What´s pretty sad about the original post is that they only talk about the visual aspect, it´s all about how the women dress. They name some big artist but don´t talk about their music. They talk about sexism, but their article is full of sexisme itself.

If you´re only talking about the visual thing, the same thing happens to men who relay big on the visual aspect.

If Prince would perform the same way he did in the 80´s he would get a lot of critism too! Can you imagine him doing Darling Nikki like he did back than?

The question is, why somebody like Mariah Carey still feels the need to wear those short skirts? If it is about the music, why would you still want to be seen as a sexsymbol?

Yes, people don't want to see a half naked Madonna in a video....but we also don't want to see a half naked Mick Jagger in a video. It's just the way it is.

robertlove said:

Yes, people don't want to see a half naked Madonna in a video....but we also don't want to see a half naked Mick Jagger in a video.

What about Iggy Pop?

Keith Richards

Denise LaSalle was 61 when she released this song in 2000.

MickyDolenz said:

This is an R&B singles chart from the same week. There's a higher ratio of female acts than the rock chart.

Absolutely! That's the way it used to be. Females were not only giving their male counterparts a run for their money on the R&B charts (The Black Charts back then), but they were probably the most dominating force on black radio. Today, just looking at the Top 40 artists on this chart, the only female who remains in regular rotation on Old School/Adult R&B radio is Sade.

robertlove said:

What´s pretty sad about the original post is that they only talk about the visual aspect, it´s all about how the women dress. They name some big artist but don´t talk about their music. They talk about sexism, but their article is full of sexisme itself.

If you´re only talking about the visual thing, the same thing happens to men who relay big on the visual aspect.

If Prince would perform the same way he did in the 80´s he would get a lot of critism too! Can you imagine him doing Darling Nikki like he did back than?

The question is, why somebody like Mariah Carey still feels the need to wear those short skirts? If it is about the music, why would you still want to be seen as a sexsymbol?

Yes, people don't want to see a half naked Madonna in a video....but we also don't want to see a half naked Mick Jagger in a video. It's just the way it is.

Thats what it boils down too. Good point

kitbradley said:

Absolutely! That's the way it used to be. Females were not only giving their male counterparts a run for their money on the R&B charts (The Black Charts back then), but they were probably the most dominating force on black radio. Today, just looking at the Top 40 artists on this chart, the only female who remains in regular rotation on Old School/Adult R&B radio is Sade.

That wasn't really my point. It was that females on rock radio stations were mostly shunned compared to other genres. I was comparing the female presence on rock and R&B charts.

MickyDolenz said:

robertlove said:

Yes, people don't want to see a half naked Madonna in a video....but we also don't want to see a half naked Mick Jagger in a video.

What about Iggy Pop?

My point exactly

robertlove said:

MickyDolenz said:

What about Iggy Pop?

My point exactly

MickyDolenz said:

kitbradley said:

Absolutely! That's the way it used to be. Females were not only giving their male counterparts a run for their money on the R&B charts (The Black Charts back then), but they were probably the most dominating force on black radio. Today, just looking at the Top 40 artists on this chart, the only female who remains in regular rotation on Old School/Adult R&B radio is Sade.

That wasn't really my point. It was that females on rock radio stations were mostly shunned compared to other genres. I was comparing the female presence on rock and R&B charts.

What's also cool about that old R&B Chart is that you had so much more diversity reflected in the chart. I mean, you had Hip Hop, (RUN-DMC, Kurtis Blow), Jazz artist like Jeff Lorber, George Benson, Al Jarreau and recently departed, George Duke (God rest his soul). Pop acts like, Madonna, Hall & Oats, and George Michael. Hell, you even had Blues acts still charting back then with J.Blackfoot and B.B. King. I'm sure later Billboard separated everything and gave every genre their own chart but still, we've come a long way since then. And not for the better.

Musicslave said:

What's also cool about that old R&B Chart is that you had so much more diversity reflected in the chart. I mean, you had Hip Hop, (RUN-DMC, Kurtis Blow), Jazz artist like Jeff Lorber, George Benson, Al Jarreau and recently departed, George Duke (God rest his soul). Pop acts like, Madonna, Hall & Oats, and George Michael. Hell, you even had Blues acts still charting back then with J.Blackfoot and B.B. King. I'm sure later Billboard separated everything and gave every genre their own chart but still, we've come a long way since then. And not for the better.

Hall & Oates often recieved R&B airplay as they were considered "blue-eyed soul". In the case of B.B. King's song Into The Night, it's more pop sounding than straight blues. It was on the soundtrack of a Jeff Goldblum movie, which is probably why it recieved airplay. B.B. didn't normally get much airplay during the 1980's.

MickyDolenz said:

Musicslave said:

What's also cool about that old R&B Chart is that you had so much more diversity reflected in the chart. I mean, you had Hip Hop, (RUN-DMC, Kurtis Blow), Jazz artist like Jeff Lorber, George Benson, Al Jarreau and recently departed, George Duke (God rest his soul). Pop acts like, Madonna, Hall & Oats, and George Michael. Hell, you even had Blues acts still charting back then with J.Blackfoot and B.B. King. I'm sure later Billboard separated everything and gave every genre their own chart but still, we've come a long way since then. And not for the better.

Hall & Oates often recieved R&B airplay as they were considered "blue-eyed soul". In the case of B.B. King's song Into The Night, it's more pop sounding than straight blues. It was on the soundtrack of a Jeff Goldblum movie, which is probably why it recieved airplay. B.B. didn't normally get much airplay during the 1980's.

I know. I just thought it was cool to see so many different type of artists on the same chart and it not be the regular Hot 100 chart.

Musicslave said:

MickyDolenz said:

Hall & Oates often recieved R&B airplay as they were considered "blue-eyed soul". In the case of B.B. King's song Into The Night, it's more pop sounding than straight blues. It was on the soundtrack of a Jeff Goldblum movie, which is probably why it recieved airplay. B.B. didn't normally get much airplay during the 1980's.

I know. I just thought it was cool to see so many different type of artists on the same chart and it not be the regular Hot 100 chart.

I noticed that Jesse Johnson & The Time both have songs on it.

The Story Of Sister Rosetta Tharpe

Wendy O. Williams and The Plasmatics: 10 Years Of Revolution Rock N Roll (documentary)

Wendy interviews Tommy Lee & Vince Neil in 1985

Punk and the participation of women is an interesting thing. It definitely seems to have upended the usual gender roles and audience expectations around a rock band, to the point where it became very normal for a mostly-male band to have female musicians as part of it. I can't think of more than a few examples prior to Talking Heads in '77 - it was one of those things that just wasn't done.

But punk bands were largely born of necessity, not because people wanted to be rock stars, so they started bands with whoever was around and willing to do it, and never thought about "is it acceptable in the industry to have a female bass player?" because they didn;t think they were ever going to enter the music industry.

There are some sub-cultures that sprung up that were more macho. There's very few bands from the hardcore scene of the early 80s that have women in them, or attracted many women to their gigs. But while that was going on, the girls who felt alienated from that scene started other scenes and you had things like riot grrl in the US, or the early 80s English bands like Essential Logic and Delta 5 making a different kind of punk rock than people had heard before.

That was the nice thing about punk, you could flex it into just about anything. If what was happening now in the punk scene didn't suit you, you could change the definition just by doing something different.

D'Angelo. Even men won't let him comeback without his 25 yo buff physique.

Seems every thing is being discussed but the actual QUALITY of the music material that comes from these older acts.