No, definitely not.

Nah she ain't over but she needs to learn that oversaturation is not the way to go if you wanna hold on to your spot. Her other girl (not mentioning her name) learned it the hard way about that shit.

VoicesCarry said:

I'm pretty sure Madonna was written off as just a pop tart at this point in her career (Like a Virgin stage, if we're keeping track).

Truth - but this record should have been True Blue for Gaga ...

VoicesCarry said:

badujunkie said:

I think staying off the road for the main cycle of the album promo was at once a mistake and the right move. there was no way to win since she had kept herself on tour (or, her agents did) from 08-11. Imagine the hype and freshness if she had waited to just do 3 month arena tours one at a time once she was a major major star...

and yes BTW was a huge hit...im asking the question, not saying she is for sure over. it just seems like all the hype about her being the next Madge, Bowie, whatever, has turned out to be empty

She could very well be the next Madonna or Bowie, but she's going to need more than two albums to do it. She's certainly the most interesting pop star that's come along in quite some time.

you don't consider this 3 albums for all intents and purposes? Fame Monster had 2 huge singles (more?) and is her best, imo...

aardvark15 said:

Blame Adele. Hopefully though we'll get another album in 2013.

saw something a few months back that she said shes already nearly finished the next album & she's doing a world tour this year she already released dates in hong kong and australia, and is set to tour europe and then north america in 2013

badujunkie said:

VoicesCarry said:

She could very well be the next Madonna or Bowie, but she's going to need more than two albums to do it. She's certainly the most interesting pop star that's come along in quite some time.

you don't consider this 3 albums for all intents and purposes? Fame Monster had 2 huge singles (more?) and is her best, imo...

It's an EP and really substituted for a re-release of The Fame (there was no gap between singles from The Fame and singles from TFM).

I guess I consider BTW her sophomore album.

badujunkie said:

VoicesCarry said:

She could very well be the next Madonna or Bowie, but she's going to need more than two albums to do it. She's certainly the most interesting pop star that's come along in quite some time.

you don't consider this 3 albums for all intents and purposes? Fame Monster had 2 huge singles (more?) and is her best, imo...

The Fame Monster was just 8 bonus tracks tacked onto the ass of The Fame.

Gaga pushed for it to be a separate release so her fans didn't have to purchase The Fame over again.

Eventually, the Fame and the Fame Monster were both sold separately, together, and in like 394728935 different packages with random shit thrown in.

All in all, "The Fame" era lasted from 2008-2010 and includes both the Fame Ball Tour (small theaters/halls) and the Monster Ball Tour (arenas).

Born This Way Ball Tour will be an arena tour in support of her sophomore album.

Spinlight said:

badujunkie said:

you don't consider this 3 albums for all intents and purposes? Fame Monster had 2 huge singles (more?) and is her best, imo...

The Fame Monster was just 8 bonus tracks tacked onto the ass of The Fame.

Gaga pushed for it to be a separate release so her fans didn't have to purchase The Fame over again.

Eventually, the Fame and the Fame Monster were both sold separately, together, and in like 394728935 different packages with random shit thrown in.

All in all, "The Fame" era lasted from 2008-2010 and includes both the Fame Ball Tour (small theaters/halls) and the Monster Ball Tour (arenas).

Born This Way Ball Tour will be an arena tour in support of her sophomore album.

i humbly and respectfully disagree with both of you gentlemen

madonna's first record only had 8 songs

thriller only had 9...

it's an album. TFM was her sophomore release. there was no gap in singles between M's debut and LAV either. it's a very similar pattern of the first two releases....while "The Fame" gets all the recognition as her blockbuster, it was truly the same slow burner in the beginning that Off the Wall, Madonna, Jagged Little Pill, Writings on the Wall, etc were/are...it gradually spun off hit after hit but it's The Fame Monster that was her true zenith and that defines her as the megastar she became, with the video for "bad romance" being her entrance to the Big House as Mega Icon...

...i think TFM is an album

I think the days of artists having super-lengthy (30 years+) careers are over.These days,you're lucky if you can last 10 years.Gaga could prove me wrong,but I don't think it's likely.The music business is not what it used to be.

badujunkie said:

Spinlight said:

The Fame Monster was just 8 bonus tracks tacked onto the ass of The Fame.

Gaga pushed for it to be a separate release so her fans didn't have to purchase The Fame over again.

Eventually, the Fame and the Fame Monster were both sold separately, together, and in like 394728935 different packages with random shit thrown in.

All in all, "The Fame" era lasted from 2008-2010 and includes both the Fame Ball Tour (small theaters/halls) and the Monster Ball Tour (arenas).

Born This Way Ball Tour will be an arena tour in support of her sophomore album.

i humbly and respectfully disagree with both of you gentlemen

madonna's first record only had 8 songs

thriller only had 9...

it's an album. TFM was her sophomore release. there was no gap in singles between M's debut and LAV either. it's a very similar pattern of the first two releases....while "The Fame" gets all the recognition as her blockbuster, it was truly the same slow burner in the beginning that Off the Wall, Madonna, Jagged Little Pill, Writings on the Wall, etc were/are...it gradually spun off hit after hit but it's The Fame Monster that was her true zenith and that defines her as the megastar she became, with the video for "bad romance" being her entrance to the Big House as Mega Icon...

...i think TFM is an album

I'm telling you how it was marketed and how it's been treated by Gaga. I've been a Gaga stan since her arrival, so I know all of this stupid data (that is probably robbing my mind of valuable real estate).

You can surely consider it a 2nd album if you'd like, but that's not how it is catalogued by Gaga or her record label. Originally, it wasn't even going to get its own release and had "Bad Romance" not been such a humongous success, it likely wouldn't have.

Also, we can't really compare album lengths from 30 years ago to today.

The Time's albums had 6 songs a piece. Yikes. That's a remix maxi nowadays. There were more tracks on a cassingle!

badujunkie said:

Spinlight said:

The Fame Monster was just 8 bonus tracks tacked onto the ass of The Fame.

Gaga pushed for it to be a separate release so her fans didn't have to purchase The Fame over again.

Eventually, the Fame and the Fame Monster were both sold separately, together, and in like 394728935 different packages with random shit thrown in.

All in all, "The Fame" era lasted from 2008-2010 and includes both the Fame Ball Tour (small theaters/halls) and the Monster Ball Tour (arenas).

Born This Way Ball Tour will be an arena tour in support of her sophomore album.

i humbly and respectfully disagree with both of you gentlemen

madonna's first record only had 8 songs

thriller only had 9...

it's an album. TFM was her sophomore release. there was no gap in singles between M's debut and LAV either. it's a very similar pattern of the first two releases....while "The Fame" gets all the recognition as her blockbuster, it was truly the same slow burner in the beginning that Off the Wall, Madonna, Jagged Little Pill, Writings on the Wall, etc were/are...it gradually spun off hit after hit but it's The Fame Monster that was her true zenith and that defines her as the megastar she became, with the video for "bad romance" being her entrance to the Big House as Mega Icon...

...i think TFM is an album

Except, unlike the albums you cited, TFM was originally defined as an EP which was going to be packaged as a bonus disc on a re-release of The Fame. Gaga negotiated with her label so that it had a separate standalone release (so fans didn't have to buy The Fame twice) and was also packaged with the original album (now titled TFM) so people could buy the two together. On the Billboard 200, only the standalone release counted towards TFM's sales whereas the both sets together were counted towards The Fame's total. In other countries, this was handled differently.

Because of those circumstances, it's a unique issue in music history and I can see the argument for both sides given its history.

Personally, I feel that artistically it was an extension of The Fame rather than a separate project, and so I don't count it as a sophomore album.

[Edited 3/18/12 13:02pm]

SoulAlive said:

I think the days of artists having super-lengthy (30 years+) careers are over.These days,you're lucky if you can last 10 years.Gaga could prove me wrong,but I don't think it's likely.The music business is not what it used to be.

she already seems to know it, she's already pulling the "im not talking anymore" thing...

http://www.dlisted.com/2012/03/18/gaga-told-oprah-shes-through-giving-interviews-wants-kids

i actually have disliked her for a long time because she sort of seemed to be a rip off of EVERY FEMALE ARTIST IVE EVER LOVED from the 80s / 90s - I see Madonna, obviously, but less talked about are her "borrowings" from Tori Amos, Annie Lennox, Janet, Kylie, Cher, Teena, Bjork, Joan Jett, Grace Jones, Alanis, Whitney, Mariah...

but with her extreme attractivenss, her realness about drug use, her killer tunes, "Alejandro," etc, i must say she is pretty fuckin cool, so i hope that her next album and this overseas tour really makes her the next mega pop star that pop music needs so badly...shit i'll take her over Adele or Katy ANY day...

VoicesCarry said:

badujunkie said:

i humbly and respectfully disagree with both of you gentlemen

madonna's first record only had 8 songs

thriller only had 9...

it's an album. TFM was her sophomore release. there was no gap in singles between M's debut and LAV either. it's a very similar pattern of the first two releases....while "The Fame" gets all the recognition as her blockbuster, it was truly the same slow burner in the beginning that Off the Wall, Madonna, Jagged Little Pill, Writings on the Wall, etc were/are...it gradually spun off hit after hit but it's The Fame Monster that was her true zenith and that defines her as the megastar she became, with the video for "bad romance" being her entrance to the Big House as Mega Icon...

...i think TFM is an album

Except, unlike the albums you cited, TFM was originally defined as an EP which was going to be packaged as a bonus disc on a re-release of The Fame. Gaga negotiated with her label so that it had a separate standalone release (so they didn't have to buy The Fame twice) and was also packaged with the original album so people could buy the two together.

Because of those circumstances, it's a unique issue in music history and I can see the argument for both sides given its history.

Personally, I feel that artistically it was an extension of The Fame rather than a separate project, and so I don't count it as a sophomore album.

I totally see your point, maybe because i think it's her best work i think it should stand alone...plus "EP" is just a marketing thing for labels to not pay as much per album sold. Worldwide Underground, for example, is an "EP" though I consider it Erykah's 3rd album (Live does not count because it's the same songs). It's really you say tomato i say tomatoe, but yeah, it could go "both ways" like many things in life

badujunkie said:

VoicesCarry said:

Except, unlike the albums you cited, TFM was originally defined as an EP which was going to be packaged as a bonus disc on a re-release of The Fame. Gaga negotiated with her label so that it had a separate standalone release (so they didn't have to buy The Fame twice) and was also packaged with the original album so people could buy the two together.

Because of those circumstances, it's a unique issue in music history and I can see the argument for both sides given its history.

Personally, I feel that artistically it was an extension of The Fame rather than a separate project, and so I don't count it as a sophomore album.

I totally see your point, maybe because i think it's her best work i think it should stand alone...plus "EP" is just a marketing thing for labels to not pay as much per album sold. Worldwide Underground, for example, is an "EP" though I consider it Erykah's 3rd album (Live does not count because it's the same songs). It's really you say tomato i say tomatoe, but yeah, it could go "both ways" like many things in life

I think the general public - casual music listeners and people who do not follow charts - probably sees BTW as a sophomore album simply because TF and TFM were very much intertwined in terms of promotion and seemed like one era unless you were looking closely.

badujunkie said:

SoulAlive said:

I think the days of artists having super-lengthy (30 years+) careers are over.These days,you're lucky if you can last 10 years.Gaga could prove me wrong,but I don't think it's likely.The music business is not what it used to be.

she already seems to know it, she's already pulling the "im not talking anymore" thing...

http://www.dlisted.com/2012/03/18/gaga-told-oprah-shes-through-giving-interviews-wants-kids

i actually have disliked her for a long time because she sort of seemed to be a rip off of EVERY FEMALE ARTIST IVE EVER LOVED from the 80s / 90s - I see Madonna, obviously, but less talked about are her "borrowings" from Tori Amos, Annie Lennox, Janet, Kylie, Cher, Teena, Bjork, Joan Jett, Grace Jones, Alanis, Whitney, Mariah...

but with her extreme attractivenss, her realness about drug use, her killer tunes, "Alejandro," etc, i must say she is pretty fuckin cool, so i hope that her next album and this overseas tour really makes her the next mega pop star that pop music needs so badly...shit i'll take her over Adele or Katy ANY day...

I think she needs to tone down her look considerably for the next album - pull a True Blue, so to speak.

It seems like she's already been ratcheting things down a notch lately, without completely abandoning her style.

"Just Dance" was actually my jam a couple years ago. I heard it and was like "Who's this?" It was wierd because R&B/Hip Hop radio was playing it.

VoicesCarry said:

badujunkie said:

she already seems to know it, she's already pulling the "im not talking anymore" thing...

http://www.dlisted.com/2012/03/18/gaga-told-oprah-shes-through-giving-interviews-wants-kids

i actually have disliked her for a long time because she sort of seemed to be a rip off of EVERY FEMALE ARTIST IVE EVER LOVED from the 80s / 90s - I see Madonna, obviously, but less talked about are her "borrowings" from Tori Amos, Annie Lennox, Janet, Kylie, Cher, Teena, Bjork, Joan Jett, Grace Jones, Alanis, Whitney, Mariah...

but with her extreme attractivenss, her realness about drug use, her killer tunes, "Alejandro," etc, i must say she is pretty fuckin cool, so i hope that her next album and this overseas tour really makes her the next mega pop star that pop music needs so badly...shit i'll take her over Adele or Katy ANY day...

I think she needs to tone down her look considerably for the next album - pull a True Blue, so to speak.

It seems like she's already been ratcheting things down a notch lately, without completely abandoning her style.

I don't know if she can do that though - she's not 'pretty' how Madonna was/still can be when she's trying.

But she is fucking hot so...maybe if she would do the brunette thing it would make her look less severe.

badujunkie said:

VoicesCarry said:

I think she needs to tone down her look considerably for the next album - pull a True Blue, so to speak.

It seems like she's already been ratcheting things down a notch lately, without completely abandoning her style.

I don't know if she can do that though - she's not 'pretty' how Madonna was/still can be when she's trying.

But she is fucking hot so...maybe if she would do the brunette thing it would make her look less severe.

Gaga is not a pretty girl She can't work "pretty" in the way that Madonna could in her heyday. I think it's one of the reasons why she's taken to these outrageous getups - they distract from her looks.

She really missed a big opportunity to tone it down in the You and I video. That sounded like a Shania Twain song (no wonder, it was produced by Mutt Lange) and it should have been a very simple video with her in jeans and a t-shirt.

But nooooooo, she had to go and dress in drag and as a mermaid. Talk about missing the point of a stripped-down song!

VoicesCarry said:

badujunkie said:

I don't know if she can do that though - she's not 'pretty' how Madonna was/still can be when she's trying.

But she is fucking hot so...maybe if she would do the brunette thing it would make her look less severe.

Gaga is not a pretty girl She can't work "pretty" in the way that Madonna could in her heyday. I think it's one of the reasons why she's taken to these outrageous getups - they distract from her looks.

She really missed a big opportunity to tone it down in the You and I video. That sounded like a Shania Twain song (no wonder, it was produced by Mutt Lange) and it should have been a very simple video with her in jeans and a t-shirt.

But nooooooo, she had to go and dress in drag and as a mermaid. Talk about missing the point of a stripped-down song!

I think that would be the most outrageous thing she could do next! show up at a pub in london or new york, flip flops, tank top, jeans, brown hair, acoustic guitar and just perform a set...

Shes not done, shes preparing for the Born This Way Ball Tour. she has only just begun.

Stateside, she's taking a break. She's started the BTW Foundation and has begun plans on the BTW Ball for overseas. She supposedly will be coming back to the states for the BTW Ball next year, I would imagine, if not toward the end of 2012.

this is about the only song of hers I can listen to all the way through, lol

SoulAlive said:

I think the days of artists having super-lengthy (30 years+) careers are over.These days,you're lucky if you can last 10 years.Gaga could prove me wrong,but I don't think it's likely.The music business is not what it used to be.

exactly, that's what I'm trying to say to many people....

xLiberiangirl said:

SoulAlive said:

I think the days of artists having super-lengthy (30 years+) careers are over.These days,you're lucky if you can last 10 years.Gaga could prove me wrong,but I don't think it's likely.The music business is not what it used to be.

exactly, that's what I'm trying to say to many people....

why do you think that is though?

dm3857 said:

xLiberiangirl said:

exactly, that's what I'm trying to say to many people....

why do you think that is though?

These days,it's just harder to hold the public's attention.Fans are extremely fickle.Back in the day,there was a such thing as "fan loyalty".Nowadays,people move on very quickly.I honestly don't think that any of these newer artists will have the same longevity that Prince,Madonna and Michael had.

SoulAlive said:

dm3857 said:

why do you think that is though?

These days,it's just harder to hold the public's attention.Fans are extremely fickle.Back in the day,there was a such thing as "fan loyalty".Nowadays,people move on very quickly.I honestly don't think that any of these newer artists will have the same longevity that Prince,Madonna and Michael had.

True, also... a lot of things are said and done before.. nothing is really shocking and/or new anymore. Most people come up with things that is already been done... hard to hold public's attention... back in the day a lot things were really new, and more exciting.

When you make microwavable music of course you aren't going to have longevity.

And pop music fans are more fickle than anyone else.

Hey but you never know.......

Not to long ago people said Mariah was through and then she released a HUGER THEN HUGE single and it was over from there. Yes before you all attack me i know Mariah was around longer, but my point is she could come with a huge single out of nowhere and dominate the charts. You never know...

Gunsnhalen said:

Hey but you never know.......

Not to long ago people said Mariah was through and then she released a HUGER THEN HUGE single and it was over from there. Yes before you all attack me i know Mariah was around longer, but my point is she could come with a huge single out of nowhere and dominate the charts. You never know...

but the term OVER to me means you dont record anymore, not anything to do with Chart Success, we can say her "honeymoon" period is long over (mariah that is) but she has a solid base of fans, is she gonna top charts, possibly, but she aint going sell millions of albums anymore, thats OVER, and its over for most, lets be real on that. Bruce Springsteen just debuted at number with 195,000 albums, that album probably when all is said and done, wont pass 600, 700 thousand overall, so is Bruce "OVER" i mean really we have to be able to seperate OVER and just not recording anymore.

As for Mariah, i dont doubt her having a hit single up her sleeve, she is smarter than most give her credit for, and she is also about 11 years younger than Madonna, that is Huge, plus Mariah still has a pretty good radio support, madonna really doesnt, especially with this album, you most likely arent gonna see a radio hit from Madonna for the most part, is gonna be all about the full album, as it should be at this point for her, she isnt rihanna or katy perry, deal with it