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Thread started 08/29/21 10:03am

CoolMF

Kanye/Donda- Thoughts?

Anyone heard this yet? If so, what do you think of it?

*

I heard the Jay Elect/Lox song last night (which was cool but too much auto-tuned Kanye singing) and Jay-Z's "Jail" verse (best Jigga verse, IMHO, I've heard in a long time) but want to hear some feedback before setting aside 2 hours to give this a complete listen...

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Reply #1 posted 08/29/21 12:38pm

TrivialPursuit

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What is a donda?

"eye don’t really care so much what people say about me because it is a reflection of who they r."
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Reply #2 posted 08/29/21 1:18pm

tony23k

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God,god,god,god,God,Jesus...save me
Angels,angels,angels...God
God,god,go...you get the idea
Perfect album to sit down, lay down and go to sleep to.
The end
my phone is heavy
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Reply #3 posted 08/29/21 2:03pm

Empress

yawn I wouldn't give this 2 seconds of my time.
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Reply #4 posted 08/29/21 2:41pm

lastdecember

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He is on that list for me that has too much distraction and nonsense going on and most of it is his doing, partially his own mental health too, but also he seems to crave the light, its similar why I cant get into Demi Lovato, just too much that has nothing to do with music distracting. And I get it she has had many problems but you dont solve them by re inviting that which she has done and he always seems to do. On top of that I really thought artists were learning not to throw so much out there, especially with todays public and their attention span, I mean 80 minute albums were why the 90's had so many crap filled records, I dont really need two hours of new music of any artist in one shot, even ones that I like, give me a solid record forty minutes and call it a day.


"We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F
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Reply #5 posted 08/29/21 3:41pm

WhisperingDand
elions

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TrivialPursuit said:

What is a donda?

His late mother who passed in 2007. A lot of people attribute his megalomania and public tantrums to his mother's death; he did significantly less of acting a fool at award shows for instance when she was alive.

https://www.youtube.com/w...3NmMKfl3Ic

https://www.youtube.com/w...CiwTy8LeDY


also https://www.youtube.com/w...GVE5QMAFNM

[Edited 8/29/21 15:48pm]

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Reply #6 posted 08/29/21 4:10pm

TrivialPursuit

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WhisperingDandelions said:

TrivialPursuit said:

What is a donda?

His late mother who passed in 2007. A lot of people attribute his megalomania and public tantrums to his mother's death; he did significantly less of acting a fool at award shows for instance when she was alive.


Wait - is donda a Kanye nickname or something?

"eye don’t really care so much what people say about me because it is a reflection of who they r."
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Reply #7 posted 08/29/21 4:18pm

WhisperingDand
elions

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TrivialPursuit said:

WhisperingDandelions said:

His late mother who passed in 2007. A lot of people attribute his megalomania and public tantrums to his mother's death; he did significantly less of acting a fool at award shows for instance when she was alive.


Wait - is donda a Kanye nickname or something?

Donda West. His late mother who passed in 2007.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanye_West#Relationships_and_family

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Reply #8 posted 08/29/21 4:48pm

TrivialPursuit

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WhisperingDandelions said:

TrivialPursuit said:


Wait - is donda a Kanye nickname or something?

Donda West. His late mother who passed in 2007.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanye_West#Relationships_and_family


AH! Sorry, got it now.

"eye don’t really care so much what people say about me because it is a reflection of who they r."
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Reply #9 posted 08/29/21 5:22pm

WhisperingDand
elions

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TrivialPursuit said:

WhisperingDandelions said:

Donda West. His late mother who passed in 2007.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanye_West#Relationships_and_family


AH! Sorry, got it now.

Check out "Hey Mama" bruh. Even as a non-Kanye fan that shit is tear-worthy.

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Reply #10 posted 08/29/21 5:49pm

TrivialPursuit

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WhisperingDandelions said:

TrivialPursuit said:


AH! Sorry, got it now.

Check out "Hey Mama" bruh. Even as a non-Kanye fan that shit is tear-worthy.


All due respect, I'll probably skip it. I lost my mom about 9 years ago (on April 21, no less, 4 years before Prince's date), and anything about moms like that is still just a bit too much. I'll trust you that it's deep.

"eye don’t really care so much what people say about me because it is a reflection of who they r."
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Reply #11 posted 08/29/21 6:37pm

purplethunder3
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CoolMF said:

Anyone heard this yet? If so, what do you think of it?

*

I heard the Jay Elect/Lox song last night (which was cool but too much auto-tuned Kanye singing) and Jay-Z's "Jail" verse (best Jigga verse, IMHO, I've heard in a long time) but want to hear some feedback before setting aside 2 hours to give this a complete listen...

Kanye can't sing.

"Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination and life to everything." --Plato
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Reply #12 posted 08/29/21 6:38pm

WhisperingDand
elions

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TrivialPursuit said:

WhisperingDandelions said:

Check out "Hey Mama" bruh. Even as a non-Kanye fan that shit is tear-worthy.


All due respect, I'll probably skip it. I lost my mom about 9 years ago (on April 21, no less, 4 years before Prince's date), and anything about moms like that is still just a bit too much. I'll trust you that it's deep.

Totally, no worries, sorry for your loss. The third video is actually him trying to perform it live many years after the fact but he stops and loses composure like two lines in because, like you said, too much.

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Reply #13 posted 08/29/21 10:02pm

AndrePatrone

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lastdecember said:

He is on that list for me that has too much distraction and nonsense going on and most of it is his doing, partially his own mental health too, but also he seems to crave the light, its similar why I cant get into Demi Lovato, just too much that has nothing to do with music distracting. And I get it she has had many problems but you dont solve them by re inviting that which she has done and he always seems to do. On top of that I really thought artists were learning not to throw so much out there, especially with todays public and their attention span, I mean 80 minute albums were why the 90's had so many crap filled records, I dont really need two hours of new music of any artist in one shot, even ones that I like, give me a solid record forty minutes and call it a day.

Let me start by saying while I disagree with a few things, I really respect how you worded this as a music nerd. Like even where I disagree, half of me agrees.

I FULLY agree there is a lot going on in what I'll call "present era kanye", and what you said about the average attention span of todays listener.

Because I am a fan of both men allow me to make this parallel. I'd be surprised if anyone agrees.

Kanye and Prince are remarkably similar from my observation. That could be a thread in itself, but I say that to say the following:

(1) Both artists are Geminis (make of that what you will, just felt necessary to mention)
(2) Both are provocateurs, either by trade or uncontrollable nature.

(3) Both tend to release projects that split fans (and non fans) down the middle.


I remember when TRC dropped, I came to the org to see what (in my eyes then) "the REAL fans" thought. Basically the ones who were adults for 80s/90s prince. Mostly I read:

-there was too much going on

-the album was too long

-enough with the God talk (and a LOT of hate for Larry Graham)


I personally love TRC, but that may speak more to my enjoyment of abstract/prog jazz type stuff (or even my Christian upbringing)..which is closer to who I think Kanye truly is (among other things) as a MUCISIAN or at least an COMPOSER. Kanye at this stage (at least as an arranger) likes or NEEDS alot going on in his music to paint the picture he wants or even NEEDS (see: mental health) to paint.

In "Prince terms" Kanye is either in his Lovesexy or his TRC period. I began with TRC because that album is POST "Slave-era Prince". We are now in "Slave-era" Kanye as well as his "God is Alive-era" (or think "The Everlasting Now" from a post-divorced Prince)

By the time you get to God is Alive by Mavis Staples Prince is doing a few things:

He's reaching back to the albums/music he listened to as a child
He's doubling down on his commitment to change his life for the better and be a man of faith
He's singing (himself and with/through others) to the world at large as well as inner city youth


Kanye's doing the exact same thing. Or at least attempting to in my humble opinion.

And the general listening public will recieve his albums the exact same way for the exact same reasons, for likely the rest of his career.

I write this as a Gemini black american male who spent years self-composing and producing albums with similiar themes/goals and maybe even flaws.

~

Back to the length.. I actually think its dope that its a 2 hour album and the short attention span of todays listener is why.

I think a 2 hour playlist from an artist at Kanyes level in 2021 has the potential to nudge younger artists into longer playing "projects", and I also think is enough music that the listener can make his/her own superior album in a seperate playist as I suspect his hardcore following will.

I definitely did this for Prince over the years. And maybe Prince anticipated that with an album like Emancipation or definitely Crystal Ball.

I think Kanye knows he cant please anyone at this point (ALBUM 10). Wants to prove that he meant what he said about recommiting himself to Christ. Wants to push younger artists back toward the more complex nature of music in the 90s or even 70s. Wants to triple down on his stance as a business man. And figures if I give you 2 hours, you'll make your own better album anyway since none of these streaming services generate sufficent income.

He has an image to repair (when doesnt he), a failed marriage to deal with, a renewed sense of faith, and must still feel like its him against the world.

I wouldnt say its Kanye's best but its up there in whatever fans will ultimately call this present era. Maybe the Jesus is King Era. Assuming it ever ends or even needs to.

The Chicago Listening party with Manson and the Procession of cars might as well have been Prince doing the LiveSexy stage show in Minniapolis...knowing damn well the merch sales wont add up to a profit..and the critics are gonna go both directions on all the God talk and audio opulence. It's too late for that.

*cues: Can't Stop from Graffitti Bridge*


Fret not that you frighten or offend. Invite the world to dance and marvel at who joins.
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Reply #14 posted 08/29/21 10:05pm

AndrePatrone

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.

[Edited 8/29/21 22:27pm]

Fret not that you frighten or offend. Invite the world to dance and marvel at who joins.
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Reply #15 posted 08/30/21 7:30am

Cinny

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TrivialPursuit said:

WhisperingDandelions said:

Check out "Hey Mama" bruh. Even as a non-Kanye fan that shit is tear-worthy.


All due respect, I'll probably skip it. I lost my mom about 9 years ago (on April 21, no less, 4 years before Prince's date), and anything about moms like that is still just a bit too much. I'll trust you that it's deep.


"Hey Mama" dropped in 2005, while Donda died in 2007 during liposuction, tummy tuck, and breast reduction, due to a pre-existing coronary artery disease.

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Reply #16 posted 08/30/21 7:32am

Cinny

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I have basically checked out since his pseudo-Christian recordings. I still like that clip of his choir singing "Back To Life (However Do You Want Me)" from their plane seats.

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Reply #17 posted 08/30/21 2:28pm

Cinny

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Read that Kanye West sampled Lauryn Hill's "Doo Wop (That Thing)" and found it is "Believe What I Say" on Donda, released yesterday (SUNDAY).

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Reply #18 posted 08/30/21 6:15pm

WhisperingDand
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Cinny said:

Read that Kanye West sampled Lauryn Hill's "Doo Wop (That Thing)" and found it is "Believe What I Say" on Donda, released yesterday (SUNDAY).

Yeah, his sampling ability/integration is barely, slightly, a smidge better than P. Diddy, Mr. Xerox himself.

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Reply #19 posted 08/30/21 8:13pm

coldcoffeeandc
ocacola

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Not my cup of tea. Coffee.. Juice.

But you know its more interesting than pretty much anything else out there

I think he wants music to stop being homogenised

Its his emancipation moment, 2 hours at a time of short short music

Manson is either picked for cancel culture statement or for a musical statement and West and manson = not a combo id ever expect.


Just saw Andre pretty much said what i did. Great minds perhaps wave
[Edited 8/30/21 20:15pm]
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Reply #20 posted 08/31/21 8:33am

AndrePatrone

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coldcoffeeandcocacola said:

Not my cup of tea. Coffee.. Juice.

But you know its more interesting than pretty much anything else out there

I think he wants music to stop being homogenised

Its his emancipation moment, 2 hours at a time of short short music

Manson is either picked for cancel culture statement or for a musical statement and West and manson = not a combo id ever expect.


Just saw Andre pretty much said what i did. Great minds perhaps wave
[Edited 8/30/21 20:15pm]



Gave him songwriter credits to two tracks too so he gets royalties. It's either a christian gesture, a stunt or all three.
[Edited 8/31/21 15:46pm]
Fret not that you frighten or offend. Invite the world to dance and marvel at who joins.
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Reply #21 posted 08/31/21 8:43am

AndrePatrone

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Cinny said:

I have basically checked out since his pseudo-Christian recordings. I still like that clip of his choir singing "Back To Life (However Do You Want Me)" from their plane seats.



I think this is how most folk feel. That doowop flip is dope if you ask me but clearly Im a fan (knowing damn well kanye may not have even been there when that track was made lol)
Fret not that you frighten or offend. Invite the world to dance and marvel at who joins.
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Reply #22 posted 08/31/21 2:01pm

Cinny

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WhisperingDandelions said:

Cinny said:

Read that Kanye West sampled Lauryn Hill's "Doo Wop (That Thing)" and found it is "Believe What I Say" on Donda, released yesterday (SUNDAY).

Yeah, his sampling ability/integration is barely, slightly, a smidge better than P. Diddy, Mr. Xerox himself.


He kick started his career with Chaka Khan "Through The Fire" and Lauryn Hill "Mystery of Iniquity". He's back to bite off a chunk of L-Boogie's righteous vibe. She's the only one who got it right. How'e gon' win when'e ain't right within?

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Reply #23 posted 08/31/21 2:04pm

Cinny

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AndrePatrone said:

Cinny said:

I have basically checked out since his pseudo-Christian recordings. I still like that clip of his choir singing "Back To Life (However Do You Want Me)" from their plane seats.

I think this is how most folk feel. That doowop flip is dope if you ask me but clearly Im a fan (knowing damn well kanye may not have even been there when that track was made lol)


I was actually school-aged when Lauryn Hill came out, and I *still* wouldn't sample her like that (though I stopped making beats ten years ago anyway lol ), but do you know what I mean?

Feels wrong sampling something so iconic by a peer, when Ye had beats on Jermaine Dupri Life In 1472 the same summer (1998).

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Reply #24 posted 08/31/21 3:32pm

AndrePatrone

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Cinny said:



AndrePatrone said:


Cinny said:

I have basically checked out since his pseudo-Christian recordings. I still like that clip of his choir singing "Back To Life (However Do You Want Me)" from their plane seats.



I think this is how most folk feel. That doowop flip is dope if you ask me but clearly Im a fan (knowing damn well kanye may not have even been there when that track was made lol)


I was actually school-aged when Lauryn Hill came out, and I *still* wouldn't sample her like that (though I stopped making beats ten years ago anyway lol ), but do you know what I mean?

Feels wrong sampling something so iconic by a peer, when Ye had beats on Jermaine Dupri Life In 1472 the same summer (1998).




First we gon fight cuz you quit making beats! Me too for a min but hear ya boy Cinny.. that Maschine MK3?? key

As for lauryn I get it. I feel that way whenever I consider sampling prince or stevie, but dig this..who gon sample it RIGHT? The n00b or the one who KNOWS that track..

Plus why not sample your peers? Public Enemy did it a few times if I'm not mistaken..js
[Edited 8/31/21 15:46pm]
Fret not that you frighten or offend. Invite the world to dance and marvel at who joins.
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Reply #25 posted 08/31/21 3:49pm

AndrePatrone

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Come to think of it I was pissed at ye for sampling J5 for H to the Izzo..but that's probably the smartest thing he ever did as a beatmaker lol
Fret not that you frighten or offend. Invite the world to dance and marvel at who joins.
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Reply #26 posted 08/31/21 8:03pm

WhisperingDand
elions

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coldcoffeeandcocacola said:

Manson is either picked for cancel culture statement or for a musical statement and West and manson = not a combo id ever expect.

Cancel culture statement, he's got a couple other problematic male feautured on the record.

Anyway Eminem collab'd with Manson on a track literally 21 years ago, so another rapper doing it two decades later isn't really that original.

https://www.youtube.com/w...aOvVF1GNOk

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Reply #27 posted 08/31/21 8:09pm

WhisperingDand
elions

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Cinny said:

He kick started his career with Chaka Khan "Through The Fire" and Lauryn Hill "Mystery of Iniquity". He's back to bite off a chunk of L-Boogie's righteous vibe. She's the only one who got it right. How'e gon' win when'e ain't right within?

Lauren blocked the "Mystery of Iniquity" sample originally (he interpolated it with another singer after she told him no), surprised he got clearance this time.

AndrePatrone said:

That doowop flip is dope if you ask me but clearly Im a fan

How is that even a "flip" though? He straight up looped the two most obvious vocal isolation portions of the song cut and paste style and did nothing else to the sample.

Now this is a flip:

https://www.youtube.com/w...SW0_ncQysg

https://www.youtube.com/w...z0XZl2Lkx4

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Reply #28 posted 08/31/21 11:38pm

AndrePatrone

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WhisperingDandelions said:

Cinny said:

He kick started his career with Chaka Khan "Through The Fire" and Lauryn Hill "Mystery of Iniquity". He's back to bite off a chunk of L-Boogie's righteous vibe. She's the only one who got it right. How'e gon' win when'e ain't right within?

Lauren blocked the "Mystery of Iniquity" sample originally (he interpolated it with another singer after she told him no), surprised he got clearance this time.

AndrePatrone said:

That doowop flip is dope if you ask me but clearly Im a fan

How is that even a "flip" though? He straight up looped the two most obvious vocal isolation portions of the song cut and paste style and did nothing else to the sample.

Now this is a flip:

https://www.youtube.com/w...SW0_ncQysg

https://www.youtube.com/w...z0XZl2Lkx4

and this? https://www.youtube.com/w...jJpf_5FFJo

Fret not that you frighten or offend. Invite the world to dance and marvel at who joins.
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Reply #29 posted 09/02/21 8:40am

Cinny

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AndrePatrone said:

Cinny said:


I was actually school-aged when Lauryn Hill came out, and I *still* wouldn't sample her like that (though I stopped making beats ten years ago anyway lol ), but do you know what I mean?

Feels wrong sampling something so iconic by a peer, when Ye had beats on Jermaine Dupri Life In 1472 the same summer (1998).

First we gon fight cuz you quit making beats! Me too for a min but hear ya boy Cinny.. that Maschine MK3?? key

Major key! key
The difference is Public Enemy probably had the peer's sample playing along side eight others in a puzzle lol

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