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Thread started 12/03/18 3:47pm

alphastreet

New Mariah thread

I couldn't reply to the other one, so thought I'd start this so we can continue discussion of the album and tour

Portrait is definitely a highlight on the album, and I realized the setlist provided was actually for her tour titled number ones in asia. I wonder what the new setlist will look like

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Reply #1 posted 12/03/18 4:14pm

Cinny

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alphastreet said:

I couldn't reply to the other one, so thought I'd start this so we can continue discussion of the album and tour

Portrait is definitely a highlight on the album, and I realized the setlist provided was actually for her tour titled number ones in asia. I wonder what the new setlist will look like

Her new but short album, Caution, will likely be the bulk of it, and she said on Kelly Ripa that she will bring back some Glitter tracks (no kidding!).

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Reply #2 posted 12/04/18 7:51am

alphastreet

Cinny said:

alphastreet said:

I couldn't reply to the other one, so thought I'd start this so we can continue discussion of the album and tour

Portrait is definitely a highlight on the album, and I realized the setlist provided was actually for her tour titled number ones in asia. I wonder what the new setlist will look like

Her new but short album, Caution, will likely be the bulk of it, and she said on Kelly Ripa that she will bring back some Glitter tracks (no kidding!).

It would be fun to see her do glitter tracks, but it would be better focusing on the classics I think. Does she do them regularly on her tours?

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Reply #3 posted 12/04/18 10:50am

Cinny

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alphastreet said:

Cinny said:

Her new but short album, Caution, will likely be the bulk of it, and she said on Kelly Ripa that she will bring back some Glitter tracks (no kidding!).

It would be fun to see her do glitter tracks, but it would be better focusing on the classics I think. Does she do them regularly on her tours?

Yes, that's all she has been doing, Number Ones tour and #1 to Infinity in Vegas before that.

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Reply #4 posted 12/04/18 4:24pm

kitbradley

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The album debuted at #5 on the Billboard Top 200 Album Charts. It debuted at #1 on the Billboard R&B Album Chart. Those are pretty respectable numbers for a veteran female R&B singer. There are some potential strong singles on the album, the title track being the obvious one. But, sadly, she probably wouldn't get any airplay outside of R&B AC radio.

"It's not nice to fuck with K.B.! All you haters will see!" - Kitbradley
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Reply #5 posted 12/05/18 3:55pm

Cinny

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kitbradley said:

But, sadly, she probably wouldn't get any airplay outside of R&B AC radio.

This is so true. I wish the pop outlets would realize her lasting appeal.

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Reply #6 posted 12/05/18 5:52pm

estelle81

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Loved "The Distance" the first time I heard it. "GTFO" confuses me. She's had so many songs in the past and present ("The Distance" for example) where she will bleep out the 'F' word but in this song she says it like it's disappearing tomorrow from existence. Girl, what?!?!? eek I needed that F bomb dropped in "The Distance"....what happened, hunty? hmph!

Prince Rogers Nelson
Sunrise: June 7, 1958
Sunset: April 21, 2016
~My Heart Loudly Weeps

"My Creativity Is My Life." ~ Prince

Life is merely a dress rehearsal for eternity.
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Reply #7 posted 12/09/18 7:19am

lastdecember

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Cinny said:



alphastreet said:


I couldn't reply to the other one, so thought I'd start this so we can continue discussion of the album and tour



Portrait is definitely a highlight on the album, and I realized the setlist provided was actually for her tour titled number ones in asia. I wonder what the new setlist will look like



Her new but short album, Caution, will likely be the bulk of it, and she said on Kelly Ripa that she will bring back some Glitter tracks (no kidding!).



I think part of the reason I like most of this album is that it’s short and to the point, it gets repetitive because she still is stuck in a groove with her tempos, but I am all for 30-40 minute 10 track records, one of the best this year for me was Camila Cabello, quick to the point not overproduced or slick sounding almost no guests except for that blip on Havana she understands what the term MY record is.

"We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F
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Reply #8 posted 12/13/18 12:06pm

Cinny

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lastdecember said:

Cinny said:

Her new but short album, Caution, will likely be the bulk of it, and she said on Kelly Ripa that she will bring back some Glitter tracks (no kidding!).

I think part of the reason I like most of this album is that it’s short and to the point, it gets repetitive because she still is stuck in a groove with her tempos, but I am all for 30-40 minute 10 track records, one of the best this year for me was Camila Cabello, quick to the point not overproduced or slick sounding almost no guests except for that blip on Havana she understands what the term MY record is.

Oh man I was totally with you until you cited Camila's record. What a snore! Now THAT'S a bitch stuck in her tempo.

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Reply #9 posted 12/15/18 6:20am

nextedition

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I went to her christmas show last thursday, she was fantastic! Her voice sounded great, i didnt know she was this entertaining! She performed my favourite track from the new album The Distance and man, that song is great life. The arena was almost sold out, like 14.000 people. Not bad for being 30 years in the business.
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Reply #10 posted 12/15/18 7:04am

lastdecember

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Cinny said:



lastdecember said:


Cinny said:


Her new but short album, Caution, will likely be the bulk of it, and she said on Kelly Ripa that she will bring back some Glitter tracks (no kidding!).



I think part of the reason I like most of this album is that it’s short and to the point, it gets repetitive because she still is stuck in a groove with her tempos, but I am all for 30-40 minute 10 track records, one of the best this year for me was Camila Cabello, quick to the point not overproduced or slick sounding almost no guests except for that blip on Havana she understands what the term MY record is.

Oh man I was totally with you until you cited Camila's record. What a snore! Now THAT'S a bitch stuck in her tempo.


Really there’s a lot more variety on her record then Mariah has had in two decades. Sorry but the comparison of those two albums Mariah is the one stuck in a groove, she is still doing the lazy rb beats.

"We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F
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Reply #11 posted 12/19/18 10:19am

Cinny

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lastdecember said:

Cinny said:

Oh man I was totally with you until you cited Camila's record. What a snore! Now THAT'S a bitch stuck in her tempo.

Really there’s a lot more variety on her record then Mariah has had in two decades. Sorry but the comparison of those two albums Mariah is the one stuck in a groove, she is still doing the lazy rb beats.

OMG Camila barely has drums anywhere, it is so dull and slow, which is why I couldn't even say "groove" in the same sentence.

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Reply #12 posted 12/22/18 9:26am

egansmind

The new album Caution is probably the best album she has done since 2005

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Reply #13 posted 12/22/18 10:47am

jungleluv

Did anyone on the org watch the Channel 5 (UK) dramadocumentary on Mariah shown a few days ago? It was called Mariah - The Diva, the demons and the drama. The actress who played Mariah was a great casting, she looked and talked just like her. I found her story quite sad tho- her struggle with Bipolar disorder and being surrounded by the wrong people.

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Reply #14 posted 12/25/18 10:19pm

Cinny

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egansmind said:

The new album Caution is probably the best album she has done since 2005



Quite easily!
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Reply #15 posted 12/28/18 7:54am

lastdecember

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The weird thing about this album is as far as the critics is clearly her most well received but commercially will turn out to be her lowest selling studio album yet by far. Which to me shows her loyal base is not so loyal after all, her numbers are way off, not that everyone’s aren’t but for her it’s very telling.

"We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F
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Reply #16 posted 12/28/18 10:57am

kitbradley

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lastdecember said:

The weird thing about this album is as far as the critics is clearly her most well received but commercially will turn out to be her lowest selling studio album yet by far. Which to me shows her loyal base is not so loyal after all, her numbers are way off, not that everyone’s aren’t but for her it’s very telling.



Not suprising. She is a female R&B singer over the age of 35. Like Janet, her gold and platinum selling days are long gone. There has been zero radio support, which is still very important to have at least one format playing your music. The few stores that still sell physical music, I have not seen the album on display, not even at Target or Walmart, which spells a significant loss in sales. We all remember Adele’s last album. You couldn’t go anywhere without the CD on display. Coffee shops, grocery stores, gas stations. Contrary to popular belief, everyone does not make music purchases based solely off of what they see on social media. Some folk still need to see and touch it before they buy it. But We all know people generally don’t buy albums any more since they can listen for free or stream. Her fanbase is no different than anyone else. So, yeah, her album sells are going to be low, especially if folk don’t know the music is out there.

Epic Records has to take the brunt of the blame for it’s shit promotion. I didn’t even know the imprint was still in existence. I don’t know what other artists are signed to the label but its clear Mariah is not a priority. Perhaps she needs to looks elsewhere and find a label who will give a rat’s behind that she is even there.
[Edited 12/28/18 11:09am]
"It's not nice to fuck with K.B.! All you haters will see!" - Kitbradley
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Reply #17 posted 12/28/18 11:11am

MickyDolenz

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lastdecember said:

The weird thing about this album is as far as the critics is clearly her most well received but commercially will turn out to be her lowest selling studio album yet by far.

Since when have critics ever sold anything? I've always noticed that the stuff critics like generally isn't popular and the stuff that is mainstream popular they usually don't like. That's true of music, movies, TV shows, books, etc. As David Lee Roth said "Music critics like Elvis Costello because music critics look like Elvis Costello". lol I don't understand the idea of needing some person who gets free records to tell them what is good or not. I can determine myself if I like something. That's why I don't believe in "guilty pleasures" or something being "cheesy". I'm not embarrased about anything I like and don't need some kind of disclaimer for it. My all time favorite movie is Smokey & The Bandit and it's the movie I've seen the most times. I doubt it got much critical praise.

For 65 years straight, the #1 genre in music, selling wise, was rock n' roll worldwide. Last year (2017) in June, it got de-crowned by hip hop. Hip hop is the #1 genre. It's hip hop - rock - country - pop or pop - country. ~ Pras
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Reply #18 posted 12/30/18 8:18am

lastdecember

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MickyDolenz said:



lastdecember said:


The weird thing about this album is as far as the critics is clearly her most well received but commercially will turn out to be her lowest selling studio album yet by far.

Since when have critics ever sold anything? I've always noticed that the stuff critics like generally isn't popular and the stuff that is mainstream popular they usually don't like. That's true of music, movies, TV shows, books, etc. As David Lee Roth said "Music critics like Elvis Costello because music critics look like Elvis Costello". lol I don't understand the idea of needing some person who gets free records to tell them what is good or not. I can determine myself if I like something. That's why I don't believe in "guilty pleasures" or something being "cheesy". I'm not embarrased about anything I like and don't need some kind of disclaimer for it. My all time favorite movie is Smokey & The Bandit and it's the movie I've seen the most times. I doubt it got much critical praise.



It’s not that critics sell or can sell its more how her base which we all thought was solid is not a solid base at all. This album in the states is still not at 100,000 sold since its release that’s a pretty huge drop for someone that had consistent gold platinum and multi platinum albums. Now people will say look at Prince prior to his passing, but also remember Prince was NOT a big seller early at all he built it then it exploded and then it went back to reality of a loyal base. With MC it’s not even close, the erosion of her base is pretty unique even in these times where sales are down for everyone, I mean the last new Bon Jovi record with no singles no airplay sold 130,000 week one and topped off somewhere around 200-300 thousand to date here, and yes Jovi is band but also now is missing a big drawing member too, so factoring that in, she really does not have the loyal base she thinks, they have tired of her albums.

"We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F
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Reply #19 posted 12/30/18 10:39am

MickyDolenz

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lastdecember said:

It’s not that critics sell or can sell its more how her base which we all thought was solid is not a solid base at all. This album in the states is still not at 100,000 sold since its release that’s a pretty huge drop for someone that had consistent gold platinum and multi platinum albums. Now people will say look at Prince prior to his passing, but also remember Prince was NOT a big seller early at all he built it then it exploded and then it went back to reality of a loyal base. With MC it’s not even close, the erosion of her base is pretty unique even in these times where sales are down for everyone, I mean the last new Bon Jovi record with no singles no airplay sold 130,000 week one and topped off somewhere around 200-300 thousand to date here, and yes Jovi is band but also now is missing a big drawing member too, so factoring that in, she really does not have the loyal base she thinks, they have tired of her albums.

Pretty much everyone loses mainstream popularity after they've been around a certain amount of time. How many records was Dean Martin & Harry Belafonte selling in the 1980s? They did not get on Top 40 radio or MTV either. Veteran acts like Frank Sinatra & Ray Charles had big selling albums at the end of their careers by releasing duets albums with young and then popular acts of the time. Same for Carlos Santana, B.B. King, & Tony Bennett. All of these people were popular sellers during their heyday. The Rolling Stones & Paul McCartney are sill popular as touring acts, but their newer albums are not huge sellers like in the past. Billy Joel has not released an album since the early 1990s and Stevie Nicks refused to do a new album with Fleetwood Mac because she said there is no point because records don't sell anymore. Implying that it's a waste to spend a lot of money for studio time and then not making the money back. Video games are the huge sellers today, more so than physical CDs, records, & tapes or even DVD/Blu Ray.

For 65 years straight, the #1 genre in music, selling wise, was rock n' roll worldwide. Last year (2017) in June, it got de-crowned by hip hop. Hip hop is the #1 genre. It's hip hop - rock - country - pop or pop - country. ~ Pras
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Reply #20 posted 12/30/18 2:44pm

lastdecember

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MickyDolenz said:

lastdecember said:

It’s not that critics sell or can sell its more how her base which we all thought was solid is not a solid base at all. This album in the states is still not at 100,000 sold since its release that’s a pretty huge drop for someone that had consistent gold platinum and multi platinum albums. Now people will say look at Prince prior to his passing, but also remember Prince was NOT a big seller early at all he built it then it exploded and then it went back to reality of a loyal base. With MC it’s not even close, the erosion of her base is pretty unique even in these times where sales are down for everyone, I mean the last new Bon Jovi record with no singles no airplay sold 130,000 week one and topped off somewhere around 200-300 thousand to date here, and yes Jovi is band but also now is missing a big drawing member too, so factoring that in, she really does not have the loyal base she thinks, they have tired of her albums.

Pretty much everyone loses mainstream popularity after they've been around a certain amount of time. How many records was Dean Martin & Harry Belafonte selling in the 1980s? They did not get on Top 40 radio or MTV either. Veteran acts like Frank Sinatra & Ray Charles had big selling albums at the end of their careers by releasing duets albums with young and then popular acts of the time. Same for Carlos Santana, B.B. King, & Tony Bennett. All of these people were popular sellers during their heyday. The Rolling Stones & Paul McCartney are sill popular as touring acts, but their newer albums are not huge sellers like in the past. Billy Joel has not released an album since the early 1990s and Stevie Nicks refused to do a new album with Fleetwood Mac because she said there is no point because records don't sell anymore. Implying that it's a waste to spend a lot of money for studio time and then not making the money back. Video games are the huge sellers today, more so than physical CDs, records, & tapes or even DVD/Blu Ray.

But again that is not the issue, everyone hits that spot, everyone has their honeymoon period as Elton John called it, speaking on his days in the 70's and then going into the 80's. Billy Joel left the Album World because he felt he couldnt write POP music anymore, bascially citing he did enough, and did not want to push it, but he went out far from not being on top he was selling millions still, I think it would have fell off but he was a strong album seller from 1977 through 1992. Fleetwood Mac is a weird animal because TO ME they are a one album wonder type group, not taht other albums were not good, their success is based off that one album much like PRINCE was riding Purple Rain and that interest for awhile and had people hanging on. Mariah I look at more like a female Billy Joel because she was topping with singles and albums selling through the roof pretty consistent till she changed direction but even then she still maintained a huge following. I cant really put her into the "Touring greats" group because she just is not a strong touring force and never has been even when she was topping charts. My thing is pointing to the fact that you usually can hold a base, so what is her base? 50-100,000 fans? I mean that really is what this current album showed is that she does not have this huge following base, the whole "lambs" thing etc....doesnt really exist.


"We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F
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Reply #21 posted 12/30/18 4:06pm

MickyDolenz

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lastdecember said:

Mariah I look at more like a female Billy Joel because she was topping with singles and albums selling through the roof pretty consistent till she changed direction but even then she still maintained a huge following. I cant really put her into the "Touring greats" group because she just is not a strong touring force and never has been even when she was topping charts. My thing is pointing to the fact that you usually can hold a base, so what is her base? 50-100,000 fans? I mean that really is what this current album showed is that she does not have this huge following base, the whole "lambs" thing etc....doesnt really exist.

Mariah's career began when a lot of people still bought records at stores and they owned a stereo to play them on. That's not the case today. Most record stores are gone and so are stereo stores like Radio Shack. They don't even put CD/tape players in new cars anymore as a default. Department stores like Sears & Montgomery Wards used to sell records and they're mostly gone too. Best Buy stopped selling CDs and Wal-Mart only sells whatever is on the Top 10 in Billboard, Greatest Hits albums, and a few popular Spanish language artists. Then Wal-Mart only carry non-stickered CDs. Since most of the popular acts now are rap, that eliminates the customers for that since most of them do not want the bleeped out versions. Wal-Mart is more popular for country albums in the heartland. Adele sold a lot because her albums were available in many stores where people can see it, including places that normally don't sell CDs. Many people do not shop online because they don't have a credit card or they don't trust online shopping. Napster was the beginning of the demise of physical sales of music. It didn't help that CDs cost more than records & tapes did, but was cheaper to make. The RIAA now counts 1,500 streams a sale of 1 album.

For 65 years straight, the #1 genre in music, selling wise, was rock n' roll worldwide. Last year (2017) in June, it got de-crowned by hip hop. Hip hop is the #1 genre. It's hip hop - rock - country - pop or pop - country. ~ Pras
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Reply #22 posted 01/04/19 7:40am

Cinny

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I think the lambs are simply more likely to adopt current technology than other "loyal" fanbases, like those of a rock band from the nineteen seventies.

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