sosgemini said:

prodigalfan said:

Not always the case. I recently took care of a young man who died of AIDS, his diagnosis to death time was like 7 years. He was a college graduate from a highly respected HBC and was receiving proper treatment. Unfortunately his strain of HIV was very aggressive. Like any other virus (like the flu) there are different strains (types) of HIV. Some more aggressive than others.

Wouldn't that be considered the exception though now and not the rule? People's comment's toward Jackson appear to be fueled by stereotypes and not reality as we know it. IMHO.

yeah, to be fair, I was pretty surprised that he had such a short run with his illness.

And about Freddie.... I am more inclined to think gastric bypass as well. Simply because he was obese and lost a lot of weight quickly.

You do lose a lot of weight with AIDS, but by then you have been in and out of the hospital so many times that it is not a surprise to hear the diagnosis. That rapid weight loss is sort like the end of the illness when you immunity system is completely broken down so you get more than just weight loss, you get pneumonia, dehydration from severe diarrhea etc.

It amazes me that this thread has become about weight and how Freddie doesn't "look" healthy.

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

Freddie co-wrote a lot of his music. I wonder did he sign away his publishing rights?

Also, no one mentioned about the sing offs he and Luther used to have at Sylvia's in Harlem. I've read several articles and stories that say that Freddie and Luther would be in Sylvia's for long hours hanging out, eating and singing. I think that would have been cool to include in the episode because they were always thought to be arch nemisis, but they were really good friends.

daPrettyman said:

It amazes me that this thread has become about weight and how Freddie doesn't "look" healthy.

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

Freddie co-wrote a lot of his music. I wonder did he sign away his publishing rights?

Also, no one mentioned about the sing offs he and Luther used to have at Sylvia's in Harlem. I've read several articles and stories that say that Freddie and Luther would be in Sylvia's for long hours hanging out, eating and singing. I think that would have been cool to include in the episode because they were always thought to be arch nemisis, but they were really good friends.

ummm...never knew that

daPrettyman said:

It amazes me that this thread has become about weight and how Freddie doesn't "look" healthy.

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

Freddie co-wrote a lot of his music. I wonder did he sign away his publishing rights?

Also, no one mentioned about the sing offs he and Luther used to have at Sylvia's in Harlem. I've read several articles and stories that say that Freddie and Luther would be in Sylvia's for long hours hanging out, eating and singing. I think that would have been cool to include in the episode because they were always thought to be arch nemisis, but they were really good friends.

Well this diminish a lot of rumors that the two '80s R&B titans didn't get along. But hell I knew Freddie and Lutehr respected each other going back in the '80s, Freddie let it be known that he looked up to Luther.

HuMpThAnG said:

daPrettyman said:

It amazes me that this thread has become about weight and how Freddie doesn't "look" healthy.

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

Freddie co-wrote a lot of his music. I wonder did he sign away his publishing rights?

Also, no one mentioned about the sing offs he and Luther used to have at Sylvia's in Harlem. I've read several articles and stories that say that Freddie and Luther would be in Sylvia's for long hours hanging out, eating and singing. I think that would have been cool to include in the episode because they were always thought to be arch nemisis, but they were really good friends.

ummm...never knew that

that would be something to see/hear

Timmy84 said:

daPrettyman said:

It amazes me that this thread has become about weight and how Freddie doesn't "look" healthy.

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

Freddie co-wrote a lot of his music. I wonder did he sign away his publishing rights?

Also, no one mentioned about the sing offs he and Luther used to have at Sylvia's in Harlem. I've read several articles and stories that say that Freddie and Luther would be in Sylvia's for long hours hanging out, eating and singing. I think that would have been cool to include in the episode because they were always thought to be arch nemisis, but they were really good friends.

Well this diminish a lot of rumors that the two '80s R&B titans didn't get along. But hell I knew Freddie and Lutehr respected each other going back in the '80s, Freddie let it be known that he looked up to Luther.

^^^^^^That's good to know but I wish he mentioned Luther's name and let it be known there was no rivalry between the two.

1sotrue said:

Timmy84 said:

Well this diminish a lot of rumors that the two '80s R&B titans didn't get along. But hell I knew Freddie and Lutehr respected each other going back in the '80s, Freddie let it be known that he looked up to Luther.

^^^^^^That's good to know but I wish he mentioned Luther's name and let it be known there was no rivalry between the two.

Knowing Unsung, they left that part out.

Now that Freddie's got all y'all's attention, this would've been the perfect time for him to relaunch his last CD. Did he buy ad time during 'Unsung'?

[Edited 1/24/12 21:22pm]

sosgemini said:

prodigalfan said:

Not always the case. I recently took care of a young man who died of AIDS, his diagnosis to death time was like 7 years. He was a college graduate from a highly respected HBC and was receiving proper treatment. Unfortunately his strain of HIV was very aggressive. Like any other virus (like the flu) there are different strains (types) of HIV. Some more aggressive than others.

Wouldn't that be considered the exception though now and not the rule? People's comment's toward Jackson appear to be fueled by stereotypes and not reality as we know it. IMHO.

EXCELLENT point, sosgemini, about stereotypes and not reality---and I think it's offensive to make assumptions about a person because of their appearance. How hurtful it must be for someone to read comments like that...no matter what they may SAY about how they're not bothered.

Maybe it really is as simple as Freddy learning from Luther and not wanting to end up the same way. Also, when people lose a lot of weight, especially at an older age, their skin tends to not bounce back so easily and is looser, contributing to rumors of ill health.

daPrettyman said:

It amazes me that this thread has become about weight and how Freddie doesn't "look" healthy.

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

Freddie co-wrote a lot of his music. I wonder did he sign away his publishing rights?

Also, no one mentioned about the sing offs he and Luther used to have at Sylvia's in Harlem. I've read several articles and stories that say that Freddie and Luther would be in Sylvia's for long hours hanging out, eating and singing. I think that would have been cool to include in the episode because they were always thought to be arch nemisis, but they were really good friends.

Unfortunately, that happened to a lot of artists back in the day. Seems to be disproportionatly black artists. The thing that surprised me is how they were talking about how Hush Productions was so huge. And it was mostly because of Freddie bacause the only other two artists that I can think of who were doing well on that roster were Melba and Meli'sa, and that was only on the R&B charts. So that's really fucked up how they did him.

Okay, if there was ever any doubt in my mind whether or not Freddie was one of "the kids", Unsung confirmed that he DEFINATELY is! When they showed a clip of that video he filmed in the early 80's with that group, he was dancing like Sylvester!!! I guess when he signed to Capital, Melba and Charles probably told him he was going to have to butch things up a little because I noticed when they were showing some of his early solo performances, he was being careful with his mannerisms. But, it seemed like the performances they showed from the 90's, that flame started to reappear.

I was always a very casual Freddie fan so it was interesting to see this and learn what I did about him. Also never realized he surpassed Luther's success in the 80's.

daPrettyman said:

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

I guess, like most others, the excitement gets in the way. The idea of "finally making it" enters the brain and poisons it without having the contract looked at by an attorney first. Or some artists could be taking the advice of their management and saying "take the deal fool, what you waiting on???!!!" Most people don't know that they have the option and a right to wait a day or two to have a contract looked over by a 3rd party before deciding to put their John Hancock on it.

kitbradley said:

daPrettyman said:

It amazes me that this thread has become about weight and how Freddie doesn't "look" healthy.

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

Freddie co-wrote a lot of his music. I wonder did he sign away his publishing rights?

Also, no one mentioned about the sing offs he and Luther used to have at Sylvia's in Harlem. I've read several articles and stories that say that Freddie and Luther would be in Sylvia's for long hours hanging out, eating and singing. I think that would have been cool to include in the episode because they were always thought to be arch nemisis, but they were really good friends.

Unfortunately, that happened to a lot of artists back in the day. Seems to be disproportionatly black artists. The thing that surprised me is how they were talking about how Hush Productions was so huge. And it was mostly because of Freddie bacause the only other two artists that I can think of who were doing well on that roster were Melba and Meli'sa, and that was only on the R&B charts. So that's really fucked up how they did him.

I agree with you. Hush was pretty big in the r&b world, though. Freddie was the big dog, but Lillo Thomas was pretty hot for a while. His Capitol records catalog did pretty good. His singles performed pretty good also.

Singles

Also, Me'lisa Morgan had some really hot songs that did really well...until she left and went to Elecktra / Pendilum Records.

Another question I had was if Kashif was under contract with Hush as a producer and writer? If he was, that would mean that they could have easily gotten a piece of the money from his big productions for Whitney and others.

Check out this site that I just found. It has a brief history of Hush Productions and Orpheus Entertainment. Just looking at artists and productsions done under the moniker of Hush, tells me that they really were making big bucks.

http://hushorpheusproduct...gspot.com/

missfee said:

daPrettyman said:

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

I guess, like most others, the excitement gets in the way. The idea of "finally making it" enters the brain and poisons it without having the contract looked at by an attorney first. Or some artists could be taking the advice of their management and saying "take the deal fool, what you waiting on???!!!" Most people don't know that they have the option and a right to wait a day or two to have a contract looked over by a 3rd party before deciding to put their John Hancock on it.

the rule of thumb should always be 4 any artist that gets a contract, have your own lawyer 2 look it over. the contracts come down from the record companies lawyer hence they will be looking at the best interest 4 the RC and not the artist.

kitbradley said:

Okay, if there was ever any doubt in my mind whether or not Freddie was one of "the kids", Unsung confirmed that he DEFINATELY is! When they showed a clip of that video he filmed in the early 80's with that group, he was dancing like Sylvester!!! I guess when he signed to Capital, Melba and Charles probably told him he was going to have to butch things up a little because I noticed when they were showing some of his early solo performances, he was being careful with his mannerisms. But, it seemed like the performances they showed from the 90's, that flame started to reappear.

I was always a very casual Freddie fan so it was interesting to see this and learn what I did about him. Also never realized he surpassed Luther's success in the 80's.

You may be right.

I saw Freddie live in about 92 or 93 (when his RCA album came out) and he was very effiminent. He talked about "loving your woman," but he never really seemed like he was comfortable with the women on stage.

He did give a great show, though.

You guys should check out his live dvd he did for BET Jazz.

daPrettyman said:

kitbradley said:

Okay, if there was ever any doubt in my mind whether or not Freddie was one of "the kids", Unsung confirmed that he DEFINATELY is! When they showed a clip of that video he filmed in the early 80's with that group, he was dancing like Sylvester!!! I guess when he signed to Capital, Melba and Charles probably told him he was going to have to butch things up a little because I noticed when they were showing some of his early solo performances, he was being careful with his mannerisms. But, it seemed like the performances they showed from the 90's, that flame started to reappear.

I was always a very casual Freddie fan so it was interesting to see this and learn what I did about him. Also never realized he surpassed Luther's success in the 80's.

You may be right.

I saw Freddie live in about 92 or 93 (when his RCA album came out) and he was very effiminent. He talked about "loving your woman," but he never really seemed like he was comfortable with the women on stage.

He did give a great show, though.

You guys should check out his live dvd he did for BET Jazz.

Tee-hee!!!!

NewPowerSista said:

Timmy84 said:

I'm kinda under the impression that most of these Unsungs especially from the first season on ain't as much about "unsung" than about telling the stories of artists whose lives we've known little about and could also be used as promotion for their latest projects much like Behind the Music has done. Just my thoughts.

I agree with you on that Timmy84. Many are not "unsung" but I do enjoy seeing stories about them that I knew nothing about. They are always interesting to me!

Trying not to overreach, but I think Luther's brilliance is what ended up defining Freddie as Unsung. And the Hush material sounds very much alike and seems to diminish the number of hits in many of our perceptions. Hearing him bust out with some impromtu runs shows how beautiful his voice is.

He speaks as if he is broke. With all of those hits this is crazy. 31 shows in Japan in three weeks? He should be set for life.

I appreciate that he does not even take on a tone of denial about his sexuality to the extent that I feel he owns it publicly more by his conduct than by a silly single word response. But he does by chance answer the question when he is talking to his audience in concert late in the episode - Y'all get up, "let me see them outfits." They are always interesting to me! It would be nice to go out to lunch and bloody marys with him.

mjscarousal said:

His so underrated.... MY GOD I WISH I HAD THIS CHANNELL!!!! UGH

But you are watching some of there programing on line, right?

http://tvone.tv/unsung-vi...&cat=1

daPrettyman said:

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

He adressed that issue in the ep and explained that he trusted his manager,

with as example the phrase "Whatever you say boss, whatever you think is ok."

daPrettyman said:

Check out this site that I just found. It has a brief history of Hush Productions and Orpheus Entertainment. Just looking at artists and productsions done under the moniker of Hush, tells me that they really were making big bucks.

http://hushorpheusproduct...gspot.com/

Great find, thanks for sharing. Turns out I have several of the CD's from their catalog, but was never much aware of Hush Productions before this thread.

Shango said:

daPrettyman said:

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

He adressed that issue in the ep and explained that he trusted his manager,

with as example the phrase "Whatever you say boss, whatever you think is ok."

Yeah that pretty much said it to me. He trusted anybody that was handling his financial business. Once he realized dude was ripping him off, he let him go.

I had no idea Hush Productions was that big! Wow... Charles and Beau Huggins knew what was up... wasn't Melba like their first Hush artist?

Shango said:

daPrettyman said:

I enjoyed the show, but still found myself asking even more questions. My biggest question was "why didn't he read over his contract before signing it?" That still puzzles me. Even after he found out about his financial problems, he still continues to work with these people. I just found that quite odd.

He adressed that issue in the ep and explained that he trusted his manager,

with as example the phrase "Whatever you say boss, whatever you think is ok."

Yeah, I saw that, but I'm sure there had to be signs that things weren't right before. Sounds like he was just looking at what was in front of him and not thinking about his long term pay check. It's sad that so many performers get used like that.

daPrettyman said:

Shango said:

He adressed that issue in the ep and explained that he trusted his manager,

with as example the phrase "Whatever you say boss, whatever you think is ok."

Yeah, I saw that, but I'm sure there had to be signs that things weren't right before. Sounds like he was just looking at what was in front of him and not thinking about his long term pay check. It's sad that so many performers get used like that.

Most artists come into the business with dreams of fame. They never think about the money. Some say they do but some don't really check into it because even if you can write, sometimes you can even sell those rights away so you won't get a dime. Plus most recording artists who sign a recording contract come from real humble backgrounds and they're influenced by what they're told to by record labels that ended up signing them and, in the case of Motown, put them under a salary.

Timmy84 said:

I had no idea Hush Productions was that big! Wow... Charles and Beau Huggins knew what was up... wasn't Melba like their first Hush artist?

Maybe that's why ole Charlie kicked Melba to the curb the way he did because he got such a big head, he figured he didn't need her any more. But, after Capital Records cut ties with them, didn't things start to go downhill for Hush Productions??? I don't recall them having anywhere near the type of exposure/success they had in the 80s.

I just thought of something. I wonder why Orpheus/Hush didn't try to start owning their master recordings early on? It doesn't seem like they thought their business plan through too well. I know that wasn't done that often in the early 80s, but it was done.

daPrettyman said:

I just thought of something. I wonder why Orpheus/Hush didn't try to start owning their master recordings early on? It doesn't seem like they thought their business plan through too well. I know that wasn't done that often in the early 80s, but it was done.

They probably didn't think it would make profit. Initially, Melba's HUSH Productions records didn't so well when released because her label didn't push those albums and didn't know what direction to take Melba. To me Melba had the kind of voice that resonated as a pop artist but they were trying to push her on the R&B market and while some songs had a good market for her in the R&B genre later on when their productions got hot, they had to use outside producers initially (Van McCoy, Giorgio Moroder, etc.). I think it was after Paul Laurence Jones and Kashif entered the picture in 1981 that the Huggins brothers start to realize that they made a mistake with that, therefore leading to a lot of problems.

What really surprised me was that all the time that Freddie had joined Capitol Records (from 1982 with Mystic Merlin as a start) and even when 3 years later while his single "Rock Me Tonight" was sky-rocketing the charts (which was described in Unsung), the Capitol execs were still clueless and not aware what kind of singer they were representing lol.