that was written in response to something Jackson did, except for a few jokes in a few songs. (So called King gives birth to do called Prince.) Bad came out in 1987 when Prince had just finished Sign O' the Times and then the whole Black Album/Lovesexy thing happened. Nothing Jacksonian about that. Prince was too busy with his own artistic journey to worry about that Jackson did.
If you take any of this seriously, you're a bigger fool than I am.
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Reply #85 posted 11/06/21 12:49pm

Free2BMe

ThatWhiteDude said:



EmmaMcG said:


ThatWhiteDude said:


First of all, while prince does have some misogynistic songs, darling nikki isn't one of them. Calling someone a sex fiend and explaining how they masturbate isn't sexist and he clearly got the hots for her. He's begging her to come back cause he wanna grind.

And then you should stop claiming that everyone is trying to tear MJ down by simply critizing him for some shit he clearly did. He was a misogynist, wether you like that or not. He cleary had a problem with women who displayed their sexuality and that was a flaw of his. He was a human being with flaws and highlighting them while they fit the topic doesn't equal tearing him down. I didn't sit here and claimed shit about him that I can't prove.



What makes you say that MJ was a misogynist? Is it just the lyrics to Dirty Diana or were there other things? I've always had the impression that MJ was probably the exact opposite of a misogynist. But, to be honest, I'm judging him purely by his music. His personal life doesn't interest me in the slightest so if he's ever expressed any misogynist leanings, I've never heard it. I don't even see Dirty Diana as being especially misogynist though. I mean, he's talking about this one woman, not all women. Having said all that, one of my favourite songs, and music videos, is Motley Crue's Girls Girls Girls. Now THAT is misogynist! lol

He expressed some on the shmuley tapes if I remember correctly and give in to me is another song with an atleast sexist undertone. I still listen to his music, but it oftem seemed like he had a problem with women who expressed their sexuality confidently, like madonna. here's a quote from the tapes:It is hard because the women today can do a good job of faking it. I mean a real good job. They are so smooth. Look in the Bible. Women have taken the most powerful men down to nothing because of what is between their legs.




But I also can see how others might see it differently. I just never liked that he generalized a whole gender. I mean if the woman didn't wanna claim that he's her baby daddy then the woman was just chasing him for sex. That was the overall theme in his songs about women.


[Edited 11/5/21 14:57pm]



Let me correct you: Michael did NOT generalize a WHOLE GENDER. Where the hell did that mess come from? So are you saying that Prince generalized a whole gender just because he made Darlin Niki? Michael didn’t generalize a whole gender with Diana any more than Prince did with Darling Niki, and you people wonder why MJ fans respond to your BS. Please tell me HOW Dirty Diana or even Billie Jean generalized a WHOLE GENDER. Btw, don’t make up crap, because that’s what you people usually do when you don’t have anything to back your rhetoric up.

So are you saying Liberian Girl, In The Closet. Pretty Young Thing, Butterflies, Break of Dawn,
She’s Out Of My Life, etc. also GENERALIZED a WHOLE GENDER? Ftr, I know Michael didn’t write every song that I listed, however, those were HIS songs on HIS album.

If you are going to claim that MJ generalized a WHOLE GENDER, then you need to come up with something other than YOUR feelings or opinion and explain why you claim MJs songs generalized a WHOLE GENDER and not Prince’s songs.You can’t naive enough
come up with this kind of rhetoric and not expect to be challenged.😎
[Edited 11/6/21 12:50pm]
[Edited 11/6/21 13:10pm]
[Edited 11/6/21 13:12pm]
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Reply #86 posted 11/06/21 1:05pm

Free2BMe

SantanaMaitreya said:

To answer the question, I don't know all that much about Michael Jackson, but I don't think there is a lot in Prince's music that was written in response to something Jackson did, except for a few jokes in a few songs. (So called King gives birth to do called Prince.) Bad came out in 1987 when Prince had just finished Sign O' the Times and then the whole Black Album/Lovesexy thing happened. Nothing Jacksonian about that. Prince was too busy with his own artistic journey to worry about that Jackson did.


Let me say that BOTH artists were too busy with their own lives and artistic journeys to be worried about the other. It’s usually Prince fans that come up with this shit. I have NEVER heard any friend, family member, associate etc. say that Prince was trying to copy Michael or vice versus. Let me clarify that WE didn’t sit around and obsess over what Prince was releasing and were never “threatened” or insecure about him. We(the people I am associated with in person and on social media) never tried to tear Prince down in order to build Michael up.Of course, the majority of Prince fans did it THEN and STILL do it to this day. It’s pathetic AND immature.
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Reply #87 posted 11/06/21 1:54pm

ThatWhiteDude

avatar

EmmaMcG said:

ThatWhiteDude said:



EmmaMcG said:


ThatWhiteDude said:


First of all, while prince does have some misogynistic songs, darling nikki isn't one of them. Calling someone a sex fiend and explaining how they masturbate isn't sexist and he clearly got the hots for her. He's begging her to come back cause he wanna grind.

And then you should stop claiming that everyone is trying to tear MJ down by simply critizing him for some shit he clearly did. He was a misogynist, wether you like that or not. He cleary had a problem with women who displayed their sexuality and that was a flaw of his. He was a human being with flaws and highlighting them while they fit the topic doesn't equal tearing him down. I didn't sit here and claimed shit about him that I can't prove.



What makes you say that MJ was a misogynist? Is it just the lyrics to Dirty Diana or were there other things? I've always had the impression that MJ was probably the exact opposite of a misogynist. But, to be honest, I'm judging him purely by his music. His personal life doesn't interest me in the slightest so if he's ever expressed any misogynist leanings, I've never heard it. I don't even see Dirty Diana as being especially misogynist though. I mean, he's talking about this one woman, not all women. Having said all that, one of my favourite songs, and music videos, is Motley Crue's Girls Girls Girls. Now THAT is misogynist! lol

He expressed some on the shmuley tapes if I remember correctly and give in to me is another song with an atleast sexist undertone. I still listen to his music, but it oftem seemed like he had a problem with women who expressed their sexuality confidently, like madonna. here's a quote from the tapes:It is hard because the women today can do a good job of faking it. I mean a real good job. They are so smooth. Look in the Bible. Women have taken the most powerful men down to nothing because of what is between their legs.




But I also can see how others might see it differently. I just never liked that he generalized a whole gender. I mean if the woman didn't wanna claim that he's her baby daddy then the woman was just chasing him for sex. That was the overall theme in his songs about women.


[Edited 11/5/21 14:57pm]



Yeah that's a good point. I'd guess that would come across as being misogynistic. Personally, I see it more a case of him being an older man from a religious background. A lot of men from his generation and background tend to have, let's say, "outdated" ways of looking at the world. Especially for someone like Michael Jackson who always came across as a bit... inexperienced with regards to the opposite sex. I never took his more questionable lyrics that seriously and was certainly never offended by them. But I love all those old hair metal bands so maybe I'm kind of numb to misogynistic viewpoints in music lol

I mean yeah, there's certainly worse stuff out there. The hair metal you've mentioned. A whole bunch of rap songs.
"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."

Poppys, Shanon319, Number23, Kares. #lifttheban
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Reply #88 posted 11/06/21 1:56pm

EmmaMcG

Free2BMe said:

ThatWhiteDude said:



EmmaMcG said:


ThatWhiteDude said:


First of all, while prince does have some misogynistic songs, darling nikki isn't one of them. Calling someone a sex fiend and explaining how they masturbate isn't sexist and he clearly got the hots for her. He's begging her to come back cause he wanna grind.

And then you should stop claiming that everyone is trying to tear MJ down by simply critizing him for some shit he clearly did. He was a misogynist, wether you like that or not. He cleary had a problem with women who displayed their sexuality and that was a flaw of his. He was a human being with flaws and highlighting them while they fit the topic doesn't equal tearing him down. I didn't sit here and claimed shit about him that I can't prove.



What makes you say that MJ was a misogynist? Is it just the lyrics to Dirty Diana or were there other things? I've always had the impression that MJ was probably the exact opposite of a misogynist. But, to be honest, I'm judging him purely by his music. His personal life doesn't interest me in the slightest so if he's ever expressed any misogynist leanings, I've never heard it. I don't even see Dirty Diana as being especially misogynist though. I mean, he's talking about this one woman, not all women. Having said all that, one of my favourite songs, and music videos, is Motley Crue's Girls Girls Girls. Now THAT is misogynist! lol

He expressed some on the shmuley tapes if I remember correctly and give in to me is another song with an atleast sexist undertone. I still listen to his music, but it oftem seemed like he had a problem with women who expressed their sexuality confidently, like madonna. here's a quote from the tapes:It is hard because the women today can do a good job of faking it. I mean a real good job. They are so smooth. Look in the Bible. Women have taken the most powerful men down to nothing because of what is between their legs.




But I also can see how others might see it differently. I just never liked that he generalized a whole gender. I mean if the woman didn't wanna claim that he's her baby daddy then the woman was just chasing him for sex. That was the overall theme in his songs about women.


[Edited 11/5/21 14:57pm]



Let me correct you: Michael did NOT generalize a WHOLE GENDER. Where the hell did that mess come from? So are you saying that Prince generalized a whole gender just because he made Darlin Niki? Michael didn’t generalize a whole gender with Diana any more than Prince did with Darling Niki, and you people wonder why MJ fans respond to your BS. Please tell me HOW Dirty Diana or even Billie Jean generalized a WHOLE GENDER. Btw, don’t make up crap, because that’s what you people usually do when you don’t have anything to back your rhetoric up.

So are you saying Liberian Girl, In The Closet. Pretty Young Thing, Butterflies, Break of Dawn,
She’s Out Of My Life, etc. also GENERALIZED a WHOLE GENDER? Ftr, I know Michael didn’t write every song that I listed, however, those were HIS songs on HIS album.

If you are going to claim that MJ generalized a WHOLE GENDER, then you need to come up with something other than YOUR feelings or opinion and explain why you claim MJs songs generalized a WHOLE GENDER and not Prince’s songs.You can’t naive enough
come up with this kind of rhetoric and not expect to be challenged.😎
[Edited 11/6/21 12:50pm]
[Edited 11/6/21 13:10pm]
[Edited 11/6/21 13:12pm]


I don't think you read his post properly. He never said that MJ generalized a whole gender with the song "Dirty Diana". He was referring to the quote "It is hard because the women today can do a good job of faking it. I mean a real good job. They are so smooth. Look in the Bible. Women have taken the most powerful men down to nothing because of what is between their legs".

I can see where ThatWhiteDude's coming from but as I said in my reply to him, I don't agree with that assessment. I don't think MJ was a misogynist or a sexist. At least, no more so than most other middle aged men who come from a religious background. Perhaps it's a generational thing? What would seem to be a fairly innocent way of looking at the world for older people may not fly for younger people nowadays? I guess I'm kind of in between, age-wise, so I can see both points of view?
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Reply #89 posted 11/06/21 2:00pm

ThatWhiteDude

avatar

Free2BMe said:

ThatWhiteDude said:



EmmaMcG said:


ThatWhiteDude said:


First of all, while prince does have some misogynistic songs, darling nikki isn't one of them. Calling someone a sex fiend and explaining how they masturbate isn't sexist and he clearly got the hots for her. He's begging her to come back cause he wanna grind.

And then you should stop claiming that everyone is trying to tear MJ down by simply critizing him for some shit he clearly did. He was a misogynist, wether you like that or not. He cleary had a problem with women who displayed their sexuality and that was a flaw of his. He was a human being with flaws and highlighting them while they fit the topic doesn't equal tearing him down. I didn't sit here and claimed shit about him that I can't prove.



What makes you say that MJ was a misogynist? Is it just the lyrics to Dirty Diana or were there other things? I've always had the impression that MJ was probably the exact opposite of a misogynist. But, to be honest, I'm judging him purely by his music. His personal life doesn't interest me in the slightest so if he's ever expressed any misogynist leanings, I've never heard it. I don't even see Dirty Diana as being especially misogynist though. I mean, he's talking about this one woman, not all women. Having said all that, one of my favourite songs, and music videos, is Motley Crue's Girls Girls Girls. Now THAT is misogynist! lol

He expressed some on the shmuley tapes if I remember correctly and give in to me is another song with an atleast sexist undertone. I still listen to his music, but it oftem seemed like he had a problem with women who expressed their sexuality confidently, like madonna. here's a quote from the tapes:It is hard because the women today can do a good job of faking it. I mean a real good job. They are so smooth. Look in the Bible. Women have taken the most powerful men down to nothing because of what is between their legs.




But I also can see how others might see it differently. I just never liked that he generalized a whole gender. I mean if the woman didn't wanna claim that he's her baby daddy then the woman was just chasing him for sex. That was the overall theme in his songs about women.


[Edited 11/5/21 14:57pm]



Let me correct you: Michael did NOT generalize a WHOLE GENDER. Where the hell did that mess come from? So are you saying that Prince generalized a whole gender just because he made Darlin Niki? Michael didn’t generalize a whole gender with Diana any more than Prince did with Darling Niki, and you people wonder why MJ fans respond to your BS. Please tell me HOW Dirty Diana or even Billie Jean generalized a WHOLE GENDER. Btw, don’t make up crap, because that’s what you people usually do when you don’t have anything to back your rhetoric up.

So are you saying Liberian Girl, In The Closet. Pretty Young Thing, Butterflies, Break of Dawn,
She’s Out Of My Life, etc. also GENERALIZED a WHOLE GENDER? Ftr, I know Michael didn’t write every song that I listed, however, those were HIS songs on HIS album.

If you are going to claim that MJ generalized a WHOLE GENDER, then you need to come up with something other than YOUR feelings or opinion and explain why you claim MJs songs generalized a WHOLE GENDER and not Prince’s songs.You can’t naive enough
come up with this kind of rhetoric and not expect to be challenged.😎
[Edited 11/6/21 12:50pm]
[Edited 11/6/21 13:10pm]
[Edited 11/6/21 13:12pm]

How old are ya? You react like a hot headed teenager lol did you even read the whole post? Listen to the shmuley tapes and tell me how it isn't a generalization of a whole gender when he says that women bring men down just because of the thing between their legs.

It's funny though. I still listen to MJ's music but stans like you are the main reason why I'm not engaging with that base anymore.

Like I said. Prince did have some very questionable lyrics as well and I'll gladly call his ass out on it and most other prince fans wouldn't give a shit. Hell they'd shit on him too just for good measure, it's one of the things prince got ahead of MJ fans. It's nearly impossible to critize the good old moonwalker without his army bitching you out for it.
"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."

Poppys, Shanon319, Number23, Kares. #lifttheban
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