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Printablealexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: I Find Him Insulting&Another Uncle Tom Acting Comedian.He would be lucky to get to Hold MR.Biggs Pimp Cane.
You really find him NOT funny? I've always been a fan of his since the first time I saw him in Robin Hood: Men In Tights! And his show is hilarious, but just like our differences with R Kelly, to each his/her own on him too! But how do you figure he's "Uncle Tom" acting? What has he done or said to make you feel that way? Come on now, I'm down for a laugh and smirked a little on first hearing the R. Kelly diss songs but I see people saying they are Dave's career highlight. There was nothing that deep or clever in obvious urinating rhymes... As for the "Uncle Tom" accusation, I think Maxxx is just hinting at the element of telling tales/mocking on/of his "own people" (R) to "Master" (The mainly white viewership/establishment). This and many other takes on humour could be seen as divisive if broken down to the elements... Dave's comedy is no different than Richard Pryor or any other black comedian who tell jokes about blacks to an audience. The type of jokes are the same! So, how he can be more of an "Uncle Tom" than any of them? I have still yet to hear a compelling argument on why Maxxx considers him an Uncle Tom!! And, who's saying those songs are his career highlight? If they're saying it, it's because they've just discovered him on Comedy Central. They obviously haven't followed his career from the beginning! There's a Dave tribute thread at Okayplayer.com, I don't see much of him in the UK so I wouldn't judge overall but the R. Kelly skits just weren't that hot to me. As for "Uncle Tom", like I said it could be applied to a lot of names if taken literally to some extent or another I agree... A tribute thread just because of the skits?! Gimme a break. If it's based on his comedy as whole that was going before the skits aired, then it's all good!  Agh, nah it's just a general tribute to him in which many including the thread poster say the RK diss tracks are his highlight.  | |
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alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: I Find Him Insulting&Another Uncle Tom Acting Comedian.He would be lucky to get to Hold MR.Biggs Pimp Cane.
You really find him NOT funny? I've always been a fan of his since the first time I saw him in Robin Hood: Men In Tights! And his show is hilarious, but just like our differences with R Kelly, to each his/her own on him too! But how do you figure he's "Uncle Tom" acting? What has he done or said to make you feel that way? You're kidding me?! You think Mario Joyner and AJ Jamal are funnier than Dave? Please! Dave's almost steals the spotlight in everything he's in!! And I certainly don't think people have JUST started to notice him because of one little spoof (little but still funny as shit). And you CAN'T be serious about your feeding him to Mr. Biggs comment! LMAO! Now, that's corny! Before he even introduced the spoof clips (with the lyrics based on the real song with real lyrics almost just as dumb, "Feelin' On Yo' Booty"; nice music but damn it's got some STUPID lyrics), he said how much he liked the new album, so it's obvious the guy respects at least some of Kelly's work. mistermaxxx | |
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alexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: I Find Him Insulting&Another Uncle Tom Acting Comedian.He would be lucky to get to Hold MR.Biggs Pimp Cane.
You really find him NOT funny? I've always been a fan of his since the first time I saw him in Robin Hood: Men In Tights! And his show is hilarious, but just like our differences with R Kelly, to each his/her own on him too! But how do you figure he's "Uncle Tom" acting? What has he done or said to make you feel that way? Come on now, I'm down for a laugh and smirked a little on first hearing the R. Kelly diss songs but I see people saying they are Dave's career highlight. There was nothing that deep or clever in obvious urinating rhymes... As for the "Uncle Tom" accusation, I think Maxxx is just hinting at the element of telling tales/mocking on/of his "own people" (R) to "Master" (The mainly white viewership/establishment). This and many other takes on humour could be seen as divisive if broken down to the elements... Dave's comedy is no different than Richard Pryor or any other black comedian who tell jokes about blacks to an audience. The type of jokes are the same! So, how he can be more of an "Uncle Tom" than any of them? I have still yet to hear a compelling argument on why Maxxx considers him an Uncle Tom!! And, who's saying those songs are his career highlight? If they're saying it, it's because they've just discovered him on Comedy Central. They obviously haven't followed his career from the beginning! mistermaxxx | |
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Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: I Find Him Insulting&Another Uncle Tom Acting Comedian.He would be lucky to get to Hold MR.Biggs Pimp Cane.
You really find him NOT funny? I've always been a fan of his since the first time I saw him in Robin Hood: Men In Tights! And his show is hilarious, but just like our differences with R Kelly, to each his/her own on him too! But how do you figure he's "Uncle Tom" acting? What has he done or said to make you feel that way? Come on now, I'm down for a laugh and smirked a little on first hearing the R. Kelly diss songs but I see people saying they are Dave's career highlight. There was nothing that deep or clever in obvious urinating rhymes... As for the "Uncle Tom" accusation, I think Maxxx is just hinting at the element of telling tales/mocking on/of his "own people" (R) to "Master" (The mainly white viewership/establishment). This and many other takes on humour could be seen as divisive if broken down to the elements... Dave's comedy is no different than Richard Pryor or any other black comedian who tell jokes about blacks to an audience. The type of jokes are the same! So, how he can be more of an "Uncle Tom" than any of them? I have still yet to hear a compelling argument on why Maxxx considers him an Uncle Tom!! And, who's saying those songs are his career highlight? If they're saying it, it's because they've just discovered him on Comedy Central. They obviously haven't followed his career from the beginning! There's a Dave tribute thread at Okayplayer.com, I don't see much of him in the UK so I wouldn't judge overall but the R. Kelly skits just weren't that hot to me. As for "Uncle Tom", like I said it could be applied to a lot of names if taken literally to some extent or another I agree... A tribute thread just because of the skits?! Gimme a break. If it's based on his comedy as whole that was going before the skits aired, then it's all good! Agh, nah it's just a general tribute to him in which many including the thread poster say the RK diss tracks are his highlight. mistermaxxx | |
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mistermaxxx said:[quote] alexnvrmnd said: [/qoute]don't even dare put Dave's Name alongside Richard Pryor DA KANG OF COMEDY Period.Pryor took on all aspects of the World&Believe Him Pryor was funny without putting people down.He was Gifted.Chapelle is a Buffon Period&Belongs alongside Insane Clown Posse because His Joke of a Career deserves to Be Hidden.He is Bugged Eye&of course it pays to take a Cheap Shot on another Black Artist because His Limited Behind Non Funny Self can't talk about nothing.you Know Chapelle was at the Kings of Comedy:in the Usher Section.anybody could do that Bums Career.He is Pandering to the most basic Element of trying to Buy a Cheap Laugh&that ain't Comedy on a Grand Scale Level.anybody can play the Dozens.back in the day He wouldn't be Jimmy Walker or Byron Allen Worthy of being Funny.
I'm just saying that plenty of comics, Pryor included, talked about certain people or made fun of all types of people, including blacks. So, that can't be a determining factor in calling Chapelle an Uncle Tom. The dude is WAY funny, and maybe not in the all-time class of Pryor, Fox, or Murphy, but he's in the next rung down. He's funny, and I think a majority of the public is just starting to find this out. Your conviction against him sounds as if he did something to your momma, man! Did he? LOL! And I certainly wouldn't call the Kelly spoofs a career highlight. Only that one guy that Essence was speaking of did, so that's on him, and he's probably a full-time Kelly basher and that's why he loved it so much. He probably hasn't even heard too much of Chapelle until he had a show on Comedy Central. | |
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mistermaxxx said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: I Find Him Insulting&Another Uncle Tom Acting Comedian.He would be lucky to get to Hold MR.Biggs Pimp Cane.
You really find him NOT funny? I've always been a fan of his since the first time I saw him in Robin Hood: Men In Tights! And his show is hilarious, but just like our differences with R Kelly, to each his/her own on him too! But how do you figure he's "Uncle Tom" acting? What has he done or said to make you feel that way? Come on now, I'm down for a laugh and smirked a little on first hearing the R. Kelly diss songs but I see people saying they are Dave's career highlight. There was nothing that deep or clever in obvious urinating rhymes... As for the "Uncle Tom" accusation, I think Maxxx is just hinting at the element of telling tales/mocking on/of his "own people" (R) to "Master" (The mainly white viewership/establishment). This and many other takes on humour could be seen as divisive if broken down to the elements... Dave's comedy is no different than Richard Pryor or any other black comedian who tell jokes about blacks to an audience. The type of jokes are the same! So, how he can be more of an "Uncle Tom" than any of them? I have still yet to hear a compelling argument on why Maxxx considers him an Uncle Tom!! And, who's saying those songs are his career highlight? If they're saying it, it's because they've just discovered him on Comedy Central. They obviously haven't followed his career from the beginning! There's a Dave tribute thread at Okayplayer.com, I don't see much of him in the UK so I wouldn't judge overall but the R. Kelly skits just weren't that hot to me. As for "Uncle Tom", like I said it could be applied to a lot of names if taken literally to some extent or another I agree... A tribute thread just because of the skits?! Gimme a break. If it's based on his comedy as whole that was going before the skits aired, then it's all good! Agh, nah it's just a general tribute to him in which many including the thread poster say the RK diss tracks are his highlight. Isley's pimp cane?? BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!! I've said it before, and I'll say it again...I hate that damn Mr. Big character/image for such a legend as Ronald Isley. It's plain ridiculous and quite laughable!! | |
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Isley's pimp cane?? BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!! I've said it before, and I'll say it again...I hate that damn Mr. Big character/image for such a legend as Ronald Isley. It's plain ridiculous and quite laughable!![/quote]
Agreed. "Mr. Biggs" better watch himself before he finds himself fighting off accusations of who knows what.. & what about Ernie "silent brother with the KILLER guitar playing" Isley??? Is it my imagination or is he just quietly going along with all this.. stuff??? At "Mr. Bigg's" age, I question if he can put up with all the "rigors" of prison life..! I really hope it never comes to that, but with the present company he often keeps.. I'll see you tonight..
in ALL MY DREAMS.. |
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if Haters Don't like Da Kang of Modern R&B than why you gotta keep the Hate Train going? MisterMaxxx,Essence&Harlepolis are down wit Da Kang of Modern R&B So haters you can talk all that Junk but we aren't paying your grabage any mind.we Flush the Junk out of the Trunk! mistermaxxx | |
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mistermaxxx said: if Haters Don't like Da Kang of Modern R&B than why you gotta keep the Hate Train going? MisterMaxxx,Essence&Harlepolis are down wit Da Kang of Modern R&B So haters you can talk all that Junk but we aren't paying your grabage any mind.we Flush the Junk out of the Trunk!
Hey, I'm down with R Kelly, to a certain extent, too, just not this character you call "Da King of Modern R&B". LOL! Even they haven't given him THAT label or pronounced him that...just diggin' some of his music, as have I (some of it anyway). | |
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alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: if Haters Don't like Da Kang of Modern R&B than why you gotta keep the Hate Train going? MisterMaxxx,Essence&Harlepolis are down wit Da Kang of Modern R&B So haters you can talk all that Junk but we aren't paying your grabage any mind.we Flush the Junk out of the Trunk!
Hey, I'm down with R Kelly, to a certain extent, too, just not this character you call "Da King of Modern R&B". LOL! Even they haven't given him THAT label or pronounced him that...just diggin' some of his music, as have I (some of it anyway). mistermaxxx | |
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mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: if Haters Don't like Da Kang of Modern R&B than why you gotta keep the Hate Train going? MisterMaxxx,Essence&Harlepolis are down wit Da Kang of Modern R&B So haters you can talk all that Junk but we aren't paying your grabage any mind.we Flush the Junk out of the Trunk!
Hey, I'm down with R Kelly, to a certain extent, too, just not this character you call "Da King of Modern R&B". LOL! Even they haven't given him THAT label or pronounced him that...just diggin' some of his music, as have I (some of it anyway). I'm sure if you put and locked Prince, Kelly, and TTD in a studio for one month so they could match material, both Prince's (whose shit would have REAL instruments on it more than likely) and TTD's material would outshine Kelly's. Guaranteed. Not saying Kelly wouldn't be able to come up with anything decent (not saying that AT ALL), but my point is is that those 2 cats can easily touch his game...and expand it. | |
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alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: if Haters Don't like Da Kang of Modern R&B than why you gotta keep the Hate Train going? MisterMaxxx,Essence&Harlepolis are down wit Da Kang of Modern R&B So haters you can talk all that Junk but we aren't paying your grabage any mind.we Flush the Junk out of the Trunk!
Hey, I'm down with R Kelly, to a certain extent, too, just not this character you call "Da King of Modern R&B". LOL! Even they haven't given him THAT label or pronounced him that...just diggin' some of his music, as have I (some of it anyway). I'm sure if you put and locked Prince, Kelly, and TTD in a studio for one month so they could match material, both Prince's (whose shit would have REAL instruments on it more than likely) and TTD's material would outshine Kelly's. Guaranteed. Not saying Kelly wouldn't be able to come up with anything decent (not saying that AT ALL), but my point is is that those 2 cats can easily touch his game...and expand it. mistermaxxx | |
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mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: if Haters Don't like Da Kang of Modern R&B than why you gotta keep the Hate Train going? MisterMaxxx,Essence&Harlepolis are down wit Da Kang of Modern R&B So haters you can talk all that Junk but we aren't paying your grabage any mind.we Flush the Junk out of the Trunk!
Hey, I'm down with R Kelly, to a certain extent, too, just not this character you call "Da King of Modern R&B". LOL! Even they haven't given him THAT label or pronounced him that...just diggin' some of his music, as have I (some of it anyway). I'm sure if you put and locked Prince, Kelly, and TTD in a studio for one month so they could match material, both Prince's (whose shit would have REAL instruments on it more than likely) and TTD's material would outshine Kelly's. Guaranteed. Not saying Kelly wouldn't be able to come up with anything decent (not saying that AT ALL), but my point is is that those 2 cats can easily touch his game...and expand it. Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! | |
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alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: if Haters Don't like Da Kang of Modern R&B than why you gotta keep the Hate Train going? MisterMaxxx,Essence&Harlepolis are down wit Da Kang of Modern R&B So haters you can talk all that Junk but we aren't paying your grabage any mind.we Flush the Junk out of the Trunk!
Hey, I'm down with R Kelly, to a certain extent, too, just not this character you call "Da King of Modern R&B". LOL! Even they haven't given him THAT label or pronounced him that...just diggin' some of his music, as have I (some of it anyway). I'm sure if you put and locked Prince, Kelly, and TTD in a studio for one month so they could match material, both Prince's (whose shit would have REAL instruments on it more than likely) and TTD's material would outshine Kelly's. Guaranteed. Not saying Kelly wouldn't be able to come up with anything decent (not saying that AT ALL), but my point is is that those 2 cats can easily touch his game...and expand it. Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! mistermaxxx | |
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mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: if Haters Don't like Da Kang of Modern R&B than why you gotta keep the Hate Train going? MisterMaxxx,Essence&Harlepolis are down wit Da Kang of Modern R&B So haters you can talk all that Junk but we aren't paying your grabage any mind.we Flush the Junk out of the Trunk!
Hey, I'm down with R Kelly, to a certain extent, too, just not this character you call "Da King of Modern R&B". LOL! Even they haven't given him THAT label or pronounced him that...just diggin' some of his music, as have I (some of it anyway). I'm sure if you put and locked Prince, Kelly, and TTD in a studio for one month so they could match material, both Prince's (whose shit would have REAL instruments on it more than likely) and TTD's material would outshine Kelly's. Guaranteed. Not saying Kelly wouldn't be able to come up with anything decent (not saying that AT ALL), but my point is is that those 2 cats can easily touch his game...and expand it. Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's! | |
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alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: if Haters Don't like Da Kang of Modern R&B than why you gotta keep the Hate Train going? MisterMaxxx,Essence&Harlepolis are down wit Da Kang of Modern R&B So haters you can talk all that Junk but we aren't paying your grabage any mind.we Flush the Junk out of the Trunk!
Hey, I'm down with R Kelly, to a certain extent, too, just not this character you call "Da King of Modern R&B". LOL! Even they haven't given him THAT label or pronounced him that...just diggin' some of his music, as have I (some of it anyway). I'm sure if you put and locked Prince, Kelly, and TTD in a studio for one month so they could match material, both Prince's (whose shit would have REAL instruments on it more than likely) and TTD's material would outshine Kelly's. Guaranteed. Not saying Kelly wouldn't be able to come up with anything decent (not saying that AT ALL), but my point is is that those 2 cats can easily touch his game...and expand it. Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's! mistermaxxx | |
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mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! first of all IMHO R.Kelly Smears TTD in a Blow out.as for Prince: over the past Decade R.Kelly Whips Him up as a Writer&Producer with ease.only since 90 does the fact being able to Be so Wicked on Stage gives Him a chance.but in the Studio since the 90's R.Kelly Creams both of them.Neither Prince nor TTD can balance Pop,R&B&Rap-Hip-Hop together like Him&if you say so than you don't know jack about Hip-Hop.you go ask some Props who of those three Fuses all three together&you will come back asking me for tissue.TTD is a Has-Been who is trys to Hard to make Himself more Intelligent than He is.Very Talented Cat&One of My All-tiem Favorites but Come On nobody is Jocking His Junk for the longest time.blame Radio,blame the Media,Blame the Record Company,Blame Fans,etc... time for Cats like TTD,Prince,MJ to just Bring it&stopp Crying A River of why they can't Hang no More.R.Kelly got Issues but still His Music speaks to People.thank Goodness Stevie Wonder doesn't keep up crying why He doesn't have Hits anymore it's about a New Era of Ears&Generation that has moved on.everybody major that makes it has there Prime&Peak&then they are done.you wanna Debate with Me because you Know I'm Right regardless of what you say.I respect your Opnion of Defending TTD&Prince but you gotta also understand why I defend R.Kelly.Prince nor TTD are Wirrtine Songs like R.Kelly.if either one of them could find a Hit they would.and as far setting trends:Prince&TTD Stopped doing that back in the 80's my friend.Prince had healthy 10 Year Run&TTD a 2 year Run.R.Kelly has had a healthy 12 Year Run.I Rest My Case!I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's![/quote]R.Kelly is Da Man.He could do it all&add Classical into His thing.who doesn't do what's happening?folks Rock R.Kelly of the three in a Breeze.Prince&TTD can't Write Hits like R.Kelly Period.and can't fade Him nowadays.R.Kelly is Da Man.You are stuck in the Past.[/quote] No way. Period. R. Kelly will probably even admit that he has a long way to go get to their level! What gives you any idea he could do rock, real funk, jazz, or country? Where's the proof? Which songs? Kelly writes hits because that's what he's trying to do. Prince and TTD could too, but they're at different points in their respective careers! Kelly isn't trying to push himself as an artist! He's still doing the same stuff he was doing when he came out with PA Announcement. Like I said, Kelly's on his run now, but there's a limit to his creativity that, so far, will NOT put in the same category as these cats! I'm not stuck in the past...I'm just a realist. I realize Kelly will have more and more hits than Prince and TTD right now (mainly cuz he's catering to the R&B/hip hop market and has his ear to the streets to know who's hot there to work with and so forth). He utilizes the promotion machine of videos and whatnot better than they do, and, quite frankly, ever really did too. And plus, I like some his stuff too, remember. But, those cats would blow his ass away on terms of pure artistry and creativity, not sales (which Kelly would kick their asses in, yes; LOL!) and you know it. But it's cool to be a Kelly fan (I'm a very casual one), just know his place (not on the big scale...yet) in the big picture of music and artistry. | |
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alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! first of all IMHO R.Kelly Smears TTD in a Blow out.as for Prince: over the past Decade R.Kelly Whips Him up as a Writer&Producer with ease.only since 90 does the fact being able to Be so Wicked on Stage gives Him a chance.but in the Studio since the 90's R.Kelly Creams both of them.Neither Prince nor TTD can balance Pop,R&B&Rap-Hip-Hop together like Him&if you say so than you don't know jack about Hip-Hop.you go ask some Props who of those three Fuses all three together&you will come back asking me for tissue.TTD is a Has-Been who is trys to Hard to make Himself more Intelligent than He is.Very Talented Cat&One of My All-tiem Favorites but Come On nobody is Jocking His Junk for the longest time.blame Radio,blame the Media,Blame the Record Company,Blame Fans,etc... time for Cats like TTD,Prince,MJ to just Bring it&stopp Crying A River of why they can't Hang no More.R.Kelly got Issues but still His Music speaks to People.thank Goodness Stevie Wonder doesn't keep up crying why He doesn't have Hits anymore it's about a New Era of Ears&Generation that has moved on.everybody major that makes it has there Prime&Peak&then they are done.you wanna Debate with Me because you Know I'm Right regardless of what you say.I respect your Opnion of Defending TTD&Prince but you gotta also understand why I defend R.Kelly.Prince nor TTD are Wirrtine Songs like R.Kelly.if either one of them could find a Hit they would.and as far setting trends:Prince&TTD Stopped doing that back in the 80's my friend.Prince had healthy 10 Year Run&TTD a 2 year Run.R.Kelly has had a healthy 12 Year Run.I Rest My Case!I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's! No way. Period. R. Kelly will probably even admit that he has a long way to go get to their level! What gives you any idea he could do rock, real funk, jazz, or country? Where's the proof? Which songs? Kelly writes hits because that's what he's trying to do. Prince and TTD could too, but they're at different points in their respective careers! Kelly isn't trying to push himself as an artist! He's still doing the same stuff he was doing when he came out with PA Announcement. Like I said, Kelly's on his run now, but there's a limit to his creativity that, so far, will NOT put in the same category as these cats! I'm not stuck in the past...I'm just a realist. I realize Kelly will have more and more hits than Prince and TTD right now (mainly cuz he's catering to the R&B/hip hop market and has his ear to the streets to know who's hot there to work with and so forth). He utilizes the promotion machine of videos and whatnot better than they do, and, quite frankly, ever really did too. And plus, I like some his stuff too, remember. But, those cats would blow his ass away on terms of pure artistry and creativity, not sales (which Kelly would kick their asses in, yes; LOL!) and you know it. But it's cool to be a Kelly fan (I'm a very casual one), just know his place (not on the big scale...yet) in the big picture of music and artistry.[/quote]You are a Comedian.if you can Write a Hit you never stop.it's not like a Switch you flick on&Off.first of all when you Play R&B Music you already Fuse all elements of Music within the Context of Pop,Country&Fushion.so R.Kelly has done all of that&also made a Artistic&Productive Way of doing things Period.TTD ain't been Mentioned since when?&Prince ain't been on that Level in how long? Artistic,Sales,Productivity,Creativity,,etc... all Add Up.what a Lame excuse they don't want to make Hits? that is Jerry Springer worthy of being funny. mistermaxxx | |
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alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! first of all IMHO R.Kelly Smears TTD in a Blow out.as for Prince: over the past Decade R.Kelly Whips Him up as a Writer&Producer with ease.only since 90 does the fact being able to Be so Wicked on Stage gives Him a chance.but in the Studio since the 90's R.Kelly Creams both of them.Neither Prince nor TTD can balance Pop,R&B&Rap-Hip-Hop together like Him&if you say so than you don't know jack about Hip-Hop.you go ask some Props who of those three Fuses all three together&you will come back asking me for tissue.TTD is a Has-Been who is trys to Hard to make Himself more Intelligent than He is.Very Talented Cat&One of My All-tiem Favorites but Come On nobody is Jocking His Junk for the longest time.blame Radio,blame the Media,Blame the Record Company,Blame Fans,etc... time for Cats like TTD,Prince,MJ to just Bring it&stopp Crying A River of why they can't Hang no More.R.Kelly got Issues but still His Music speaks to People.thank Goodness Stevie Wonder doesn't keep up crying why He doesn't have Hits anymore it's about a New Era of Ears&Generation that has moved on.everybody major that makes it has there Prime&Peak&then they are done.you wanna Debate with Me because you Know I'm Right regardless of what you say.I respect your Opnion of Defending TTD&Prince but you gotta also understand why I defend R.Kelly.Prince nor TTD are Wirrtine Songs like R.Kelly.if either one of them could find a Hit they would.and as far setting trends:Prince&TTD Stopped doing that back in the 80's my friend.Prince had healthy 10 Year Run&TTD a 2 year Run.R.Kelly has had a healthy 12 Year Run.I Rest My Case!I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's! No way. Period. R. Kelly will probably even admit that he has a long way to go get to their level! What gives you any idea he could do rock, real funk, jazz, or country? Where's the proof? Which songs? Kelly writes hits because that's what he's trying to do. Prince and TTD could too, but they're at different points in their respective careers! Kelly isn't trying to push himself as an artist! He's still doing the same stuff he was doing when he came out with PA Announcement. Like I said, Kelly's on his run now, but there's a limit to his creativity that, so far, will NOT put in the same category as these cats! I'm not stuck in the past...I'm just a realist. I realize Kelly will have more and more hits than Prince and TTD right now (mainly cuz he's catering to the R&B/hip hop market and has his ear to the streets to know who's hot there to work with and so forth). He utilizes the promotion machine of videos and whatnot better than they do, and, quite frankly, ever really did too. And plus, I like some his stuff too, remember. But, those cats would blow his ass away on terms of pure artistry and creativity, not sales (which Kelly would kick their asses in, yes; LOL!) and you know it. But it's cool to be a Kelly fan (I'm a very casual one), just know his place (not on the big scale...yet) in the big picture of music and artistry.[/quote] Putting aside yours and Maxxx's "Who's better?" discussion, I think you do RK a massive diservice. First of all he does have his own vibe and sound which has given rise to a whole heap of imitators. Also why would so many artists go to R for songs if his sound was so run of the mill? Also he's got jazzy with Quincy Jones, old school soul (sometimes with Ronald Isley), hip-hop jams, party uptempo joints, straight R&B, inspiring gospel ballads, funk/rock (Check the Prince-like Imagine on CF). Hell he's even done an Opera pastiche, how versatile do you want him to be? | |
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mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! first of all IMHO R.Kelly Smears TTD in a Blow out.as for Prince: over the past Decade R.Kelly Whips Him up as a Writer&Producer with ease.only since 90 does the fact being able to Be so Wicked on Stage gives Him a chance.but in the Studio since the 90's R.Kelly Creams both of them.Neither Prince nor TTD can balance Pop,R&B&Rap-Hip-Hop together like Him&if you say so than you don't know jack about Hip-Hop.you go ask some Props who of those three Fuses all three together&you will come back asking me for tissue.TTD is a Has-Been who is trys to Hard to make Himself more Intelligent than He is.Very Talented Cat&One of My All-tiem Favorites but Come On nobody is Jocking His Junk for the longest time.blame Radio,blame the Media,Blame the Record Company,Blame Fans,etc... time for Cats like TTD,Prince,MJ to just Bring it&stopp Crying A River of why they can't Hang no More.R.Kelly got Issues but still His Music speaks to People.thank Goodness Stevie Wonder doesn't keep up crying why He doesn't have Hits anymore it's about a New Era of Ears&Generation that has moved on.everybody major that makes it has there Prime&Peak&then they are done.you wanna Debate with Me because you Know I'm Right regardless of what you say.I respect your Opnion of Defending TTD&Prince but you gotta also understand why I defend R.Kelly.Prince nor TTD are Wirrtine Songs like R.Kelly.if either one of them could find a Hit they would.and as far setting trends:Prince&TTD Stopped doing that back in the 80's my friend.Prince had healthy 10 Year Run&TTD a 2 year Run.R.Kelly has had a healthy 12 Year Run.I Rest My Case!I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's! No way. Period. R. Kelly will probably even admit that he has a long way to go get to their level! What gives you any idea he could do rock, real funk, jazz, or country? Where's the proof? Which songs? Kelly writes hits because that's what he's trying to do. Prince and TTD could too, but they're at different points in their respective careers! Kelly isn't trying to push himself as an artist! He's still doing the same stuff he was doing when he came out with PA Announcement. Like I said, Kelly's on his run now, but there's a limit to his creativity that, so far, will NOT put in the same category as these cats! I'm not stuck in the past...I'm just a realist. I realize Kelly will have more and more hits than Prince and TTD right now (mainly cuz he's catering to the R&B/hip hop market and has his ear to the streets to know who's hot there to work with and so forth). He utilizes the promotion machine of videos and whatnot better than they do, and, quite frankly, ever really did too. And plus, I like some his stuff too, remember. But, those cats would blow his ass away on terms of pure artistry and creativity, not sales (which Kelly would kick their asses in, yes; LOL!) and you know it. But it's cool to be a Kelly fan (I'm a very casual one), just know his place (not on the big scale...yet) in the big picture of music and artistry. You are a Comedian.if you can Write a Hit you never stop.it's not like a Switch you flick on&Off.first of all when you Play R&B Music you already Fuse all elements of Music within the Context of Pop,Country&Fushion.so R.Kelly has done all of that&also made a Artistic&Productive Way of doing things Period.TTD ain't been Mentioned since when?&Prince ain't been on that Level in how long? Artistic,Sales,Productivity,Creativity,,etc... all Add Up.what a Lame excuse they don't want to make Hits? that is Jerry Springer worthy of being funny.
If I'm a comedian, then you're the only one laughing at my statement. So, you mean to say ANYONE who does R&B is versatile since it fuses all of the elements you stated?? LMAO! Now that's comedy!! Prince has said it himself that it's easy to right a hit, but it's all about challenging yourself (at least in his eyes). Just right a damn hook and have a certain riff going, and there ya go. Prince did it I don't know how many times before!! Using shit like that to appeal to the masses isn't THAT hard to do. TTD specifically said after his debut album that he wanted to go in a more artistic direction, not one that one that would guarantee his name in the Top 10 all the time. That's why his second album was Neither Fish Nor Flesh, and he STILL hasn't decided to go that way. So, you can't tell me you can't just turn it off or on on writing a hit. They have intentionally done it. Why haven't you heard so much from these cats lately? Because of their artistic decision to not chase the damn Billboards all the time which lead to dissatisfaction with their record companies. With no real record company (and their money) behind them, their exposure isn't going to be nearly what it could be with one. Face it, man; you can champion Kelly all you want right now (and with some good reason), but he's just not on the same level as those two - creatively or artistically...YET. He needs to stand the test of time more and show more versatility for that to happen. I mean, have you HEARD TTD's Symphony or Damn or Wildcard Jokers' Edition? Kelly could NEVER do shit like that, and you can't sit there and say he could. I'm giving Kelly his props, believe me, but he just ain't there yet!!! | |
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Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! first of all IMHO R.Kelly Smears TTD in a Blow out.as for Prince: over the past Decade R.Kelly Whips Him up as a Writer&Producer with ease.only since 90 does the fact being able to Be so Wicked on Stage gives Him a chance.but in the Studio since the 90's R.Kelly Creams both of them.Neither Prince nor TTD can balance Pop,R&B&Rap-Hip-Hop together like Him&if you say so than you don't know jack about Hip-Hop.you go ask some Props who of those three Fuses all three together&you will come back asking me for tissue.TTD is a Has-Been who is trys to Hard to make Himself more Intelligent than He is.Very Talented Cat&One of My All-tiem Favorites but Come On nobody is Jocking His Junk for the longest time.blame Radio,blame the Media,Blame the Record Company,Blame Fans,etc... time for Cats like TTD,Prince,MJ to just Bring it&stopp Crying A River of why they can't Hang no More.R.Kelly got Issues but still His Music speaks to People.thank Goodness Stevie Wonder doesn't keep up crying why He doesn't have Hits anymore it's about a New Era of Ears&Generation that has moved on.everybody major that makes it has there Prime&Peak&then they are done.you wanna Debate with Me because you Know I'm Right regardless of what you say.I respect your Opnion of Defending TTD&Prince but you gotta also understand why I defend R.Kelly.Prince nor TTD are Wirrtine Songs like R.Kelly.if either one of them could find a Hit they would.and as far setting trends:Prince&TTD Stopped doing that back in the 80's my friend.Prince had healthy 10 Year Run&TTD a 2 year Run.R.Kelly has had a healthy 12 Year Run.I Rest My Case!I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's! No way. Period. R. Kelly will probably even admit that he has a long way to go get to their level! What gives you any idea he could do rock, real funk, jazz, or country? Where's the proof? Which songs? Kelly writes hits because that's what he's trying to do. Prince and TTD could too, but they're at different points in their respective careers! Kelly isn't trying to push himself as an artist! He's still doing the same stuff he was doing when he came out with PA Announcement. Like I said, Kelly's on his run now, but there's a limit to his creativity that, so far, will NOT put in the same category as these cats! I'm not stuck in the past...I'm just a realist. I realize Kelly will have more and more hits than Prince and TTD right now (mainly cuz he's catering to the R&B/hip hop market and has his ear to the streets to know who's hot there to work with and so forth). He utilizes the promotion machine of videos and whatnot better than they do, and, quite frankly, ever really did too. And plus, I like some his stuff too, remember. But, those cats would blow his ass away on terms of pure artistry and creativity, not sales (which Kelly would kick their asses in, yes; LOL!) and you know it. But it's cool to be a Kelly fan (I'm a very casual one), just know his place (not on the big scale...yet) in the big picture of music and artistry.[/quote] Putting aside yours and Maxxx's "Who's better?" discussion, I think you do RK a massive diservice. First of all he does have his own vibe and sound which has given rise to a whole heap of imitators. Also why would so many artists go to R for songs if his sound was so run of the mill?
Also he's got jazzy with Quincy Jones, old school soul (sometimes with Ronald Isley), hip-hop jams, party uptempo joints, straight R&B, inspiring gospel ballads, funk/rock (Check the Prince-like Imagine on CF). Hell he's even done an Opera pastiche, how versatile do you want him to be? Everything you just mentioned is pretty much all a part of the R&B genre. He hasn't done anything much outside of it besides hip hop (which I'm not knocking)! And why do some artists go to Kelly for a song? Because he's the hot thing right now. Plain and simple. They don't go to him so that he can help diversify their sound. And most (NOT all) of these artists are newer ones that he's trying to develop himself or put on the map, so you know they're not going to say no. Look, I'm not trying to make it seem like he's worthless! Not at all. But he just hasn't demonstrated the artistry that TTD or Prince has. Hell, if y'all wanna talk current, even Raphael Saadiq has brought it more than Kelly has. Now, he should be considered the "Modern King of R&B"!! For real! | |
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alexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! first of all IMHO R.Kelly Smears TTD in a Blow out.as for Prince: over the past Decade R.Kelly Whips Him up as a Writer&Producer with ease.only since 90 does the fact being able to Be so Wicked on Stage gives Him a chance.but in the Studio since the 90's R.Kelly Creams both of them.Neither Prince nor TTD can balance Pop,R&B&Rap-Hip-Hop together like Him&if you say so than you don't know jack about Hip-Hop.you go ask some Props who of those three Fuses all three together&you will come back asking me for tissue.TTD is a Has-Been who is trys to Hard to make Himself more Intelligent than He is.Very Talented Cat&One of My All-tiem Favorites but Come On nobody is Jocking His Junk for the longest time.blame Radio,blame the Media,Blame the Record Company,Blame Fans,etc... time for Cats like TTD,Prince,MJ to just Bring it&stopp Crying A River of why they can't Hang no More.R.Kelly got Issues but still His Music speaks to People.thank Goodness Stevie Wonder doesn't keep up crying why He doesn't have Hits anymore it's about a New Era of Ears&Generation that has moved on.everybody major that makes it has there Prime&Peak&then they are done.you wanna Debate with Me because you Know I'm Right regardless of what you say.I respect your Opnion of Defending TTD&Prince but you gotta also understand why I defend R.Kelly.Prince nor TTD are Wirrtine Songs like R.Kelly.if either one of them could find a Hit they would.and as far setting trends:Prince&TTD Stopped doing that back in the 80's my friend.Prince had healthy 10 Year Run&TTD a 2 year Run.R.Kelly has had a healthy 12 Year Run.I Rest My Case!I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's! No way. Period. R. Kelly will probably even admit that he has a long way to go get to their level! What gives you any idea he could do rock, real funk, jazz, or country? Where's the proof? Which songs? Kelly writes hits because that's what he's trying to do. Prince and TTD could too, but they're at different points in their respective careers! Kelly isn't trying to push himself as an artist! He's still doing the same stuff he was doing when he came out with PA Announcement. Like I said, Kelly's on his run now, but there's a limit to his creativity that, so far, will NOT put in the same category as these cats! I'm not stuck in the past...I'm just a realist. I realize Kelly will have more and more hits than Prince and TTD right now (mainly cuz he's catering to the R&B/hip hop market and has his ear to the streets to know who's hot there to work with and so forth). He utilizes the promotion machine of videos and whatnot better than they do, and, quite frankly, ever really did too. And plus, I like some his stuff too, remember. But, those cats would blow his ass away on terms of pure artistry and creativity, not sales (which Kelly would kick their asses in, yes; LOL!) and you know it. But it's cool to be a Kelly fan (I'm a very casual one), just know his place (not on the big scale...yet) in the big picture of music and artistry. Putting aside yours and Maxxx's "Who's better?" discussion, I think you do RK a massive diservice. First of all he does have his own vibe and sound which has given rise to a whole heap of imitators. Also why would so many artists go to R for songs if his sound was so run of the mill?
Also he's got jazzy with Quincy Jones, old school soul (sometimes with Ronald Isley), hip-hop jams, party uptempo joints, straight R&B, inspiring gospel ballads, funk/rock (Check the Prince-like Imagine on CF). Hell he's even done an Opera pastiche, how versatile do you want him to be? Everything you just mentioned is pretty much all a part of the R&B genre. He hasn't done anything much outside of it besides hip hop (which I'm not knocking)! And why do some artists go to Kelly for a song? Because he's the hot thing right now. Plain and simple. They don't go to him so that he can help diversify their sound. And most (NOT all) of these artists are newer ones that he's trying to develop himself or put on the map, so you know they're not going to say no. Look, I'm not trying to make it seem like he's worthless! Not at all. But he just hasn't demonstrated the artistry that TTD or Prince has. Hell, if y'all wanna talk current, even Raphael Saadiq has brought it more than Kelly has. Now, he should be considered the "Modern King of R&B"!! For real![/quote]
That's suspect you won't appreciate any diversifications between the genre labels/styles I listed above but I'll skip that... You can't have it both ways though, he's the "Hot thing" but you say he doesn't have a unique "thing", so what is the "thing" the artists want from him?
Why can't they get a "hot thing" somewhere else if R Kelly has no unique qualities or sound? You can't use an association with a cool name cop out because in troubled recent times artists have distanced themselves from him, even Jay-Z did and they had album together... his name is mud. | |
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Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! first of all IMHO R.Kelly Smears TTD in a Blow out.as for Prince: over the past Decade R.Kelly Whips Him up as a Writer&Producer with ease.only since 90 does the fact being able to Be so Wicked on Stage gives Him a chance.but in the Studio since the 90's R.Kelly Creams both of them.Neither Prince nor TTD can balance Pop,R&B&Rap-Hip-Hop together like Him&if you say so than you don't know jack about Hip-Hop.you go ask some Props who of those three Fuses all three together&you will come back asking me for tissue.TTD is a Has-Been who is trys to Hard to make Himself more Intelligent than He is.Very Talented Cat&One of My All-tiem Favorites but Come On nobody is Jocking His Junk for the longest time.blame Radio,blame the Media,Blame the Record Company,Blame Fans,etc... time for Cats like TTD,Prince,MJ to just Bring it&stopp Crying A River of why they can't Hang no More.R.Kelly got Issues but still His Music speaks to People.thank Goodness Stevie Wonder doesn't keep up crying why He doesn't have Hits anymore it's about a New Era of Ears&Generation that has moved on.everybody major that makes it has there Prime&Peak&then they are done.you wanna Debate with Me because you Know I'm Right regardless of what you say.I respect your Opnion of Defending TTD&Prince but you gotta also understand why I defend R.Kelly.Prince nor TTD are Wirrtine Songs like R.Kelly.if either one of them could find a Hit they would.and as far setting trends:Prince&TTD Stopped doing that back in the 80's my friend.Prince had healthy 10 Year Run&TTD a 2 year Run.R.Kelly has had a healthy 12 Year Run.I Rest My Case!I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's! No way. Period. R. Kelly will probably even admit that he has a long way to go get to their level! What gives you any idea he could do rock, real funk, jazz, or country? Where's the proof? Which songs? Kelly writes hits because that's what he's trying to do. Prince and TTD could too, but they're at different points in their respective careers! Kelly isn't trying to push himself as an artist! He's still doing the same stuff he was doing when he came out with PA Announcement. Like I said, Kelly's on his run now, but there's a limit to his creativity that, so far, will NOT put in the same category as these cats! I'm not stuck in the past...I'm just a realist. I realize Kelly will have more and more hits than Prince and TTD right now (mainly cuz he's catering to the R&B/hip hop market and has his ear to the streets to know who's hot there to work with and so forth). He utilizes the promotion machine of videos and whatnot better than they do, and, quite frankly, ever really did too. And plus, I like some his stuff too, remember. But, those cats would blow his ass away on terms of pure artistry and creativity, not sales (which Kelly would kick their asses in, yes; LOL!) and you know it. But it's cool to be a Kelly fan (I'm a very casual one), just know his place (not on the big scale...yet) in the big picture of music and artistry. Putting aside yours and Maxxx's "Who's better?" discussion, I think you do RK a massive diservice. First of all he does have his own vibe and sound which has given rise to a whole heap of imitators. Also why would so many artists go to R for songs if his sound was so run of the mill?
Also he's got jazzy with Quincy Jones, old school soul (sometimes with Ronald Isley), hip-hop jams, party uptempo joints, straight R&B, inspiring gospel ballads, funk/rock (Check the Prince-like Imagine on CF). Hell he's even done an Opera pastiche, how versatile do you want him to be? Everything you just mentioned is pretty much all a part of the R&B genre. He hasn't done anything much outside of it besides hip hop (which I'm not knocking)! And why do some artists go to Kelly for a song? Because he's the hot thing right now. Plain and simple. They don't go to him so that he can help diversify their sound. And most (NOT all) of these artists are newer ones that he's trying to develop himself or put on the map, so you know they're not going to say no. Look, I'm not trying to make it seem like he's worthless! Not at all. But he just hasn't demonstrated the artistry that TTD or Prince has. Hell, if y'all wanna talk current, even Raphael Saadiq has brought it more than Kelly has. Now, he should be considered the "Modern King of R&B"!! For real!That's suspect you won't appreciate any diversifications between the genre labels/styles I listed above but I'll skip that... You can't have it both ways though, he's the "Hot thing" but you say he doesn't have a unique "thing", so what is the "thing" the artists want from him?
Why can't they get a "hot thing" somewhere else if R Kelly has no unique qualities or sound? You can't use an association with a cool name cop out because in troubled recent times artists have distanced themselves from him, even Jay-Z did and they had album together... his name is mud.[/quote]R.Kelly for a Decade Plus hasn't slowed down&you have had your Dr.Dre Period,Babyface,Period,Neptunes,Puffy,Cash Money,Timberland,No-Limit,&other Sounds&again R.Kelly is still Standing doing His thing.you can't fade R.Kelly mistermaxxx | |
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Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! first of all IMHO R.Kelly Smears TTD in a Blow out.as for Prince: over the past Decade R.Kelly Whips Him up as a Writer&Producer with ease.only since 90 does the fact being able to Be so Wicked on Stage gives Him a chance.but in the Studio since the 90's R.Kelly Creams both of them.Neither Prince nor TTD can balance Pop,R&B&Rap-Hip-Hop together like Him&if you say so than you don't know jack about Hip-Hop.you go ask some Props who of those three Fuses all three together&you will come back asking me for tissue.TTD is a Has-Been who is trys to Hard to make Himself more Intelligent than He is.Very Talented Cat&One of My All-tiem Favorites but Come On nobody is Jocking His Junk for the longest time.blame Radio,blame the Media,Blame the Record Company,Blame Fans,etc... time for Cats like TTD,Prince,MJ to just Bring it&stopp Crying A River of why they can't Hang no More.R.Kelly got Issues but still His Music speaks to People.thank Goodness Stevie Wonder doesn't keep up crying why He doesn't have Hits anymore it's about a New Era of Ears&Generation that has moved on.everybody major that makes it has there Prime&Peak&then they are done.you wanna Debate with Me because you Know I'm Right regardless of what you say.I respect your Opnion of Defending TTD&Prince but you gotta also understand why I defend R.Kelly.Prince nor TTD are Wirrtine Songs like R.Kelly.if either one of them could find a Hit they would.and as far setting trends:Prince&TTD Stopped doing that back in the 80's my friend.Prince had healthy 10 Year Run&TTD a 2 year Run.R.Kelly has had a healthy 12 Year Run.I Rest My Case!I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's! No way. Period. R. Kelly will probably even admit that he has a long way to go get to their level! What gives you any idea he could do rock, real funk, jazz, or country? Where's the proof? Which songs? Kelly writes hits because that's what he's trying to do. Prince and TTD could too, but they're at different points in their respective careers! Kelly isn't trying to push himself as an artist! He's still doing the same stuff he was doing when he came out with PA Announcement. Like I said, Kelly's on his run now, but there's a limit to his creativity that, so far, will NOT put in the same category as these cats! I'm not stuck in the past...I'm just a realist. I realize Kelly will have more and more hits than Prince and TTD right now (mainly cuz he's catering to the R&B/hip hop market and has his ear to the streets to know who's hot there to work with and so forth). He utilizes the promotion machine of videos and whatnot better than they do, and, quite frankly, ever really did too. And plus, I like some his stuff too, remember. But, those cats would blow his ass away on terms of pure artistry and creativity, not sales (which Kelly would kick their asses in, yes; LOL!) and you know it. But it's cool to be a Kelly fan (I'm a very casual one), just know his place (not on the big scale...yet) in the big picture of music and artistry. Putting aside yours and Maxxx's "Who's better?" discussion, I think you do RK a massive diservice. First of all he does have his own vibe and sound which has given rise to a whole heap of imitators. Also why would so many artists go to R for songs if his sound was so run of the mill?
Also he's got jazzy with Quincy Jones, old school soul (sometimes with Ronald Isley), hip-hop jams, party uptempo joints, straight R&B, inspiring gospel ballads, funk/rock (Check the Prince-like Imagine on CF). Hell he's even done an Opera pastiche, how versatile do you want him to be? Everything you just mentioned is pretty much all a part of the R&B genre. He hasn't done anything much outside of it besides hip hop (which I'm not knocking)! And why do some artists go to Kelly for a song? Because he's the hot thing right now. Plain and simple. They don't go to him so that he can help diversify their sound. And most (NOT all) of these artists are newer ones that he's trying to develop himself or put on the map, so you know they're not going to say no. Look, I'm not trying to make it seem like he's worthless! Not at all. But he just hasn't demonstrated the artistry that TTD or Prince has. Hell, if y'all wanna talk current, even Raphael Saadiq has brought it more than Kelly has. Now, he should be considered the "Modern King of R&B"!! For real!That's suspect you won't appreciate any diversifications between the genre labels/styles I listed above but I'll skip that... You can't have it both ways though, he's the "Hot thing" but you say he doesn't have a unique "thing", so what is the "thing" the artists want from him?
Why can't they get a "hot thing" somewhere else if R Kelly has no unique qualities or sound? You can't use an association with a cool name cop out because in troubled recent times artists have distanced themselves from him, even Jay-Z did and they had album together... his name is mud.[/quote] Because the "diversity" you mentioned pales in comparison to what I was talking about. One song or two that may have a guitar in it doens't mean he's successfully covered the genre. And the others he hasn't shown much depth in besides gospel, so that's why I never touched on it. And maybe I shouldn't use the word "unique", but rather radically different or trend setting. I'd say Timbaland's sound is/was more unique or trend-setting than Kelly's. Again, not to bash the guy to death, but he's not artistic hulk you guys are making him to be. And your Jay-Z example is a good one to bring up when it comes to "everything" he does is a hit. Not exactly. It was a hit all right...it hit straight into the ground running (much like Prince's current sales; LOL!) It's no coincidence that so many people (critics and fans alike) are complaining about the state of current R&B music, especially at a time when Kelly is considered the "king" of modern R&B to some! | |
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mistermaxxx said:[quote] Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! first of all IMHO R.Kelly Smears TTD in a Blow out.as for Prince: over the past Decade R.Kelly Whips Him up as a Writer&Producer with ease.only since 90 does the fact being able to Be so Wicked on Stage gives Him a chance.but in the Studio since the 90's R.Kelly Creams both of them.Neither Prince nor TTD can balance Pop,R&B&Rap-Hip-Hop together like Him&if you say so than you don't know jack about Hip-Hop.you go ask some Props who of those three Fuses all three together&you will come back asking me for tissue.TTD is a Has-Been who is trys to Hard to make Himself more Intelligent than He is.Very Talented Cat&One of My All-tiem Favorites but Come On nobody is Jocking His Junk for the longest time.blame Radio,blame the Media,Blame the Record Company,Blame Fans,etc... time for Cats like TTD,Prince,MJ to just Bring it&stopp Crying A River of why they can't Hang no More.R.Kelly got Issues but still His Music speaks to People.thank Goodness Stevie Wonder doesn't keep up crying why He doesn't have Hits anymore it's about a New Era of Ears&Generation that has moved on.everybody major that makes it has there Prime&Peak&then they are done.you wanna Debate with Me because you Know I'm Right regardless of what you say.I respect your Opnion of Defending TTD&Prince but you gotta also understand why I defend R.Kelly.Prince nor TTD are Wirrtine Songs like R.Kelly.if either one of them could find a Hit they would.and as far setting trends:Prince&TTD Stopped doing that back in the 80's my friend.Prince had healthy 10 Year Run&TTD a 2 year Run.R.Kelly has had a healthy 12 Year Run.I Rest My Case!I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's! No way. Period. R. Kelly will probably even admit that he has a long way to go get to their level! What gives you any idea he could do rock, real funk, jazz, or country? Where's the proof? Which songs? Kelly writes hits because that's what he's trying to do. Prince and TTD could too, but they're at different points in their respective careers! Kelly isn't trying to push himself as an artist! He's still doing the same stuff he was doing when he came out with PA Announcement. Like I said, Kelly's on his run now, but there's a limit to his creativity that, so far, will NOT put in the same category as these cats! I'm not stuck in the past...I'm just a realist. I realize Kelly will have more and more hits than Prince and TTD right now (mainly cuz he's catering to the R&B/hip hop market and has his ear to the streets to know who's hot there to work with and so forth). He utilizes the promotion machine of videos and whatnot better than they do, and, quite frankly, ever really did too. And plus, I like some his stuff too, remember. But, those cats would blow his ass away on terms of pure artistry and creativity, not sales (which Kelly would kick their asses in, yes; LOL!) and you know it. But it's cool to be a Kelly fan (I'm a very casual one), just know his place (not on the big scale...yet) in the big picture of music and artistry. Putting aside yours and Maxxx's "Who's better?" discussion, I think you do RK a massive diservice. First of all he does have his own vibe and sound which has given rise to a whole heap of imitators. Also why would so many artists go to R for songs if his sound was so run of the mill?
Also he's got jazzy with Quincy Jones, old school soul (sometimes with Ronald Isley), hip-hop jams, party uptempo joints, straight R&B, inspiring gospel ballads, funk/rock (Check the Prince-like Imagine on CF). Hell he's even done an Opera pastiche, how versatile do you want him to be? Everything you just mentioned is pretty much all a part of the R&B genre. He hasn't done anything much outside of it besides hip hop (which I'm not knocking)! And why do some artists go to Kelly for a song? Because he's the hot thing right now. Plain and simple. They don't go to him so that he can help diversify their sound. And most (NOT all) of these artists are newer ones that he's trying to develop himself or put on the map, so you know they're not going to say no. Look, I'm not trying to make it seem like he's worthless! Not at all. But he just hasn't demonstrated the artistry that TTD or Prince has. Hell, if y'all wanna talk current, even Raphael Saadiq has brought it more than Kelly has. Now, he should be considered the "Modern King of R&B"!! For real!That's suspect you won't appreciate any diversifications between the genre labels/styles I listed above but I'll skip that...
You can't have it both ways though, he's the "Hot thing" but you say he doesn't have a unique "thing", so what is the "thing" the artists want from him?
Why can't they get a "hot thing" somewhere else if R Kelly has no unique qualities or sound? You can't use an association with a cool name cop out because in troubled recent times artists have distanced themselves from him, even Jay-Z did and they had album together... his name is mud. R.Kelly for a Decade Plus hasn't slowed down&you have had your Dr.Dre Period,Babyface,Period,Neptunes,Puffy,Cash Money,Timberland,No-Limit,&other Sounds&again R.Kelly is still Standing doing His thing.you can't fade R.Kelly
You can't tell me Dre's cooled down?? He's hotter than Kelly right now, and you can't deny that!! You want me to be impressed by Kelly? Tell him to change his artistic direction and add some depth to his repertoire. Then, I can be a believer. Until then, he's just another "hitmaker" (albeit a talented one). As I said in the post before, it's no coincidence that many (fans and critics alike) consider these days a sad state of R&B. | |
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On the serious and true note, I wanted to take a quick time out to say it's been a pleasure discussing our disagreements on this topic with y'all two, Maxxx and Essence! I hold steadfast to my convictions, but I definitely have much respect for your opinions, and you've kept me on my Ps and Qs when we have intelligent, well-thought out discussions such as this one, instead of it becoming a bunch of childish name calling and flaming. This is how it should be on a board! Now, on to you guys being wrong... | |
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alexnvrmnd said: On the serious and true note, I wanted to take a quick time out to say it's been a pleasure discussing our disagreements on this topic with y'all two, Maxxx and Essence! I hold steadfast to my convictions, but I definitely have much respect for your opinions, and you've kept me on my Ps and Qs when we have intelligent, well-thought out discussions such as this one, instead of it becoming a bunch of childish name calling and flaming. This is how it should be on a board! Now, on to you guys being wrong... yeah I Guess you are interesting to Debate with but Essence&Myself are Right&We Know How Bad R.Kelly is&Collect His Works Non-stop Because His Music has Soul&Feeling.if the Cat didn't Bring The Pain then we wouldn't be having this Disscussion.We Are Civil but I Know R.Kelly is Da Kang Of Modern R&Bmistermaxxx | |
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alexnvrmnd said:[quote] mistermaxxx said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: Essence said: alexnvrmnd said: mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: Not playing the defense card at all. Just saying that compared to those two, he's not yet in their league. And the way I look at it, Prince and TTD can do what R Kelly does, but he can't do what they do. He can't play rock AND R&B (among other genres) seamlessly, and mainly just sticsk to the tired current R&B/hip hop genre. For me to really look at him as a MAJOR force, he needs to expand his sound, something he hasn't been able to do since he's come onto the scene. I'm just explaining to you why I don't think of him as highly as you do. And, he may be the biggest thing in R&B music right now...I'll give you that (no "hating" here). But as far as setting trends and being an electic force throughout music itself, he's just not there (a place TTD could EASILY have been too had he not decided to make music radio PDs wouldn't want to air, but brilliant nonetheless)! first of all IMHO R.Kelly Smears TTD in a Blow out.as for Prince: over the past Decade R.Kelly Whips Him up as a Writer&Producer with ease.only since 90 does the fact being able to Be so Wicked on Stage gives Him a chance.but in the Studio since the 90's R.Kelly Creams both of them.Neither Prince nor TTD can balance Pop,R&B&Rap-Hip-Hop together like Him&if you say so than you don't know jack about Hip-Hop.you go ask some Props who of those three Fuses all three together&you will come back asking me for tissue.TTD is a Has-Been who is trys to Hard to make Himself more Intelligent than He is.Very Talented Cat&One of My All-tiem Favorites but Come On nobody is Jocking His Junk for the longest time.blame Radio,blame the Media,Blame the Record Company,Blame Fans,etc... time for Cats like TTD,Prince,MJ to just Bring it&stopp Crying A River of why they can't Hang no More.R.Kelly got Issues but still His Music speaks to People.thank Goodness Stevie Wonder doesn't keep up crying why He doesn't have Hits anymore it's about a New Era of Ears&Generation that has moved on.everybody major that makes it has there Prime&Peak&then they are done.you wanna Debate with Me because you Know I'm Right regardless of what you say.I respect your Opnion of Defending TTD&Prince but you gotta also understand why I defend R.Kelly.Prince nor TTD are Wirrtine Songs like R.Kelly.if either one of them could find a Hit they would.and as far setting trends:Prince&TTD Stopped doing that back in the 80's my friend.Prince had healthy 10 Year Run&TTD a 2 year Run.R.Kelly has had a healthy 12 Year Run.I Rest My Case!I understand why you defend R. Kelly too. I think he's talented as well, just not as talented as those two! Kelly hasn't started or headed ANY trend, my friend...just been doing what's current and doing what some of the people want to hear (which I'm certainly not knocking him for). He hasn't set any new trends or gone in any new directions! But, you're smoking crack if you think Kelly can blow TTD away!!! In the studio, both Prince and he would KILL Kelly with originality, musical talent, and creativity. If you notice, they're not trying to write hits like Kelly is, so that's the difference! You're right...Kelly does blend R&B and hip hop better than those two. Absolutely, but he hasn't demonstrated that he can pursue other genres. Can he rock, (true) funk, do blues, jazz, and even folk-rock/country? He can't. And that's what separates him from the other two. I mean c'mon, they're not even in the same class!!! I'd have to give him a few more years to see what else he does, but right now, he's just a hot, quite talented R&B star having a nice little run, not unlike Babyface was ubquitous back in the early to mid 90's! No way. Period. R. Kelly will probably even admit that he has a long way to go get to their level! What gives you any idea he could do rock, real funk, jazz, or country? Where's the proof? Which songs? Kelly writes hits because that's what he's trying to do. Prince and TTD could too, but they're at different points in their respective careers! Kelly isn't trying to push himself as an artist! He's still doing the same stuff he was doing when he came out with PA Announcement. Like I said, Kelly's on his run now, but there's a limit to his creativity that, so far, will NOT put in the same category as these cats! I'm not stuck in the past...I'm just a realist. I realize Kelly will have more and more hits than Prince and TTD right now (mainly cuz he's catering to the R&B/hip hop market and has his ear to the streets to know who's hot there to work with and so forth). He utilizes the promotion machine of videos and whatnot better than they do, and, quite frankly, ever really did too. And plus, I like some his stuff too, remember. But, those cats would blow his ass away on terms of pure artistry and creativity, not sales (which Kelly would kick their asses in, yes; LOL!) and you know it. But it's cool to be a Kelly fan (I'm a very casual one), just know his place (not on the big scale...yet) in the big picture of music and artistry. Putting aside yours and Maxxx's "Who's better?" discussion, I think you do RK a massive diservice. First of all he does have his own vibe and sound which has given rise to a whole heap of imitators. Also why would so many artists go to R for songs if his sound was so run of the mill?
Also he's got jazzy with Quincy Jones, old school soul (sometimes with Ronald Isley), hip-hop jams, party uptempo joints, straight R&B, inspiring gospel ballads, funk/rock (Check the Prince-like Imagine on CF). Hell he's even done an Opera pastiche, how versatile do you want him to be? Everything you just mentioned is pretty much all a part of the R&B genre. He hasn't done anything much outside of it besides hip hop (which I'm not knocking)! And why do some artists go to Kelly for a song? Because he's the hot thing right now. Plain and simple. They don't go to him so that he can help diversify their sound. And most (NOT all) of these artists are newer ones that he's trying to develop himself or put on the map, so you know they're not going to say no. Look, I'm not trying to make it seem like he's worthless! Not at all. But he just hasn't demonstrated the artistry that TTD or Prince has. Hell, if y'all wanna talk current, even Raphael Saadiq has brought it more than Kelly has. Now, he should be considered the "Modern King of R&B"!! For real!That's suspect you won't appreciate any diversifications between the genre labels/styles I listed above but I'll skip that...
You can't have it both ways though, he's the "Hot thing" but you say he doesn't have a unique "thing", so what is the "thing" the artists want from him?
Why can't they get a "hot thing" somewhere else if R Kelly has no unique qualities or sound? You can't use an association with a cool name cop out because in troubled recent times artists have distanced themselves from him, even Jay-Z did and they had album together... his name is mud. R.Kelly for a Decade Plus hasn't slowed down&you have had your Dr.Dre Period,Babyface,Period,Neptunes,Puffy,Cash Money,Timberland,No-Limit,&other Sounds&again R.Kelly is still Standing doing His thing.you can't fade R.Kelly
You can't tell me Dre's cooled down?? He's hotter than Kelly right now, and you can't deny that!! You want me to be impressed by Kelly? Tell him to change his artistic direction and add some depth to his repertoire. Then, I can be a believer. Until then, he's just another "hitmaker" (albeit a talented one). As I said in the post before, it's no coincidence that many (fans and critics alike) consider these days a sad state of R&B. mistermaxxx | |
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mistermaxxx said: alexnvrmnd said: On the serious and true note, I wanted to take a quick time out to say it's been a pleasure discussing our disagreements on this topic with y'all two, Maxxx and Essence! I hold steadfast to my convictions, but I definitely have much respect for your opinions, and you've kept me on my Ps and Qs when we have intelligent, well-thought out discussions such as this one, instead of it becoming a bunch of childish name calling and flaming. This is how it should be on a board! Now, on to you guys being wrong... yeah I Guess you are interesting to Debate with but Essence&Myself are Right&We Know How Bad R.Kelly is&Collect His Works Non-stop Because His Music has Soul&Feeling.if the Cat didn't Bring The Pain then we wouldn't be having this Disscussion.We Are Civil but I Know R.Kelly is Da Kang Of Modern R&BSoul and feeling? To who? The dead? I feel nothing when I listen to it besides a desire to hit the "stop" button or to change the station. You are right about one thing...he does bring me pain! And, if I were to consider him the king of modern R&B, it would be ONLY in the sale dept, certainly not musically. Besides, even Essence hasn't dubbed him that, only you. LOL! | |
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alexnvrmnd said: On the serious and true note, I wanted to take a quick time out to say it's been a pleasure discussing our disagreements on this topic with y'all two, Maxxx and Essence! I hold steadfast to my convictions, but I definitely have much respect for your opinions, and you've kept me on my Ps and Qs when we have intelligent, well-thought out discussions such as this one, instead of it becoming a bunch of childish name calling and flaming. This is how it should be on a board! Now, on to you guys being wrong...
It's cool, I didn't get too involved because it's pointless arguing to somebody about why they should like what you like. Akin with Moonbeam's stumbling over expressing his ideas for why Aretha Franklin is overrated, people can like/dislike what they want but at least offer respect where it's due... | |
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