I finally got around to listening to Sananda's lastest output: The Rise of the Zugebrian Time Lords.

What the hell happened to TTD? This is bad........

Graycap23 said:

I finally got around to listening to Sananda's lastest output: The Rise of the Zugebrian Time Lords.

What the hell happened to TTD? This is bad........

is it? i never listened to some of the later stuff because from the little I heard it just didn't catch me. his voice is still in fine form but I don't get the sense that his recording/songwriting/producing chops are there. Sound very unfinished.

lool said:

Ellie said:

I sriously gave up on him after Angels & Vampires.

that bad huh? the idea and title is a great concept, i never heard much of it though.

I like many of the songs on Prometheus and Pandora. It's admirable the way he evolved from being an obnoxious upstart into a genre-bending writer/instrumentalist.

"Prometheus & Pandora" is not finished yet... He's finishing 9 more songs for the last chapter. If you look on his twitter page he mentions that he's still working on finishing it.

In spite of that, Chapters 1-3 are already available for download.

@Identity: Cool... Didn't mean to suggest otherwise. "Prometheus and Pandora" is the first Sananda album that I haven't downloaded individual tracks ahead of time, I'm waiting for the finished cd. Good to hear that it sounds good. It seems to be a mix of old and new Sananda songs. Should be another great collection of songs... And if I'm not mistaken, around 40 songs on the finished cd!

Looking forward to getting the final product.

His output is way too out there for me. He started these wide spanning opuses of shit years ago, and the quality is just garbage. The album with "O Davina" in 2001 was his last good one, IMO. He did release a few singles here & there that were okay. But in general.... girl, bye.

Graycap23 said:

PeteSilas said:

you don't need state of the art anymore. I've been meaning to listen to his stuff but i never get around to it. I still go through phases when i binge on his early stuff the guy was/is amazing.

NorthC said:

PeteSilas said:

is it? i never listened to some of the later stuff because from the little I heard it just didn't catch me. his voice is still in fine form but I don't get the sense that his recording/songwriting/producing chops are there. Sound very unfinished.

He still writes great songs, better than Prince in his later years imho. But because he isn't a superstar with a state of the art studio, he has to record on the cheap and that's why it may sound unfinished. I'd say, give it a chance. As a singer and a songwriter, he is still good. Even if you may need to get used to his new sound...

^^^I'd say just go for it and give his stuff a listen--be down with the 99! I'm enjoying the continuum of Sananda's sound. He's on most streaming services plus much stuff is on Youtube--he even has his own channel & is quite accessible on his website. He remains a good songwriter and singer. If you're into more of the contemporary standard R&B or whatever smooth production, the sound may not be particularly for you. His indie vibe apparently puts some people off, but it is a thing that he embraces and there are those of us who welcome the sound dearly. It really does maintain a quality of integrity. I've got most all of his stuff, save 1 album and I'm still angling to grab the one I missed, too.

>

His forthcoming project, "Prometheus and Pandora" appears to contain older material that others have mentioned had been released as singles and free downloads in past years, along with new jams to follow in the vein of his last project, "Return of the Zugebrian Time Lords." I can't wait for it to drop.

>

>

*On a soapbox ramble*

I believe if Prince had taken his independent route more in the direction that Sananda had done, compromised with the old labels to produce those treasured reissues and maintained the option to release new material independently with his own little label and distribution team, like SM's Treehouse Publishing does, he might still be walking the Earth today. Instead P chose to keep up the bigger productions and fight a broader battle for artists' rights; such effort takes time, and along the way he took one too many a pill to keep his pain and age at bay.

>

Then again, had P. made such concessions and left the medications alone, he might be sadly witnessing D.J.T. destroying the dignity and potential of the land today (sorry--if you're not down with the 1% and aren't a bigot, you get my point), and hearing sucky "fans" complain about "Prince's diminished abilities and decision-making...." Well, then, I think his worries are done. R.I.P. Prince. I'll visit the P.P. soon to pay my respects. In the meanwhile, Rock on, Sananda!

[Edited 5/26/17 22:52pm]

i don't necessarily doubt you, just haven't gotten around to it but i never, never stopped being a huge fan. I've contacted him a couple times and whenever a MJ or a Prince dies, i go to his page and thank him for still being here, and yes, i consider him in that league without a doubt.

I still don't know what to make of the whole prince fiasco, i just watched a great docu called slave trade for the second time this week, trying to understand. you're right, prince could have scaled down years ago, lived a simpler life but he seemed bent on having the fancy clothes, the lifestyle, the perks of being a superstar. He was definitely not happy on either side of the fence, he wouldn't have been happy being like his father, an unknown talent and he didn't seem to be happy with the lack of privacy or even the record deals he got. Watching the docu made me wish i had some of his "problems" it ain't easy being an unknown musician, sure he was getting screwed but he didn't have to go through the mess most of us go through.

Germanegro said:

^^^I'd say just go for it and give his stuff a listen--be down with the 99! I'm enjoying the continuum of Sananda's sound. He's on most streaming services plus much stuff is on Youtube--he even has his own channel & is quite accessible on his website. He remains a good songwriter and singer. If you're into more of the contemporary standard R&B or whatever smooth production, the sound may not be particularly for you. His indie vibe apparently puts some people off, but it is a thing that he embraces and there are those of us who welcome the sound dearly. It really does maintain a quality of integrity. I've got most all of his stuff, save 1 album and I'm still angling to grab the one I missed, too.

>

His forthcoming project, "Prometheus and Pandora" appears to contain older material that others have mentioned had been released as singles and free downloads in past years, along with new jams to follow in the vein of his last project, "Return of the Zugebrian Time Lords." I can't wait for it to drop.

>

>

*On a soapbox ramble*

I believe if Prince had taken his independent route more in the direction that Sananda had done, compromised with the old labels to produce those treasured reissues and maintained the option to release new material independently with his own little label and distribution team, like SM's Treehouse Publishing does, he might still be walking the Earth today. Instead P chose to keep up the bigger productions and fight a broader battle for artists' rights; such effort takes time, and along the way he took one too many a pill to keep his pain and age at bay.

>

Then again, had P. made such concessions and left the medications alone, he might be sadly witnessing D.J.T. destroying the dignity and potential of the land today (sorry--if you're not down with the 1% and aren't a bigot, you get my point), and hearing sucky "fans" complain about "Prince's diminished abilities and decision-making...." Well, then, I think his worries are done. R.I.P. Prince. I'll visit the P.P. soon to pay my respects. In the meanwhile, Rock on, Sananda!

[Edited 5/26/17 22:52pm]

Prince just had so much to give to the world--he was so inspiring in so many ways throughout his life to the onlookers who paid attention. And, yeah, conflicted too--caught between his need for privacy and the grandiosement of talent and beckoning worldwide attention; piety and sensuality. He just had so much to give that he just wore himself out in the process of trying to make "it" --the realization of his visions--happen. Slave Trade is a very good overview of his post 80s career, IMO, a highly valued part of video library.

>

Sananda took his beatdowns early and profusely. People strait-up detested his braggadoccio--I enjoyed it, however, 'cause that's what I feel these special people are here for, like our real-time superheroes, but whatever. I think I'm in the small minority, here. Prince went there, too, living the legendary role, and being so forward-thinking--I can't say too much about that. I think the uniqueness and simplicity of Prince's communication with people, the way he touched the psyche and would then retreat had kept an aura around him that somehow cloaked him from some of the beatdown, early on. His original vision was to be a cult version of diversity. It also didn't hurt that he arrived to the "fame club" second to MJ. Three is a crowd!

>

Sananda ultimately retreated, went humble, looked within, took strength from his treasured and nurturing associations, and continued forth with his brilliant wit, courage and wonder if accompanied by a smidge of paranoia, himself being a sensitive character. He has said that he regrets not having created a project like Prince's Purple Rain, but nevertheless I've been ready for his "Post-Millenium Rock" sound. Folky, gritty stuff with hints toward future shapeshifting. I like it!

Germanegro said:

Prince just had so much to give to the world--he was so inspiring in so many ways throughout his life to the onlookers who paid attention. And, yeah, conflicted too--caught between his need for privacy and the grandiosement of talent and beckoning worldwide attention; piety and sensuality. He just had so much to give that he just wore himself out in the process of trying to make "it" --the realization of his visions--happen. Slave Trade is a very good overview of his post 80s career, IMO, a highly valued part of video library.

>

Sananda took his beatdowns early and profusely. People strait-up detested his braggadoccio--I enjoyed it, however, 'cause that's what I feel these special people are here for, like our real-time superheroes, but whatever. I think I'm in the small minority, here. Prince went there, too, living the legendary role, and being so forward-thinking--I can't say too much about that. I think the uniqueness and simplicity of Prince's communication with people, the way he touched the psyche and would then retreat had kept an aura around him that somehow cloaked him from some of the beatdown, early on. His original vision was to be a cult version of diversity. It also didn't hurt that he arrived to the "fame club" second to MJ. Three is a crowd!

>

Sananda ultimately retreated, went humble, looked within, took strength from his treasured and nurturing associations, and continued forth with his brilliant wit, courage and wonder if accompanied by a smidge of paranoia, himself being a sensitive character. He has said that he regrets not having created a project like Prince's Purple Rain, but nevertheless I've been ready for his "Post-Millenium Rock" sound. Folky, gritty stuff with hints toward future shapeshifting. I like it!

Slave trade was somewhat illuminating and I hope it's accurate. Alan Leeds made it seem like Prince was pushing for that 100 million dollar deal just to match mj and madonna, i didn't know that. It's crazy to think he actually thought he could sell 5 mill an album for all those advances, he had delusional belief in himself, maybe because it worked for him earlier. Or, maybe his ego just got the better of him. Like I say, he was spoiled, even if he was getting fucked, compared to most of us musicians he had it great. Many of us have to go through all kinds of humiliation and financial problems, especially today with such a saturated market and with the death of the industry. However, for Prince, it did sound like it worked out for the best, even the emancipation album didn't go gold and he made five mill on it, that's not bad and he learned his business. I was left wondering why he went back to WB, I was thinking, maybe he did know he'd die soon and trusted WB more than whoever else would have gotten his music.

With sananda, i keep swearing i'm going to download all his stuff and i just never get around to it, i always listen to the stuff he posts online and some of it's ok, his voice is still in fine fettle. It's just that some of his tunes sound half-baked. He really said he wanted to make a purple rain huh? I still think Symphony or Damn is the last great concept album, just exceptionally good and better than what prince and mj had out at the time. I also loved Neither Fish nor Flesh, a great album and of course his debut album which I still consider the best debut ever by anyone. He has said that MJ sabotaged him, i've also read that was true or at least MJ attempted to do that. Truth was though, by the time of Symphony or Damn, the music business was totally revolutionized by grunge and hip hop. Prince and MJ were effected too but Terence was pretty much robbed of his moment. I don't think it was his mouth although I'm sure it did rub lots of people the wrong way. Also, i think his leap into psychedelia on his second album was premature. You know, these artists always blame the company for not promoting but sometimes the public just isn't ready for the music and no one can force them. Each of those guys and george michael too tried to blame the record companies but it's more likely in my opinion that the fickle pop audience just wasn't interested. Bruce Springsteen had two albums that tanked in that period too.

PeteSilas said:

Germanegro said:

Prince just had so much to give to the world--he was so inspiring in so many ways throughout his life to the onlookers who paid attention. And, yeah, conflicted too--caught between his need for privacy and the grandiosement of talent and beckoning worldwide attention; piety and sensuality. He just had so much to give that he just wore himself out in the process of trying to make "it" --the realization of his visions--happen. Slave Trade is a very good overview of his post 80s career, IMO, a highly valued part of video library.

>

Sananda took his beatdowns early and profusely. People strait-up detested his braggadoccio--I enjoyed it, however, 'cause that's what I feel these special people are here for, like our real-time superheroes, but whatever. I think I'm in the small minority, here. Prince went there, too, living the legendary role, and being so forward-thinking--I can't say too much about that. I think the uniqueness and simplicity of Prince's communication with people, the way he touched the psyche and would then retreat had kept an aura around him that somehow cloaked him from some of the beatdown, early on. His original vision was to be a cult version of diversity. It also didn't hurt that he arrived to the "fame club" second to MJ. Three is a crowd!

>

Sananda ultimately retreated, went humble, looked within, took strength from his treasured and nurturing associations, and continued forth with his brilliant wit, courage and wonder if accompanied by a smidge of paranoia, himself being a sensitive character. He has said that he regrets not having created a project like Prince's Purple Rain, but nevertheless I've been ready for his "Post-Millenium Rock" sound. Folky, gritty stuff with hints toward future shapeshifting. I like it!

Slave trade was somewhat illuminating and I hope it's accurate. Alan Leeds made it seem like Prince was pushing for that 100 million dollar deal just to match mj and madonna, i didn't know that. It's crazy to think he actually thought he could sell 5 mill an album for all those advances, he had delusional belief in himself, maybe because it worked for him earlier. Or, maybe his ego just got the better of him. Like I say, he was spoiled, even if he was getting fucked, compared to most of us musicians he had it great. Many of us have to go through all kinds of humiliation and financial problems, especially today with such a saturated market and with the death of the industry. However, for Prince, it did sound like it worked out for the best, even the emancipation album didn't go gold and he made five mill on it, that's not bad and he learned his business. I was left wondering why he went back to WB, I was thinking, maybe he did know he'd die soon and trusted WB more than whoever else would have gotten his music.

With sananda, i keep swearing i'm going to download all his stuff and i just never get around to it, i always listen to the stuff he posts online and some of it's ok, his voice is still in fine fettle. It's just that some of his tunes sound half-baked. He really said he wanted to make a purple rain huh? I still think Symphony or Damn is the last great concept album, just exceptionally good and better than what prince and mj had out at the time. I also loved Neither Fish nor Flesh, a great album and of course his debut album which I still consider the best debut ever by anyone. He has said that MJ sabotaged him, i've also read that was true or at least MJ attempted to do that. Truth was though, by the time of Symphony or Damn, the music business was totally revolutionized by grunge and hip hop. Prince and MJ were effected too but Terence was pretty much robbed of his moment. I don't think it was his mouth although I'm sure it did rub lots of people the wrong way. Also, i think his leap into psychedelia on his second album was premature. You know, these artists always blame the company for not promoting but sometimes the public just isn't ready for the music and no one can force them. Each of those guys and george michael too tried to blame the record companies but it's more likely in my opinion that the fickle pop audience just wasn't interested. Bruce Springsteen had two albums that tanked in that period too.

Indeed, Prince did have a special time with the recording company and was their spoiled darling child, for sure. Thankfully he grew up, although many would argue that point. I believe that his time with WB would have been limited no matter how you slice it, as he had so very much more ambition than the usual crowd of clients. He came back to them I believe because he accepted there being a significant bond forged with them through the genesis of his career, and WB holding their own vault of Prince's stuff that they weren't going to give up if they could help it! After conducting his vast experimentation with selling schemes and cutting out the majority of exploitive streaming services he believed he could acutally constructivey use a record company to fulfill his vision of keeping the business of "Prince" in good form, if he could just get the terms of the deal to fit each of their needs.

>

Sananda has just settled down and laid himself back. No big tours at all. No industry contact. Dude was just too scarred, and that's too bad, 'cause I'd like to see one of his shows! Most of his music these days is written to accomodate a trio formation. He plays a lot of guitar and is a slow hand, not a shredder at all. Every once in a while he does a larger arrangement like "Blanket on the Ground" and...hmm, not many more of those I can think of! The songs are quite reflective, less grandiose than "Vibrator" or psychedelic and audacious as "NFNF"--Symphony or Damn was special, cause he was still a young guy expanding his experiences in life-- but today is just looking back, crafting relationship vigniettes, weaving cautionary tales, and allegorical flights of fancy that may be more rooted in reality that people would think. I think that has made more people fall off-- he's not exactly the old-time TTD, plus like you say, the overrunning culture of what's up next with the hip hop, grunge, boy bands, and ever-advancing music technology and culture.

>

Here's a link to one of Sananda's interveiws that outlines a bit of his experinces speaking of his career journey, inspiration, regrets, and I feel is inspirational. Settle in, it's 26 minutes long! .

Interesting video.

I've always been a big fan of his talent, I'm just a bit puzzled at the music the last few years.

Graycap23 said:

Interesting video.

I've always been a big fan of his talent, I'm just a bit puzzled at the music the last few years.

Sometimes I wish that Prince could have broken his situation down like that--really candidly--but being such a superstar, he just occupied a different realm of persona.

Germanegro said:

Graycap23 said:

Germanegro said:

Sometimes I wish that Prince could have broken his situation down like that--really candidly--but being such a superstar, he just occupied a different realm of persona.

Prince would never done such a thing. His philosophy was more on creating illusions. Life is no fun without mystery.

Graycap23 said:

I've always been a big fan of his talent, I'm just a bit puzzled at the music the last few years.

Listen to some songs from Sananda's "Nigor Mortis" album, then check out Valerie June's Organic Moonshine Roots movement exibited in her album "Pushin' Against a Stone" and that might help you get into his current vibe. Her sound aligns more toward what he's doing now with the Post-Modern Rock. His output now is just different from what happened in the 80s and 90s. Not for all, I guess. You might just feel that all of it is just a bunch of doody but sometimes I like the idea of helping people make the leap toward a sound that I like!

Wild Card is a phenomenal album. It's superior to anything Prince released during the final decade of his life. The name change still baffles me, though. Terence Trent is such a cool name.

Identity said:

Wild Card is a phenomenal album. It's superior to anything Prince released during the final decade of his life. The name change still baffles me, though. Terence Trent is such a cool name.

i always thought he was following prince's example with the name thing. I still struggle to call him sandanda whenever i post on his page because it just seems ridiculous. but, if that's what he wants to be called, like his hero, ali, he should be called that.

Identity said:

Identity said:

Wild Card is a phenomenal album. It's superior to anything Prince released during the final decade of his life. The name change still baffles me, though. Terence Trent is such a cool name.

Ha--I can imagine his friends in childhood running down the street calling out "Terry Darby"!

>

He details his name-changing experinece pretty explicitly, though. It was a part of his transformation to move himself out of the depression that covered him after the shitty experience he had battling Sony Records over what was to be recorded and sold after his last Sony-released album and then being dropped by them. He dreamed up the new combination of names and went with that, going forward, you know, as an F.U. to the past an embracing the shred of sanity he had left to move in a new direction with his life, in general. It allowed a definite delineation between who he became in his personal evolution and his brand as an artist. That's his rationale. He made the name change legal--although he assures us that the IRS continues to keep the old TTD name on file!

>

Just a hunch--he may have had a few female fans trying to ride his jock while he was about the business of getting maried and settling down around that time. Women will distract you big time if you let them, so such an extreme gesture might have signalled them to step back; he was making serious choices in his efforts.

PeteSilas said:

Identity said:

Wild Card is a phenomenal album. It's superior to anything Prince released during the final decade of his life. The name change still baffles me, though. Terence Trent is such a cool name.

i always thought he was following prince's example with the name thing. I still struggle to call him sandanda whenever i post on his page because it just seems ridiculous. but, if that's what he wants to be called, like his hero, ali, he should be called that.

As outsiders viewing the spectacle it can look that way, but I doubt that he was looking at Prince and taking those notes--"hmm...name change? OK. Check!" His doing the splits onstage, however...was that taken from Prince, or James Brown?

>

He had friendships with plenty enough contemporaries beyond that one to aid in his soul-seeking. Although he and P. were artistic pals and friends he hadn't elevated Prince as an influence as high as he does The Beatles and other older artists. None of those Beatles changed their names with any transformation or crisis they may have had--just their religion, LOL.

>

And Sananda, despite his love for Prince, wasn't having Prince's Jehovah Witness testimonials. The last time Prince reached out to him he brushed him aside over that stickling point, I've read in Sananda's notes.

>

With all of that being said, I scoff at the notion that either incarnation of TTD/ Sananda was a sychophant of Prince/ . Doesn't matter much--I just had to get that off my chest.