LiLi1992 said:

I wrote immediately after the list:

(The last figure - coefficient, which equals 2 million)

Bad has sold about 32 million according to this list.

16 on the list - it is not the number of copies sold

so 16 x 2 = 32 million
Now that album sales are close to 35 million worldwide.

Thriller - 68 million

St. Pepper and One - more than 30 million each

Purple Rain - 20 million

I just copied the list .. I think that everyone can do the math - just multiply by 2

12 for Adele - it's not 12 million copies sold, and 24 million
coefficient is used because it is impossible to obtain precise figures, especially for the old albums.

Though that is true to a degree, those are the numbers that have been around longer and would have been dispelled by now had they not been true.

I don't think a lot of people are going to agree with this, but I also think the loss of Amy Winehouse really contributed to Adele's 21 sales cause they could have been buying her albums at the same time Amy's sales went up. She was already a success without Amy, but continued selling more, since they are both female British singers-songwriters that were highly respected at about the same time.

alphastreet said:

LiLi1992 said:

and they are absolutely right.

I was born the following year after D, so I have no personal experience, but in 2010, I listened for the first time the entire discography and after Off the Wall and Thriller was not very impressed (only liked Billie Jean, Beat it, WBSS, Don`t stop, Working day and night, Off the wall and Get on the floor) and only Bad and Dangerous really did IT for me.

PS Why I can never get past the discussion that obvious off-topic?

sorry

----------------------

So now Oasis!
it was very long ago, when I last listened this album, but I remember that I had a good impression of it.
I hope that 21 does not catch up in the near future, the guys that I really like: The Beatles and Queen, but I have a very, very bad feeling.

Let's think in general:most albums in the top 10 have been released a long time ago ... at first it was vinyl, then cassettes, then CD, etc. .... and fans bought this album over and over again in different formats ... In the 80's "Bad" has become a leader in the list of best-selling albums in the UK in the first 2 years after the release of ... and it was about 2.8 million over 2 years. Adele during this time sold 4.5 million .. and that all sales are only in modern formats ... it's just HUGE

Lil, from the lists I've seen over the years, it looks like a mix of US and worldwide figures all jumbled up. The last time I saw about 16 million for Bad was the late 80's, since the early 00's I have seen something like a 27 million figure which is now over 30 million that I read after the death. I have read 11 million for Bad in the US alone in 2005 though I know there is no certification to back it up yet so logically, 15 million is very likely in the US, though 15 million for Dangerous for either the US or worldwide makes no sense since the soundscan in the US is at 7 million and the worldwide sales are about 30 million if not more. If you go to wikipedia, there is a more accurate list though I have seen it years before wikipedia existed.

Thriller was referenced as 40 million around the relase of the Moonwalk book and 54 million in the 90's on a worldwide level. The last time it was recertified in the US was early 2000 or 2001 at about 29 million so the 34 million makes no sense though it sounds like it should be that high in the US, NOT worldwide! Catch my drift?

Those Beatles albums St. Pepper and One look very similar to what I read about US sales in 2005, definitely not worldwide at all. They have had so many diamond albums and were a worldwide phenomenon, so selling that little worldwide at their prime is an injustice to their numbers too.

[Edited 1/2/13 6:01am]

Alphastreet they say MJ fans are not rational

By the way, I do agree

mjscarousal said:

alphastreet said:

Lil, from the lists I've seen over the years, it looks like a mix of US and worldwide figures all jumbled up. The last time I saw about 16 million for Bad was the late 80's, since the early 00's I have seen something like a 27 million figure which is now over 30 million that I read after the death. I have read 11 million for Bad in the US alone in 2005 though I know there is no certification to back it up yet so logically, 15 million is very likely in the US, though 15 million for Dangerous for either the US or worldwide makes no sense since the soundscan in the US is at 7 million and the worldwide sales are about 30 million if not more. If you go to wikipedia, there is a more accurate list though I have seen it years before wikipedia existed.

Thriller was referenced as 40 million around the relase of the Moonwalk book and 54 million in the 90's on a worldwide level. The last time it was recertified in the US was early 2000 or 2001 at about 29 million so the 34 million makes no sense though it sounds like it should be that high in the US, NOT worldwide! Catch my drift?

Those Beatles albums St. Pepper and One look very similar to what I read about US sales in 2005, definitely not worldwide at all. They have had so many diamond albums and were a worldwide phenomenon, so selling that little worldwide at their prime is an injustice to their numbers too.

[Edited 1/2/13 6:01am]

Alphastreet they say MJ fans are not rational

By the way, I do agree

Seriously. If Britney Spears had sales higher than Elvis, I wouldn't even bother going out of my way to lie about it like some of these trolls. Why lie about numbers that have been around for ages and are growing?

[Edited 1/2/13 9:04am]

I lurk over there at UK Mix and I don't see it (least not where I'm supposed to see it, that is). But of course those figures are inaccurate.

That said, "21" is around 20-25 million worldwide at the moment and it is one of the best-selling albums worldwide.

There's actually not too many albums that do 30-40 million as one might expect and the classic albums have had a harder time with how many sales it actually sold versus how many that were shipped.

Since Soundscan wasn't around in the 1960s, '70s, '80s and before 1991, it's hard to see how much it "sold" since the RIAA was used to test the shipments/sales combination.

^Really?
absolutely in any threads in the section "Artist Chart Analysis" people refer to the website mediatraffiс (weekly sales, album sales for the whole year, etc.).
This site is very popular in the UK mix. I'm surprised you have not seen it.

http://www.mediatraffic.de/alltime-album-chart.htm

of course their lists are not 100% correct (I would like to see a more faithful lists from your point of view), but somewhere close to reality, closer than other lists that are in the net

and .. Baby One More Time, of course, has sold more than any album of Elvis, even in the U.S. (which is the main market for Elvis by far) album Britney certified 14x platinum, although the most successful album of Elvis 10x platinum.

I posted a list of best-selling albums, which I think is significant at 90% ... if someone has a more appropriate list from his point of view, I would love to see ...

[Edited 1/2/13 11:15am]

LiLi1992 said:

^Really?
absolutely in any threads in the section "Artist Chart Analysis" people refer to the website mediatraffiс (weekly sales, album sales for the whole year, etc.).
This site is very popular in the UK mix. I'm surprised you have not seen it.

http://www.mediatraffic.de/alltime-album-chart.htm

of course their lists are not 100% correct (I would like to see a more faithful lists from your point of view), but somewhere close to reality, closer than other lists that are in the net

and .. Baby One More Time, of course, has sold more than any album of Elvis, even in the U.S. (which is the main market for Elvis by far) album Britney certified 14x platinum, although the most successful album of Elvis 10x platinum.

I posted a list of best-selling albums, which I think is significant at 90% ... if someone has a more appropriate list from his point of view, I would love to see ...

[Edited 1/2/13 11:15am]

That's because I've only been in the artist chart analysis threads in UK Mix. I haven't been to the actual Media Traffic site.

Also, speaking of Elvis and Britney, you can't really compare their album sales. Elvis selling anywhere between 500,000 and 1 million in 1956 was equivalent to Britney selling 10-15 million in 1999. Plus the industry was more singles-heavy than even in the singles-dominated pop culture these days (albums have continued to sell despite a drop).

I don't know how they came up with 34 for Thriller. That's just as ridiculous as the 100 million figure. Nevermind, just went there.

[Edited 1/2/13 11:29am]

Hmm, just went there... it seems like the figures posted there come from IFPI figures. Which could mean that's how much it sold in Europe alone... not the world. If the list is accurate, then "21" has pushed 12 million in European countries alone.

Come on, Timmy, don`t kill me at least you!!
I wrote several times that 34, 20 or 12 - are not sold millions of albums.
even at the end of the list is written - "albums with global sales of 2 million copies
with additional 2 million copies indicated by a numeral following the symbol "

that is, you have to multiply these numbers by 2 to get the millions!

21 sold 12, the equivalent of 24 million copies sold worldwide

Can peoplle just not accept someone sold a lot of albums? bejesus

Like i said someone can come out playing 71 instruments & be the most talented mofo on the planet... but if they sell more than MJ or The Beatles people will freak out.

Anf they will do ''oh ther good.. but OVERRATED and not that good but the album is good(Hell it's great But not THAT great.)

That's all i see people doing!~ oh Adele is overrated she is good but not THAT GOOD and her album is good(Ok maybe a little great) But not THAT GREAT she is only somewhat talented(But more talented then the other pop tarts)

Can yall just admit you like album and be happy she sells? or not like it and not care

LiLi1992 said:

Come on, Timmy, don`t kill me at least you!!
I wrote several times that 34, 20 or 12 - are not sold millions of albums.
even at the end of the list is written - "albums with global sales of 2 million copies
with additional 2 million copies indicated by a numeral following the symbol "

that is, you have to multiply these numbers by 2 to get the millions!

21 sold 12, the equivalent of 24 million copies sold worldwide

I'm not trying to kill you.

I'm just saying, I didn't know how they calculated it unless they divided it because 21 did in fact did sell over 24 million worldwide. It seems like Media Traffic divide the actual sales by half? Which doesn't make sense. You got Hammer's album down there and it said (8^)...

Oh and "21" is already ten times platinum in Europe. Right now as I see it, the total worldwide sales are between 24, 25 or 26 million at the moment.

Gunsnhalen said:

Can peoplle just not accept someone sold a lot of albums? bejesus

Like i said someone can come out playing 71 instruments & be the most talented mofo on the planet... but if they sell more than MJ or The Beatles people will freak out.

Anf they will do ''oh ther good.. but OVERRATED and not that good but the album is good(Hell it's great But not THAT great.)

That's all i see people doing!~ oh Adele is overrated she is good but not THAT GOOD and her album is good(Ok maybe a little great) But not THAT GREAT she is only somewhat talented(But more talented then the other pop tarts)

Can yall just admit you like album and be happy she sells? or not like it and not care

That's what I'm kinda seeing as well. Which is what I don't get why MJ, Elvis and Britney are being brought up. All these artists were popular in different times.

Timmy84 said:

Gunsnhalen said:

Can peoplle just not accept someone sold a lot of albums? bejesus

Like i said someone can come out playing 71 instruments & be the most talented mofo on the planet... but if they sell more than MJ or The Beatles people will freak out.

Anf they will do ''oh ther good.. but OVERRATED and not that good but the album is good(Hell it's great But not THAT great.)

That's all i see people doing!~ oh Adele is overrated she is good but not THAT GOOD and her album is good(Ok maybe a little great) But not THAT GREAT she is only somewhat talented(But more talented then the other pop tarts)

Can yall just admit you like album and be happy she sells? or not like it and not care

That's what I'm kinda seeing as well. Which is what I don't get why MJ, Elvis and Britney are being brought up. All these artists were popular in different times.

YES!!!

But people just can not get off sales!! especially when it comes to Jackson or The Beatles.

I Have a dream that one day we will not give a fuck about sales, i have a dream people will not use shit like oh there good.. but overrated.. but great to todays music... but overrated in past music and my music opinion is higher than Jesus almighty.

I Hope one day thsi dream will be realized

Timmy, 12 for Adele mean that the album reached the level of 24 million ... it could be 24.5 million or 25.8 million, but it has not yet reached 26 million, when sales reached that mark, it will have a coefficient of 13!

1 unit on their site is 2 million copies sold, they are using this formula, because it is difficult to establish the exact figures for the old albums especially.

----------------------

this thread is not "21 appreciation", but "21 sold a bunch of albums," so we are discussing the sales.

For me, the sales of this album seem more impressive than the music recorded on this album.

if this thread was about the music of this album, I would have found a more interesting things to do than to discuss it ...
but I'm interested in this album primarily as a phenomenon of the demand of the buyers of music.

[Edited 1/2/13 12:05pm]

Gunsnhalen said:

Timmy84 said:

That's what I'm kinda seeing as well. Which is what I don't get why MJ, Elvis and Britney are being brought up. All these artists were popular in different times.

YES!!!

But people just can not get off sales!! especially when it comes to Jackson or The Beatles.

I Have a dream that one day we will not give a fuck about sales, i have a dream people will not use shit like oh there good.. but overrated.. but great to todays music... but overrated in past music and my music opinion is higher than Jesus almighty.

I Hope one day thsi dream will be realized

Unfortunately it will never happen. But hey we can still dream.

LiLi1992 said:

Timmy, 12 for Adele mean that the album reached the level of 24 million ... it could be 24.5 million or 25.8 million, but it has not yet reached 26 million, when sales reached that mark, it will have a coefficient of 13!

1 unit on their site is 2 million copies sold, they are using this formula, because it is difficult to establish the exact figures for the old albums especially.

----------------------

this thread is not "21 appreciation", but "21 sold a bunch of albums," so we are discussing the sales.

For me, the sales of this album seem more impressive than the music recorded on this album.

if this thread was about the music of this album, I would have found a more interesting things to do than to discuss it ...
but I'm interested in this album primarily as a phenomenon of the demand of the buyers of music.

[Edited 1/2/13 12:05pm]

Level? It did sell 24 million.

I don't buy the Media Traffic's explanation.

And technically it is kind of an appreciation since, to me anyway, it's a really good album.

I think the music is impressive. But stick to your Beatles.

Gunsnhalen said:

Can peoplle just not accept someone sold a lot of albums? bejesus

Like i said someone can come out playing 71 instruments & be the most talented mofo on the planet... but if they sell more than MJ or The Beatles people will freak out.

Anf they will do ''oh ther good.. but OVERRATED and not that good but the album is good(Hell it's great But not THAT great.)

That's all i see people doing!~ oh Adele is overrated she is good but not THAT GOOD and her album is good(Ok maybe a little great) But not THAT GREAT she is only somewhat talented(But more talented then the other pop tarts)

Can yall just admit you like album and be happy she sells? or not like it and not care

Definitly agree with this

The problem is, you have some posters who bash MJ or the Beatles to make artists such as Adele appear better and that is how the whole "this album is better than that album" arguement comes into play. I think you can congradulate someone without making negative remarks such as "Well Thriller is not really a good album" Like since someone surpassed it that means it was not good I dont get that logic. I think people can be happy without putting other artists down.

I don't really care about sales, I just prefer Michael Jackson and The Beatles to Adele's music. I really do think that the album is good, in fact I think it's great. That doesn't mean I have to love it as much as other artists or that it hasn't become overrated over time. I think the early reviews of the album were pretty fair, although I think it's a little bit better than some of the early reviews suggest.

Every song on there could have been released as a single and would've been a hit, I don't know why they weren't.

But that doesn't mean I like every single song on the album especially not as much as I love MJ and The Beatles' classics. I think that Adele is very talented but that doesn't make the album the greatest, there are tons of talented artists who put out mediocre albums. I'm glad she is selling though, like I said I like the fact that anyone making music is selling at all whether it's the most talented artist in the world or not.

MiniJamesW said:

I don't really care about sales, I just prefer Michael Jackson and The Beatles to Adele's music. I really do think that the album is good, in fact I think it's great. That doesn't mean I have to love it as much as other artists or that it hasn't become overrated over time. I think the early reviews of the album were pretty fair, although I think it's a little bit better than some of the early reviews suggest.

Every song on there could have been released as a single and would've been a hit, I don't know why they weren't.

But that doesn't mean I like every single song on the album especially not as much as I love MJ and The Beatles' classics. I think that Adele is very talented but that doesn't make the album the greatest, there are tons of talented artists who put out mediocre albums. I'm glad she is selling though, like I said I like the fact that anyone making music is selling at all whether it's the most talented artist in the world or not.

And then I agree with this to

MiniJamesW said:

I don't really care about sales, I just prefer Michael Jackson and The Beatles to Adele's music. I really do think that the album is good, in fact I think it's great. That doesn't mean I have to love it as much as other artists or that it hasn't become overrated over time. I think the early reviews of the album were pretty fair, although I think it's a little bit better than some of the early reviews suggest.

Every song on there could have been released as a single and would've been a hit, I don't know why they weren't.

But that doesn't mean I like every single song on the album especially not as much as I love MJ and The Beatles' classics. I think that Adele is very talented but that doesn't make the album the greatest, there are tons of talented artists who put out mediocre albums. I'm glad she is selling though, like I said I like the fact that anyone making music is selling at all whether it's the most talented artist in the world or not.

That's just the thing. I think the fact that Adele has been heralded as such a good singer with some catchy songs proves you can still sell albums. It don't take nothing from any legendary act and it shouldn't.

Timmy84 said:

That's just the thing. I think the fact that Adele has been heralded as such a good singer with some catchy songs proves you can still sell albums. It don't take nothing from any legendary act and it shouldn't.

Yeah, Adele gives me hope for the music industry in this decade. I really hope we get more great big pop albums like 21 from new talent that sell.