lrn36 said:

I thought J*Davey was going to head the next wave of rnb. They were a sucessful mix of EDM and RnB.

I don't know what happend to them.

That band's fuckin brilliant!!! Thanks so much!!!

Check out this label for great contemporary electrofunk: http://www.tokyodawn.net/

Their compilations The Boogie (3 volumes) is a good way to get into their catalogue

lrn36 said:

I hate to say it, but black youth and youth in general have dropped the ball. They are not pushing and creating new cultures in which new music is born. Almost all of modern music had its seeds planted in the black youth movements of the 20th century. Of course, other groups and races around the world took those seeds and expanded on it. For the first time, the well of innovation has dried up and everyone is spinning their wheels in mud.

Think of the early days of hip hop where black and latino youth strove to create in the most dire situations. I can't get access to music education or instruments. Then I will use turntables and make my own. I can't find a venue to perform. Then I will plug my turntables and speakers into a lamp post and rock a show out in the park. I can't get exposure to that arts. Then I will dance in the streets on cardboard or use a cheap spray can to paint. Where is that passion to create now? Where is the ego to say fuck everything that came before and I'm creating something new.

The demise of r & b is just a symptom of greater problem. If you look around almost of genres are suffering financially and creatively. Pop music is becoming the all purpose, no purpose music of the ages. Pop used to draw inspiration from various genres of music. Now its like vampire sucking them lifeless. The problem is there are no new genres or sub cultures that can push and drag modern music forward.

There is no such thing as white culture in America. White privelege, yes, but NOT white culture. There IS such a thing as black culture, and the foundation of black culture (as distinct from Southern culture which encompasses Southerners both black and white) is segregation. Segregation was something NEW in America that emerged AFTER Reconstruction mostly in the 1880s and beyond. Segregation forced ALL African-Americans into a community which had never existed before as during slavery white and blacks in the South all lived together in a COMMON CULTURE (they lived together very unequally, of course.) African-American segregation caused a cultural explosion, as blacks who'd lived rural and isolated lives in the South in tiny hamlets and towns now moved to big cities like New Orleans, Kansas City, Chicago, Detroit, Los Angeles, etc and were now crowded into tiny ghetto or other all-black areas of town. Now the African-Americans were with each other in physical proximity by the thousands. They were no longer isolated. In these new new totally segregated inner city conditions, relentless harrassment and violence was directed at blacks by whites and especially and particularly by the new immigrants from Europe (Irish, Italians, Eastern Europeans) who in order to prove themselves to the new white masters in America and also to avoid their wrath (these new immigrants spoke bad English if any at all and tended toward Catholocism) adopted ultra-racist anti-black attitudes even more racist than the native anglo-saxon whites who came over before them. The result was that these huge masses of concentrated African-American population turned inward for protection and psychological mooring and sense of community and a new culture began to develop. In the final analysis it was the RELENTLESS outside pressure from whites which kept the blacks isolated and living amongst themselves which drove the development of their utterly unique culture which is the foundation for nearly all modern American culture. As it was segregation which birthed this new African-American culture, it was INTEGRATION which killed it. A black person with real money can live just about anywhere they damn please. Segregation today is based upon who's got money and who doesn't. It's about green now. The culture of the African-American people which gave rise to the entire rock and soul and jazz and hip-hop era has completely collapsed as a result of integration. All I can really say is go see Prince as much as you can, because he's about the last person standing from the rock and soul era who is still delivering the goods at the very highest of possible levels. There are never going to be artists like that again. Ever. What we took for granted growing up in America in terms of enormously high quality of culture and music was a historical anomaly. A beautiful, wonderful, mindblowing 40-50 year accidental stretch of the most incredible cultural output perhaps ever known to man. The rock and soul era. Which includes hip-hop and real house music and punk and everything else. Many countries contributed to this awesome movement, particularly the UK, nevertheless the roots are American, the roots of the whole movement are with the African-American people. And its over. It's never coming back. Thank God I lived through a big piece of it. I simply cannot fathom an existence without the 1970s and 1980s as the bedrock. If you weren't around during that time, you simply missed out on EVERYTHING. E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N-G.

hardwork said:

lrn36 said:

I hate to say it, but black youth and youth in general have dropped the ball. They are not pushing and creating new cultures in which new music is born. Almost all of modern music had its seeds planted in the black youth movements of the 20th century. Of course, other groups and races around the world took those seeds and expanded on it. For the first time, the well of innovation has dried up and everyone is spinning their wheels in mud.

Think of the early days of hip hop where black and latino youth strove to create in the most dire situations. I can't get access to music education or instruments. Then I will use turntables and make my own. I can't find a venue to perform. Then I will plug my turntables and speakers into a lamp post and rock a show out in the park. I can't get exposure to that arts. Then I will dance in the streets on cardboard or use a cheap spray can to paint. Where is that passion to create now? Where is the ego to say fuck everything that came before and I'm creating something new.

The demise of r & b is just a symptom of greater problem. If you look around almost of genres are suffering financially and creatively. Pop music is becoming the all purpose, no purpose music of the ages. Pop used to draw inspiration from various genres of music. Now its like vampire sucking them lifeless. The problem is there are no new genres or sub cultures that can push and drag modern music forward.

There is no such thing as white culture in America. White privelege, yes, but NOT white culture. There IS such a thing as black culture, and the foundation of black culture (as distinct from Southern culture which encompasses Southerners both black and white) is segregation. Segregation was something NEW in America that emerged AFTER Reconstruction mostly in the 1880s and beyond. Segregation forced ALL African-Americans into a community which had never existed before as during slavery white and blacks in the South all lived together in a COMMON CULTURE (they lived together very unequally, of course.) African-American segregation caused a cultural explosion, as blacks who'd lived rural and isolated lives in the South in tiny hamlets and towns now moved to big cities like New Orleans, Kansas City, Chicago, Detroit, Los Angeles, etc and were now crowded into tiny ghetto or other all-black areas of town. Now the African-Americans were with each other in physical proximity by the thousands. They were no longer isolated. In these new new totally segregated inner city conditions, relentless harrassment and violence was directed at blacks by whites and especially and particularly by the new immigrants from Europe (Irish, Italians, Eastern Europeans) who in order to prove themselves to the new white masters in America and also to avoid their wrath (these new immigrants spoke bad English if any at all and tended toward Catholocism) adopted ultra-racist anti-black attitudes even more racist than the native anglo-saxon whites who came over before them. The result was that these huge masses of concentrated African-American population turned inward for protection and psychological mooring and sense of community and a new culture began to develop. In the final analysis it was the RELENTLESS outside pressure from whites which kept the blacks isolated and living amongst themselves which drove the development of their utterly unique culture which is the foundation for nearly all modern American culture. As it was segregation which birthed this new African-American culture, it was INTEGRATION which killed it. A black person with real money can live just about anywhere they damn please. Segregation today is based upon who's got money and who doesn't. It's about green now. The culture of the African-American people which gave rise to the entire rock and soul and jazz and hip-hop era has completely collapsed as a result of integration. All I can really say is go see Prince as much as you can, because he's about the last person standing from the rock and soul era who is still delivering the goods at the very highest of possible levels. There are never going to be artists like that again. Ever. What we took for granted growing up in America in terms of enormously high quality of culture and music was a historical anomaly. A beautiful, wonderful, mindblowing 40-50 year accidental stretch of the most incredible cultural output perhaps ever known to man. The rock and soul era. Which includes hip-hop and real house music and punk and everything else. Many countries contributed to this awesome movement, particularly the UK, nevertheless the roots are American, the roots of the whole movement are with the African-American people. And its over. It's never coming back. Thank God I lived through a big piece of it. I simply cannot fathom an existence without the 1970s and 1980s as the bedrock. If you weren't around during that time, you simply missed out on EVERYTHING. E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N-G.

so very poignant, so very true, so very honest....all of it

black culture in this country was cultivated for the very reasons u mentioned, which is why its always been susceptable to being exploited when a certain aspect of it reaches a stage of maturity, at that moment, that's when the establishment comes and robs it of its virtue for monetary gain; rather its a music form itself or an exceptionally talented individual whose culture shaped his/her talent

as you say, the greatness that permeated throughout that culture and other cultures of authenticity have ben all tapped out, stretched bone dry

this is why I've always been an opponent of sampling for this very reason....for sampling is rooted in the practice of exploiting cutlure of all its worth

the destruction and decline has occured in rapid fashion in the past 27 years and I'm very saddened by it

I don't listen to radio anymore....just talk radio

whatever music is on the air now, I feel absolutely nothing from it and I know that's not a good place to be

It stopped being about the music over a quarter century ago

[Edited 3/22/14 13:57pm]

Interesting discussion...

I was thinking just the other day about why I don't listen to much of the mainstream big hitters these days. A lot of popular music is performed by teenagers and performers in their early 20s who simply have nothing interesting to say or music worth listening.

It is truly remarkable that Stevie Wonder, MJ, Prince et al produced such seminal work by the time they were 25 years old. It seems such a young age to me.

I'd agree with those who say that R&B has lost it's way. Money talks. When you have thin-voiced singers trying to do R&B, yet getting all the plaudits, you know something has gone wrong.

The R&B when I was growing up (80's/90's) was all about lush chord arrangements and melodies, delivered with heartfelt vocal performances...

^^^^^ Yes! Me TOO! What ever happened to the Shirley Jones', the Melba Moore's, the Jean Carne's, the Teena Marie's, the Cherrelle's, the Anita Baker's, the Peabo Bryson's, the Jeffrey Osborne's and/or the Frankie Beverly's of the R&B music market? They didn't use Rap in their records to score #1 hits and albums. Their music was seasoned just right with lush chords, REAL instrumentation and was completely void of Rap/Hip-Hop and Autotune embellishments. It's nauseating and completely discouraging as 2 what sells today and what is "passed off" as R&B.

[Edited 3/22/14 14:09pm]