I really hate to admit this right now. But a lot of classic hip-hop groups i love. Have very limited ''greats'' in their discography. Take Public Enemy for example. They have always been my favorite hip-hop group. But i honestly only give a fuck about their first 4 records. Everything after 91 is so spotty and almost cringeworthy. RUN-DMC had 3 great albums. RUN-DMC, Raising Hell, and Tougher than Leather. Even King Of Rock is patchy and full of filler. When they went gangster rap it was too cringe.

The Message album by Grandmaster Flash is amazing. I love the hell out of every track. But besides that and a greatest hits. The rest of the albums are pretty boring. LL Cool J was never a great lyricists. And besides Radio & Mama Said Knock You Out. His discography is pretty cheesy. N.W.A had one great album. The posse album is just a fun album. Nothing great or anything special. And Nuns for life is horrible.

Besides the first two Wu-Tang albums. I find the rest of their discography very empty.

I respect what all these artists did. And i still love all of them too. I just realize all their discographies are patchy. And it makes me feel meh /:

In retrospect to all of this. I think The Roots has the bets hip-hop discography. They have 8 great albums with almost no filler. And the rest are all very damn efforts.

Our problem is that we expect our artists to churn out masterpieces when in reality we're lucky if we get one great piece of work out of them.

I think with Wu-Tang a lot of people kinda count many of the solo albums as being part of their overall discography, especially since a lot of them feature RZA production and multiple other members of Wu anyway. If you look at it like that then the number of great albums by them swells a lot, I mean, pretty much all of the first round of solo albums are considered Hip-Hop classics now.

CynicKill said:

Our problem is that we expect our artists to churn out masterpieces when in reality we're lucky if we get one great piece of work out of them.

I think this is true actually. I think of artists who have 8 or 9 great albums. And maybe i'm spoiled by that. And a lot of those albums were groundbacking as well! so that's extra points.

CynicKill said:

Our problem is that we expect our artists to churn out masterpieces when in reality we're lucky if we get one great piece of work out of them.

Great artists don't really get two. Doesn't matter who it is. There's always a definitive work. There is only ever one truly outstanding piece that can potentially floor anyone. That singular greatness then just gets diluted or repeated.

.

Rap isn't really my cup of tea, so feels a bit weird posting that in here but there you go.

Chris Rock from a recent Rolling Stone Magazine interview:

RS:

Someone like Chuck D will say that there needs to be more historical awareness among hip-hop fans, that it's not right that the Stones can play arenas and stadiums and Public Enemy can't.

Chris Rock:

The Stones can play arenas because the Stones have songs that are not purely based on references that you had to be there for. I love Public Enemy. But they don't have "You Can't Always Get What You Want." Kanye will be able to play arenas maybe more than Jay Z honestly, because there's a vulnerability and an emotional thing that happens in his music that doesn't happen in most rap. I love rap, but rap is like comedy: It rots. Comedy rots. Trading Places is a perfect movie, just unbelievably good. But there are other comedies, not nearly as old as Trading Places, that just have references and things in them that aren't funny five years later. And rap's got a lot of that.

datdude said:

Outkast & DeLa have pretty good catalogs. I think if u had 3 or 4 solid albums, then u achieved success in the genre. Longevity seems harder to come by in hip-hop. But PE gets a 'pass' as their impact was undeniable & more important than indiv album greatness

Outkast, De La Soul, and The Roots. Have the best discography in hip-hop hands down.

The reason i started this thread. Was that i was thinking about the greats VS modern. Public Enemy was way more groundbreaking than Kanye. But Kanye has 6 solid albums. I would say 4 of them are great (College,, Late, 808's, MBDTF... and almost Yeezus) then very good (Yeezus, Graduation) he's had 6 non stop solid albums. While PE only had 3 great albums.

The Roots may not be seen as ''ground breaking'' like grandmaster flash, PE, Run-DMC, Rob Base, Fab Five Freddy, Gill Scott heron etc. But they've never made a bad album! they had solid albums from the early 90's till now. Outkast had 5 great albums non stop albums. The Beastie Boys have 4 or 5 great albums. De La Soul is the same.

But i still don't know if that makes them better. Or superior artists because of that.

Agree with you here. Most rappers and rap groups back then only had one or two, maximum two or three good albums in them. Once they released those, they had nothing left to say, musically speaking.

I think Jay-Z, Kanye and Nas are an exception to that rule. But then again, Jay-Z has been telling the same old shit for two decades now.

Masta Ace is one old school rapper who released many interesting albums and still does. Great live performer ,too.

Gunsnhalen said:

I really hate to admit this right now. But a lot of classic hip-hop groups i love. Have very limited ''greats'' in their discography. Take Public Enemy for example. They have always been my favorite hip-hop group. But i honestly only give a fuck about their first 4 records. Everything after 91 is so spotty and almost cringeworthy. RUN-DMC had 3 great albums. RUN-DMC, Raising Hell, and Tougher than Leather. Even King Of Rock is patchy and full of filler. When they went gangster rap it was too cringe.

The Message album by Grandmaster Flash is amazing. I love the hell out of every track. But besides that and a greatest hits. The rest of the albums are pretty boring. LL Cool J was never a great lyricists. And besides Radio & Mama Said Knock You Out. His discography is pretty cheesy. N.W.A had one great album. The posse album is just a fun album. Nothing great or anything special. And Nuns for life is horrible.

Besides the first two Wu-Tang albums. I find the rest of their discography very empty.

I respect what all these artists did. And i still love all of them too. I just realize all their discographies are patchy. And it makes me feel meh /:

In retrospect to all of this. I think The Roots has the bets hip-hop discography. They have 8 great albums with almost no filler. And the rest are all very damn efforts.

guns: I respect your opinion and agree with a lot of it, and there several realities that affect this:

1. Father Time. The artists age, have different perspectives, and often, different responsibilities and interests. Sometimes they grow apart. It's hard to keep artistic momentum going. Advancing age leads to . . .

2. Distance From Lucrative Audiences. (IMO) the 18-30 demographic is where the music industry lives and dies. Most of those audiences don't want to hear middle-aged men and women, they want to hear from their own voices. Which in terms leads to . . .

3. Label priorities, instability, movement. It seems that a lot of these of these old-school groups from the late 80's on have either been lost in the shuffle of newer artists, or fallen out with the labels that put out their best work. This leads to inconsistency in putting out records, period.

All that being said, I think many of the groups still record interesting work. De La Soul and PE's recent effort, "The People," was a solid track.


As you said . . . De La has a discography that takes a back seat to no one, with no less than 3 clear classics -- 3 Feet (1989), De La Soul Is Dead (1991) and Stakes Is High (1996) . Two others, Buhloone Mindstate (1993) and The Grind Date (2004) are at or near classic status.

Arguably the most creative and barrier-breaking MC in the entire game, MF Doom, formerly Zev Love X of KMD, is from the old school era. Madvillainy (2004) is, for my the greatest hip-hop album of the era.

[Edited 12/29/14 9:36am]

[Edited 12/29/14 9:39am]

CynicKill said:

Our problem is that we expect our artists to churn out masterpieces when in reality we're lucky if we get one great piece of work out of them.

And there it is.

RaspBerryGirlFriend said:

I think with Wu-Tang a lot of people kinda count many of the solo albums as being part of their overall discography, especially since a lot of them feature RZA production and multiple other members of Wu anyway. If you look at it like that then the number of great albums by them swells a lot, I mean, pretty much all of the first round of solo albums are considered Hip-Hop classics now.

Ghostface is still one of the best in the game.

KoolEaze said:

Agree with you here. Most rappers and rap groups back then only had one or two, maximum two or three good albums in them. Once they released those, they had nothing left to say, musically speaking.

I think Jay-Z, Kanye and Nas are an exception to that rule. But then again, Jay-Z has been telling the same old shit for two decades now.

Masta Ace is one old school rapper who released many interesting albums and still does. Great live performer ,too.

"Jay-Z" has become a brand. He's America's Rapper.


Kanye and Nas continue to try new things. That's all we can ask of any artist.

namepeace said:

KoolEaze said:

Agree with you here. Most rappers and rap groups back then only had one or two, maximum two or three good albums in them. Once they released those, they had nothing left to say, musically speaking.

I think Jay-Z, Kanye and Nas are an exception to that rule. But then again, Jay-Z has been telling the same old shit for two decades now.

Masta Ace is one old school rapper who released many interesting albums and still does. Great live performer ,too.

"Jay-Z" has become a brand. He's America's Rapper.


Kanye and Nas continue to try new things. That's all we can ask of any artist.

This is actually very true. Hell he hasn't had a solo hit with just him in years. He's all about lots of features and being flashy.

[Edited 12/29/14 23:30pm]

I will take Kool Moe Dee and Ice-T. Their albums were all dope. Ice-T suffered after his label dropped him but his first 5 albums were all strong from start to finish. Moe Dee was the same as his first 4 albums were strong. He messed up by trying to do the Treacherous Three thing again. I will take their catalogue albums over any other though.

Ice-T

Rhyme Pays

Power

The Iceberg

OG Original Gangster

Home Invasion

Kool moe Dee

self titled

How ya like me now

Knowledge is king

Funke Funke Wisdom

All Classics!!

I think part of the issue is that rap music back in the day changed rapidly compared to how slowly rap music of today changes. It was unheard back in the day to have an artist in their late 20s making waves in the rap game. Nowadays, there are a handful of aging rappers who are still "in the game" but who are putting out the same type of sound over and over again. There's very little variety in rap music these days because some higher ups in the industry seem to think the whole "guns, drugs and whores" themes should be the main aspect of most songs in general. There's just simply no variety in rap music now but if you compare rap music from 1988 to rap music to 1992 there is a huge difference. Run DMC and a Tribe Called Quest are like night and day, for example.