Cause some of their stuff, like "Prototype" fits the bill

No.

Smooth Criminal, educate ne-why not?

scriptgirl said:

Smooth Criminal, educate ne-why not?

They are definitely hip-hop...if you wanna get nit-picky, say alternative hip-hop, but I'd never call them neo-soul. I think more D'Angelo/Badu type cats for neo-soul.

Nah. I call them alternative hip-hoppers though in the beginning they were more in the grain of the Southern rap style that UGK, Geto Boyz and them pioneered at first.

I need a new Andre album...... that is all!!!!

Hey script (waves)...

I'm another NO vote here. Outkast represents an offshoot of rap that tends to avoid all the stereotypes of rap at whatever given time, but yet are still firmly w/in that genre. In that sense they remind me of the old school groups like De La Soul or a Tribe Called Quest. While everybody knew they were "different", nobody considered them so different as to be RnB (which to my mind is primarily about singing).

IMHO, Mos Def might comes closest to RnB of all the "different" rappers, if you feel what I'm sayin'.

Who cares? Is putting a label on everything so important?

TheDigitalGardener said:

Who cares? Is putting a label on everything so important?

It shouldn't matter, but it does. How it's labeled has a great effect on if it's played and where. Frankly it's the merging of the rap/hip hop w/ RnB genres that has helped kill off RnB, so I understand trying to figure out where something lies on the spectrum seeing as how the spectrum has so dramatically changed.

[Edited 2/24/12 4:14am]

Not.

Hell no. And THAT is a good thing.

silverchild said:

Hell no. What is neo-soul anyways? There's no such thing.

A shitty ass term made by music "critics".

Timmy84 said:

silverchild said:

Hell no. What is neo-soul anyways? There's no such thing.

New artists making soul.

smoothcriminal12 said:

silverchild said:

Hell no. What is neo-soul anyways? There's no such thing.

New artists making soul.

No. No. NO.

That term like I said was made up.

Timmy84 said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

New artists making soul.

No. No. NO.

That term like I said was made up.

Hey, I don't like it either, but what can you do?

Guys, if you think about it, all the words used to categorized music are

"made up." One of the problems neo-soul musicians had with the term "neo-

soul" is that they did not consider the music they were making to be a new

expression of anything other than regular "soul" music. They were claiming

that Urban Hang Suite was a normal extension of Hot Buttered Soul and

not a fad or trend.

I don't get hung up on categories anymore because that is simply how

humans relate to each other via language. In short, get over it!

The term is perfect for marketing, expressing and communicating an updated

and distinct style and sound of soul music.

Otherwise, yes, I could consider OutKast as a neo-soul group simply because

they were (1) soulful, (2) involved in pushing the boundaries of hip hop,

(3) hip hop is black (and therefore, soul music) therefore, OutKast was (4) involved

in creating a music that was an expression of an updated, distinct style and

sound of soul music.

duccichucka said:

silverchild said:

duccichucka said:

Guys, if you think about it, all the words used to categorized music are

"made up." One of the problems neo-soul musicians had with the term "neo-

soul" is that they did not consider the music they were making to be a new

expression of anything other than regular "soul" music. They were claiming

that Urban Hang Suite was a normal extension of Hot Buttered Soul and

not a fad or trend.

I don't get hung up on categories anymore because that is simply how

humans relate to each other via language. In short, get over it!

The term is perfect for marketing, expressing and communicating an updated

and distinct style and sound of soul music.

Otherwise, yes, I could consider OutKast as a neo-soul group simply because

they were (1) soulful, (2) involved in pushing the boundaries of hip hop,

(3) hip hop is black (and therefore, soul music) therefore, OutKast was (4) involved

in creating a music that was an expression of an updated, distinct style and

sound of soul music.

[img:$uid]http://ohellnawlblog.com/newohnblog/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/ani_wtf_cube.gif[/img:$uid]

duccichucka said:

Guys, if you think about it, all the words used to categorized music are

"made up." One of the problems neo-soul musicians had with the term "neo-

soul" is that they did not consider the music they were making to be a new

expression of anything other than regular "soul" music. They were claiming

that Urban Hang Suite was a normal extension of Hot Buttered Soul and

not a fad or trend.

I don't get hung up on categories anymore because that is simply how

humans relate to each other via language. In short, get over it!

The term is perfect for marketing, expressing and communicating an updated

and distinct style and sound of soul music.

Otherwise, yes, I could consider OutKast as a neo-soul group simply because

they were (1) soulful, (2) involved in pushing the boundaries of hip hop,

(3) hip hop is black (and therefore, soul music) therefore, OutKast was (4) involved

in creating a music that was an expression of an updated, distinct style and

sound of soul music.

Why do i see you bring race into every so much

Why can't music be music... without all that shit

Timmy84 said:

Nah. I call them alternative hip-hoppers though in the beginning they were more in the grain of the Southern rap style that UGK, Geto Boyz and them pioneered at first.

I agree because I first got into them with Player's Ball.

They were shouting out the players and hustlers with that one.

all the playas came from far and wide, wearin afros and braids, kickin them gangsta rides........

silverchild said:

duccichucka said:

Guys, if you think about it, all the words used to categorized music are

"made up." One of the problems neo-soul musicians had with the term "neo-

soul" is that they did not consider the music they were making to be a new

expression of anything other than regular "soul" music. They were claiming

that Urban Hang Suite was a normal extension of Hot Buttered Soul and

not a fad or trend.

I don't get hung up on categories anymore because that is simply how

humans relate to each other via language. In short, get over it!

The term is perfect for marketing, expressing and communicating an updated

and distinct style and sound of soul music.

Otherwise, yes, I could consider OutKast as a neo-soul group simply because

they were (1) soulful, (2) involved in pushing the boundaries of hip hop,

(3) hip hop is black (and therefore, soul music) therefore, OutKast was (4) involved

in creating a music that was an expression of an updated, distinct style and

sound of soul music.

[img:$uid]http://ohellnawlblog.com/newohnblog/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/ani_wtf_cube.gif[/img:$uid]

I JUST SCREAMED!!!!!!!! jkgjklsgfkjlsfkjgs YOU ______ !!!

silverchild said:

Hell no. What is neo-soul anyways? There's no such thing.

Notice that I called it RnB and not "neo-soul"?! That term was a strange re-branding of what had been known as RnB. I never understood why they felt the need to rebrand it.

I think the term "neo soul" was pushed by Kedar Massenburg in the late 90's by his label.

Per Wikipedia:

Kedar Massenburg is an American record producer and record label executive, who was the president of Motown Records from 1997 to 2004. Massenburg is the current president and CEO of Kedar Entertainment.^[1] Massenburg is best known for bringing Erykah Badu to fame, and for coining the term "neo soul" to describe Badu's sound and that of several like-minded artists.

The article continues:

Massenburg wanted to start a genre that in no way ignored or minimized the influence of hip-hop and of other electronics-influenced musical styles. Massenburg was quoted in an interview on Kedar Entertainment's World Wide Web homepage, " I am committed to signing and grooming the careers of artists who reflect a return to performing, writing, and live instrumentation."^[2] Massenburg even coined a new genre name, "neo-classic soul," to describe the music that was taking shape under his influence and blew up the industry with a new musical genre that made everyone check out the evolution of R&B.^[1][2]

There have you...marketing to the fullest.

[Edited 2/24/12 23:26pm]

silverchild said:

duccichucka said:

Guys, if you think about it, all the words used to categorized music are

"made up." One of the problems neo-soul musicians had with the term "neo-

soul" is that they did not consider the music they were making to be a new

expression of anything other than regular "soul" music. They were claiming

that Urban Hang Suite was a normal extension of Hot Buttered Soul and

not a fad or trend.

I don't get hung up on categories anymore because that is simply how

humans relate to each other via language. In short, get over it!

The term is perfect for marketing, expressing and communicating an updated

and distinct style and sound of soul music.

Otherwise, yes, I could consider OutKast as a neo-soul group simply because

they were (1) soulful, (2) involved in pushing the boundaries of hip hop,

(3) hip hop is black (and therefore, soul music) therefore, OutKast was (4) involved

in creating a music that was an expression of an updated, distinct style and

sound of soul music.

[img:$uid]http://ohellnawlblog.com/newohnblog/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/ani_wtf_cube.gif[/img:$uid]

This is funny (!) but why I expected someone to engage in a serious conversation about

music here without gifs or emoticons and thinking outside the box, was beyond me.

Gunsnhalen said:

duccichucka said:

Guys, if you think about it, all the words used to categorized music are

"made up." One of the problems neo-soul musicians had with the term "neo-

soul" is that they did not consider the music they were making to be a new

expression of anything other than regular "soul" music. They were claiming

that Urban Hang Suite was a normal extension of Hot Buttered Soul and

not a fad or trend.

I don't get hung up on categories anymore because that is simply how

humans relate to each other via language. In short, get over it!

The term is perfect for marketing, expressing and communicating an updated

and distinct style and sound of soul music.

Otherwise, yes, I could consider OutKast as a neo-soul group simply because

they were (1) soulful, (2) involved in pushing the boundaries of hip hop,

(3) hip hop is black (and therefore, soul music) therefore, OutKast was (4) involved

in creating a music that was an expression of an updated, distinct style and

sound of soul music.

Why do i see you bring race into every so much

Why can't music be music... without all that shit

Do you have any examples of me bringing race into all of my discussions on music

in discussions where race is not the topic? Because if I do bring race up, it's simply

because the topic is centered on race!

I am a little perturbed at the amount of insight that posters in this forum seem to

lack - where are all the thinkers at?

People are complaining about the term neo-soul; but neo-soul is a term coined by

a Black American, unlike other terms used to describe musical art forms created

by Black Americans. It was not a Black person who camed up with the terms "R&B,"

"Soul," "Rock n Roll," to describe these genres of Black American music.

So it was a marketing term. Fine. But words are not static; they are living abstracts that

change as society changes. Now the word soul music can be used to identify with any

type of music created by Black Americans. A lot also depends upon how you use the

word "soul music." (anybody here read Wittgenstein?)

If you ding dongs can't think outside the box with me on this one, that OutKast's brand

of hip hop was soulful and soul music, and that their music was grounded in an

aesthetic similar to those of the classic 70s soul artists; that Black American music is always

going to be "soul" music, including hip hop; and that OutKast's musical output was a

new interpretation of old hip hop soul music, and that you are to be so rigid about how you appropriate a term such as "neo-soul" to OutKast, knock yerself out.

And for those of you who claim "why can't music just be music?" I ask "why can't you

just be "dude" and not go by your given name?" Words are how we categorize and

communicate our reality - get over it. There is another reason why I believe in

using categories to describe Black American music but that's another diatribe on another

day.

OutKast is new soul music = OutKast is neo-soul

Neo-Soul:

{or insert big ass, retarded gif here in the stead of a well thought out response}

Neo....NOT!

Graycap23 said:

Neo....NOT!

Why?

LOL - y'all are funny! You see OutKast and instantly think "hip hop" and see "neo-soul" and

immediately think D'Angelo, Lauryn Hill or a Raheem Devaughn or Jon B. (who all use elements

of hip hop in their production values, by the way) but have a problem associating a hip hop

based group with the word neo-soul? Why? I'll tell you why:

The only reason why you're saying "NOT" here is because you've been conditioned to think

two things:

1. Neo soul is not hip hop

2. OutKast is strictly hip hop

But both things are not absolutes. You guys are saying "OutKast can't be considered

neo-soul because they are a hip hop group." But none of you have been able to articulate

what hip hop is, what neo-soul is and why OutKast isn't able to be considered neo-soul.

Some of you are saying "Neo Soul doesn't even exist!" That is funny too....Is it possible

that OutKast, who started out as a hip hop duo, could have incorporated neo-soul aesthetics

and production values into their music as they progressed as musicians?

The answers is yes.

In fact, name a putative neo-soul artist who doesn't use hip hop production values!

Once again, I'm being met with goofy emoticons and gifs and no one has the

wherewithal for articulated discourse. Fine with me!

"NO! OUTKAST IS HIP HOP! NEO SOUL DOESNT EXIST! IT'S A MADE UP TERM!"