I wouldn't say stuffy and boring ... I was eager for her to do something different with her latest album and Madame X certainly was that (though not to my taste). Her Madame X tour is also different, small venues, more theatrical and experimental.

I think the much bigger problem is how she's managing her business at the moment. The late start times on her shows persist, and its really starting to p*ss off her fans, even he hardcore ones. Who wants to be stuck in a foreign city because they missed their last train?

And the show cancellations have been really badly handled. The last one in Lisbon was 45mins before start time, apparently because of her knee injury. Surely she would have known well before this that the knee was going to allow her to perform. More to the point, why not change up the show, sit more, tell more stories, focus on singing not dancing, so that those that invested alot of money on travel and hotels don't miss out. Its bloody minded and not very respectful to her fans not to consider this.

And whoever is in charge of her Instagram needs kicking in to the long grass. Cancel a show, then the next post on her Instagram that night is her partying and doing shots? Christ ...

My Madonna theory is that she was always about being the biggest star, steamrolling over everyone else through sheer mainstream appeal (I say this as a fan of her stuff), taking on modern trends and blowing them up to the biggest audience possible.

The problem now is that over the past decade, if not 20 years, the mainstream has fractured and it's all about exploring your own niche, who beyond her fanbase listened to the last Rihanna record in its entirety for example? She's still one of the biggest stars going. Madonna's problem is that she has no niche, everything she does was done by someone else first, in more detail, and in more depth. I think she could retreat to her very early image and do a small, focused, modern-sounding club record and people would like it but dunno if Madonna would want to do anything that wasn't trying to complete on a global scale.

It's all relative of course, she's doing fine and can sell out massive venues for the rest of her life, and stadiums if she wanted to do a greatest hits tour. I just don't see any future hits for her though.

[Edited 1/22/20 5:06am]

jaawwnn said:

My Madonna theory is that she was always about being the biggest star, steamrolling over everyone else through sheer mainstream appeal (I say this as a fan of her stuff), taking on modern trends and blowing them up to the biggest audience possible.

The problem now is that over the past decade, if not 20 years, the mainstream has fractured and it's all about exploring your own niche, who beyond her fanbase listened to the last Rihanna record in its entirety for example? She's still one of the biggest stars going. Madonna's problem is that she has no niche, everything she does was done by someone else first, in more detail, and in more depth. I think she could retreat to her very early image and do a small, focused, modern-sounding club record and people would like it but dunno if Madonna would want to do anything that wasn't trying to complete on a global scale.

It's all relative of course, she's doing fine and can sell out massive venues for the rest of her life, and stadiums if she wanted to do a greatest hits tour. I just don't see any future hits for her though.

[Edited 1/22/20 5:06am]

Agreed. Looking at Bowie & Prince's later career are great examples of global stars (legendary artists) carving out a niche even later in their career.

Her Instagram compared to whom? Bon Jovi? Her top competition are mostly six feet under nowadays. I'm happy she is doing anything, let alone a world tour in a theater setting. She could pull a Tina Turner, but she hasn't and I'm thankful for it. Also she had a #1 album in 2019.... 9 #1 albums throughout her career... people like to go for the easy target, I suppose.

No shame but she's done everything and she's old now.

Listen to Madonna's Woman of the Year speech in 2016. It says everything. She is doing her own thing now and doesn't care about mainstream audiences. It's obvious if you listen to her latest record. And her social media has massively improved. I almost unfollowed her a couple years ago because it was ridiculous. But she obviously has a clue now.

phillymonster said:

Listen to Madonna's Woman of the Year speech in 2016. It says everything. She is doing her own thing now and doesn't care about mainstream audiences. It's obvious if you listen to her latest record. And her social media has massively improved. I almost unfollowed her a couple years ago because it was ridiculous. But she obviously has a clue now.

Agreed ... the Madame X album was a big step away from the mainstream / EDM sounds of her last three albums. Again, it wasn't to my tastes, but I'm pleased she's doing different things after three albums of lazily following whatever sound was popular on the charts.

Another Madame X Tour date cancelled tonight though. Looks like the knee issue isn't going away. Hoping the rest of the tour survives as I've got London tickets!

CynicKill said:

No shame but she's done everything and she's old now.

I don't think anyone has done everything. Some artists certainly get in a groove and ride it until the end of time. Bon Jovi, The Rollinng Stones - certain folks are just "oh, yep, that's them." Madonna certainly tries to inhabit new sounds every time around. MJ did (of course with the span between his albums, it wasn't hard to find new sounds), and Janet does, too. Prince sorta had carry over sounds that connected certain albums or eras. D&P and are similar, Controversy & 1999 are sisters, ATWIAD & Parade are almost interchangeable at times, etc. M purposely sets out to do something different in each record.

What is stuffy though is her compressed, dry electronica aesthetic. It was cute on Ray of Light. It was okay on Music, then it got boring on American Life (her worst album, to me). The threads of that sound are throughout her subsequent records. But I will say Confessions was more open and fun. MDNA is okay as a record, but is great in concert. I like the DVD concert much more than the album. Rebel Heart was her Prince 90's moment, when she fully grabbed at trends, instead of making them. The fucking air horn sound alone makes it one of her worst albums in history. I hate that it even exists. It's the first Madonna record I've skipped buying (as well as the concert DVD). It have a visceral reaction to it. It's just garbage.

I wonder if fans would say the same about Prince being "old now" since they are the same age. Did anyone say that when he decided to just sit at a piano and play songs for 70 minutes? "How boring. He's old now, so makes sense." What does age have to do with making music? Just because she's 62 this year doesn't mean her brain has stopped working.

But I don't think any artist has done everything. We could've said that about Prince - having done rap, rock, R&B, soul, funk, spoken word, etc - but then he sat his ass down at a piano and sang and people lost their minds (rightly so).

The one thing that tires me with Madonna is always being overly political or SJW-esque. But she's speaking her truth in the moment. I just get sorta tired of it sometimes.

TrivialPursuit said:

CynicKill said:

No shame but she's done everything and she's old now.

I don't think anyone has done everything. Some artists certainly get in a groove and ride it until the end of time. Bon Jovi, The Rollinng Stones - certain folks are just "oh, yep, that's them." Madonna certainly tries to inhabit new sounds every time around. MJ did (of course with the span between his albums, it wasn't hard to find new sounds), and Janet does, too. Prince sorta had carry over sounds that connected certain albums or eras. D&P and are similar, Controversy & 1999 are sisters, ATWIAD & Parade are almost interchangeable at times, etc. M purposely sets out to do something different in each record.

What is stuffy though is her compressed, dry electronica aesthetic. It was cute on Ray of Light. It was okay on Music, then it got boring on American Life (her worst album, to me). The threads of that sound are throughout her subsequent records. But I will say Confessions was more open and fun. MDNA is okay as a record, but is great in concert. I like the DVD concert much more than the album. Rebel Heart was her Prince 90's moment, when she fully grabbed at trends, instead of making them. The fucking air horn sound alone makes it one of her worst albums in history. I hate that it even exists. It's the first Madonna record I've skipped buying (as well as the concert DVD). It have a visceral reaction to it. It's just garbage.

I wonder if fans would say the same about Prince being "old now" since they are the same age. Did anyone say that when he decided to just sit at a piano and play songs for 70 minutes? "How boring. He's old now, so makes sense." What does age have to do with making music? Just because she's 62 this year doesn't mean her brain has stopped working.

But I don't think any artist has done everything. We could've said that about Prince - having done rap, rock, R&B, soul, funk, spoken word, etc - but then he sat his ass down at a piano and sang and people lost their minds (rightly so).

The one thing that tires me with Madonna is always being overly political or SJW-esque. But she's speaking her truth in the moment. I just get sorta tired of it sometimes.

Come on dude, Rebel Heart wasn't that bad! ... Heartbreak City was a fantastic track, Ghosttown, Joan of Arc, Hold Tight, Living for Love were good.

The Rebel Heart Tour was also really good, most happy and relaxed I've seen her on tour, and the most fun show since Confessions.

CynicKill said:

No shame but she's done everything and she's old now.

ok ..but keep that ass covered

DaveT said:

TrivialPursuit said:

Rebel Heart was her Prince 90's moment, when she fully grabbed at trends, instead of making them. The fucking air horn sound alone makes it one of her worst albums in history. I hate that it even exists. It's the first Madonna record I've skipped buying (as well as the concert DVD). It have a visceral reaction to it. It's just garbage.

Come on dude, Rebel Heart wasn't that bad! ... Heartbreak City was a fantastic track, Ghosttown, Joan of Arc, Hold Tight, Living for Love were good.

The Rebel Heart Tour was also really good, most happy and relaxed I've seen her on tour, and the most fun show since Confessions.

It wasn't that bad.

It was worse.

alphastreet said:

DaveT said:

TrivialPursuit said:

CynicKill said:

No shame but she's done everything and she's old now.

I don't think anyone has done everything. Some artists certainly get in a groove and ride it until the end of time. Bon Jovi, The Rollinng Stones - certain folks are just "oh, yep, that's them." Madonna certainly tries to inhabit new sounds every time around. MJ did (of course with the span between his albums, it wasn't hard to find new sounds), and Janet does, too. Prince sorta had carry over sounds that connected certain albums or eras. D&P and are similar, Controversy & 1999 are sisters, ATWIAD & Parade are almost interchangeable at times, etc. M purposely sets out to do something different in each record.

What is stuffy though is her compressed, dry electronica aesthetic. It was cute on Ray of Light. It was okay on Music, then it got boring on American Life (her worst album, to me). The threads of that sound are throughout her subsequent records. But I will say Confessions was more open and fun. MDNA is okay as a record, but is great in concert. I like the DVD concert much more than the album. Rebel Heart was her Prince 90's moment, when she fully grabbed at trends, instead of making them. The fucking air horn sound alone makes it one of her worst albums in history. I hate that it even exists. It's the first Madonna record I've skipped buying (as well as the concert DVD). It have a visceral reaction to it. It's just garbage.

I wonder if fans would say the same about Prince being "old now" since they are the same age. Did anyone say that when he decided to just sit at a piano and play songs for 70 minutes? "How boring. He's old now, so makes sense." What does age have to do with making music? Just because she's 62 this year doesn't mean her brain has stopped working.

But I don't think any artist has done everything. We could've said that about Prince - having done rap, rock, R&B, soul, funk, spoken word, etc - but then he sat his ass down at a piano and sang and people lost their minds (rightly so).

The one thing that tires me with Madonna is always being overly political or SJW-esque. But she's speaking her truth in the moment. I just get sorta tired of it sometimes.

I was using these terms in more of a figure-of-speech sort of way.

But you have to agree Madonna has done quite a bit musically, and has been out forever.

The woman was known as the queen of reinvention. How many more skins do you expect her to shed.

The woman is 62 yrs old. She doesn't have the energy, will or currency to put out anything equivalent to what she did in late 80's.

If she could sing anymore then maybe a piano tour would be more to her speed. Her body is even telling her to slow down.

I'm seriously questioning what you guys expect her to do.

[Edited 1/22/20 21:49pm]

I kinda feel Madame X is her Rainbow Children in the sense that she's given up on chasing trends and wanting chart success and is doing exactly what she wants. That isn't to say she hasn't done this before, but since 2008, her music seemed to be chasing trends rather than creating them. I think she now realises that everything she does is going to be judged through the prism of her age and what society expects a woman her age to be doing. She's breaking conventions.

I feel she now realises commercial success is probably not gonna happen so she's just doing the music she wants. Madame X isn't to everyone's taste, but personally I like the fact she made a weird, experimental, non-commercial album.

I'm seeing the tour next month in London (hopefully!) so I'll get to see the full Madame X Experience.

Stuffy and boring? Never.

Honestly,I wish Madonna would write her autobigraphy and oversee the filming of her biopic.The director of Elton John's Rocketman has expressed an interest in a Madonna biopic.It's time for her to finally tell her story and focus on her legacy.Her story is so exciting and interesting.

as for the tour.....I didn't go this time.I've seen every Madonna tour since Blonde Ambition,spent a ton of money and I'm at the point now where I'll just wait for the blu-ray,if there will be one

SoulAlive said:

Honestly,I wish Madonna would write her autobigraphy and oversee the filming of her biopic.The director of Elton John's Rocketman has expressed an interest in a Madonna biopic.It's time for her to finally tell her story and focus on her legacy.Her story is so exciting and interesting.

Yes, a self-made woman from a very early age. She has chutzpah.

Madonna is becoming stuffy and boring?

Madonna has ALWAYS been stuffy and boring.

SoulAlive said:

What do you expect, for her to act like she did in her 20's or something, she's almost a senior citizen, the woman is in her 60's for pete's sake, she's getting older not younger!

looby said:

alphastreet said:

looby said:

What do you expect, for her to act like she did in her 20's or something, she's almost a senior citizen, the woman is in her 60's for pete's sake, she's getting older not younger!

She definitely doesn’t have her 25 year old body but she acts kind of young on Instagram I find

She "can act kind of young on Instagram" all she wants to, but that doesn't change the fact that she isn't young, she's 61, soon to be 62 years old! I'm sorry, but I don't think that there are many people that want to see a 60 plus year old person, gyrating around on stage, in skimpy costumes or underwear, trying to pretend that they are the same young, attractive, person that they were in their 20's.....it's silly, and truth be told, just looks ridiculous!

looby said:

looby said:

I'm sorry, but I don't think that there are many people that want to see a 60 plus year old person, gyrating around on stage, in skimpy costumes or underwear,

Are you sure about that? Because lots of people go to concerts by Grace Jones & Iggy Pop who are in their 70s. These pics are from 2019.

MickyDolenz said:

looby said:

I'm sorry, but I don't think that there are many people that want to see a 60 plus year old person, gyrating around on stage, in skimpy costumes or underwear,

Are you sure about that? Because lots of people go to concerts by Grace Jones & Iggy Pop who are in their 70s. These pics are from 2019.

Yes, very sure, and I think the last bottom pic speaks for itself.

Grace Jones is incredible live, and looks brilliant.