Madonna is an American singer-songwriter, actress, dancer, and entrepreneur. As a prominent figure within popular culture since her debut in 1983, Madonna's contribution to music, film, fashion and dance and with her attitude has influenced many other artists in the world.

In this manner, she is cited as cultural icon as well a pop, gayand fashion icon.

Her influence in the entertainment industry has generated extensive commentaries and analysis from the critics, the public and the media. An example of this is the term "Madonna wannabe" with origins in the middle of the decade of 1980 and with validity today. Juan Restrepo from Yahoo! described it this way: "With Madonna something happens that is unparalleled in the music and popular culture generally. She is her own current. Madonna ends inevitably present in the lives of almost all the singers in the world, either at the beginning or end of the race. She is the source of inspiration and goal to conquer"

Certified by the Guinness World Record as the best-selling female recording artist of all time many authors have called Madonna the most successful, powerful, admired and/or influential female performer of all time

In this way, Madonna has appeared as the first in several lists drawn up by media as VH1 (100 Greatest Women in Music) or the British tabloid The Sun ("The 50 female singers who will never be forgotten")

Influence and commentaries

Like any artist, Madonna has taken inspiration from some personalities ranging from Marilyn Monroe to Led Zeppelin, and several necessities as the Kabbalah; as well on gender stereotypes, sexual cliches, corporate monoliths and religious ones.Within this theme, Billboard editor M. Tye Comer stated: "Although Madonna had her influences, she created her own unmistakable style... She wrote her own ticket; she didn't have to follow anybody's formula. She declared who she was ... and took possession of her music". Jocelyn Vena of MTV commented that "she's influenced others and, yes, even herself". Her influence on social history was declared by World Music Awards saying how Madonna changed the World: "She inspired every struggling young

singer/actor/dancer with a dream..... She put Malawi on the map. Not many people talked about Malawi before Madonna's Raising Malawi Organisation and.... She popularised Argentinian politics. Before Madonna played Eva Perón, not many really knew much about Argentina's General Peron." Even, Telcel added "since her appearance on the music scene in 1983, no artist has called more the attention that Madonna... has pushed the boundaries of the world of music, film and fashion." Rolling Stone concluded that "her influence in the recent generations of artists who have picked up some of her moves and have been influenced by her style".The authors of the book Encyclopedia of Women in Today's World noted that "Madonna's cultural influence has been profound and pervasive, as her multiple transformations and controversies have attracted the attention of numerous scholars working in a variety of fields, namely feminist and queer theory, cultural studies, film and media studies". For its part, the British sociologist and media theorist, David Gauntlett ensures that "Madonna has clearly been a uniquely successful and enduring pop phenomenon; Madonna provides a whole world of ideas and experiences - in music, visual and expressions of cultural and sexual politics".

Authors noted Madonna's influence on pop stars, generating extensive scrutiny comments. For example, in Madonna's Drowned Worlds, biographers Santiago Fouz-Hernández and Freya Jarman-Ivens noted that since the beginning of her career, Madonna has clearly inspired many female pop artists, including the Spice Girls, Britney Spears and Kelly Osbourne. VH1 spokeswoman Sally Habbershaw said: "Madonna has truly reached iconic status and many of our viewers will know her entire career."

ony Sclafani from MSNBC felt that "her influence on pop music has outshone that of the Beatles". Add that "quarter century after Madonna emerged, artists still use her ideas and seem modern and edgy doing so. Beyond the obvious Madonna wannabe 1980s singers, Madonna’s influence is felt in artists from Gwen Stefani to Britney Spears to boy bands, who found in the 1990s there was an audience beyond the old rock crowd." Furthermore, stated: "It’s worth noting that before Madonna, most music mega-stars were guy rockers; after her, almost all would be female singers" and that "the word "female" is significant in that assessment of Madonna because she presented herself in a fresh way for women artists". The Time magazine, stated: "Every pop star of the last two to three decades has Madonna to thank in some part for his or her success". Homa Khaleeli from The Guardian said that "no matter the decade or the fashion... Madonna is about power; despite nearly 30 years in a notoriously fickle business, and compared with her contemporaries – Michael Jackson and Prince – has remained in the spotlight largely on her own terms. Highlighted that "she inspires not because she gives other women a helping hand, but because she breaks the boundaries of what's considered acceptable for women", while Carlos Otero from Divinity Channel wrote that "Madonna has secured for life the title of "Queen of Pop". He further asserted that "after 30 years of career would take another three decades to meet her influence and legacy.

The author Ken Mcleod in his book We Are the Champions: The Politics of Sports and Popular Music, wrote that "Madonna has been one of the most influential female pop singers for the past three decades." Similarly, the author Kimberly Potts said: "No other female pop star in history has had the musical, music video, concert tour, and fashion influence that Madonna has had, and continues to have, in the past three —continuining into a fourth— deacade". Peter Robinson from The Guardian felt that "Madonna pretty much invented contemporary pop fame so there is a little bit of her in the DNA of every modern pop thing." Tú Magazine from Editorial Televisa, commented:

Madonna's influence on pop music stars is undeniable, from the music to the sets or outfits, all can see that the Queen of Pop has been the model for the current stars of world music firmament.

In this lines, Ian Youngs from BBC News say that "her influence on others has come as much from her image as her music, with her no-nonsense, boundary-pushing persona showing other artists what could be achieved". And according to Fouz-Hernández, female pop performers such as Britney Spears, Christina Aguilera, Kylie Minogue, theSpice Girls, Destiny's Child, Jennifer Lopez and Pink were like "Madonna's daughters in the very direct sense that they grew up listening to and admiring Madonna, and decided they wanted to be like her." Ottawa Sun editor Aedan Helmer commented: "It would be easy to quantify her influence by the generations of pop stars created and groomed in her self-made image — without Madonna, the Britneys and Katys of the world simply wouldn’t exist". As Youngs and Helmer, Merely Me from Health Centralwrote: "I feel that there would be no Britney Spears or Lady Gaga without Madonna. Her influence is seen in the fashion, style and songs of many of the female pop stars of today." Rick Florino from Artist Direct commented:

"You can't think of modern pop music without thinking about her. There would be no Britney, no Christina, no Pussycat Dolls and no Lady GaGa without her. From the second that she burst onto the scene in the early '80s, her presence has permeated almost every facet of pop. Her influence is everywhere, and she's not going anywhere either.

Howard Kramer, curatorial director of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and Museum, commented: "Today's more-flamboyant female pop stars enjoy the freedom to make music and perform the way they do, but they didn't create that freedom. Madonna did the moving and shaking when she burst onto the pop-music charts in the early '80s." He further asserted that "Madonna and the career she carved out for herself made possible virtually every other female pop singer to follow... She certainly raised the standards of all of them... She redefined what the parameters were for female performers."

In this lines, Ian Youngs from BBC News say that "her influence on others has come as much from her image as her music, with her no-nonsense, boundary-pushing persona showing other artists what could be achieved". And according to Fouz-Hernández, female pop performers such as Britney Spears, Christina Aguilera, Kylie Minogue, the Spice Girls, Destiny's Child, Jennifer Lopez and Pink were like "Madonna's daughters in the very direct sense that they grew up listening to and admiring Madonna, and decided they wanted to be like her." Ottawa Sun editor Aedan Helmer commented: "It would be easy to quantify her influence by the generations of pop stars created and groomed in her self-made image — without Madonna, the Britneys and Katys of the world simply wouldn’t exist". As Youngs and Helmer, Merely Me from Health Centralwrote: "I feel that there would be no Britney Spears or Lady Gaga without Madonna. Her influence is seen in the fashion, style and songs of many of the female pop stars of today." Rick Florino from Artist Direct commented:

"You can't think of modern pop music without thinking about her. There would be no Britney, no Christina, no Pussycat Dolls and no Lady GaGa without her. From the second that she burst onto the scene in the early '80s, her presence has permeated almost every facet of pop. Her influence is everywhere, and she's not going anywhere either.

Howard Kramer, curatorial director of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and Museum, commented: "Today's more-flamboyant female pop stars enjoy the freedom to make music and perform the way they do, but they didn't create that freedom. Madonna did the moving and shaking when she burst onto the pop-music charts in the early '80s." He further asserted that "Madonna and the career she carved out for herself made possible virtually every other female pop singer to follow... She certainly raised the standards of all of them... She redefined what the parameters were for female performers."

Influenced by Madonna

Comments from artists and media attention

Within the field of entertainment, many personalities have recognized the importance of Madonna in showbiz. Many artists have been inspired by and has been compared to Madonna. Additionally, some artists also has called "Madonna" by the media international, including the "Mexican Madonna" (Selena,^[Yuri or Gloria Trevi), "Latin Madonna" (Gloria Estefan, Thalía or Shakira), "Black Madonna" (Rihanna or Beyoncé), etc. In fact, often many of the artists who have been inspired heavily by Madonna are known by international press as "The heirs of Madonna". For example, in 2013 MTV Latin America makes a call vote What is the heir to the queen of pop?. Rolling Stone Argentina cited of Britney to Gaga, passing by Rihanna and Christina.^[Ann Powers from NPR Music commented that "Madonna, is doing turning the world's attention to her heirs." Rodrigo Fresán said: "We think of the Madonnas that to come as we think on science fiction that is becoming less fiction and allow ourselves to imagine Madonna's clones."

Many media conglomerates Britney Spears have referred to as the "heir" of Madonna, and others as Us Weekly Staff said her heir apparent is Lady Gaga. Among them, Madonna's influence was most notable in Spears, who has been called "her protégé". In her case, Gwen Stefani responded "Some people say that I copy her. But show me one girl my age who was not influenced by her." She has been referred to as "The new Madonna" by publications such as The Hollywood Reporter and People. Within this topic, Paul Rees, editor of Q said "Madonna is aware of the influence she has on the heirs to her crown, but does not rate them highly". Diego A. Manrique from El País as well Fouz-Hernández in Madonna's Drowned Worlds (2004) and other authors, called to artists like Spears, Aguilera and others as Madonna's musical daughters.

The following are some comments made by artists who have been inspired by Madonna:

Justin Timberlake recognizes that "her mighty influence seems to have subconsciously seeped into the videos of some of today’s biggest stars too". In 2014, rapper Kanye West declared her as "The Greatest Visual Musical Artist' Of All Time" during his commentaries on popular culture and the Madonna's influence on the industry. Her ex-husband, Guy Ritchie admitted that: "Madonna completely changed his life" because "it catapulted him into the public eye".

• Nicki Minaj stated to Ryan Seacrest in 2012: "Meeting Madonna changed my life. Working with Madonna changed my life."Minaj credits Madonna as major influence on her career. In August 2014 Minaj said "I feel like one of the people who I [always] looked up to the most was Madonna," during an interview with Ryan Seacrest
• Paris Hilton: Hilton said that "She always reinvents herself and I really look up to her as an artist. I am so inspired by her and her music".

• Paulina Rubio: cited Madonna as influence in several occasions. For example, by her seventh studio album Ananda she revealed when that things in change, think of Madonna, whom she admires for her ability to evolve over time. The international press has referred to She as "The Mexican Madonna".

• Katy Perry: has cited Madonna as an influence more than once. Her film, Katy Perry: Part of Me was largely influenced by Madonna’s 1991 film Truth or Dare. On other occasion, she said she wants to be like Madonna.

• Kylie Minogue: has been inspired by and compared to Madonna throughout her career.^[159] Minogue has said of Madonna, "Her huge influence on the world, in pop and fashion, meant that I wasn't immune to the trends she created. I admire Madonna greatly but in the beginning she made it difficult for artists like me, she had done everything there was to be done ...", and "Madonna's the Queen of Pop, I'm the princess. I'm quite happy with that."

• Lady Gaga: "The last revolution was launched by Madonna 25 years ago" in addition to commenting that "there is really no one that is a more adoring and loving Madonna fan than me. I am the hugest fan personally and professionally."Worldwide, Lady Gaga has been identified as "The Next Madonna".

• Britney Spears: In the 2002 book Madonnastyle by Carol Clerk, she is quoted saying: "I have been a huge fan of Madonna since I was a little girl. She's the person that I've really looked up to. I would really, really like to be a legend like Madonna."She cites Madonna as a strong influence on her career.

• Christina Aguilera: Aguilera has named Madonna as one of her biggest influences "for being re-inventive and being brave as a strong female, to explore whatever, even if they do get bad press. It's just like they were fearless."

• Rihanna has named Madonna as her idol and biggest influence, and said she wants to be the "The Black Madonna". She said: "I think that Madonna was a great inspiration for me, especially on my earlier work. If I had to examine her evolution through time, I think she reinvented her clothing style and music with success every single time. And at the same time remained a real force in entertainment in the whole world."

• Jessica Simpson: When confessed that was accidentally influenced by Madonna's "Holiday" She admitted that Madonna "did influence me and still does today. I hope to have the longevity of her career."

• Dita Von Teese: She give credits to Madonna "for inspiring her to be individual". "With helping her feel comfortable with her looks as a youngster".

• Beyoncé: has credited to Madonna because she inspired her to take control of her own career. She is has been known for some media such as "The Black Madonna".

• Avril Lavigne: confessed want to be "the new Madonna". She added: "I want to be around the way Madonna has done it. She's had her life but still maintained her career throughout."

• Brittany Murphy: Murphy confessed that Madonna had a quote, "I’m going to change the world". Was a huge inspiration to me so I decided I was going to be my own version of Madonna when I grew up."

• Miley Cyrus: She revealed that wants to be the "The Next Madonna" and said that Madonna always reinvents herself, and that's what I want to do.

• Alizée: cited to Madonna in many times as one of her biggest influence. In 2008, she declared: "The only my thing left is meet Madonna and singing with her." In 2010, said "Madonna is a singer who I greatly admire his talent and career. Instead, by Lady Gaga I feel not that admiration, sometimes I think that falls into the ridiculous, I think Madonna does cause and does so with elegance, an element that is missing in Gaga".

• Ariana Grande: shared her comments on Madonna during a Billboard interview in August 2014. Grande said "she is strength, is freedom, and is wisdom beyond anybody’s comprehension.

This should be interesting once you start looking into the dudes that have been inspired by La M.

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and of course those whom are adamant that her continued success is all an elaborate white muse.

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Anyhoo:

Industry darling ADELE:

On Madonna’s Ray of Light being the "chief inspiration" for 25:
"You know what I found so amazing about that record? That's the record Madonna wrote after having her first child, and for me, it's her best. I was so all over the place after having a child, just because my chemicals were just hitting the fucking roof and shit like that."

"I was just drifting away, and I couldn't find that many examples for myself where I was like, 'Fuck, they truly came back to themselves,' until someone was like, 'Well, obviously, Ray of Light.'"

There is not denying of her influence, she is great.

[Edited 3/29/16 13:13pm]

Love her and her influence too, and have been a lifelong fan of hers up until recently (I can't stand her new stuff), but a lot of those acts have cited janet too and I see more of her or just as much of her in them than madonna.

alphastreet said:

Love her and her influence too, and have been a lifelong fan of hers up until recently (I can't stand her new stuff), but a lot of those acts have cited janet too and I see more of her or just as much of her in them than madonna.

Love specially for her ballads and the more vulnerable songs of hers.

[Edited 3/29/16 13:15pm]

ok ..and who came before madonna?

luvsexy4all said:

ok ..and who came before madonna?

Are you kidding, before Madonna no one but Eve.

214 said:

luvsexy4all said:

ok ..and who came before madonna?

Are you kidding, before Madonna no one but Eve.

try blondie...

In my opinion, Madonna's influence on music -- and to a lesser extent, culture -- has been almost entirely negative.

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She's no worse than dozens upon dozens of other artists, but she's 'bigger' and more famous, so she'll have to bear the brunt.

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There were aspects of her that I appreciated in the late 80s (notice I said 'aspects'). It was cool that she was ballsy and bold, and projected an image of being 'in charge'. Somewhat like Prince did, she flaunted sexuality, which is fine, though the 'boy-toy' belt and selling herself as a sexual object in video after video contributed to the continual denigration of the female pop star, I'm sure. I can understand doing that in, say, 1983/84 when she was still hungry for superstardom, but to still be basing her entire image (which is, essentially, her career) on her sexuality in 1994 was a bit embarrassing.

.

Musically, she was pleasant disco-pop fare in the mid-80s, a singer possessed of a very average voice, but then made one great pop album, Like A Prayer (1989). Even at this highest artistic moment, however, she couldn't let the music speak for itself as she needed to make Catholic-baiting videos in order to ensure her name was in the press (she succeeded).

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Following this, an embarrassing three or four years in the first half of the 90s ensued when her star fell considerably, her sex-selling became a parody of itself, and she appeared to be on the way down (not coincidentally, this mini-fall coincided with a period of a new generation of rock musicians and female singers whose success was premised on music, not image). Luckily for Madonna, boy-bands and teen-pop were ascendant again by the late-90s, and with some carefully chosen high-priced collaborators, she re-emerged in uncritical pop circles as a 'legend' in her own time, the Godmother of image-first, sell-everything, body-toned, disposable pop. She's basically held her position there ever since.

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I should give Madonna some credit for developing her vocal chops as she matured, and also for her extremely hard work (tone those abs!) over the years. She's obviously a highly driven achiever who would have succeeded in anything she chose to pursue.

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But as far as her legacy, and the artists she influenced, I would say it's negative and they're mainly disposable, respectively. In some sense, what Madonna symbolizes is the downfall of popular music in the Western world.

ThePanther said:

In my opinion, Madonna's influence on music -- and to a lesser extent, culture -- has been almost entirely negative.

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She's no worse than dozens upon dozens of other artists, but she's 'bigger' and more famous, so she'll have to bear the brunt.

.

There were aspects of her that I appreciated in the late 80s (notice I said 'aspects'). It was cool that she was ballsy and bold, and projected an image of being 'in charge'. Somewhat like Prince did, she flaunted sexuality, which is fine, though the 'boy-toy' belt and selling herself as a sexual object in video after video contributed to the continual denigration of the female pop star, I'm sure. I can understand doing that in, say, 1983/84 when she was still hungry for superstardom, but to still be basing her entire image (which is, essentially, her career) on her sexuality in 1994 was a bit embarrassing.

.

Musically, she was pleasant disco-pop fare in the mid-80s, a singer possessed of a very average voice, but then made one great pop album, Like A Prayer (1989). Even at this highest artistic moment, however, she couldn't let the music speak for itself as she needed to make Catholic-baiting videos in order to ensure her name was in the press (she succeeded).

.

Following this, an embarrassing three or four years in the first half of the 90s ensued when her star fell considerably, her sex-selling became a parody of itself, and she appeared to be on the way down (not coincidentally, this mini-fall coincided with a period of a new generation of rock musicians and female singers whose success was premised on music, not image). Luckily for Madonna, boy-bands and teen-pop were ascendant again by the late-90s, and with some carefully chosen high-priced collaborators, she re-emerged in uncritical pop circles as a 'legend' in her own time, the Godmother of image-first, sell-everything, body-toned, disposable pop. She's basically held her position there ever since.

.

I should give Madonna some credit for developing her vocal chops as she matured, and also for her extremely hard work (tone those abs!) over the years. She's obviously a highly driven achiever who would have succeeded in anything she chose to pursue.

.

But as far as her legacy, and the artists she influenced, I would say it's negative and they're mainly disposable, respectively. In some sense, what Madonna symbolizes is the downfall of popular music in the Western world.

Absolutely ridiculous post on every level. In the early 1990's. she released Erotica which was one of her best and most critically acclaimed albums. So to say the early 1990's was her worst period is not accurate.

Why is it Madonna is always criticized for relying image and not being about the music, when someone like the late David Bowie was more than the music, but he is praised as an all around artist. Because you incorporate visuals and sexuality into your music, does not mean your music doesn't have merit.

If her music is so disposable, why is it people want to still hear it after all these years? To say all of her music is disposable means you haven't actually listened to most of it. There's nothing disposable about songs such as Like A Prayer or Live to Tell.

ThePanther said:

In my opinion, Madonna's influence on music -- and to a lesser extent, culture -- has been almost entirely negative.

.

She's no worse than dozens upon dozens of other artists, but she's 'bigger' and more famous, so she'll have to bear the brunt.

.

There were aspects of her that I appreciated in the late 80s (notice I said 'aspects'). It was cool that she was ballsy and bold, and projected an image of being 'in charge'. Somewhat like Prince did, she flaunted sexuality, which is fine, though the 'boy-toy' belt and selling herself as a sexual object in video after video contributed to the continual denigration of the female pop star, I'm sure. I can understand doing that in, say, 1983/84 when she was still hungry for superstardom, but to still be basing her entire image (which is, essentially, her career) on her sexuality in 1994 was a bit embarrassing.

.

Musically, she was pleasant disco-pop fare in the mid-80s, a singer possessed of a very average voice, but then made one great pop album, Like A Prayer (1989). Even at this highest artistic moment, however, she couldn't let the music speak for itself as she needed to make Catholic-baiting videos in order to ensure her name was in the press (she succeeded).

.

Following this, an embarrassing three or four years in the first half of the 90s ensued when her star fell considerably, her sex-selling became a parody of itself, and she appeared to be on the way down (not coincidentally, this mini-fall coincided with a period of a new generation of rock musicians and female singers whose success was premised on music, not image). Luckily for Madonna, boy-bands and teen-pop were ascendant again by the late-90s, and with some carefully chosen high-priced collaborators, she re-emerged in uncritical pop circles as a 'legend' in her own time, the Godmother of image-first, sell-everything, body-toned, disposable pop. She's basically held her position there ever since.

.

I should give Madonna some credit for developing her vocal chops as she matured, and also for her extremely hard work (tone those abs!) over the years. She's obviously a highly driven achiever who would have succeeded in anything she chose to pursue.

.

But as far as her legacy, and the artists she influenced, I would say it's negative and they're mainly disposable, respectively. In some sense, what Madonna symbolizes is the downfall of popular music in the Western world.

Rubbish, but you weave a wonderful post none the less lol

She hit superstardom in the 80s but hit another level of superstardom in the 90s with the Justify My Love era into Erotic Bedtime Stories and the Evita movie.
She took some time off to have her child and then reemerged with Ray of Light which was hardly about Selling Sex but spiritual journeys and enlightenement. That was a wonderful time(American Life/Reinvention tour) I actually thought Madonna was going to go a bit clean on us. And I wasn't to happy with that. Then then wonderful Confessions on a Dance Floor took over...I wish she would have stayed closer to that path.

Not to mention the outspokeness on political and social issues
drawing attention to African issues, HIV, Sexual Racial & Gender Issues
She spoke about what was happening in American culture.
As much as Prince is always the object of my affection, he failed in the 90s in these regards.
But the Italia hardly symbolizes a downfall of popular music in any world lol

ThePanther said:

In my opinion, Madonna's influence on music -- and to a lesser extent, culture -- has been almost entirely negative.

.

She's no worse than dozens upon dozens of other artists, but she's 'bigger' and more famous, so she'll have to bear the brunt.

.

There were aspects of her that I appreciated in the late 80s (notice I said 'aspects'). It was cool that she was ballsy and bold, and projected an image of being 'in charge'. Somewhat like Prince did, she flaunted sexuality, which is fine, though the 'boy-toy' belt and selling herself as a sexual object in video after video contributed to the continual denigration of the female pop star, I'm sure. I can understand doing that in, say, 1983/84 when she was still hungry for superstardom, but to still be basing her entire image (which is, essentially, her career) on her sexuality in 1994 was a bit embarrassing.

.

Musically, she was pleasant disco-pop fare in the mid-80s, a singer possessed of a very average voice, but then made one great pop album, Like A Prayer (1989). Even at this highest artistic moment, however, she couldn't let the music speak for itself as she needed to make Catholic-baiting videos in order to ensure her name was in the press (she succeeded).

.

Following this, an embarrassing three or four years in the first half of the 90s ensued when her star fell considerably, her sex-selling became a parody of itself, and she appeared to be on the way down (not coincidentally, this mini-fall coincided with a period of a new generation of rock musicians and female singers whose success was premised on music, not image). Luckily for Madonna, boy-bands and teen-pop were ascendant again by the late-90s, and with some carefully chosen high-priced collaborators, she re-emerged in uncritical pop circles as a 'legend' in her own time, the Godmother of image-first, sell-everything, body-toned, disposable pop. She's basically held her position there ever since.

.

I should give Madonna some credit for developing her vocal chops as she matured, and also for her extremely hard work (tone those abs!) over the years. She's obviously a highly driven achiever who would have succeeded in anything she chose to pursue.

.

But as far as her legacy, and the artists she influenced, I would say it's negative and they're mainly disposable, respectively. In some sense, what Madonna symbolizes is the downfall of popular music in the Western world.

Sort of understand your point about the use of her sexuality, but have you ever heard about Prince? he did exactly the same and in a more explicit way, the same with Bowie as someone already mentioned, but they are men isn't; they are allowed to do so.

214 said:

Sort of understand your point about the use of her sexuality, but have you ever heard about Prince? he did exactly the same and in a more explicit way, the same with Bowie as someone already mentioned, but they are men isn't; they are allowed to do so.

Mens' and womens' sexuality, both physically and in public discourse, is different, in my opinion, and therefore straight-up comparisons don't really work.

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Having said that, I do get where you're coming from. I can totally understand when some women feel upset by men (I'm male) loudly stating opinions about women's sexuality and what is okay and what isn't. I do understand that.

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Nevertheless, my opinion -- which everyone is more than welcome to dismiss -- remains that Madonna is an average singer who stayed the course of selling sex and sex shock-value way too long, to embarrassing effect. When I was a kid, I admired her considerably, but in the early 90s I started losing respect for her, which I've had no reason to recall.

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It doesn't mean Madonna is a bad person or that I don't respect her hard work and survival in a cut-throat industry. And, she had the brains to avoid starring in Graffitti Bridge, so there's that...

ThePanther said:

Nevertheless, my opinion -- which everyone is more than welcome to dismiss -- remains that Madonna is an average singer who stayed the course of selling sex and sex shock-value way too long, to embarrassing effect. When I was a kid, I admired her considerably, but in the early 90s I started losing respect for her, which I've had no reason to recall.

In the 90s when Madonna was doing things like the Sex book and releasing singles like "Erotica",Prince was also doing very sexual songs like "Come" and "Gett Off".Did you have a problem with that? Or is it because Madonna is a woman,you find it "embarrassing"? The funny thing is,in 1994,Madonna wrote a song called "Human Nature" which was directed at people such as yourself,lol.

so this is your idea of "disposable pop",huh?

ThePanther said:

Following this, an embarrassing three or four years in the first half of the 90s ensued when her star fell considerably, her sex-selling became a parody of itself, and she appeared to be on the way down (not coincidentally, this mini-fall coincided with a period of a new generation of rock musicians and female singers whose success was premised on music, not image). Luckily for Madonna, boy-bands and teen-pop were ascendant again by the late-90s, and with some carefully chosen high-priced collaborators, she re-emerged in uncritical pop circles as a 'legend' in her own time, the Godmother of image-first, sell-everything, body-toned, disposable pop. She's basically held her position there ever since.

I don't see how Madonna 1996-2006 could be called embarassing for using 'sex to sell herself' when very little of her work during this period was focused on sex, at least not balatantly. During these years she developed her voice and her music to become a more mature artist so the focus was on her music rather than her image or controversy.

I think the sexed up image returned with Hard Candy but she's simply making a point of being a 50+ year old woman who is still enjoying her sexuality, looking after her body and expressing herself at the same time as being a mother.

I very much doubt if Prince was still focusing on sex in his work and churning out explicit songs people would say it was embarassing or that he was too old to be doing so.

It's a double standard, plain and simple.

One could turn the "I'm sexist" argument around and point out that Madonna is mainly known for her image, while Prince is mainly known for his music. To me, they are not comparable artists, in much the same way Justin Bieber is not comparable to, say, Bon Iver.

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I've never sat down and listened to Ray of Light, since life is too short. I did hear the singles a lot at clubs and whatnot back in the day. God, that one hit was annoying...

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Anyway, if my wife and I ever conceive and have a daughter, I'm going to encourage my child to check out great female artists (I listen to many) that maintained their integrity through their celebrity, while also making timeless, great music. Madonna will not be one of them.

ThePanther said:

One could turn the "I'm sexist" argument around and point out that Madonna is mainly known for her image, while Prince is mainly known for his music. To me, they are not comparable artists, in much the same way Justin Bieber is not comparable to, say, Bon Iver.

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I've never sat down and listened to Ray of Light, since life is too short. I did hear the singles a lot at clubs and whatnot back in the day. God, that one hit was annoying...

.

Anyway, if my wife and I ever conceive and have a daughter, I'm going to encourage my child to check out great female artists (I listen to many) that maintained their integrity through their celebrity, while also making timeless, great music. Madonna will not be one of them.

If you go back and read interviews and reviews U will get a different opinion about what Prince in mainly known for. It all went hand in hand. The image for Prince was just as important as the music. And in the 90s Prince was seriously not known for the music but the controversy, the 'weirdness' etc

You should listen to Bedtime Stories, Ray of Light & Confessions on a Dancefloor.

Madonna made a lot of wonderful Pop(ular) hits and ballads. That people danced to and that as music is supposed to do, accompany them through life. This same person has always had Prince's respect, and I think that says a lot.

SoulAlive said:

ThePanther said:

Nevertheless, my opinion -- which everyone is more than welcome to dismiss -- remains that Madonna is an average singer who stayed the course of selling sex and sex shock-value way too long, to embarrassing effect. When I was a kid, I admired her considerably, but in the early 90s I started losing respect for her, which I've had no reason to recall.

In the 90s when Madonna was doing things like the Sex book and releasing singles like "Erotica",Prince was also doing very sexual songs like "Come" and "Gett Off".Did you have a problem with that? Or is it because Madonna is a woman,you find it "embarrassing"? The funny thing is,in 1994,Madonna wrote a song called "Human Nature" which was directed at people such as yourself,lol.

And Madonna did that period with a purpose. That period was huge on exposing peoples puritan hypocracy's concerning sexuality, that was still a revolutionary period concerning the Aids epidemic and she was very vocal about these things.

Prince was using sex for the sake of sex and was being very exploitive of sex, for no real reason.

Compared to how he did it in the 80s.

My point was....in the early 90s,Prince,too,was using his "sexual image" to create controversy and be seen as provocative.Appearing on the MTV Awards with those "ass-less" pants on....doing things like the "Gett Off" video....releasing an entire called "Come"....seems that you have no problem with him doing these things,but when Madonna did it,you somehow found it to be "embarrassing".That makes no sense.

ThePanther said:

One could turn the "I'm sexist" argument around and point out that Madonna is mainly known for her image, while Prince is mainly known for his music. To me, they are not comparable artists, in much the same way Justin Bieber is not comparable to, say, Bon Iver.

ThePanther said:

I've never sat down and listened to Ray of Light, since life is too short. I did hear the singles a lot at clubs and whatnot back in the day. God, that one hit was annoying...

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Ray Of Light is a very deep,introspective,bold album by Madonna...hardly the type of album that any reasonable person would dismiss as "disposable pop".

ThePanther said:

Anyway, if my wife and I ever conceive and have a daughter, I'm going to encourage my child to check out great female artists (I listen to many) that maintained their integrity through their celebrity, while also making timeless, great music. Madonna will not be one of them.

She'll probably become a Madonna fan anyway Don't be surprised if you find a copy of The Immaculate Collection in her music library,lol

Ray of Light was a surprise album that came out of nowhere in 1998. Daft Punk, Prodigy, Chemical Brothers were having hits left and right with the electronica-dance sound one would have not associated Madonna with 1-2 years earlier depending where you lived. The curiousity with her new sound, video, adapting Eastern influences in a tasteful way is what drove the album to sell 4 million in the US alone and become one of her best sellers yet, and get recognized at the Grammys in this era. It was not for everyone, but I would honestly say whether you are a fan of madonna or don't care for her music, it's an album you'll want to hear at some point objectively for the music if not for the person. Also, it sounded nothing like teen-pop in the 90's, they were two seperate worlds completely.

[Edited 4/6/16 10:27am]

SoulAlive said:

ThePanther said:

I've never sat down and listened to Ray of Light, since life is too short. I did hear the singles a lot at clubs and whatnot back in the day. God, that one hit was annoying...

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Ray Of Light is a very deep,introspective,bold album by Madonna...hardly the type of album that any reasonable person would dismiss as "disposable pop".

Is a beautiful album, and i mean it just listen to Mer Girl, Drowned World, Frozan, Has To Be, Swim, Sky Fits Heaven and so on... Panther i do not understand where you oming from; it sounds as if you were uncomfortable with Madonna nad her sexual image just because she is a woman; but not with Prince same use of his sexual image and more extended in his music, just because of the mere fact that he is a man. I do agree she has not the voice like other female artists; you name it.

I just wanted to point out that Prince going on TV in ass-less pants, and Madonna (theoretically) going onstage in ass-less pants, is not the same.

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Why? Because Prince is a man and Madonna is a woman.

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A man (who's a major star with a mass audience) going on TV with ass-less pants is challenging every known gender/image-norm for heterosexual men. It's guaranteed to turn-off part of his own audience (call that the middle of the road hetero-normative crowd), and it's completely out of step with music-industry traditions and expectations for established mainstream male stars.

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By contrast, Madonna (or any attractive woman who's a major star with a mass audience) going onstage in ass-less pants (or a corset, or underwear, or whatever) is not challenging anything -- in fact, it's setting feminism back 50 years and giving in to male-centred expectations for the exploitation of the female body.

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(And yes, I'm well aware of Madonna's enormous appeal to a gay audience. That's fine. But it's a different matter entirely.)

ThePanther said:

I just wanted to point out that Prince going on TV in ass-less pants, and Madonna (theoretically) going onstage in ass-less pants, is not the same.

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Why? Because Prince is a man and Madonna is a woman.

.

A man (who's a major star with a mass audience) going on TV with ass-less pants is challenging every known gender/image-norm for heterosexual men. It's guaranteed to turn-off part of his own audience (call that the middle of the road hetero-normative crowd), and it's completely out of step with music-industry traditions and expectations for established mainstream male stars.

.

By contrast, Madonna (or any attractive woman who's a major star with a mass audience) going onstage in ass-less pants (or a corset, or underwear, or whatever) is not challenging anything -- in fact, it's setting feminism back 50 years and giving in to male-centred expectations for the exploitation of the female body.

.

(And yes, I'm well aware of Madonna's enormous appeal to a gay audience. That's fine. But it's a different matter entirely.)

Clearly you don't 'get' Madonna and never will. She's never shown her body or done anything to attract men or women, she's done it because she enjoys her own body. She's owning it. You can be sexual and still be intellegent.