What in particular is POP music or how do you define it?

Lack of complexity.

immediacy .

Catchiness / chorus-oriented.

Trendy/Hip (at the time, often dated in a few years)

Trivial or puerile lyrics.

Short running time.

Pop music it's not a genre, everything that goes to mainstream is pop.

Can't really be done but...

It's about the song, and it's about the detail. Everything else is variable.

Traditionally it was defined in opposition to rock music, which was about the album rather than the single, but we've had many, many good pop albums over the years so that hasn't applied (if it ever did) since the late 60s..

Some of the best pop music is shiny perfection planned in a boardroom, some of the best pop music is badly played, badly recorded rip-off music by total con artists that accidentaly stumbled into something new. Some of the best pop songs were cynically written for cash, some of the best pop songs were total pure expression with no thought given to moving stock at a later date.

If you think it's "just what's popular" then you're missing the point, although you probably have to be either aiming for popularity or achieving popularity.

O Superman is over 8 minutes long and has no chorus and got to number 2 in the UK charts. Ghosts by Japan got to number 5. 96 Tears was a number one hit in the USA. Here Comes the Sun is the most streamed song by the Beatles and wasn't a single. Mr Blobby got to number 1 in the UK. Classical Gas got to number 1 in the USA. Telstar got to number 1 in both the US and the UK.

They're all pop songs, some are better than others.

[Edited 8/13/20 4:46am]

jaawwnn said:

Can't really be done but...

It's about the song, and it's about the detail. Everything else is variable.

Traditionally it was defined in opposition to rock music, which was about the album rather than the single, but we've had many, many good pop albums over the years so that hasn't applied (if it ever did) since the late 60s..

Some of the best pop music is shiny perfection planned in a boardroom, some of the best pop music is badly played, badly recorded rip-off music by total con artists that accidentaly stumbled into something new. Some of the best pop songs were cynically written for cash, some of the best pop songs were total pure expression with no thought given to moving stock at a later date.

If you think it's "just what's popular" then you're missing the point, although you probably have to be either aiming for popularity or achieving popularity.

O Superman is over 8 minutes long and has no chorus and got to number 2 in the UK charts. Ghosts by Japan got to number 5. 96 Tears was a number one hit in the USA. Here Comes the Sun is the most streamed song by the Beatles and wasn't a single. Mr Blobby got to number 1 in the UK. Classical Gas got to number 1 in the USA. Telstar got to number 1 in both the US and the UK.

They're all pop songs, some are better than others.

[Edited 8/13/20 4:46am]

Then what's pop?

slyjackson said:

jaawwnn said:

Can't really be done but...

It's about the song, and it's about the detail. Everything else is variable.

Traditionally it was defined in opposition to rock music, which was about the album rather than the single, but we've had many, many good pop albums over the years so that hasn't applied (if it ever did) since the late 60s..

Some of the best pop music is shiny perfection planned in a boardroom, some of the best pop music is badly played, badly recorded rip-off music by total con artists that accidentaly stumbled into something new. Some of the best pop songs were cynically written for cash, some of the best pop songs were total pure expression with no thought given to moving stock at a later date.

If you think it's "just what's popular" then you're missing the point, although you probably have to be either aiming for popularity or achieving popularity.

O Superman is over 8 minutes long and has no chorus and got to number 2 in the UK charts. Ghosts by Japan got to number 5. 96 Tears was a number one hit in the USA. Here Comes the Sun is the most streamed song by the Beatles and wasn't a single. Mr Blobby got to number 1 in the UK. Classical Gas got to number 1 in the USA. Telstar got to number 1 in both the US and the UK.

They're all pop songs, some are better than others.

Then what's pop?

Infinite possibility and freedom from rules and scolds.

[Edited 8/14/20 3:33am]

Lack of complexity? When Doves Cry is not complex?

would you say there was 'Pop' music in the 50s 60s or 70s?

OldFriends4Sale said:

would you say there was 'Pop' music in the 50s 60s or 70s?

I've seen people trace it back as far as the mid 1800's when various songs were popular across the wagon trails, i've also seen Alexander's Ragtime Band argued as the first pop song (the first million selling sheet music), personally I would probably say it probably emerges around the early 1950s, with the invention of the cheap 7" single. Give or take as you see fit.

Is It's a Good Day by Peggy Lee a pop song or a jazz song? Probably closer to pop and it came out in 1946. Minnie the Moocher is 1931, Honeysuckle Rose is 1928... you can slice these things a lot of ways.

[Edited 8/28/20 7:05am]

There is a lot of 80s pop for example when you look at the lives and experiences of the entertainers backgrounds gives POP a darker edge to it.

I think of Karen Carpenter, and though all that music she was living an internal nightmare

JoeBala said:

Catchy chorus/Riff is the main thing.

Do you think songs buildt around a chorus tend to be popish?

Don't You (Forget About Me) by Simple Minds, they didn't expect this song to become a Pop number as it did

Whatever is popular becomes pop, pop is not a genre.

Pop is a genre.

jaawwnn said:

Pop is a genre.

It's not a genre.

Letoya. I mean she's the Pope of Pop.