mjscarousal said:

PeteSilas said:

you guys can believe that if you want but anyone who's been as sociable and in the spotlight for as long as q has knows how to contain anything like that if he knew it was making him look bad. I think it was just what I said, kind of a gloating thing, kind of a "you left me and you couldn't make it on your own".

I agree.. if you consider someone to be your "brother" why try to defame them? Why disrespect them and their children? I don't see how anyone could excuse that behavior. Its not like Quincy was some random producer, MJ identified Q as a friend and so did he, so he should be held to that standard. He was a fake and not a geniune friend. I sense Quincy was jealous of MJ as well.

[Edited 7/27/17 18:32pm]

Jealous....jealous of what?

interesting, leave it to the brits to say things that american news might try to overlook. the only person i recall mentioning the white skin was comedian paul mooney. I'm sure black folks discussed it but like i said, i wasn't around a lot of black folks at that point in time, i just kinda assumed they weren't saying anything. I don't remember reading anything about it. Of course by the time of Dangerous, leave it to oprah to ask him about the shit. He definitely did have vitiligo, no arguement there but what I've read is that you can misuse that bleaching cream enough so that it'll cause vitiligo, so, in that case, maybe he wouldn't have turned white if he'd never used the stuff. It's a sad story, and as for me, doesn't really ruin MJ for me. I tell you, i was broken hearted for a good while when he died, my stepdad said he cried and my stepdad is a mean motherfucker so for anyone to have that effect on him has to be meaningful in some way.

bboy87 said:

Scorp said:

and Nelson George wrote that AFTER he said this in an interview during the moment the BAD LP was released.

....and then wrote this the following March

That's the thing, assumptions are assumptions, but what's really happening is a whole other ball game.

I'm black, and when that BAD video hit, in the united states, black people all across the land, were stunned in mass, not only stunned but instead of what those who followed love to describe as "bitter" (spoken from a position of entitlement), black people were angry and had every right to be considering who served as the basis and the foundation of his support from day one when J-5 cut those 4 #1 singles after debuting on the Ed Sullivan show in 1969....

Paul Mooney definitely wasn't the first black public figure to speak on the subject, by the time he had the opportunity to speak as such, the damage had already been done...and this is what this story is really all about, and the moment that Bad video hit, a message had been sent that it was never going to be the same again, and the Michael Jackson the world grew accustomed to watching growing from a child prodigy to an adult superstar, and a person his audience could relate to.....that ended at that moment....and the thing is, it wasn't just black people who were turned off, but allot of white people were turned off too, as well as fans from other cultures.....

to the human eye, when I saw Michael in that video, I did not think that was him, I thought it was somebody else, but the only reason I knew it was him is because it was him...that's how perplexing it became

and in this clip I posted......a clip that only has received less than 10,000 views on youtube (because few want to discuss the cold stone truth about the matter).....esteemed music/cultural critic Nelson George said point blank, "by Michael making such a drastic change in his appearance, it's going to offend allot of people, particularly his black audience, who are the basis of his appeal"

and that's exactly what happened, as Bad sold over 20 million copies less than its predecessor because......black people as whole during that time when it actually went down didn't need an explanation of what was going on with him, for we already knew, because it's spiritual.

the black audience is what made it possible for him to achieve the global superstardom he did because with any foundational support of any premier artist, that support is needed to build and maintain viability, and without his future following realizing it, after Bad, he spent the remainder of his career coming up with every means possible to regain that lost audience (collaborating with Teddy Riley, having the Eddie Murphys, Magic Johnsons, Michael Jordans, Heavy Ds, Kris Kross's, John Landis, Boyz II Mens, Shaquille Oneals, Notorius B.I.G, his sister Janet, The R. Kelly's, Floetry, Chris Tuckers, Dr. Freeze, Babyface, Tyrese Gibson, Rodney Jerkins either star in his videos or perform on his songs, or product or song write for him) and those efforts did not work ultimately because.........it didn't matter how popular they were during that time, it was about him and how he viewed himself and the degree he changed himself that was the deciding factor.................and when he was visibly black, he didn't need to rely on all that, he could star in a video himself and that video stood out more because of who he already was.

and I'm not saying one audience is better than the other...it's not about that, but those who bought Jackson Five records from day one, even before a person such as myself was old enough to really start enjoying their music and knowing who they were by the mid 70s, they made it possible

and it did not have to be this way, this really could have been the greatest story that every unfolded in the history of music w/out the tragic ending. It was right there for it to happen, if he had not done all that to himself......every single one of his follow up albums to Thriller would have sold more than what they did because he would not have lost his foundational support, I'll put all my years of following his adult solo career on that....he would have been a happier person and he would not have received all the ridicule, scrutiny, and criticism he did, and he would not have subject of those allegations, and he would have never felt the need to make songs such as Scream, Money, They Don't Really Care About Us, or a Leave Me Alone.......it would not have happened.....AND there would be no dissension between younger fans and older fans, there would have always been a natural continuum

That's how good he had it.

see, he never expected all the media scrutiny he did, and that's why he said in the song They Don't Really Care About Us...

Tell me what has become of my rights
Am I invisible because you ignore me?
Your proclamation promised me free liberty, now
I'm tired of bein' the victim of shame
They're throwing me in a class with a bad name
I can't believe this is the land from which I came

PeteSilas said:

interesting, leave it to the brits to say things that american news might try to overlook. the only person i recall mentioning the white skin was comedian paul mooney. I'm sure black folks discussed it but like i said, i wasn't around a lot of black folks at that point in time, i just kinda assumed they weren't saying anything. I don't remember reading anything about it. Of course by the time of Dangerous, leave it to oprah to ask him about the shit. He definitely did have vitiligo, no arguement there but what I've read is that you can misuse that bleaching cream enough so that it'll cause vitiligo, so, in that case, maybe he wouldn't have turned white if he'd never used the stuff. It's a sad story, and as for me, doesn't really ruin MJ for me. I tell you, i was broken hearted for a good while when he died, my stepdad said he cried and my stepdad is a mean motherfucker so for anyone to have that effect on him has to be meaningful in some way.

bboy87 said:

....and then wrote this the following March

[Edited 7/28/17 7:33am]

Scorp said:

mjscarousal said:

I agree.. if you consider someone to be your "brother" why try to defame them? Why disrespect them and their children? I don't see how anyone could excuse that behavior. Its not like Quincy was some random producer, MJ identified Q as a friend and so did he, so he should be held to that standard. He was a fake and not a geniune friend. I sense Quincy was jealous of MJ as well.

[Edited 7/27/17 18:32pm]

Jealous....jealous of what?

That's what I'm saying! Quincy is a jazz legend, and simply one of the greatest producers in this history of recorded music. He made signature sounds for Frank Sinatra and Michael Jackson. He's produced successful artists in nearly every genre. He's got Grammys, awards, and fame and fortune most people can only dream of.

Jealous of MJ? Really?

He just wanted to get what was owed him, not from MJ himself, but from the folks managing his estate.

[Edited 7/28/17 11:06am]

namepeace said:

Scorp said:

Jealous....jealous of what?

That's what I'm saying! Quincy is a jazz legend, and simply one of the greatest producers in this history of recorded music. He made signature sounds for Frank Sinatra and Michael Jackson. He's produced successful artists in nearly every genre. He's got Grammys, awards, and fame and fortune most people can only dream of.

Jealous of MJ? Really?

He just wanted to get what was owed him, not from MJ himself, but from the folks managing his estate.

[Edited 7/28/17 11:06am]

If you were familiar with Quincy's disrespectful behavior and comments towards Michael you would understand why I said that.

mjscarousal said:

namepeace said:

That's what I'm saying! Quincy is a jazz legend, and simply one of the greatest producers in this history of recorded music. He made signature sounds for Frank Sinatra and Michael Jackson. He's produced successful artists in nearly every genre. He's got Grammys, awards, and fame and fortune most people can only dream of.

Jealous of MJ? Really?

He just wanted to get what was owed him, not from MJ himself, but from the folks managing his estate.

[Edited 7/28/17 11:06am]

If you were familiar with Quincy's disrespectful behavior and comments towards Michael you would understand why I said that.

See Reply 222. I already said that it's easy to see how that relationship may have gotten messy over the years.

Even if QJ's comments over the years could be perceived as "disrespectful" (like comments about him being "weird" and having "no idea what he was doing" making Thriller), I don't see QJ being "jealous" of MJ. They exist in different worlds. They were never peers of each other.

The only thing I think Quincy could be resentful of MJ about would be money and credit for putting the album together. But that ain't jealousy; that's about QJ getting his due financially (which a court partially validated) and artistically (which honestly, many MJ fans still deny him). Otherwise, he doesn't care. His resume is one of a kind.

[Edited 7/28/17 12:35pm]

namepeace said:

Scorp said:

Jealous....jealous of what?

That's what I'm saying! Quincy is a jazz legend, and simply one of the greatest producers in this history of recorded music. He made signature sounds for Frank Sinatra and Michael Jackson. He's produced successful artists in nearly every genre. He's got Grammys, awards, and fame and fortune most people can only dream of.

Jealous of MJ? Really?

He just wanted to get what was owed him, not from MJ himself, but from the folks managing his estate.

[Edited 7/28/17 11:06am]

The most decorated grammy award winner ever

namepeace said:

mjscarousal said:

If you were familiar with Quincy's disrespectful behavior and comments towards Michael you would understand why I said that.

See Reply 222. I already said that it's easy to see how that relationship may have gotten messy over the years.

Even if QJ's comments over the years could be perceived as "disrespectful" (like comments about him being "weird" and having "no idea what he was doing" making Thriller), I don't see QJ being "jealous" of MJ. They exist in different worlds. They were never peers of each other.

The only thing I think Quincy could be resentful of MJ about would be money and credit for putting the album together. But that ain't jealousy; that's about QJ getting his due financially (which a court partially validated) and artistically (which honestly, many MJ fans still deny him). Otherwise, he doesn't care. His resume is one of a kind.

[Edited 7/28/17 12:35pm]

He has made comments that imply that he may be jealous of him. He suggested that MJ gets to much credit for albums that he worked on with him and some of his personal attacks IMO come from a place of jealousy. Why talk about someone's children? Why call your friend out his name? I have no respect for Quincy at all, NONE. When he heard that MJ's estate was worth a billion dollars, he immediately sued and automatically felt entitled to money. Q feels entitled to things that MJ earned on his own.

all kinds of dynamics there, no doubt, i don't know if i'd label it jealousy. Maybe you could, jealousy implies he wants what michael had, the fame and the glamour. I think he did want the credit for "making" him, like i said, and that's what makes him such an asshole. I learned not to let those kinds of people into my life anymore becuase those kinds are everywhere and if you don't do what they want always, they have a mentality called "i made you and I can break you".

mjscarousal said:

namepeace said:

See Reply 222. I already said that it's easy to see how that relationship may have gotten messy over the years.

Even if QJ's comments over the years could be perceived as "disrespectful" (like comments about him being "weird" and having "no idea what he was doing" making Thriller), I don't see QJ being "jealous" of MJ. They exist in different worlds. They were never peers of each other.

The only thing I think Quincy could be resentful of MJ about would be money and credit for putting the album together. But that ain't jealousy; that's about QJ getting his due financially (which a court partially validated) and artistically (which honestly, many MJ fans still deny him). Otherwise, he doesn't care. His resume is one of a kind.

[Edited 7/28/17 12:35pm]

He has made comments that imply that he may be jealous of him. He suggested that MJ gets to much credit for albums that he worked on with him and some of his personal attacks IMO come from a place of jealousy. Why talk about someone's children? Why call your friend out his name? I have no respect for Quincy at all, NONE. When he heard that MJ's estate was worth a billion dollars, he immediately sued and automatically felt entitled to money. Q feels entitled to things that MJ earned on his own.

PeteSilas said:

all kinds of dynamics there, no doubt, i don't know if i'd label it jealousy. Maybe you could, jealousy implies he wants what michael had, the fame and the glamour. I think he did want the credit for "making" him, like i said, and that's what makes him such an asshole. I learned not to let those kinds of people into my life anymore becuase those kinds are everywhere and if you don't do what they want always, they have a mentality called "i made you and I can break you".

mjscarousal said:

He has made comments that imply that he may be jealous of him. He suggested that MJ gets to much credit for albums that he worked on with him and some of his personal attacks IMO come from a place of jealousy. Why talk about someone's children? Why call your friend out his name? I have no respect for Quincy at all, NONE. When he heard that MJ's estate was worth a billion dollars, he immediately sued and automatically felt entitled to money. Q feels entitled to things that MJ earned on his own.

Of coure he does and I think he does envy Michael's success. You can be successful and still envy the success of others. Quincy comments implies he feels entitled to a lot of Michael's success, fame, money, etc.

mjscarousal said:

PeteSilas said:

all kinds of dynamics there, no doubt, i don't know if i'd label it jealousy. Maybe you could, jealousy implies he wants what michael had, the fame and the glamour. I think he did want the credit for "making" him, like i said, and that's what makes him such an asshole. I learned not to let those kinds of people into my life anymore becuase those kinds are everywhere and if you don't do what they want always, they have a mentality called "i made you and I can break you".

Of coure he does and I think he does envy Michael's success. You can be successful and still envy the success of others. Quincy comments implies he feels entitled to a lot of Michael's success, fame, money, etc.

damn shame, i used to be the biggest q fan too, now here i am wanting to roll his wheelchair off a dock.

I use to have tremendous respect for Quincy and his role in Michael's first 3 solo adult albums. However, when he FIRST talked shit about MJ in 04, I was DONE. He said OUT HIS MOUTH I only know MJ the artist not the person" after years of publically referring to MJ as a close friend. That is FAKE and then once MJ died, he just proved that he never gave a damn about Michael. I think its pathetic people are making excuses for his behavior. Quincy Jones doesn't deserve any sympathy. He was never MJ's friend and he has made that perfectly clear. The only person I feel sorry for is Michael because everyone just used him and took advantage of his kindness.

PeteSilas said:

damn shame, i used to be the biggest q fan too, now here i am wanting to roll his wheelchair off a dock.

[Snip - luv4u]

I won't get tired of saying Bless His Soul is such a prophetic song, the man himself was tellin us in advance what would happen less than 20 years later.

214 said:

PeteSilas said:

damn shame, i used to be the biggest q fan too, now here i am wanting to roll his wheelchair off a dock.

[Snip - luv4u]

[Snip - luv4u]

mjscarousal said:

I use to have tremendous respect for Quincy and his role in Michael's first 3 solo adult albums. However, when he FIRST talked shit about MJ in 04, I was DONE. He said OUT HIS MOUTH I only know MJ the artist not the person" after years of publically referring to MJ as a close friend. That is FAKE and then once MJ died, he just proved that he never gave a damn about Michael. I think its pathetic people are making excuses for his behavior. Quincy Jones doesn't deserve any sympathy. He was never MJ's friend and he has made that perfectly clear. The only person I feel sorry for is Michael because everyone just used him and took advantage of his kindness.

yup, after enough of those kinds of statements I just turned on him because I always felt like he'd have been a much, much lesser figure in american music without MJ, MJ gave him newfound clout which he parlayed into movies and tv. with mj? it's like malcolm x said in his book when he spoke about the mentor that had him killed "when i think about it, we picked each other up" or rather who made who here?

PeteSilas said:

mjscarousal said:

I use to have tremendous respect for Quincy and his role in Michael's first 3 solo adult albums. However, when he FIRST talked shit about MJ in 04, I was DONE. He said OUT HIS MOUTH I only know MJ the artist not the person" after years of publically referring to MJ as a close friend. That is FAKE and then once MJ died, he just proved that he never gave a damn about Michael. I think its pathetic people are making excuses for his behavior. Quincy Jones doesn't deserve any sympathy. He was never MJ's friend and he has made that perfectly clear. The only person I feel sorry for is Michael because everyone just used him and took advantage of his kindness.

yup, after enough of those kinds of statements I just turned on him because I always felt like he'd have been a much, much lesser figure in american music without MJ, MJ gave him newfound clout which he parlayed into movies and tv. with mj? it's like malcolm x said in his book when he spoke about the mentor that had him killed "when i think about it, we picked each other up" or rather who made who here?

newfound clout?

Quincy was already the best musical producer/composer on planet earth by the time the 70s hit, the first black person chosen to create the musical score for the Oscars.....heck, in the 60s, he became the first vice president of a major recold label at Mercury

that world famous composition "Sout Bossa Nova" that's played at world cup soccer games to this very day, the same tune that's featured in the Austin Powers movie that cashed in at the box office, Quincy Jones created that......

Countless musical scores for over 55 motion pictures/TV shows combined....

That Sanford & Son theme music....That's Quincy Jones.....

The classic song by Leslie Gore "It's My Party (I do what I want to)" ...back in the 60s, Quincy Jones produced that, that song hit #1 in the United States.......I won't even mention the works and compositions he did for Frank Sinatra, Duke Ellington, Sarah Vaughn, Dinah Washington, Dizzy Gillespie, Miles Davis, Billy Eckstine, Ella Fitzgerald

and in 1977, produced the musical score for the most watched TV mini series of all time in Alex Haley's "Roots"....

He was already the most accomplished composer in the recording industry before Michael Jackson went adult solo.......

truth be told, MIchael Jackson probably wanted Quincy Jones to product his debut adult solo album from jump street but went about it indirectly without coming right out and saying it...

[Edited 7/28/17 20:48pm]

PeteSilas said:

all kinds of dynamics there, no doubt, i don't know if i'd label it jealousy. Maybe you could, jealousy implies he wants what michael had, the fame and the glamour.

That was the point. Agreed.

I don't know why its so hard to believe that Quincy may envy Michael when he constantly makes statements that imply that he does.

scorp, i know all about the man, i'd probably still be a fan if he hadn't made all those comments. I stand by my statement, michael just gave him more juice, the record company didn't even like the idea of him as producer, which i'm sure you know. His biggest talent is as a social animal and a bullshitter, that's his biggest talent. No doubt he's great though but i'm no longer a fan.

Scorp said:

PeteSilas said:

yup, after enough of those kinds of statements I just turned on him because I always felt like he'd have been a much, much lesser figure in american music without MJ, MJ gave him newfound clout which he parlayed into movies and tv. with mj? it's like malcolm x said in his book when he spoke about the mentor that had him killed "when i think about it, we picked each other up" or rather who made who here?

newfound clout?

Quincy was already the best musical producer/composer on planet earth by the time the 70s hit, the first black person chosen to create the musical score for the Oscars.....heck, in the 60s, he became the first vice president of a major recold label at Mercury

that world famous composition "Sout Bossa Nova" that's played at world cup soccer games to this very day, the same tune that's featured in the Austin Powers movie that cashed in at the box office, Quincy Jones created that......

Countless musical scores for over 55 motion pictures/TV shows combined....

That Sanford & Son theme music....That's Quincy Jones.....

The classic song by Leslie Gore "It's My Party (I do what I want to)" ...back in the 60s, Quincy Jones produced that, that song hit #1 in the United States.......I won't even mention the works and compositions he did for Frank Sinatra, Duke Ellington, Sarah Vaughn, Dinah Washington, Dizzy Gillespie, Miles Davis, Billy Eckstine, Ella Fitzgerald

and in 1977, produced the musical score for the most watched TV mini series of all time in Alex Haley's "Roots"....

He was already the most accomplished composer in the recording industry before Michael Jackson went adult solo.......

truth be told, MIchael Jackson probably wanted Quincy Jones to product his debut adult solo album from jump street but went about it indirectly without coming right out and saying it...

[Edited 7/28/17 20:48pm]

mjscarousal said:

I use to have tremendous respect for Quincy and his role in Michael's first 3 solo adult albums. However, when he FIRST talked shit about MJ in 04, I was DONE. He said OUT HIS MOUTH I only know MJ the artist not the person" after years of publically referring to MJ as a close friend. That is FAKE and then once MJ died, he just proved that he never gave a damn about Michael. I think its pathetic people are making excuses for his behavior. Quincy Jones doesn't deserve any sympathy. He was never MJ's friend and he has made that perfectly clear. The only person I feel sorry for is Michael because everyone just used him and took advantage of his kindness.

It was really disappointing when he first turned his back on him around the time of the trial ("I only know the music and not the man," quote) to his comments about MJ etc after 2009

Goddess4Real said:

mjscarousal said:

I use to have tremendous respect for Quincy and his role in Michael's first 3 solo adult albums. However, when he FIRST talked shit about MJ in 04, I was DONE. He said OUT HIS MOUTH I only know MJ the artist not the person" after years of publically referring to MJ as a close friend. That is FAKE and then once MJ died, he just proved that he never gave a damn about Michael. I think its pathetic people are making excuses for his behavior. Quincy Jones doesn't deserve any sympathy. He was never MJ's friend and he has made that perfectly clear. The only person I feel sorry for is Michael because everyone just used him and took advantage of his kindness.

It was really disappointing when he first turned his back on him around the time of the trial ("I only know the music and not the man," quote) to his comments about MJ etc after 2009

How did Quincy Jones turned his back when MJ cut himself off from everyone who didn't support his false image?......

He turned his back on himself and how God created him to be naturally.

Take the false image out the entire equation and none of those allegations including that unncessary trial wouldn't have even happened.......

fans would never ever had sad a word if everything would have worked according to plan and they dont' want the real story to be told because it would show just how much Michael Jackson was misled after reaching the pinnacle of his career by moving beyond his natural being and that's why he's no longer here today because nothing good came out of it...not one single thing

[Edited 7/29/17 18:43pm]

his race issues and the legal issues aren't the same scorp. I don't think quincy had much issue with Mike changing his face but i don't know, at least publicly, he never said anything negative during the earlier eras, i still have a people article from the bad era where he calls michael "the most normal guy I know". Anyway, there are different types of people, haven't you ever been through some shit where people abandoned you? some kind of hard time, maybe even completely out of your control? I've seen people with health issues suddendly wonder where all their friends went, people who get in trouble with the law find out they have no friends or what have you. but sometimes there are the die hard friends, those are rare, quincy is not one of them. just look at cosby, everyone has turned on the man, even the people who looked up at him as a mentor over the years are making statements like "i don't know the man, i just worked with him" therefore, when you have a phylicia rashad stand up for Bill, that shows a mark of character if not good judgement because anyone who stands up for bill now faces ostracization too. even the girl who played rudy took heat for escorting the man to court.

Scorp said:

Goddess4Real said:

It was really disappointing when he first turned his back on him around the time of the trial ("I only know the music and not the man," quote) to his comments about MJ etc after 2009

How did Quincy Jones turned his back when MJ cut himself off from everyone who didn't support his false image?......

He turned his back on himself and how God created him to be naturally.

Take the false image out the entire equation and none of those allegations including that unncessary trial wouldn't have even happened.......

fans would never ever had sad a word if everything would have worked according to plan and they dont' want the real story to be told because it would show just how much Michael Jackson was misled after reaching the pinnacle of his career by moving beyond his natural being and that's why he's no longer here today because nothing good came out of it...not one single thing

[Edited 7/29/17 18:43pm]

anyway, when you have footage of q sitting next to mj and his snake as if it was the most normal thing in the world and then him talking shit post-death about michael and his animals and how one bit one of his daughters show him to be a two face at best.

One dynamic led to the other.....moving beyond his natural being led to ambigous situations that put him in situations for allegations to surface...as early as 1989, based on that same false image, me as a teenage fan of his musical message, I could already see that sooner or later, he was setting himself up for allegations....that's why when the first allegations occurred in 93, it didn't suprise me at all...not one iota

and just like Nelson George's commentary post MJ's career, the psychology is the same of what Quincy said about "being the most normal guy I know" highlights how both men at different points tried to protect their memories of what MJ used to be........

and some realness needs to be applied here instead of all this beating around the bush..........when someone is accussed of something like that, or I should say when that same person continues to put himself in the same position as the first time and gets accused for it a second time, people who truly care about you are going to become frustrated with your actions and show anger in the process

and all this talk about Quincy Jones "abandoning" him, I saw zero of his supposed "friends" who showed up in that courtroom during that trial which wasn't a surprise to me at all....because they were cool on it, those six months during that trial, there was not one peep out of them, not even little bo peep

there wasn't this talk about abandonment during the years of Off The Wall or Thriller......

and fans act like the Quincy Jones of the world don't read, or have TV to watch where fans crap on him or coming up with fables talking about stuff like he didn't want the Billie Jean single on Thriller..just making up stuff right out the blue....and he knows there's an attempt to write him out of MJs history because not all, but the majority of them want Michael to be remembered as the King of Pop and nothing else

PeteSilas said:

his race issues and the legal issues aren't the same scorp. I don't think quincy had much issue with Mike changing his face but i don't know, at least publicly, he never said anything negative during the earlier eras, i still have a people article from the bad era where he calls michael "the most normal guy I know". Anyway, there are different types of people, haven't you ever been through some shit where people abandoned you? some kind of hard time, maybe even completely out of your control? I've seen people with health issues suddendly wonder where all their friends went, people who get in trouble with the law find out they have no friends or what have you. but sometimes there are the die hard friends, those are rare, quincy is not one of them. just look at cosby, everyone has turned on the man, even the people who looked up at him as a mentor over the years are making statements like "i don't know the man, i just worked with him" therefore, when you have a phylicia rashad stand up for Bill, that shows a mark of character if not good judgement because anyone who stands up for bill now faces ostracization too. even the girl who played rudy took heat for escorting the man to court.

Scorp said:

How did Quincy Jones turned his back when MJ cut himself off from everyone who didn't support his false image?......

He turned his back on himself and how God created him to be naturally.

Take the false image out the entire equation and none of those allegations including that unncessary trial wouldn't have even happened.......

fans would never ever had sad a word if everything would have worked according to plan and they dont' want the real story to be told because it would show just how much Michael Jackson was misled after reaching the pinnacle of his career by moving beyond his natural being and that's why he's no longer here today because nothing good came out of it...not one single thing

[Edited 7/29/17 18:43pm]

[Edited 7/29/17 19:39pm]

there are just as many semi-fans, or people who don't know as much about Mj/Q who think mj was created by q, just like there are mmany people who still think elvis was nothing more than a result of colonel tom parker. q is in no danger of that and you know it.

PeteSilas said:

his race issues and the legal issues aren't the same scorp. I don't think quincy had much issue with Mike changing his face but i don't know, at least publicly, he never said anything negative during the earlier eras, i still have a people article from the bad era where he calls michael "the most normal guy I know". Anyway, there are different types of people, haven't you ever been through some shit where people abandoned you? some kind of hard time, maybe even completely out of your control? I've seen people with health issues suddendly wonder where all their friends went, people who get in trouble with the law find out they have no friends or what have you. but sometimes there are the die hard friends, those are rare, quincy is not one of them. just look at cosby, everyone has turned on the man, even the people who looked up at him as a mentor over the years are making statements like "i don't know the man, i just worked with him" therefore, when you have a phylicia rashad stand up for Bill, that shows a mark of character if not good judgement because anyone who stands up for bill now faces ostracization too. even the girl who played rudy took heat for escorting the man to court.

Scorp said:

How did Quincy Jones turned his back when MJ cut himself off from everyone who didn't support his false image?......

He turned his back on himself and how God created him to be naturally.

Take the false image out the entire equation and none of those allegations including that unncessary trial wouldn't have even happened.......

fans would never ever had sad a word if everything would have worked according to plan and they dont' want the real story to be told because it would show just how much Michael Jackson was misled after reaching the pinnacle of his career by moving beyond his natural being and that's why he's no longer here today because nothing good came out of it...not one single thing

[Edited 7/29/17 18:43pm]

Hun, Scorp hates MJ...period (regardless of how much he lies and says he doesn't). Its a lost cause going back and forth with him. He thinks anyone who has slandered MJ has not done anything wrong.

[Edited 7/30/17 1:24am]

ya, i get it but i'm just trying to see his point, he talks like he was there, he probably wasn't as none of us were. Lots of the conjecture for motive would need some proof I think, i'm trying to get him to give it up. And at any rate, It allows me to vent on a mentor turned, a mentor failed, i've had a few and had I known then what i know now, they wouldn't have been allowed in my life in the first place. Michael could have been like Prince in terms of doing it all as a BOSS but unlike prince, he didn't have that fierce need for independence or the scars that made it impossible to rely on anyone.

mjscarousal said:

PeteSilas said:

his race issues and the legal issues aren't the same scorp. I don't think quincy had much issue with Mike changing his face but i don't know, at least publicly, he never said anything negative during the earlier eras, i still have a people article from the bad era where he calls michael "the most normal guy I know". Anyway, there are different types of people, haven't you ever been through some shit where people abandoned you? some kind of hard time, maybe even completely out of your control? I've seen people with health issues suddendly wonder where all their friends went, people who get in trouble with the law find out they have no friends or what have you. but sometimes there are the die hard friends, those are rare, quincy is not one of them. just look at cosby, everyone has turned on the man, even the people who looked up at him as a mentor over the years are making statements like "i don't know the man, i just worked with him" therefore, when you have a phylicia rashad stand up for Bill, that shows a mark of character if not good judgement because anyone who stands up for bill now faces ostracization too. even the girl who played rudy took heat for escorting the man to court.

Hun, Scorp hates MJ...period (regardless of how much he lies and says he doesn't). Its a lost cause going back and forth with him. He thinks anyone who has slandered MJ has not done anything wrong.

[Edited 7/30/17 1:24am]

mjscarousal said:

PeteSilas said:

his race issues and the legal issues aren't the same scorp. I don't think quincy had much issue with Mike changing his face but i don't know, at least publicly, he never said anything negative during the earlier eras, i still have a people article from the bad era where he calls michael "the most normal guy I know". Anyway, there are different types of people, haven't you ever been through some shit where people abandoned you? some kind of hard time, maybe even completely out of your control? I've seen people with health issues suddendly wonder where all their friends went, people who get in trouble with the law find out they have no friends or what have you. but sometimes there are the die hard friends, those are rare, quincy is not one of them. just look at cosby, everyone has turned on the man, even the people who looked up at him as a mentor over the years are making statements like "i don't know the man, i just worked with him" therefore, when you have a phylicia rashad stand up for Bill, that shows a mark of character if not good judgement because anyone who stands up for bill now faces ostracization too. even the girl who played rudy took heat for escorting the man to court.

Hun, Scorp hates MJ...period (regardless of how much he lies and says he doesn't). Its a lost cause going back and forth with him. He thinks anyone who has slandered MJ has not done anything wrong.

[Edited 7/30/17 1:24am]

Wrong as usual and I will respond to all this later