Replica said:

Gunsnhalen said:

This is an asshole move. D obviously has talent. But dude is right about one thing...

D is not an eccentric genius. And he has released only 2 albums which happen to be very good. I know it's differences of opinion. But i don't understand why D is a genius.

He writes his own music and plays a few instruments. So do dozens of other artists. Lenny Kravitz plays more instruments than him. And produces all of his own music. And no ones calling Lenny a genius

[Edited 5/26/14 13:33pm]

I'm not discrediting Lenny Kravitz, but I gotta admit I think it's a great achievment selling as many records a D'Angelo did with Voodoo with only one hit single, and the rest being swamp funk for the niche underground market. Alot of people between 20-30 loves this dude, and knows almost nothing about our man Prince. His whole approach when creating Voodoo was pretty damn groundbreaking, even though it as a whole sounded kinda traditional and old school if not actually listening. Their way of doing what Parliament did, just 10x swampier with the smoothness of marvin gaye, al green and prince combined on top of that warm and swampy composition was never heard before. Lenny Kravitz was more or less just doing whatever he loved from earlier artists. He never truly was an inventor of the same degree.

I don't know why people say Kravitz didn't invent anything. Have people really forgotten his signature rock hits like "Are You Gonna Go My Way?" or "Rock'n'Roll Is Dead"? Those songs had the type of riffs and a feel I haven't really heard anywhere else. I'm aware that people are going to compare them to some of Jimi's stuff, but by the early-90s Kravitz had developed an easily distinguishable style that made him stand out at the time. He even influenced other artists, like TTD, to make similar type of rock songs. People were saying the rock songs on TTD's Vibrator album sounded like rock songs by Kravitz etc.

I think the "Lenny is unoriginal" stuff has more to do with him favouring retro aesthetics and old equipment when it wasn't fashionable yet. He got criticized for a lot of stuff then that people are these days applauding younger artists for.

I'm not a huge fan anymore, but I did learn to play the guitar by studying his songs back in the day and I know that there's some unique stuff happening in those songs.

That woman was Jocelyn Cooper, who was a music publisher and now started the Afro punk festival. There were many in the audience who helped D out and D graciously acknowledged them. Look, I am a huge D fan and I never gotten the impression that he is a dick. I know people that have met him on a casual basis and on a more personal level and the general consensus is that he is wild, a free spirit, a straight up thug, a pothead, not very bright and overall, just a very, very nice guy that has problems.

he should just release that album this year and then put some 100

songs or so on his website for download.

at the time of voodoo's release they were already talking about

having recorded 'hundreds of hours' of music.

i'm sure they did record a lot of tracks since voodoo but somehow

d'angelo keeps scrapping and tinkering.

he should just release the album, then get that decade old nut out

and clear his mind that way.

plus it would silence those people who say he's only managed to

put 1 album's worth of songs to tape in all those years.

that is, if he does indeed have many songs recorded over that time.

Old Boy doesn't have a website.

Sounds like this guy has bent over more than once for D and D still sticks to doing what he's been doing for the past 20 years without producing anything.

But you know, maybe this is what D needs to read right now. Sometimes people don't respond to anything but harsh love. Maybe he'll read this and it'll give him the necessary kick in the ass to get off his butt and give the world what he deep down knows he's capable of giving. I'm not expecting anything will blow me away tbh but anything is better than nothing and dying in obscurity because he's too afraid to fail after 20 years of tinkering.

D doesn't go online and I doubt he will hear about this. Interesting cause Gary Harris was interviewed at length 2 years back for that great GQ piece on D.

He's right about Nelson George not asking him the only question any of us were interested in; When will there be new music? Interviewing someone who hasn't been productive in 14 years and not asking them about new music is kind of pointless, especially when new music has been hinted at.

Replica said:

laurarichardson said:

" 20-30 loves this dude, and knows almost nothing about our man Prince." Then that is there problem. I am sick and tired of hearing about what 20 somethings know about. I was in my 20s once and I was not so stupid that I could not go out and find out who Sly Stone, Stevie Wonder or James Brown was. I knew P would not have been P without the influence of those artist. I am really do not care if younger people are too stupid to know that without Prince you would have no D'Angelo who by the way did not come up with his own sound that went on to influence artist across many different genres. All he has done is put out to okay CDs and is not really fit to wipe P purple boots.

The choices Prince took as an artist was both good and bad for him historically. People who actually know their shit, know that Prince has had a huge influence on modern funk, a huge influence in modern rnb and hip hop production and urban music in general, a huge influence in pop music, but has also influenced a bunch of guitar players etc as well. His influence is enormous. However being a crossover artist often makes people think that you don't really know the genres you blend that well. In his case it was knowing the genres as well as he did that made him creata seamless hybrids that was impossible to label. That's freakin good. But he never really developed completely new genres. He developed new steps in so many directions, it's impossible to say that he was the innovator of a genre in itself. While James Brown could be defined as an innovator and maybe even creator of funk more or less. He spent so much time trying to figure out the funk, that he truly created something that was to be duplicated for many years to come. Prince kinda just mastered about anything he'd listen to pretty damn well, so he wouldn't spend too much time on one thing. It would bore the hell out of him. I'm not saying D is the same calibre as Prince. I'm just saying that the legacy of someone is not measured entirely on quality and quantity alone, but the appreciation of it as a whole. Yeah, plenty love Prince. But many of them are pop lovers that were in their youth in the 80s. For those who wasn't brought up on his music. His discography is too much to digest. Even his best albums are too diverse for those who loves concept records that doesn't stretch it too far. Prince does stretch it quite far when it comes to how different one album sounds like. Even 1999 that was almost just synths, guitar, bass, linn drum in a pretty much similar "atmosphere" throughout, still sounds a bit too diverse for many. Funk lovers could dig that DMSR, 1999, Lady Cab Driver and All The Critics Love You In New Youk... and feel that there's a bunch of fillers just because it doesn't fit their style.

Maybe I should not have used the word "Genre" "Sound" He was one of the crafters of the Minneapolis sound which you still hear in popular music today.

Love P, but I don't hear much Minneapolis sound nowadays.

...nor D'Angelo sound either.

That might be the problem with the recordings he's made. They might sound dated already. I remember Questlove telling a few years back that D'Angelo had asked him to redo the drums and that to me sounds like they might have used too much of that "rimshot for snares" approach on the recordings. You know, that was the hottest thing imaginable in R&B music in the late-90s and still in the early-00s, but not now, no.

The new stuff's gotta have more of a funk or rock approach to the instrumentation. The "neo soul" sound's certainly not going to sound fresh by today's standards. Maxwell did a good job updating his sound on his previous record without resorting to some sort of production gimmicks, so I hope D'Angelo manages to do the same.

[Edited 5/27/14 12:13pm]

VooDoo doesn't have a hint of age to it.

Oh, c'mon. Of course it does.

scriptgirl said:

Love P, but I don't hear much Minneapolis sound nowadays.

I beg to differ. You hear elements of the Minneapolis sound in a lot of pop and RnB.

scriptgirl said:

Love P, but I don't hear much Minneapolis sound nowadays.

There's a bunch of music inspired by Prince. It doesn't have to be heavy use of linn drum and oberheim synths to be inspired by Prince. Blood Orange, Frank Ocean, Miguel, Dam Funk etc. Pharrell and Timbaland atleast were extremly inspired by him, although their sound has been going through some changes.

laurarichardson said:

scriptgirl said:

Love P, but I don't hear much Minneapolis sound nowadays.

I beg to differ. You hear elements of the Minneapolis sound in a lot of pop and RnB.

Agreed. I hear elements of the MPLS sound everywhere. Whether it's Pharrell, Timbaland, etc..... All these guys are clearly influenced by it.

Replica said:

scriptgirl said:

Love P, but I don't hear much Minneapolis sound nowadays.

There's a bunch of music inspired by Prince. It doesn't have to be heavy use of linn drum and oberheim synths to be inspired by Prince. Blood Orange, Frank Ocean, Miguel, Dam Funk etc. Pharrell and Timbaland atleast were extremly inspired by him, although their sound has been going through some changes.

The Dream as well..

CynicKill said:

VooDoo doesn't have a hint of age to it.

Yeah, I agree. I think alot of it has to do with their approach to music. They chose different equipment than what was normal at the time, Pino has a style of playing the bass that is probably close to impossible to duplicate, or atleast I've heard few that has done it better, Questlove really worked on his sloppy style of playing in a way I've not heard other places too. D'angelo is singing in this mumbling curtis mayfieldish slyprincealgreen style, that is not heard anywhere else. It is often labled as neo soul, but honestly Brown Sugar was more neo soul to me. Voodoo is some of the best produced stuff I've ever heard, and the warmth of the production is something else. It has that great vintage sound of the 70s, but updated and alot fuller and detailed sounding. All of these minor things made it sound different from both the old school soul of the 70s, but also from other music released at its time. The good thing about the sound is that it doesnt sound like a sound, it just sounds perfect. If Prince took what was best from Dirty Mind, Controversy, Parade and Lovesexy to find the perfect sound, and let Questlove do some studio magic with his knowledge of old Al Green records etc... they'd truly find that sound. That's what they did. Prince albums suffers a bit sometimes because of the sound. Even the classics do. Cause he cares mostly about the creative process in the moment, and less about aging.

Gunsnhalen said:

He writes his own music and plays a few instruments. So do dozens of other artists. Lenny Kravitz plays more instruments than him. And produces all of his own music. And no ones calling Lenny a genius

I feel the same way about Beck.

[Edited 5/27/14 14:24pm]

I have lived my whole life without ever hearing a single D'Angelo or Van Hunt song.

Van Hunt I get, but D'Angelo?!

Go to youtube NOW!

scriptgirl said:

Van Hunt I get, but D'Angelo?!

Go to youtube NOW!

I just might! I know he's well-thought-of here, but something about him has always kept me away. But I'll check him out some time.

But never Van Hunt. Not after what that guy said about Prince fans.

RodeoSchro said:

scriptgirl said:

Van Hunt I get, but D'Angelo?!

Go to youtube NOW!

I just might! I know he's well-thought-of here, but something about him has always kept me away. But I'll check him out some time.

But never Van Hunt. Not after what that guy said about Prince fans.

What did he say?

RodeoSchro said:

I have lived my whole life without ever hearing a single D'Angelo or Van Hunt song.

He has some pretty damn cool vocal layering, and his smooth and laidback mumbling style of singing realy fit with questlove on drums and pino palladino on bass

RodeoSchro said:

scriptgirl said:

Van Hunt I get, but D'Angelo?!

Go to youtube NOW!

I just might! I know he's well-thought-of here, but something about him has always kept me away. But I'll check him out some time.

But never Van Hunt. Not after what that guy said about Prince fans.

Can't be too sensitive about what some dude says about orgers. Damn the org is a mess sometimes, so I can't blame him lol. But what excatly did he say?

His music though is pretty damn cool. However I think it often sounds like he hasn't found himself. His blending of influences isn't excatly seamless. On some parts of a song he'll sound almost like a Curtis Mayfield copy, then suddenly when he is using more power in his voice he is Rick James. I'm not sure if I can take all of his songs seriously, even though his lyrics are brilliant. He is great poetic lyricist. Wonderfull stuff.

Not to be the asshole here, but this sounds like Gary Harris...
If you ask me he's the ONLY authority on speaking truth about the D'Angelo bullshit wagon...
The guy released 1 good album and one boring and pretentious BS record somewhere around the millenium that spawned a legion of shit records by shit "artists" for the years to come...
I wanted to give this a guy a chance but his BS non-talented ass is right down there with the Lauryn Hills and other BS flash-in-the-pan hacks of the 1990's...
Had he stayed consisted in at least releasing albums (no matter the quality) like for instance Common who released awesome records and his fair share of crap, or did a record with The Roots just so people who claim him to be some genius could at least have some material to back their claims up...
Ever since his last record D'Angelo just comes off as a "Pun" not to be taken seriously, no matter how much his hack Hype-man QuestLove babbles on about him...

Neversin.

Neversin said:

Not to be the asshole here, but this sounds like Gary Harris...
If you ask me he's the ONLY authority on speaking truth about the D'Angelo bullshit wagon...
The guy released 1 good album and one boring and pretentious BS record somewhere around the millenium that spawned a legion of shit records by shit "artists" for the years to come...
I wanted to give this a guy a chance but his BS non-talented ass is right down there with the Lauryn Hills and other BS flash-in-the-pan hacks of the 1990's...
Had he stayed consisted in at least releasing albums (no matter the quality) like for instance Common who released awesome records and his fair share of crap, or did a record with The Roots just so people who claim him to be some genius could at least have some material to back their claims up...
Ever since his last record D'Angelo just comes off as a "Pun" not to be taken seriously, no matter how much his hack Hype-man QuestLove babbles on about him...

Neversin.

I'm a much bigger Prince fan than D'Angelo fan, but yet I think Voodoo beats about any album Prince has released after 88, and Brown Sugar is alot more dated sounding as it is just another neo soul album of the time. Great songs, but the overall production etc is so close to everything else released in the 90s. He knew that he had to make the overall production more interesting. I don't care if it's pretentious if it sounds great. It's not like he is making fun of anyone. Why I think it's great:

-"sloppy" but ultra tight drumming. Like if a drunk dude accidentally just played PERFECT. Heavily inspired by J Dilla, but something of its own.
-Behind the beat bass lines by living legend Pino Palladino
-vocals that both seem mumbly and crystal clear at the same time.
-vocal layers out of this world, only matched by Prince occatinally. Prince at his best is alot more exciting creativly. But as music this was perfect for its concept
-amazing vintage, but yet not aging almost futuristic sound imo. This set a standard for real micing instruments that is extremly difficult to duplicate.

Replica said:

I'm a much bigger Prince fan than D'Angelo fan, but yet I think Voodoo beats about any album Prince has released after 88, and Brown Sugar is alot more dated sounding as it is just another neo soul album of the time. Great songs, but the overall production etc is so close to everything else released in the 90s.

After 1988 Prince release , "Come", "Exodus", "The Gold Experience"...
Hell, even nonsense like "The Rainbow Children", "Musicology" and "3121" is better than anything on "Voodoo"...
And sure, "Brown Sugar" sounds dated (so does "Voodoo" BTW...) and is on par with the lame music released at the time but there were nice enough songs on it to make it stand out, even though he sounded and wanted to come off as a Prince wannabe...
But this is not a pissing contest between Prince and D'Angelo since Prince has proven himself time and time again and D'Angelo wass just an overhyped Maxwell, or any other Neo-Soul product making shitty produced drivel...

Replica said:

-"sloppy" but ultra tight drumming. Like if a drunk dude accidentally just played PERFECT. Heavily inspired by J Dilla, but something of its own.
-Behind the beat bass lines by living legend Pino Palladino
-vocals that both seem mumbly and crystal clear at the same time.
-vocal layers out of this world, only matched by Prince occatinally. Prince at his best is alot more exciting creativly. But as music this was perfect for its concept
-amazing vintage, but yet not aging almost futuristic sound imo. This set a standard for real micing instruments that is extremly difficult to duplicate.

Pino Palladino is not a guarnatee for a great album, employing great musicians does not equal a great album (see for example Prince's post 1995 output...) and D'Angelo's vocal and recording techniques have been done better in other non-Western music...
And about setting standards for real micing instruments? No...

Neversin.

[Edited 5/28/14 4:57am]

Neversin said:

Replica said:

I'm a much bigger Prince fan than D'Angelo fan, but yet I think Voodoo beats about any album Prince has released after 88, and Brown Sugar is alot more dated sounding as it is just another neo soul album of the time. Great songs, but the overall production etc is so close to everything else released in the 90s.

After 1988 Prince release , "Come", "Exodus", "The Gold Experience"...
Hell, even nonsense like "The Rainbow Children", "Musicology" and "3121" is better than anything on "Voodoo"...
And sure, "Brown Sugar" sounds dated (so does "Voodoo" BTW...) and is on par with the lame music released at the time but there were nice enough songs on it to make it stand out, even though he sounded and wanted to come off as a Prince wannabe...
But this is not a pissing contest between Prince and D'Angelo since Prince has proven himself time and time again and D'Angelo wass just an overhyped Maxwell, or any other Neo-Soul product making shitty produced drivel...

Replica said:

-"sloppy" but ultra tight drumming. Like if a drunk dude accidentally just played PERFECT. Heavily inspired by J Dilla, but something of its own.
-Behind the beat bass lines by living legend Pino Palladino
-vocals that both seem mumbly and crystal clear at the same time.
-vocal layers out of this world, only matched by Prince occatinally. Prince at his best is alot more exciting creativly. But as music this was perfect for its concept
-amazing vintage, but yet not aging almost futuristic sound imo. This set a standard for real micing instruments that is extremly difficult to duplicate.

Pino Palladino is not a guarnatee for a great album, employing great musicians does not equal a great album (see for example Prince's post 1995 output...) and D'Angelo's vocal and recording techniques have been done better in other non-Western music...
And about setting standards for real micing instruments? No...

Neversin.

[Edited 5/28/14 4:57am]

Not gonna argue on opinions of music taste. But I'd very much like to hear a good example of these non-western recordings that you're speaking of. That must pretty damn good. However in the world of rnb? It's the whole package I'm loving. And the whole industry as well as most music critics seem to disagree with you. So your opinion is not much more than an opinion from a random orger. Our opinions in here don't weigh much when all we do is my claiming "daddy is stronger than your daddy", my car is faster than your car. It's no facts, just opinions based on taste usually. I admit that I haven't proven anything more than you in this discussion. However MY TASTE says that this music is THE SHIT, in a positive sense.

From my experience as a listener I find D'angelo to be vocally just as similar to Marving Gay and Al Green as he is to Prince. D'angelo is alot more gospel about him also, while Prince has a more "white" approach often. He is a seamless hybrid of everything he touches. So if D'angelo is copying Prince, he has found what Prince did that suits himself perfectly. Kinda like Prince did with The Tubeway Army, Devo and similar New Wave acts that did alot of the same sounds and rhytms as Prince would do later. He took what was adaptable to his own way of seeing music. That's what D'angelo does too. The big difference is D'angelo is acting like Prince is a hero, and not just one of his influences. Because of how big Prince is, being very influenced by him is more easily noticable for most people. So D'angelo has to eliminate his fanboy image, if he wants to be seen as the true artist that he actually is imo. I hated when he did that Superjam that sounded like if he was trying to be Prince. It's more evident when playing live that he wants to be Prince. I just think that he is a bit too much in love with Prince music. Doesn't make him less good though. I saw him live in Norway a couple years ago. It was fantastic!

Replica, it was revealed that Gary Harris made these comments already.

I am not a huge fan of Brown Sugar, but Voodoo is my fave album ever.

What do you all mean when you say "behind the beat?" Like how do you sing "behind the beat?"