Ok, I have been wondering about this for a while and I'm not sure about this so if I'm wrong just let me know.

To me, it seems, that when a black American artist gets really popular they seem to always get accused of being arrogant, full of themselves. I know that this is mainly aimed at artists such as Michael Jackson, Prince, and Kanye West. Yet...I never hear this mentioned when it comes to non-black male American artists. For example, I hear that Madonna is a bitch, but I never hear anyone in the media simply go "Madonna is so full of herself, especially when she did this music video or whatever.

I also never heard of a black female artist be accused of this in particular. I do hear the diva tag getting thrown around some, but I never hear something like "Oh Beyonce is so full of herself."

I guess I could be wrong, but this is what it seems like to me. Not to say that the above artists in my example aren't or are full of themselves, but why do they always get called out on it more than others. Even with John Mayer, no one accuses him of being arrogant, even if they do call him an asshole.

Just curious...

Should I? Nah, I'll leave it.

I do understand what you are saying but...

I do think Madonna has been accused of being a controlling bitch her entire career. (BC she is)

Doesn't EVERYONE think John Mayor is an asshole? (BC he is)

Everyone on the org thinks Beyonce is full of herslef (BC she is)

I've just come to the conclusion that every major artist is full of themselves, they have to be to make it in an industry of constant self promotion.

RKJCNE said:

I do understand what you are saying but...

I do think Madonna has been accused of being a controlling bitch her entire career. (BC she is)

Doesn't EVERYONE think John Mayor is an asshole? (BC he is)

Everyone on the org thinks Beyonce is full of herslef (BC she is)

I've just come to the conclusion that every major artist is full of themselves, they have to be to make it in an industry of constant self promotion.

I get what you are saying and I agree with it. It is that kind of industry. It's cut throat. If you lack the self-confidance you won't make it.

That being said, being known as a controlling bitch and being full of yourself are kinda different I think...

I've heard it said of India.Arie and Jill Scott, but who really knows, right? It's not like I know either one personally to make such an assessment. Could BE though. :-O

RKJCNE said:

I do understand what you are saying but...

I do think Madonna has been accused of being a controlling bitch her entire career. (BC she is)

Doesn't EVERYONE think John Mayor is an asshole? (BC he is)

Everyone on the org thinks Beyonce is full of herslef (BC she is)

I've just come to the conclusion that every major artist is full of themselves, they have to be to make it in an industry of constant self promotion.

As Much as I dislike her music.

I've actually met her.

And she's really quite sweet and very down to earth.

I will say that the people who she surrounds herself with are a bit shady.

I think this happens with more "popular" artists, no matter the race. Especially when they have a few hits under their belts. I know people that know Stevie Wonder and they say he's one of the kindest and generous people you'll ever meet, but he has his way of being a "diva" or whatever you want to call it.

I think once you go outside of the "popular" artists, you start finding more down to earth and not-so-full of themselves type of people. When I was watching the Bio channel's profile on Ray Charles a month or so ago, they mentioned how Ray was one of the richest men in music, but he never made it a point to flaunt it. He used his money for what was necessary and necessarily to impress someone else. I didn't know until I saw his bio that he had a private jet when he got tired of dealing with airports.

Uh artists of ALL RACES are full of themselves.

I just thought of something else also.

Back in the day, it was an accomplishment for a black artist to cross over to the mainstream. However, since the 80s (or there abouts), it's like we, as African Americans, tend to start saying things like "they're a sell out".

I remember hearing people say that about Prince when PR came out (the soundtrack). Especially since 1999 was such a big success on urban radio. 1999 was getting play 24/7 and not just the singles. Radio stations were spinning DMSR, International Lover, Lady Cab Driver, and Automatic without hesitation.

The same was said about MJ, Janet and others. What I loved most about MJ, Janet and Prince was that they never really acknowledged it. They ignored it and kept making great music.

Today's crop of stars don't know how to do that. These fools are constantly bragging about houses, cars, and money, and are not concerned with making meaningful and good music.

Timmy84 said:

Uh artists of ALL RACES are full of themselves.

This may seem like its coming outta left field but this is what hit me when I read the thread title-

"Oh, this is going to be about rap."

Of course it isn't but that's what I thought.

So much of rap is pure braggadocio... who's got the most money, the best rides, the most women, the baddest flow, etc.

I think it's pretty clear that most of the genre is artists who make bank on being full of themselves and they influence so many kids to adopt those values too so that the next generation of popular rappers is larger than the one before and the whole phenomena just keeps growing.

It could be that the rap/hip hop side of black music has spread its reputation to all categories of popular black music.

Just a thought...

I don't follow celebrity gossip much so I don't know which artists don't deserve being lumped in with the idea that "black artists are really full of themselves."

I only know that Kanye won't let you forget that he is cuz he pulls all that shit in public and whines when he doesn't get what he thinks should be his.

WOW........

Man there is so many white artists that are full of themselves and don't think there shit don't stink

Madonna is known to be a controlling bitch, Christina is shown in interviews to be rude, hateful & she even spit gum at one of her fans. Lady GaGa talk's about how she has one of the best voices in the industry and is making the album of the decade, Lilly Allen talk's well do i even need to comment on the shit she say's

John Mayor is a known asshole who think's he is the white Jimi Hendrix. And that is just a few

Artists of every race is full of themselves as said before..... fullness is color blind

Oh and althought i am a huge fan of this guy... HUGE .... we can't forget the biggest full of themselves artists. BONO- The one man who literally think's he is the messiah of music. And you guy's know it's true and i'm saying this as a big U2 Fan

Gunsnhalen said:

Oh and althought i am a huge fan of this guy... HUGE .... we can't forget the biggest full of themselves artists. BONO- The one man who literally think's he is the messiah of music. And you guy's know it's true and i'm saying this as a big U2 Fan

I'm Christ and so is my wife.

Cloudbuster said:

Gunsnhalen said:

Oh and althought i am a huge fan of this guy... HUGE .... we can't forget the biggest full of themselves artists. BONO- The one man who literally think's he is the messiah of music. And you guy's know it's true and i'm saying this as a big U2 Fan

I'm Christ and so is my wife.

Wow, your really stalking my posts today aren't you cloudbuster? i'm flattered

Now why don't you show me the real person behind that avatar

Gunsnhalen said:

Cloudbuster said:

I'm Christ and so is my wife.

Wow, your really stalking my posts today aren't you cloudbuster? i'm flattered

Now why don't you show me the real person behind that avatar

I'd rather you enjoy your week.

sosgemini said:

That too.

Unholyalliance said:

Ok, I have been wondering about this for a while and I'm not sure about this so if I'm wrong just let me know.

To me, it seems, that when a black American artist gets really popular they seem to always get accused of being arrogant, full of themselves. I know that this is mainly aimed at artists such as Michael Jackson, Prince, and Kanye West. Yet...I never hear this mentioned when it comes to non-black male American artists. For example, I hear that Madonna is a bitch, but I never hear anyone in the media simply go "Madonna is so full of herself, especially when she did this music video or whatever.

I also never heard of a black female artist be accused of this in particular. I do hear the diva tag getting thrown around some, but I never hear something like "Oh Beyonce is so full of herself."

I guess I could be wrong, but this is what it seems like to me. Not to say that the above artists in my example aren't or are full of themselves, but why do they always get called out on it more than others. Even with John Mayer, no one accuses him of being arrogant, even if they do call him an asshole.

Just curious...

Well, just in case no one has ever said it, let me be the first to say Beyonce is so totally full of herself.

Acting full of yourself is a good thing if its used to further their music or stage presence. As long as you keep pushing out the good music (Or at least music that sells ) then they have the right to be cocky with people they don't like/on the stage, they earned it. They shouldnt be an asshole about it to the people they work with or friends, but they should use it to their advantage (For rappers, if their clever they can use this aggresiveness to expand their art, though being stupid about it can backfire really easily)

Except with Kanye, hes an example of just complete failure at hanlding his fame and has completely ruined his public image for the time being. I don't care how good of a producer that guy is and I dont mind him being cocky when hes on the mic, hes a total asshole off the mic doing just the stupidist shit (Though I feel all he has to do is stop doing the stupid, and it'll all going away).

Cloudbuster said:

Gunsnhalen said:

Wow, your really stalking my posts today aren't you cloudbuster? i'm flattered

Now why don't you show me the real person behind that avatar

I'd rather you enjoy your week.

ahahahahahh fine

sosgemini said:

Unholyalliance said:

Ok, I have been wondering about this for a while and I'm not sure about this so if I'm wrong just let me know.

To me, it seems, that when a black American artist gets really popular they seem to always get accused of being arrogant, full of themselves. I know that this is mainly aimed at artists such as Michael Jackson, Prince, and Kanye West. Yet...I never hear this mentioned when it comes to non-black male American artists. For example, I hear that Madonna is a bitch, but I never hear anyone in the media simply go "Madonna is so full of herself, especially when she did this music video or whatever.

I also never heard of a black female artist be accused of this in particular. I do hear the diva tag getting thrown around some, but I never hear something like "Oh Beyonce is so full of herself."

I guess I could be wrong, but this is what it seems like to me. Not to say that the above artists in my example aren't or are full of themselves, but why do they always get called out on it more than others. Even with John Mayer, no one accuses him of being arrogant, even if they do call him an asshole.

Just curious...

Anyone can be arrogant, though I understand you are discussing this from the media's view. Those who are not "dominant class" will always be knocked down in the media, whether for the reasons you are saying, or other reasons and that will make headlines. I think it's common/exagerrated with non-whites and women overall. But to be honest, a lot of people who are celebrity, though definitely not all are arrogant or at most,self-absorbed. You have to be self-absorbed to some degree to make it and believe in yourself, so in moderation, that one is okay.

[Edited 9/1/11 17:51pm]

I think that is such a generalization....and an inaccurate one. I think many artists, not just black ones, are REALLY full of themselves, but there are also many, some of whom I've met personally, who are not at all. I do think that sometimes the people who surround them, somewhat necessarily, such as publicity folks, security and such cause people to appear "full of themselves" when they actually aren't.

Hmm...generally speaking, I don't think that I denied anyone being arrogant. Arrogance transcends all genders and races for sure.

I just wonder about media portrayal though. Like, I never hear anyone in the media go "Oh that Steven Tyler is so arrogant." Even with Kanye the first thing they mention is him being arrogant almost before anything else. Maybe that is a bad example, but even though I may not agree with some of things that he does or...say, I appreciate his chutzpah, to say the least. Like I never heard Beyonce sit there and talk about things that she's thinks are wrong. Kanye does. Granted that their demographics are different, but I think that is also reflected in their work as artists. I mean, ultimately, imo, this is what makes his work so much interesting, even if most would consider him to be have a rotten personality.

I could be wrong, but I don't think that I am.

All artists are full of themselves. It has nothing to do with race.

mjscarousal said:

All artists are full of themselves. It has nothing to do with race.

Yep. With the approval of art comes ego. MOST artists are arrogant but some show it less and some hide it until they can't anymore. I remember when people thought John Mayer was humble.

Arrogance makes good art--look at the fucking Sistine Chapel! Michaelangelo just spits ego all over the ceiling.

But, these days, people are arrogant even if they don't do great art. Blame this on our sickly cultural slog.

Let's not forget, blacks have the lowest self esteem of any other group. Arrogance is just a hiding place for the pain.

HermesReborn said:

RKJCNE said:

I do understand what you are saying but...

I do think Madonna has been accused of being a controlling bitch her entire career. (BC she is)

Doesn't EVERYONE think John Mayor is an asshole? (BC he is)

Everyone on the org thinks Beyonce is full of herslef (BC she is)

I've just come to the conclusion that every major artist is full of themselves, they have to be to make it in an industry of constant self promotion.

As Much as I dislike her music.

I've actually met her.

And she's really quite sweet and very down to earth.

I will say that the people who she surrounds herself with are a bit shady.

I'm so jealous! I'm sure she is somewhat down to earth, she's never exactly had a loud personality. But at the same time Beyonce has to be full of herself and a diva to get things done, just watch the 4 documentry.

I think it are mostly artists who rely on image and commercial succes, but lack the artistic skills, who are full of themselves, wether they are black, white or yellow.

[Edited 9/2/11 13:23pm]

[Edited 9/2/11 13:24pm]