MickyDolenz said:

alphastreet said:

Hence, why I said too much appropriation over time in the industry has not earned them the dues they deserve.

Was Shalamar even that popular? I've read they were popular in the UK, but in the US they were mostly successful on the R&B charts, they didn't really crossover except for Dead Giveaway. The mainstream awards like the Grammys mostly just recognizes acts that were popular on the Top 40 pop charts, not the R&B, dance, or country charts. Jody as a solo crossed over, but she's just considered a dance pop singer who had some brief success. Not really any different than Taylor Dayne, Expose, Sheena Easton, Paula Abdul, Lisa Lisa, Debbie Gibson, or Samantha Fox who were also popular around that time.

They were before my time but I would guess they were bigger on urban radio in the US, and Jody Watley had some crossover success briefly with her solo work. Same as you're saying. I have heard Shalamar music played at jams till this day so I would imagine there is an audience that would support a tour if they got on the road or joined a few others from that time.

[Edited 7/6/14 22:19pm]

I'm just gonna say this, Jody Watley has a grammy award as a solo act, but she didn't deserve to win it. She won for best new artist she was far from new.This was during a time that Grammy awards had no clue or rules TTD doesn't win, but wins the following year, to make up for not giving him the award he should have gotten the year before. WTF... and don't get me started about how they fucked over Prince, Bruce, Marvin, Diana, Stephanie and others that have done far more than Jody has ever done.

I own Watley's first 4 solo albums, so I know what she can do, but you expecting a solo showcase on THAT show. No. You were not and are not that great. Did Jody forget about a girl named Ms. Jackson during her time.

Jody broke down the history and why she refused previous requests in her youtube series

Frederick96 said:

Dancing in the Sheets from Footloose soundtrack was their biggest hit. Since Howard Hewett sang lead most of the time as long as he tours u get the same vibe. And they didn't do a lot of fancy choreography that I remember.

That was after Jody & Jeffrey left. It's a different lineup. Technically you could say that this period was really Howard solo. I think Delisa Davis & Micki Free played instruments, but didn't sing much, because on songs like My Girl Loves Me and Don't Get Stopped In Beverly Hills, all the vocals are Howard's.

alphastreet said:

They were before my time but I would guess they were bigger on urban radio in the US, and Jody Watley had some crossover success briefly with her solo work. Same as you're saying. I have heard Shalamar music played at jams till this day so I would imagine there is an audience that would support a tour if they got on the road or joined a few others from that time.

Howard & Jeffrey has been performing the past few years as Shalamar, with Carolyn Griffey doing Jody's parts. Here's a show from December 2013. On the 2nd, Carolyn is doing some Midnight Star & Whispers songs.

Hell....They coulda had a Shalamar reunion w/Micki Free!!!! "Circumstancial Evidence" was CRACKIN'!!! oh yeah.......F**K Lionel Richie 4 not having a PROPER Commodores reunion b4 "Captain Quick Draw" Milan Williams passed!!!!!!

Learn something new... didn't know Jodi Watley was part of Shalamar. Liked both the group's songs and her as an artist.

Thanks, now I got Dead Giveaway in my head now ... Take That To The Bank...well it sounds like today will be my Shalamar Monday.

woogiebear said:

Hell....They coulda had a Shalamar reunion w/Micki Free!!!! "Circumstancial Evidence" was CRACKIN'!!! oh yeah.......

To me,Shalamar was "over" when Jody and Jeffrey departed.It just wasn't the same after that.I think even Howard agreed because he only did one album with the new line-up.

Here's some recent pics of Jody with Gerald Brown and a duet

Jody is cool but

Howard is the Voice!

I love Shalamar

"The Lover in You"

kitbradley said:

Jody really has an over-inflated ego. Don't nobody care (or remember) that she won a Grammy in 1987! Go do the performance, make your bread and go home! A Shalamar reunion does not call for a Jody Watley or Howard Hewitt solo spotlight. Why is she making such a big deal? Yeah, Howard was the star of the group so he would get most of the leads so maybe that's why she has her bloomers in a bunch. Unless it's Beyonce or Miley Cirus acting like prostitutes, people generally forget about those Award Show performances a couple of days after they occur so why is she even making it an issue? And, I'm sorry, but the majority of people who watch the BET Awards aren't even going to have the slightest idea who Shalamar is so what the hell difference does it make?

[Edited 7/6/14 17:56pm]

You got that right! Good grief, just do the bloody reunion and stop acting like a drama queen. I love Shalamar and Jody too but this seems unneccesarily dramatic. What is her problem?

The thing is you will say she has an over-inflated ego, but her impact after Shalamar seemed to be bigger than the group's. I love Shalamar, but I can't really remember how big they were compared to "Looking For A New Love" or "Friends" featuring Rakim.


On the other hand, she is STILL the one holding out on a Shalamar reunion if she wants to shoehorn a Jody Watley tribute into it. It is easier to argue because she went solo, but if she went from Shalamar to another GROUP, there is no way the other GROUP would get a "spotlight".


Anyway... another opportunity lost, especially on the heels of Mary J Blige's current cover of "A Night To Remember".

MickyDolenz said:

alphastreet said:

Hence, why I said too much appropriation over time in the industry has not earned them the dues they deserve.

Was Shalamar even that popular? I've read they were popular in the UK, but in the US they were mostly successful on the R&B charts, they didn't really crossover except for Dead Giveaway. The mainstream awards like the Grammys mostly just recognizes acts that were popular on the Top 40 pop charts, not the R&B, dance, or country charts. Jody as a solo crossed over, but she's just considered a dance pop singer who had some brief success. Not really any different than Taylor Dayne, Expose, Sheena Easton, Paula Abdul, Lisa Lisa, Debbie Gibson, or Samantha Fox who were also popular around that time.

shalamar was much bigger then what you read trust me. jody watley knows exactly what she doing.

617automatic said:

I'm just gonna say this, Jody Watley has a grammy award as a solo act, but she didn't deserve to win it. She won for best new artist she was far from new.This was during a time that Grammy awards had no clue or rules TTD doesn't win, but wins the following year, to make up for not giving him the award he should have gotten the year before. WTF... and don't get me started about how they fucked over Prince, Bruce, Marvin, Diana, Stephanie and others that have done far more than Jody has ever done.

I own Watley's first 4 solo albums, so I know what she can do, but you expecting a solo showcase on THAT show. No. You were not and are not that great. Did Jody forget about a girl named Ms. Jackson during her time.

100% right she didnt deserve the nomination at all under the rules of the award which for some reason every other year back then got enforced.

CASES

Cyndi Lauper was lead singer of Blue ANgel who had a label release she should not been allowed to be nominated.

Whitney Houston: was disqualified from the nomination because of the duet with Teddy Pendergrass a year prior on his record. she obviously would have won.

Richard Marx: was disqualified for having a song on the Tom Hanks 1986 film "Nothing In Common" soundtrack, a song no one heard, no one really bought the soundtrack but he was disqualified and he with 4 Top 10 hits and a 4 million selling debut was a shoe in.

Expose: ironically the same year was also disqualified, the issue was that on the first press of their "Exposure" album which spawned 4 top 10's, the 3 members were not in the group, about 1,000 copies got out before the other 3 were replaced with the members that HAD the HITS. None of songs in the other version ever made the airwaves but they were disqualified. Its funny how the grammy's pai attention on them and not a few years later with Milli Vanilli.

Jody obviously was a member of Shalamar and being a member of a group disqualifies technically though it seems the grammys pick and choose, Gwen Stefani i believe was nominated solo right? or Lauryn Hill too

Jody I'm sorry to say but this isnt how you do things. Whether she was taken out of context or whatever she comes of as being full of herself. If she is using Nsync or Destinys Child as a reference, well first of all, Justin Timberlake and Beyonce are light years bigger than Jody was, it was one album that blew up. Also the show wanted a shalamar reunion not a Jody Watley tribute show. If i was in shalamar there is no way im going to be playing "Looking for a new Love" so you can shine.

^^^^ she tried to get on the same boat, but they wanted to just stand there and hold microphones and that is NOT the history of the Shalamar brand. Ill refer to a certain performance on tv that had another act doing a medley then the lead did their own solo hit, which i am sure was the only way they would have performed with the rest of the group.

^^So you're saying Jody is the Michael Jackson of the group? She has no such clout, even when she was popular. Mike was in his heyday for Motown 25, and Berry Gordy knew that Mike/Jackson 5 would draw attention to his show. That's why Mike was allowed to perform a non-Motown song, when the other acts that were no longer on the label (Marvin Gaye, Four Tops, Diana Ross) only performed songs they released on Motown. Jody is not going to draw an audience to watch the show. It's like Otis Williams said about the Temptations, no one man is bigger than the group. Phil Collins became bigger than Genesis, but he remained in the band and did not do his solo material on Genesis tours.

I have to call bullshit on Jody. It wasn't until she fell off and the Unsung episode

that she started taking shots and goint on this long tangent about why she doesn't

want to reunite with Shalamar. I'm not doubting for one minute some of the stuff

that went on behind the scenes with the group particularly with Dick Griffey.

When her career was hot in the mid eighties she had nothing but praise for her

ex bandmates especially during an interview on Video Soul. I remember her talking about

the guy who sung lead before Howard and how she laughed at the guy when he left the

group to get a reaction(more money) and the reaction he got was Howard Hewitt. Now she

does a 180 after her time's up and wants to give the other lead singer before Howard props

and treat Howard and Jeffrey like criminals is absolutely absurd. Chill Jody. You either in

or not but quit talking like you are an icon. You had a brief run of hits from 1986-1989.

SoulAlive said:

It would have been cool just to see them do a 3-song medley of "The Second Time Around",then "This Is For The Lover In You",then a kickass version of "A Night To Remember".Old school R&B fans would have loved that.

There you go. And that's good enough for R&B fans. Those hits will always resonate

with this audience. It would be a Shalamar performance. Not a Howard Hewitt performance

or Jody Watley. They can tour and do their own solo shows elsewhere.

woogiebear said:

Hell....They coulda had a Shalamar reunion w/Micki Free!!!! "Circumstancial Evidence" was CRACKIN'!!! oh yeah.......F**K Lionel Richie 4 not having a PROPER Commodores reunion b4 "Captain Quick Draw" Milan Williams passed!!!!!!

Yeah Micki kicked ass on that album but I don't think that would have went over well with Shalamar fans that know Jody, Jeffrey, and Howard. Micki even stated so on Unsung that his lineup of Shalamar was never accepted like the Jody, Jeff, and Howard lineup. Games and Plaything was the shit too on that album. Don't get me started on Lionel.

Love Jody...I like that she stands in her own truth..Once again "Let the chips fall where they may"...It wouldve been nice to see them perform but sometimes reunions are not meant to be..All 3 members are much older and settled into their ways...They just need to continue doing what makes them Happy...

phunkdaddy said:

SoulAlive said:

It would have been cool just to see them do a 3-song medley of "The Second Time Around",then "This Is For The Lover In You",then a kickass version of "A Night To Remember".Old school R&B fans would have loved that.

There you go. And that's good enough for R&B fans. Those hits will always resonate

with this audience. It would be a Shalamar performance. Not a Howard Hewitt performance

or Jody Watley. They can tour and do their own solo shows elsewhere.

That would have been a perfect line-up of songs for the show. Howard would get to do the group's signature ballad, while Jody and Jeffery could do their dancing for "The Second Time Around" and "A Night to Remember".

MickyDolenz said:

^^So you're saying Jody is the Michael Jackson of the group? She has no such clout, even when she was popular. Mike was in his heyday for Motown 25, and Berry Gordy knew that Mike/Jackson 5 would draw attention to his show. That's why Mike was allowed to perform a non-Motown song, when the other acts that were no longer on the label (Marvin Gaye, Four Tops, Diana Ross) only performed songs they released on Motown. Jody is not going to draw an audience to watch the show. It's like Otis Williams said about the Temptations, no one man is bigger than the group. Phil Collins became bigger than Genesis, but he remained in the band and did not do his solo material on Genesis tours.

JODY WATLEY DOES NOT HAVE TO BE MIKE JACKSON TO BE CONSIDERED SUCCESSFUL. WHEN SHALAMAR WAS DROPPING HITS, THEY WERE PLAYED ON THE RADIO CONSTANTLY, WHEN JODY WATLEY WENT SOLO, HER SONGS WERE PLAYED CONSTANTLEY ON POP AND BLACK RADIO. PLUS LETS NOT FORGET HER FACE DOMINATED EVERY MAGAZINE FROM HER FIRST HIT FROM SHALAMAR TO HER LAST SOLO ALBUM. LETS FACE IT, JODY WAS HUGE. WHEN SHALAMAR CAME UP, IT WAS AT A TIME WHEN WOMEN WERE STARTING TO DOMINATE THE CHARTS AND SHE WAS PICKED OUT OF THE GROUP FOR HER LOOK, AND STYLE.

jackson35 said

JODY WATLEY DOES NOT HAVE TO BE MIKE JACKSON TO BE CONSIDERED SUCCESSFUL. WHEN SHALAMAR WAS DROPPING HITS, THEY WERE PLAYED ON THE RADIO CONSTANTLY, WHEN JODY WATLEY WENT SOLO, HER SONGS WERE PLAYED CONSTANTLEY ON POP AND BLACK RADIO. PLUS LETS NOT FORGET HER FACE DOMINATED EVERY MAGAZINE FROM HER FIRST HIT FROM SHALAMAR TO HER LAST SOLO ALBUM. LETS FACE IT, JODY WAS HUGE. WHEN SHALAMAR CAME UP, IT WAS AT A TIME WHEN WOMEN WERE STARTING TO DOMINATE THE CHARTS AND SHE WAS PICKED OUT OF THE GROUP FOR HER LOOK, AND STYLE.

Her face dominated every magazine? I didn't see her on Field & Stream.

jackson35 said:

MickyDolenz said:

^^So you're saying Jody is the Michael Jackson of the group? She has no such clout, even when she was popular. Mike was in his heyday for Motown 25, and Berry Gordy knew that Mike/Jackson 5 would draw attention to his show. That's why Mike was allowed to perform a non-Motown song, when the other acts that were no longer on the label (Marvin Gaye, Four Tops, Diana Ross) only performed songs they released on Motown. Jody is not going to draw an audience to watch the show. It's like Otis Williams said about the Temptations, no one man is bigger than the group. Phil Collins became bigger than Genesis, but he remained in the band and did not do his solo material on Genesis tours.

JODY WATLEY DOES NOT HAVE TO BE MIKE JACKSON TO BE CONSIDERED SUCCESSFUL. WHEN SHALAMAR WAS DROPPING HITS, THEY WERE PLAYED ON THE RADIO CONSTANTLY, WHEN JODY WATLEY WENT SOLO, HER SONGS WERE PLAYED CONSTANTLEY ON POP AND BLACK RADIO. PLUS LETS NOT FORGET HER FACE DOMINATED EVERY MAGAZINE FROM HER FIRST HIT FROM SHALAMAR TO HER LAST SOLO ALBUM. LETS FACE IT, JODY WAS HUGE. WHEN SHALAMAR CAME UP, IT WAS AT A TIME WHEN WOMEN WERE STARTING TO DOMINATE THE CHARTS AND SHE WAS PICKED OUT OF THE GROUP FOR HER LOOK, AND STYLE.

I may be a janet fan, but she put janet to shame so many times, and it saddens me that the younger generation that does know janet overlooks jody, karyn white and the like. Rhythm Nation and Janet era have traces of Jody, Karyn and Paula stuff too from that time if you ask me, even if Janet did it well. I remember Jody on the radio in the late 80's too often, being an elementary school kid listening to Real Love on heavy rotation.

[Edited 7/8/14 15:07pm]

Initially,I was on Jody's side but after reading all these comments and thinking it through,I feel like she should have dropped her request for a solo spotlight and just went ahead with the reunion.It would have been a win-win situation for all involved.A well-received Shalamar performance could have been the basis for a reunion tour (which Jody has expressed interest in doing).The tour is where the 'solo spotlights' could have happened.Howard does one of his solo hits,and Jody does the same.The fans get a thrilling show.I think Jody has failed to look at the big picture.

phunkdaddy said:

SoulAlive said:

It would have been cool just to see them do a 3-song medley of "The Second Time Around",then "This Is For The Lover In You",then a kickass version of "A Night To Remember".Old school R&B fans would have loved that.

There you go. And that's good enough for R&B fans. Those hits will always resonate

with this audience. It would be a Shalamar performance. Not a Howard Hewitt performance

or Jody Watley. They can tour and do their own solo shows elsewhere.

SoulAlive said:

Initially,I was on Jody's side but after reading all these comments and thinking it through,I feel like she should have dropped her request for a solo spotlight and just went ahead with the reunion.It would have been a win-win situation for all involved.A well-received Shalamar performance could have been the basis for a reunion tour (which Jody has expressed interest in doing).The tour is where the 'solo spotlights' could have happened.Howard does one of his solo hits,and Jody does the same.The fans get a thrilling show.I think Jody has failed to look at the big picture.

Agreed!

SoulAlive said:

Initially,I was on Jody's side but after reading all these comments and thinking it through,I feel like she should have dropped her request for a solo spotlight and just went ahead with the reunion.It would have been a win-win situation for all involved.A well-received Shalamar performance could have been the basis for a reunion tour (which Jody has expressed interest in doing).The tour is where the 'solo spotlights' could have happened.Howard does one of his solo hits,and Jody does the same.The fans get a thrilling show.I think Jody has failed to look at the big picture.

Unfortunately, I don't think egos and years of hard feelings would have allowed for a reunion tour.

kitbradley said:

SoulAlive said:

Initially,I was on Jody's side but after reading all these comments and thinking it through,I feel like she should have dropped her request for a solo spotlight and just went ahead with the reunion.It would have been a win-win situation for all involved.A well-received Shalamar performance could have been the basis for a reunion tour (which Jody has expressed interest in doing).The tour is where the 'solo spotlights' could have happened.Howard does one of his solo hits,and Jody does the same.The fans get a thrilling show.I think Jody has failed to look at the big picture.

Unfortunately, I don't think egos and years of hard feelings would have allowed for a reunion tour.

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