The Beatles for sure (I can't even bring myself to read the stuff on this thread as to why they are NOT)

Neil Young/Bob Dylan - It's their voices. Sell them lyrics, cause yall ain't doing them justice. Best Dylan stuff I heard, I heard from other people singing it

Radiohead - I KNOW better because I tend to like deep album tracks more than "singles" but our "greatest hits" should pique my interest!

JT - Derivative Biter

Beyonce - Not even the most interesting artist amongst her siblings

Gaga - Recent sales tank are revelatory - but even if she was still selling zillions.....

MotownSubdivision said:

EddieC said:

I would be serious if I said it--well, I wouldn't include the Stones in the conversation. I have never been able to get into the Motown sound as a whole. Motown just doesn't work for me. I don't hate everything, but the vast majority of tracks coming out from Hitsville leave me lukewarm. Competent, but not compelling.

I understand that others feel that way about my obsessions.

However, since the Beatles' "core discography" (by a count on Wikipedia) amounts to "217 songs and approximately 10 hours of music" it would be pretty easy to listen to all of it (and it's ridiculously easy to find without having to buy it). It's not like trying to catch up with Johnny Cash (I've got over a hundred hours of him on my laptop, and it's nearly all official). Or, for that matter, Motown.

Personal preference aside, Motown was a major player of the 1960s music scene and to disregard it as such is flat out wrong on countless levels.

I sometimes wonder if Motown artists (in the early 60s) had in some ways opened the door for desegeration, etc. Most certainly by the late 60s that revoluntionary radio sound was popular and profitable for record companies. I think Motown acts but a face on black folks who were dapper and talented and actually on TV and radio back then. Of course, they can thank Nat King Cole as well. Music has a strange way of getting people in motion.

[Edited 6/24/14 14:36pm]

Adorecream said:

I get the points about Motown, they were outstanding songs and artists that defined a generation. But Motown was at least 10 major acts and 50 or so more minor ones. The greater names like Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, The Temptations, Diana Ross and the Supremes, 4 tops, Jackson 5 etc all only have 10 or 30 (In the case of Wonder who went on to bigger and better things) hits each and Motown had a lot of artists that only had 1 or 2 smashes, then either languished (Mary Wells, David Ruffin) or went to another label and had greater success there (Gladys Knight and Isleys). Also Motown served up a lot of rubbish songs too like Darling Baby by the Elegants and Greetings from Uncle sam, along with some lacklustre filler albums by their artists. I also felt that the Gordy may have nutured their artists, but also exploited and controlled them with bad results. Many died due to problems associated with stress of being a Motown act alongside violence and substance abuse issues.

.

I mean the Beatles became rich of their success, McCartney is very wealthy, so is Ringo, most Motown has beens died in Poverty or in straightened circumstances as they got paid little and blew what they had on crap like cars, drugs and unpaid taxbills. The Beatles were at least bright enough to have a few less financial hassles (It wasn't all true, didn't Apple go bankrupt, and why did Paul sell Northern Songs to MJ?" But still the 2 Beatles who died, one was shot by a deranged lunatic, the other died at his mansion and Macca is thriving even after superbitch Mills cleaned him out.

.
But with the Beatles, its the same group of 4 guys who were around for 8 golden years, making a stream of melodic and very inventive pop and rock music.

.

Maybe I am wearing Pink glasses and the fact I have a bias towards white rock and roll over Black rap and soul music I rate them highly, but nearly everyone I know and every kid I went to school with was in tune to their genius.

.

I also think its very harsh to say the Beatles are overrated when you have them compared to fluff acts like Justin Bieber, Britney, Black eyed peas, Rhianna, who to me are not even approaching the astral plane of the Beatles.

[Edited 6/23/14 20:14pm]

The irony of this comment is that you make some serious claims about Motown stars who weren't "smart" enough to invest, etc. but don't you find it odd that a former Motown artist (Michael Jackson) BOUGHT THE ENTIRE Beatles catalog before he was even in his late 20s?

datdude said:

The Beatles for sure (I can't even bring myself to read the stuff on this thread as to why they are NOT)

Neil Young/Bob Dylan - It's their voices. Sell them lyrics, cause yall ain't doing them justice. Best Dylan stuff I heard, I heard from other people singing it

Radiohead - I KNOW better because I tend to like deep album tracks more than "singles" but our "greatest hits" should pique my interest!

JT - Derivative Biter

Beyonce - Not even the most interesting artist amongst her siblings

Gaga - Recent sales tank are revelatory - but even if she was still selling zillions.....

Beyonce and her fans are the worst. They act as though she's Jesus and if you don't like her music that you must be jealous or a hater. It's the most ridiculous thing ever. I think she's probably the most overrated artist out there at the moment. Her fame puzzles me but it seems that she just pays off the media outlets to keep her name out there, ad nausem, because she's probably afraid that if she takes three days off that someone else will rise up the ranks. Someone should really tell her now that it's inevitable anyway.

[Edited 6/24/14 14:38pm]

SeventeenDayze said:

Adorecream said:

I get the points about Motown, they were outstanding songs and artists that defined a generation. But Motown was at least 10 major acts and 50 or so more minor ones. The greater names like Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, The Temptations, Diana Ross and the Supremes, 4 tops, Jackson 5 etc all only have 10 or 30 (In the case of Wonder who went on to bigger and better things) hits each and Motown had a lot of artists that only had 1 or 2 smashes, then either languished (Mary Wells, David Ruffin) or went to another label and had greater success there (Gladys Knight and Isleys). Also Motown served up a lot of rubbish songs too like Darling Baby by the Elegants and Greetings from Uncle sam, along with some lacklustre filler albums by their artists. I also felt that the Gordy may have nutured their artists, but also exploited and controlled them with bad results. Many died due to problems associated with stress of being a Motown act alongside violence and substance abuse issues.

.

I mean the Beatles became rich of their success, McCartney is very wealthy, so is Ringo, most Motown has beens died in Poverty or in straightened circumstances as they got paid little and blew what they had on crap like cars, drugs and unpaid taxbills. The Beatles were at least bright enough to have a few less financial hassles (It wasn't all true, didn't Apple go bankrupt, and why did Paul sell Northern Songs to MJ?" But still the 2 Beatles who died, one was shot by a deranged lunatic, the other died at his mansion and Macca is thriving even after superbitch Mills cleaned him out.

.
But with the Beatles, its the same group of 4 guys who were around for 8 golden years, making a stream of melodic and very inventive pop and rock music.

.

Maybe I am wearing Pink glasses and the fact I have a bias towards white rock and roll over Black rap and soul music I rate them highly, but nearly everyone I know and every kid I went to school with was in tune to their genius.

.

I also think its very harsh to say the Beatles are overrated when you have them compared to fluff acts like Justin Bieber, Britney, Black eyed peas, Rhianna, who to me are not even approaching the astral plane of the Beatles.

[Edited 6/23/14 20:14pm]

The irony of this comment is that you make some serious claims about Motown stars who weren't "smart" enough to invest, etc. but don't you find it odd that a former Motown artist (Michael Jackson) BOUGHT THE ENTIRE Beatles catalog before he was even in his late 20s?

OUCH!!!!

and the other 4 didn't

can't blame airthang on Yoko

HuMpThAnG said:

SeventeenDayze said:

The irony of this comment is that you make some serious claims about Motown stars who weren't "smart" enough to invest, etc. but don't you find it odd that a former Motown artist (Michael Jackson) BOUGHT THE ENTIRE Beatles catalog before he was even in his late 20s?

OUCH!!!!

and the other 4 didn't

can't blame airthang on Yoko

Nope, can't blame her for all the problems of humanity on her

I've heard it said more than once that the reason MJ eventually became so hated was that he owned the Beatles catalog. Perhaps if MJ was just ghetto rich he wouldn't have had so many enemies.

SeventeenDayze said:

Beyonce and her fans are the worst. They act as though she's Jesus and if you don't like her music that you must be jealous or a hater. It's the most ridiculous thing ever. I think she's probably the most overrated artist out there at the moment. Her fame puzzles me but it seems that she just pays off the media outlets to keep her name out there, ad nausem, because she's probably afraid that if she takes three days off that someone else will rise up the ranks. Someone should really tell her now that it's inevitable anyway.

[Edited 6/24/14 14:38pm]

Call me a "hater" (Sorry, Guns! )...
I HATE that she is making all that money and has saturated the market in multiple media, yet she has very little to bring in the way of musicality. Her lyrics are embarrassingly vapid, and she just screams now.

Her fans- young and old- all act like she's their "double-secret best friend", but I doubt that she'd even bother to scrape them off the bottom of her shoe if they were gum.

SeventeenDayze said:

HuMpThAnG said:

OUCH!!!!

and the other 4 didn't

can't blame airthang on Yoko

Nope, can't blame her for all the problems of humanity on her

I've heard it said more than once that the reason MJ eventually became so hated was that he owned the Beatles catalog. Perhaps if MJ was just ghetto rich he wouldn't have had so many enemies.

ahhhhhhh...

Gunsnhalen said:

SeventeenDayze said:

I love MJ to death, so tell me what's overrated about him

His songs are cheesy, his songwriting was about as good as AC/DC. His albums are full of filler, he owes a lot to his production team. I don't give a damn if he was a good dancer or not. Thriller is full of filler and cheesy ass songs. Off The Wall is the only album i really enjoy from him.

Plus, his hardcore fanbase is the absolute worse. I mean worse than Mariah Carey, Janet, Madonna, Whitney, Lady GaGa, Beyonce stans. And that's just disturbing

Most of his stuff is just cheesy, campy, and silly too me. But... that's just my opinion

[Edited 6/22/14 11:15am]

Michael Jackson is SOOOOO overrated! I can't stand MOST of his output. Fillerish, inDEED. His voice just grates on my nerves and I cannot STAND all those syncopated vocals he does with the "Bah! Cha!" Ugh!!! I bought "History: Past, Present & Future Book 1" recently and have no idea even WHY! LOL! Prob'ly sell it back 2 the used CD store 4 credit toward somethin' else. NOT a fan by ANY means. Janet's WAY better in my opinion. PLUS, his dancing didn't evolve really. He always did the same moves since Motown 25 and the corny videos of him playin' a brotha from the hood always made me wanna PUKE! If he ever went into the hood pullin' that shit, boy'd be BEATEN down! He didn't even know what homeless people were! Okay...don't get me started. 'Nuff said. These are merely my opinions and I am NOT hatin'. I just don't like his voice or much of his vids and/or material.

[Edited 6/24/14 15:15pm]

[Edited 6/24/14 15:25pm]

whitechocolatebrotha said:

Gunsnhalen said:

His songs are cheesy, his songwriting was about as good as AC/DC. His albums are full of filler, he owes a lot to his production team. I don't give a damn if he was a good dancer or not. Thriller is full of filler and cheesy ass songs. Off The Wall is the only album i really enjoy from him.

Plus, his hardcore fanbase is the absolute worse. I mean worse than Mariah Carey, Janet, Madonna, Whitney, Lady GaGa, Beyonce stans. And that's just disturbing

Most of his stuff is just cheesy, campy, and silly too me. But... that's just my opinion

[Edited 6/22/14 11:15am]

Michael Jackson is SOOOOO overrated! I can't stand MOST of his output. Fillerish, inDEED. His voice just grates on my nerves and I cannot STAND all that syncopated vocals he does with the "Bah! Cha!" Ugh. I bought "History: Past, Present & Future Book 1" recently and have no idea even WHY! LOL! Prob'ly sell it back 2 the used CD store 4 credit toward somethin' else. NOT a fan by ANY means. Janet's WAY better in my opinion. PLUS, his dancing didn't evolve really. He always did the same moves since Motown 25 and the corny videos of him playin' a brotha from the hood always made me wanna PUKE! If he ever went into the hood pullin' that shit, boy'd be BEATEN down! He didn't even know what homeless people were! Okay...don't get me started. 'Nuff said.

[Edited 6/24/14 15:15pm]

I'm trying to think of the tracks on the History album that maybe you tolerated at some point Maybe it was Stranger in Moscow (not including how the song begins with the hiccuping noise you hate, LOL) Or perhaps They don't care about us?

HuMpThAnG said:

SeventeenDayze said:

Nope, can't blame her for all the problems of humanity on her

I've heard it said more than once that the reason MJ eventually became so hated was that he owned the Beatles catalog. Perhaps if MJ was just ghetto rich he wouldn't have had so many enemies.

ahhhhhhh...

Yep, Michael (at that time) wasn't known to be involved in drugs, gangs, etc. and came from a family with both parents. He was already a target. He had his own issues about his appearance but he certainly wasn't the first celeb to change their appearance. These days, MOST celebs go under the knife and it's more widely accepted compared to that time.

The only thing he did wrong, in the minds of some, is that he owned the most valuable catalog (including his own!) of all time. Oh, and a country in Africa crowned him as a King to their nation. MJ was power in the music world and out of it. That's a rare combination and it made him a target.

phunkdaddy said:

chocolate1 said:

And Mary J. Blige.


** It has been no secret on the Org over the years that her voice is a sort of great distress for me.

She sounds like that old lady in church whom everyone is afraid to tell that she can't sing...
She sweats, waves her arms, jumps up and down, and people swore she SANG.
Nope. She sweated, jumped and down, and waved her arms. The tone was off, but the performance was good.
She was very lucky to find that market who could identify with her "life sucks because of every man" lyrics... But she CANNOT. SING.


My

[Edited 6/22/14 14:55pm]

I'm with you here. With the exception of a few songs the thought of me even listening to

a full cd from her is terrifying. I would need to overdose on a bottle of Excedrin to absorb

the hollering and screaming or what most of her fans call singing with emotion.

As for Lauryn Hill, I wouldn't call her overrated but whatever magic she had on

Miseducation she lost. I definitely wasn't crazy about the Fugees.

Yup YUP! Mary J. is anOTHER 1 who's overrated and I agree with u wholeheartedly. A couple of songs I like by her, but on the whole, she can't SANG. "Disrespectful" with Chaka was a total SCREAMfest and Chaka wasn't the one who was doin' the screamin' EITHER. I don't own a single one of her CD's. She doesn't excite me in the least. Melba MOORE, on the other hand...now THAT'S sangin'!

I forgot to add DRAKE to my list. His music and looks are overrated!

It's funny u say that. I'm got a "thing" with Christina Aguilera's voice. It just rubs me the wrong way. It's all that melisma she does that makes me wanna throw sumpthin' at the speakers. BAM! Great talent, but less is much more.

Chancellor said:

Definitely Sheryl Crow...I am so mean to her...LOL...But I just don't feel she deserves all those Grammys and I think her voice is mediocre...I don't know why she rubs me the wrong way....

The most overrated act of all time is Rick Rubin.

SeventeenDayze said:

Adorecream said:

I get the points about Motown, they were outstanding songs and artists that defined a generation. But Motown was at least 10 major acts and 50 or so more minor ones. The greater names like Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, The Temptations, Diana Ross and the Supremes, 4 tops, Jackson 5 etc all only have 10 or 30 (In the case of Wonder who went on to bigger and better things) hits each and Motown had a lot of artists that only had 1 or 2 smashes, then either languished (Mary Wells, David Ruffin) or went to another label and had greater success there (Gladys Knight and Isleys). Also Motown served up a lot of rubbish songs too like Darling Baby by the Elegants and Greetings from Uncle sam, along with some lacklustre filler albums by their artists. I also felt that the Gordy may have nutured their artists, but also exploited and controlled them with bad results. Many died due to problems associated with stress of being a Motown act alongside violence and substance abuse issues.

.

I mean the Beatles became rich of their success, McCartney is very wealthy, so is Ringo, most Motown has beens died in Poverty or in straightened circumstances as they got paid little and blew what they had on crap like cars, drugs and unpaid taxbills. The Beatles were at least bright enough to have a few less financial hassles (It wasn't all true, didn't Apple go bankrupt, and why did Paul sell Northern Songs to MJ?" But still the 2 Beatles who died, one was shot by a deranged lunatic, the other died at his mansion and Macca is thriving even after superbitch Mills cleaned him out.

.
But with the Beatles, its the same group of 4 guys who were around for 8 golden years, making a stream of melodic and very inventive pop and rock music.

.

Maybe I am wearing Pink glasses and the fact I have a bias towards white rock and roll over Black rap and soul music I rate them highly, but nearly everyone I know and every kid I went to school with was in tune to their genius.

.

I also think its very harsh to say the Beatles are overrated when you have them compared to fluff acts like Justin Bieber, Britney, Black eyed peas, Rhianna, who to me are not even approaching the astral plane of the Beatles.

[Edited 6/23/14 20:14pm]

The irony of this comment is that you make some serious claims about Motown stars who weren't "smart" enough to invest, etc. but don't you find it odd that a former Motown artist (Michael Jackson) BOUGHT THE ENTIRE Beatles catalog before he was even in his late 20s?

I suggest you re read my epistle, I have put it bold in case your attention span is shorter than 2 seconds. Nortehrn Songs was the name of the company given to all the songs published by Lennon and McCartney (They will never get their hands on Octopus's Graden for instance).

.

And yet before he died, he was ruthlessly trying to flog it off and take loans with SONY music using Northern songs as collateral, he fell so far behind in payments that was why he agreed to do "This is It"

.

Please don't ever try to compare Michael Jackson to the Beatles in financial skills. We are talking about a guy who spent half a million dollars on having perfume blown into the studio while he was recording the flop album Invincible. And a man who was anti drugs, but ended up swallowing more painkillers than Elvis and Hendrix combined. He also spent a lot of his millions on turning himself from an attractive black man, into a white transvestite alien thing.

Editing posts after someone responds and then pretending not to....priceless...

whitechocolatebrotha said:

Gunsnhalen said:

His songs are cheesy, his songwriting was about as good as AC/DC. His albums are full of filler, he owes a lot to his production team. I don't give a damn if he was a good dancer or not. Thriller is full of filler and cheesy ass songs. Off The Wall is the only album i really enjoy from him.

Plus, his hardcore fanbase is the absolute worse. I mean worse than Mariah Carey, Janet, Madonna, Whitney, Lady GaGa, Beyonce stans. And that's just disturbing

Most of his stuff is just cheesy, campy, and silly too me. But... that's just my opinion

[Edited 6/22/14 11:15am]

Michael Jackson is SOOOOO overrated! I can't stand MOST of his output. Fillerish, inDEED. His voice just grates on my nerves and I cannot STAND all those syncopated vocals he does with the "Bah! Cha!" Ugh!!! I bought "History: Past, Present & Future Book 1" recently and have no idea even WHY! LOL! Prob'ly sell it back 2 the used CD store 4 credit toward somethin' else. NOT a fan by ANY means. Janet's WAY better in my opinion. PLUS, his dancing didn't evolve really. He always did the same moves since Motown 25 and the corny videos of him playin' a brotha from the hood always made me wanna PUKE! If he ever went into the hood pullin' that shit, boy'd be BEATEN down! He didn't even know what homeless people were! Okay...don't get me started. 'Nuff said. These are merely my opinions and I am NOT hatin'. I just don't like his voice or much of his vids and/or material.

[Edited 6/24/14 15:15pm]

[Edited 6/24/14 15:25pm]

It's alright not to like Michael's music or him. I understand that because I can't stand his sister Janet or her music. However, the ignorance in the statement about Michael not knowing what homeless people are is pathetic. Your girl, Janet has said that she was with Michael when he would give HOMELESS people hundreds of dollars. She said they would just drive in neighborhoods and Michael would give out money. The bodyguards who recently released a book said that Michael would see people on the street and give them hundreds of dollars, especially to women. Again, it is alright not to like Michael or his music. That is your opinion, and I don't care or have no wish to change your mind. Just as you could never change my dislike about Janet or her music. However, it is not the fuck alright to lie and spew bullshit rumors just because you don't like MJ or his music. Ignorance is not a virtue!

Gunsnhalen said:

SeventeenDayze said:

I love MJ to death, so tell me what's overrated about him

His songs are cheesy, his songwriting was about as good as AC/DC. His albums are full of filler, he owes a lot to his production team. I don't give a damn if he was a good dancer or not. Thriller is full of filler and cheesy ass songs. Off The Wall is the only album i really enjoy from him.

Plus, his hardcore fanbase is the absolute worse. I mean worse than Mariah Carey, Janet, Madonna, Whitney, Lady GaGa, Beyonce stans. And that's just disturbing

Most of his stuff is just cheesy, campy, and silly too me. But... that's just my opinion

[Edited 6/22/14 11:15am]

Couldn't agree more. Check my thread about MJ.

SeventeenDayze said:

HuMpThAnG said:

ahhhhhhh...

Yep, Michael (at that time) wasn't known to be involved in drugs, gangs, etc. and came from a family with both parents. He was already a target. He had his own issues about his appearance but he certainly wasn't the first celeb to change their appearance. These days, MOST celebs go under the knife and it's more widely accepted compared to that time.

The only thing he did wrong, in the minds of some, is that he owned the most valuable catalog (including his own!) of all time. Oh, and a country in Africa crowned him as a King to their nation. MJ was power in the music world and out of it. That's a rare combination and it made him a target.

One thing is to get under the knife. Another is to erase your face. Can't you, MJ Fans, see the difference?

Adorecream said:

SeventeenDayze said:

The irony of this comment is that you make some serious claims about Motown stars who weren't "smart" enough to invest, etc. but don't you find it odd that a former Motown artist (Michael Jackson) BOUGHT THE ENTIRE Beatles catalog before he was even in his late 20s?

I suggest you re read my epistle, I have put it bold in case your attention span is shorter than 2 seconds. Nortehrn Songs was the name of the company given to all the songs published by Lennon and McCartney (They will never get their hands on Octopus's Graden for instance).

.

And yet before he died, he was ruthlessly trying to flog it off and take loans with SONY music using Northern songs as collateral, he fell so far behind in payments that was why he agreed to do "This is It"

.

Please don't ever try to compare Michael Jackson to the Beatles in financial skills. We are talking about a guy who spent half a million dollars on having perfume blown into the studio while he was recording the flop album Invincible. And a man who was anti drugs, but ended up swallowing more painkillers than Elvis and Hendrix combined. He also spent a lot of his millions on turning himself from an attractive black man, into a white transvestite alien thing.

Have you ever thought that Michael could EASILY have sold his share in the Sony/ATV catalogue and probably been debt-free. Of course, you SHOULD know that MANY conglomerates( as Michael was/ and still is) have to take loans out or use their assests for collateral. Did Michael ever file for bankruptcy? No. Even Donald Trum[, known as a billionaire filed for bankruptcy. Michael had debts. No one is denying that. Yeah, I am going to compare Michael to the Beatles in financial skills. Michael bought the Beatle catalogue. He merged that with THOUSANDS of other songs and created ATV. He merged that with Sony. Sony/ATV is worth BILLIONS. I don't know any intelligent person who doesn't say that THIS venture was very smart BUSINESS sense.

It's a shame that you are allowing your bias of MJ to rob you of any rational thinking. According to a coroner's report ( the same kind who did autopsieson Elvis and Hendrix), there were NO DRUGS in Michael's system other than the Propofol that the killer, Conrat Murray, pumped into him. This is not just me as a fan talking, this is what the coroner's report stated. Are you saying that you believe the coroner's report concerning Elvis and Hendrix and not Michael's coroner's report? How convenient that you are ignoring the FACTS just because of your bias. Of course, the bottomline is just common sense and not tabloid mentality. I have stated in another post, that I don't give a fuck if you like Michael or his music. Just show some "balls" and print facts, istead of lies or manipulations of the truth.

[Edited 6/24/14 18:49pm]

MJ is the most overrated act of all time.

Poor songwriter. Did playback most of the time. Inept inside a studio, thus too reliant on a producer. Couldn't play a single instrument. Corny/cheesy/tacky music videos and songs. Absolutely zero quality to his music after OTW.

Free2BMe said:

Adorecream said:

I suggest you re read my epistle, I have put it bold in case your attention span is shorter than 2 seconds. Nortehrn Songs was the name of the company given to all the songs published by Lennon and McCartney (They will never get their hands on Octopus's Graden for instance).

.

And yet before he died, he was ruthlessly trying to flog it off and take loans with SONY music using Northern songs as collateral, he fell so far behind in payments that was why he agreed to do "This is It"

.

Please don't ever try to compare Michael Jackson to the Beatles in financial skills. We are talking about a guy who spent half a million dollars on having perfume blown into the studio while he was recording the flop album Invincible. And a man who was anti drugs, but ended up swallowing more painkillers than Elvis and Hendrix combined. He also spent a lot of his millions on turning himself from an attractive black man, into a white transvestite alien thing.

Have you ever thought that Michael could EASILY have sold his share in the Sony/ATV catalogue and probably been debt-free. Of course, you SHOULD know that MANY conglomerates( as Michael was/ and still is) have to take loans out or use their assests for collateral. Did Michael ever file for bankruptcy? No. Even Donald Trum[, known as a billionaire filed for bankruptcy. Michael had debts. No one is denying that. Yeah, I am going to compare Michael to the Beatles in financial skills. Michael bought the Beatle catalogue. He merged that with THOUSANDS of other songs and created ATV. He merged that with Sony. Sony/ATV is worth BILLIONS. I don't know any intelligent person who doesn't say that THIS venture was very smart BUSINESS sense.

It's a shame that you are allowing your bias rob you of any rational thinking. According to a coromer's report ( the same kind who did autopies on Elvis and Hendrix), there were NO DRUGS in Michael's system other than the Propofol that the killer, Conrat Murray, pumped into him. This is not just me as a fan talking, this is what the coroner's report stated. How conveniet that you are ignoring the FACTS just because of your bias. Of course, the bottomline is just common sense and not your tabloid mentality.

Then why did his family claim he was a drug obsessive user?

Schubert said:

MotownSubdivision said:

Schubert said:

MJ is the most overrated act of all time.

Poor songwriter. Did playback most of the time. Inept inside a studio, thus too reliant on a producer. Couldn't play a single instrument. Corny/cheesy/tacky music videos and songs. Absolutely zero quality to his music after OTW.

The title of most overrated act of all time belongs to The Beatles. Sorry you feel that way about MJ though.

I don't feel that way. Those are facts.

Can you deny he did playback most of the times? Can you deny he played ZERO instruments?

Schubert said:

Free2BMe said:

Have you ever thought that Michael could EASILY have sold his share in the Sony/ATV catalogue and probably been debt-free. Of course, you SHOULD know that MANY conglomerates( as Michael was/ and still is) have to take loans out or use their assests for collateral. Did Michael ever file for bankruptcy? No. Even Donald Trum[, known as a billionaire filed for bankruptcy. Michael had debts. No one is denying that. Yeah, I am going to compare Michael to the Beatles in financial skills. Michael bought the Beatle catalogue. He merged that with THOUSANDS of other songs and created ATV. He merged that with Sony. Sony/ATV is worth BILLIONS. I don't know any intelligent person who doesn't say that THIS venture was very smart BUSINESS sense.

It's a shame that you are allowing your bias rob you of any rational thinking. According to a coromer's report ( the same kind who did autopies on Elvis and Hendrix), there were NO DRUGS in Michael's system other than the Propofol that the killer, Conrat Murray, pumped into him. This is not just me as a fan talking, this is what the coroner's report stated. How conveniet that you are ignoring the FACTS just because of your bias. Of course, the bottomline is just common sense and not your tabloid mentality.

Then why did his family claim he was a drug obsessive user?

I guess you haven't read the just released book by the bodyguards which shot to hell the bullshit that his family, mostly Randy and Janet, have been spewing about the so-called "drug use"? Do you remember when Janet came on national TV and said that they had done interventions where they crashed through the gate in an attempt at an intervention? The body guards said that Randy DID crash through the gate where Michael was staying:however, it had shit to do with "drugs". Randy was saying that Michael owed him money and it he didn't get it, he would call the media. There were also numerous attempts, from Janet AND the rest of the family, to try and COERCE Michael to do a REUINION tour with the brothers. Michael refused and that's when the "drug- intervention" stories started. Btw, this is just one of the reasons why I can't stand Janet. She perpetuated this lie and rumor about her brother after he was no longer here to defend himself. She would NEVER had the courage to do that if he was alive. What a fucking coward! Btw, I don't like Jermaine's tactics, but, I believe him when he says that Michael was NOT a drug adddict. Michael's mom had complete access to him. She said that she never saw a drug problem. I don't know about you, but I have never seen an "addict" who had a problem one day and didn't show the same problem on a consistent basis. I also have never heard of an "addict" who didn't have any drugs in their system when they died. The only drugs in Michael's system was the Propofol that the killer, Conrat Murray pumped into him. According to the bodyguards, who were around him daily in the last years of his life, they never saw any evidence of this so-called "drug-use". I wonder when his family are going to admit that they LIED. All it takes is a little COMMON SENSE and RATIONAL deductive thinking skills. Try it you would be surprised at what you will come up with, instead of the tabloidism that you regurgitate.

[Edited 6/24/14 19:07pm]

Most UNDERRATED music act of all time- Latoya Jackson.

Latoya, the daughter of Joseph, is undoubtedly the Pope of Pop, the Sultan of Sound. Janet's prettier sister has had numerous #1 hits on the Indonesian and Angola's charts. Her new single has #84 chart-position hit written all over hit.

She has had numerous duets with towering talents such as Minoka Usaka.

We, Toy soldiers, won't let the world forget about the most talented Jackson. Toy Toy is ready to conquer the world! For, like, the second time!

Schubert said:

SeventeenDayze said:

Yep, Michael (at that time) wasn't known to be involved in drugs, gangs, etc. and came from a family with both parents. He was already a target. He had his own issues about his appearance but he certainly wasn't the first celeb to change their appearance. These days, MOST celebs go under the knife and it's more widely accepted compared to that time.

The only thing he did wrong, in the minds of some, is that he owned the most valuable catalog (including his own!) of all time. Oh, and a country in Africa crowned him as a King to their nation. MJ was power in the music world and out of it. That's a rare combination and it made him a target.

One thing is to get under the knife. Another is to erase your face. Can't you, MJ Fans, see the difference?

Lemme think about it at a tanning salon and I'll get back to you.

Free2BMe said:

Schubert said:

Then why did his family claim he was a drug obsessive user?

I guess you haven't read the just released book by the bodyguards which shot to hell the bullshit that his family, mostly Randy and Janet, have been spewing about the so-called "drug use"? Do you remember when Janet came on national TV and said that they had done interventions where they crashed through the gate in an attempt at an intervention? The body guards said that Randy DID crash through the gate where Michael was staying:however, it had shit to do with "drugs". Randy was saying that Michael owed him money and it he didn't get it, he would call the media. There were also numerous attempts, from Janet AND the rest of the family, to try and COERCE Michael to do a REUINION tour with the brothers. Michael refused and that's when the "drug- intervention" stories started. Btw, this is just one of the reasons why I can't stand Janet. She perpetuated this lie and rumor about her brother after he was no longer here to defend himself. She would NEVER had the courage to do that if he was alive. What a fucking coward! Btw, I don't like Jermaine's tactics, but, I believe him when he says that Michael was NOT a drug adddict. Michael's mom had complete access to him. She said that she never saw a drug problem. I don't know about you, but I have never seen an "addict" who had a problem one day and didn't show the same problem on a consisten basis. According to the bodyguards, who were around him daily in the last years of his life, they never saw any evidence of this so-called "drug-use". I wonder when his family are going to admit that they LIED. Of course, we know that Janet and the rest will NEVER do that.

Lol. I know he was not a drug addict. That was BS spewed by his family in order to sue AEG, and get some millions. It was just a way to put Jackson fans between the spade and the wall: to make them get confronted with their own Jackson family delusion.

I was MOL, a former user 4-5 years ago. I don't know if you're a contemporary of mine, but I used, along with a few others, to denounce the Jackson family. Back then I was a huge MJ fan and was one of the first ones to realize he was not a drug addict. Back then nobody believe in us, thinking it was just fandom. Now, people know the truth, but it is loo late for some fans to come back: we got tired of it. I am no longer a fan. I used to adore him, worship him. No longer. The family was the trigger.

Schubert said: