whitechocolatebrotha said:

I never cared 4 Michael Jackson. Maybe one song: "Remember The Time," but that's about it. I don't even own a single one of his albums either. Just not a fan. He's overrated in my opinion. Not a great vocalist by ANY means and just bores me 2 tears. I much prefer Janet over Michael ANY day. As 4 The Jacksons, again, just a couple of songs hit me: "Can You Feel It" and "Heartbreak Hotel," but that's it. I'd take The Isley Brothers over The Jacksons ANY DAY too. Crossover is a sales thing. Despite sales figures, there is some amazing music out there that just never saw the light of Radio endorsement. I won't get into those songs/performers where this is about MJ and his brothers, but really...no big deal 2 me. I'm happy that Amazon likes the first aforementioned song enough 2 use it though. It's a great song.

It's been renamed "This Place Hotel" because it's already a "Heartbreak Hotel" registered & published by Elvis Presley.

Btw: I learned how to sing listening to MJ. The first single I ever bought was "Never Can Say Goodbye".

[Edited 12/21/18 2:51am]

SoulAlive said:

Why is it so important for something to “cross over”? Frankie Beverly and Maze never really crossed over.Does that mean that they were not a great band?

The Phunk has come back to the Music:Non Prince forum. I see what's left of the forum a whole

lot hasn't changed. Frankie Beverly perfect example. Throughout the years they never went 3 or 4 times platinum but quietly go gold or platinum. Quiet consistency. As a result they built a cult following during their live shows and despite not recording an album since 1993 Back To Basics r&b fans flock to Maze concerts like ducks to water. Frankie rarely does interviews but he did one for Ebony around 2007 and he said it used to bother him that Maze didn't get their propers from the industry like other artists but he said those artists want what they have now and that's a cult following to their shows. Frankie calls Maze fans the Black Grateful Dead. I've gone to 3 of his shows in the past 8 years and it's unreal the level of support Maze fans give. Everyone knows what happens when the band performs Before I Let Go at one of the shows. It's turns into a big slide party.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

MickyDolenz said:

The Jacksons as a group never really crossed over, they were more successful on R&B radio. The later Jackson 5 records had less crossover as well. Many people think All I Do was original to Troop. It was the early J5 that had a lot of crossover. The Jacksons didn't even have a greatest hits until 2004, unless you count the 1981 live album. That's mainly why they don't get spoken about today in the mainstream music press, just like they're not that likely to write about the Isley Brothers or Teddy Pendergrass who were also more popular with the R&B audience than the pop audience. Today, other than maybe Shake Your Body, The Jacksons don't get played on oldies radio stations that focus on Top 40 pop hits. They do get airplay for other songs on Adult R&B stations. Others acts that did crossover like Earth Wind & Fire and JT Taylor era Kool & The Gang get quite a bit of airplay on pop oldies radio and are also often in movies, TV, and commercials. On Youtube, songs like September, Boggie Wonderland, & Celebration have over 100 million views, way more than any video by The Jacksons. The highest is Can You Feel It with 13 million and for the J5 - I Want You Back with 52 million.

Saying the Jacksons between 1976-1984 didn't cross over is like saying no black bands or groups crossed over. Probably only the Commodores, EWF, Kool & the Gang, Isley Bros and P-Funk from that same time were more successful or just as successful.

Don't know exactly how they charted in terms of crossover success but the Jacksons had to have

had a certain level of popularity among pop fans because they appeared on talks shows like Dinah Shore and the Mike Douglas show. They also had their own variety show on CBS in the seventies.

whitechocolatebrotha said:

He's overrated in my opinion. Not a great vocalist by ANY means

ridiculous

i'm not a huge Michael Jackson fan, but to deny his vocal ability is insane

whitechocolatebrotha said:

MoBettaBliss said:

phunkdaddy said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

phunkdaddy said:

Don't know exactly how they charted in terms of crossover success but the Jacksons had to have

had a certain level of popularity among pop fans because they appeared on talks shows like Dinah Shore and the Mike Douglas show. They also had their own variety show on CBS in the seventies.

Yeah. The only black R&B group to have a prime time show was let me see, uh. Nope, just the Jacksons.

70s R&B flashback: "Show You The Way To Go" by The Jacksons (1976)

Comin' back 2 this. I felt really bad with my initial post. What I might have added is that I LOVE his production on other people: Rebbie, Diana, Rockwell; I failed 2 mention that tho. Apologies. I also like some of his stuff as well as some of his brothers' stuff, but much prefer Janet's catalog over his and theirs. I won't deny that he was a great dancer/entertainer, but just wanted 2 make sure I could get these points across without injuring others' tastes any further. Thanks, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year! <3

[Edited 12/24/18 19:00pm]

ChocolateBox3121 said:

LOL! I know, Michael...I KNOW. I'm SORRY! That NOSE is the only thing that's "Bad" and that ain't GOOD.

That is so ridiculous. I've been revisiting the Jacksons catalog in recent months and they have some smooth bops well worth bumping on the speakers: music that INSTANTLY lifts the spirits and puts you in a great mood.

ChocolateBox3121 said:

Exactly

Ottensen said:

That is so ridiculous. I've been revisiting the Jacksons catalog in recent months and they have some smooth bops well worth bumping on the speakers: music that INSTANTLY lifts the spirits and puts you in a great mood.

There's a fraction of younger fans don't know or appreciate MJ's pre-Off The Wall material but for those who KNOW? The Jacksons' catalog isn't just a footnote, it's an essential chapter to his legacy

You can't really discuss his career and work without mentioning Heartbreak Hotel/This Place Hotel, Lovely One, Walk Right Now, Push Me Away, That's What You Get For Being Polite, Show You The Way To Go, Enjoy Yourself, Strength of One Man and the others

Destiny and Triumph are MUST HAVE albums

MickyDolenz said:

HAPPYPERSON said:

I'm sad that Destiny & Triumph are not celebrated much

The Jacksons as a group never really crossed over, they were more successful on R&B radio. The later Jackson 5 records had less crossover as well. Many people think All I Do was original to Troop. It was the early J5 that had a lot of crossover. The Jacksons didn't even have a greatest hits until 2004, unless you count the 1981 live album. That's mainly why they don't get spoken about today in the mainstream music press, just like they're not that likely to write about the Isley Brothers or Teddy Pendergrass who were also more popular with the R&B audience than the pop audience. Today, other than maybe Shake Your Body, The Jacksons don't get played on oldies radio stations that focus on Top 40 pop hits. They do get airplay for other songs on Adult R&B stations. Others acts that did crossover like Earth Wind & Fire and JT Taylor era Kool & The Gang get quite a bit of airplay on pop oldies radio and are also often in movies, TV, and commercials. On Youtube, songs like September, Boggie Wonderland, & Celebration have over 100 million views, way more than any video by The Jacksons. The highest is Can You Feel It with 13 million and for the J5 - I Want You Back with 52 million.

"The Jackson 5, had less crossover as well".... The Jackson 5 had 18 top 40 hits, 8 top 10 hits, 4 #1s, 3 #2s on the Billboard Hot 100. The Jacksons had 7 top 40 hits, 3 top 10s (no top 5 hits). So I am going to completely disagree with the Jackson 5 not having crossever success.Their debut album had 4 #1 singles out of the gate. The reality is that anything before the MTV era, is not really focused on, in today's music scene. We live in this web world - were the minlennials get there facts from wikipedia, and the lazy journalists write articles from the false information posted on wikipedia. They also think that record sales tell the story, when in fact it doesn't. But yes the Jackson have totally been dwarfed by MJ's solo career, it's very sad.

whitechocolatebrotha said:

I never cared 4 Michael Jackson. Maybe one song: "Remember The Time," but that's about it. I don't even own a single one of his albums either. Just not a fan. He's overrated in my opinion. Not a great vocalist by ANY means and just bores me 2 tears. I much prefer Janet over Michael ANY day. As 4 The Jacksons, again, just a couple of songs hit me: "Can You Feel It" and "Heartbreak Hotel," but that's it. I'd take The Isley Brothers over The Jacksons ANY DAY too. Crossover is a sales thing. Despite sales figures, there is some amazing music out there that just never saw the light of Radio endorsement. I won't get into those songs/performers where this is about MJ and his brothers, but really...no big deal 2 me. I'm happy that Amazon likes the first aforementioned song enough 2 use it though. It's a great song.

I thought he was the best young singer ( male vocalist) we have ever had. I thought he was sensational, with the Jackson 5 and the solo stuff he did in the 70s. Ben, Got to Be There, I Wanna Be Where You Are, Happy etc... But after he started with the nose surgeries his voice changed (which is why Streisand never got her nose fixed), he couldn't reach those high notes like he could in his younger days. He wasn't the same vocalist. I didn't myself care for anything much after Thriller, and like a few from that.

Tontoman22 said:

whitechocolatebrotha said:

I never cared 4 Michael Jackson. Maybe one song: "Remember The Time," but that's about it. I don't even own a single one of his albums either. Just not a fan. He's overrated in my opinion. Not a great vocalist by ANY means and just bores me 2 tears. I much prefer Janet over Michael ANY day. As 4 The Jacksons, again, just a couple of songs hit me: "Can You Feel It" and "Heartbreak Hotel," but that's it. I'd take The Isley Brothers over The Jacksons ANY DAY too. Crossover is a sales thing. Despite sales figures, there is some amazing music out there that just never saw the light of Radio endorsement. I won't get into those songs/performers where this is about MJ and his brothers, but really...no big deal 2 me. I'm happy that Amazon likes the first aforementioned song enough 2 use it though. It's a great song.

I thought he was the best young singer ( male vocalist) we have ever had. I thought he was sensational, with the Jackson 5 and the solo stuff he did in the 70s. Ben, Got to Be There, I Wanna Be Where You Are, Happy etc... But after he started with the nose surgeries his voice changed (which is why Streisand never got her nose fixed), he couldn't reach those high notes like he could in his younger days. He wasn't the same vocalist. I didn't myself care for anything much after Thriller, and like a few from that.

Agreed! He didn't have the same voice as he continued tweakin' his nose. Great dancer (my fav'rite part of his talent), but vocally? ... Nuthin' special. Too much of those peeps and squeaks and breathy things hid the actual voice. After "Thriller," I was over him. I found his ballads 2b bombastic and overly produced. His jams were better on "Dangerous" having gotten with Teddy Riley, but from that point 4ward, no biggie. He was being overshadowed by the THEN up 'n comin' talents. Happy New Year! <3

[Edited 12/29/18 18:09pm]

Cinny said:

MickyDolenz said:

What's funny? It can clearly be seen that the audience during the Triumph Tour tended to be more black than the post-Thriller Victory Tour.

That's not just the population of the city they were in when this snapshot was taken?

I think that's in LA at the Forum

bboy87 said:

Look at those ticket prices....

whitechocolatebrotha said:

Tontoman22 said:

I thought he was the best young singer ( male vocalist) we have ever had. I thought he was sensational, with the Jackson 5 and the solo stuff he did in the 70s. Ben, Got to Be There, I Wanna Be Where You Are, Happy etc... But after he started with the nose surgeries his voice changed (which is why Streisand never got her nose fixed), he couldn't reach those high notes like he could in his younger days. He wasn't the same vocalist. I didn't myself care for anything much after Thriller, and like a few from that.

Agreed! He didn't have the same voice as he continued tweakin' his nose. Great dancer (my fav'rite part of his talent), but vocally? ... Nuthin' special. Too much of those peeps and squeaks and breathy things hid the actual voice. After "Thriller," I was over him. I found his ballads 2b bombastic and overly produced. His jams were better on "Dangerous" having gotten with Teddy Riley, but from that point 4ward, no biggie. He was being overshadowed by the THEN up 'n comin' talents. Happy New Year! <3

[Edited 12/29/18 18:09pm]

I can't honest say I listened to his music, after 1984. I didn't buy any of it either, and as far as radio, well that all became about who could pay the DJs to play their music, in 90s. It got so ridiculous, even the Billboard (hot 100) chart calculations starting heavily favouring air play. By the mid 90's they were debuting songs at #1. I think he was the first to do it, but 3 or 4 other followed him rather quickly.

Tontoman22 said:

whitechocolatebrotha said:

purple05 said:

Tontoman22 said:

I thought he was the best young singer ( male vocalist) we have ever had. I thought he was sensational, with the Jackson 5 and the solo stuff he did in the 70s. Ben, Got to Be There, I Wanna Be Where You Are, Happy etc... But after he started with the nose surgeries his voice changed (which is why Streisand never got her nose fixed), he couldn't reach those high notes like he could in his younger days. He wasn't the same vocalist. I didn't myself care for anything much after Thriller, and like a few from that.

He couldn’t reach high notes? Men aren’t reaching the same notes postpuberty unless they were castrated. MJ has a pretty wide chest range

I feel MJ had a pretty good voice as an adult for someone that had been putting so much strain on his voice since he was a little boy.

whitechocolatebrotha said:

I never cared 4 Michael Jackson.

Thanks for letting us know. What would we do without that information?

SoulAlive said:

“Show You The Way To Go” is my absolute favorite Jacksons song that song is heavenly!

Rejoice everbody and get the job done.

Love, love, love it. And oddly enough it took me years to really appreciate it's greatness.

bboy87 said:

Yeah. 70 minutes seems a bit pathetic. Jacksons setlists are better these days.