chamber said:

Icon? Sure.

Legend? No. HELL YEAH!

Fixed.

NOOOO!!!!...

YESSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Legendary: (def) extremely well known; famous or renowned.

Renowned: (def) having a widespread, esp good, reputation; famous

yeah why not...

I really consider her a legend and icon, and most of all, an inspiration. I love that woman.

Yeah she's a legend and icon!

She might be in one country, but she certainly isn't worldwide.

No I wouldn't. She had her heyday and garnered her success and whatnot, but I don't consider her a legend.

Honestly I don't think we would even be talking about her period if her last name was Johnson, as opposed to Jackson.

[Edited 8/8/11 8:37am]

NaQu said:

No I wouldn't. She had her heyday and garnered her success and whatnot, but I don't consider her a legend. Honestly I don't think we wouldn't even be talking about her period if her last name was Johnson, as opposed to Jackson.

Then wouldnt the rest of her family be famous too? I mean that line gets so old.

This question always tickle me concerning Janet. If you were to take all of her success throughout her entire career, and give it to another artist not named Janet Jackson that artist would still be considered a legend

Musicslave said:

This question always tickle me concerning Janet. If you were to take all of her success throughout her entire career, and give it to another artist not named Janet Jackson that artist would still be considered a legend

Heck If anything she would be MORE successfulf imo! She couldn't go anywhere with being introduced as "Michael Jackson's Sister Janet!".

ThePopLover2 said:

NaQu said:

No I wouldn't. She had her heyday and garnered her success and whatnot, but I don't consider her a legend. Honestly I don't think we wouldn't even be talking about her period if her last name was Johnson, as opposed to Jackson.

Then wouldnt the rest of her family be famous too? I mean that line gets so old.

Yup. It is just a weak argument for people who actually don't have any knowledge about Janet or her music.

EVERY single Jackson tried to make it as a solo star and they all failed apart from two. If anything Janet's surname has made it even harder for her.

I only credit her family (i.e. Joe) for landing her a record deal - If it wasn't for him she would not be singing and performing. But I also think to some extent Michael wouldn't have gone far without his father pushing him. Not because he lacks natural talent, but I think he lacked the confidence and charisma to go for a record deal.

[Edited 8/8/11 9:15am]

Shes as legendary as Huey Lewis and the news and Cyndi Lauper.

NaQu said:

No I wouldn't. She had her heyday and garnered her success and whatnot, but I don't consider her a legend.

Honestly I don't think we would even be talking about her period if her last name was Johnson, as opposed to Jackson.

[Edited 8/8/11 8:37am]

Oh please. That "because she's a Jackson" shit is overused, played, old, and really a non-issue. If her last name was Johnson, and she put out the groundbreaking, iconic album that was 1986's Control, then we would STILL be calling her the way-paving pop legend that she is.

SquirrelMeat said:

Shes as legendary as Huey Lewis and the news and Cyndi Lauper.

Your obvious ignorance is allowing me a good chuckle on this here afternoon.

SEANMAN said:

SquirrelMeat said:

Shes as legendary as Huey Lewis and the news and Cyndi Lauper.

Your obvious ignorance is allowing me a good chuckle on this here afternoon.

How is that ignorance? She has had two massive albums GLOBALLY as have Huey and Cyndi. Are you looking at things only from the blinkered US standpoint?

I like Janet very much, but I do NOT consider her to be a legend or legendary. She's released a number of good cd's and had some interesting dance moves and video's in the past, but she's just not "up there" as far as I'm concerned.

SquirrelMeat said:

SEANMAN said:

Your obvious ignorance is allowing me a good chuckle on this here afternoon.

How is that ignorance? She has had two massive albums GLOBALLY as have Huey and Cyndi. Are you looking at things only from the blinkered US standpoint?

It's ignorance because I don't see anyone in the pop industry today still emulating Huey and Cyndi (well, Gaga reminds me a lot of Cyndi, but I digress). On the contrary, Janet's performance style and look is still present and alive in today's pop performers. Whenever you see Ciara in a hat and suit, twirling a handkerchief around as she dances, Janet has already done it. Whenever you see Kelly Rowland performing a slinky number on-stage in a big-brimmed hat and boustier with fitting black slacks and tight choreography, Janet has already done it. Rhianna's big, curly red hairdo that everyone is so gung-ho over? Janet did it in 1997. Britney performing a tease on-stage in concert with a feather boa wrapped over her shoulders? Janet did it on the Velvet Rope tour. The young girl from The Vampire Diaries has remade a couple of Janet songs, and Janet's music STILL gets sampled by various artists in the hip-hop genre. Janet's industry records are not only impressive, but most of them still stand. Who else has had an album that, from a singles-released standpoint, can stand alongside Thriller and Born in the USA? Who else can claim the title of most successful debut tour? A tour that travelled the WORLD? Janet has done film, TV, music, a book...do you think a book put out by Huey Lewis or Cyndi Lauper would make it to #1 on the NY Times Bestsellers list?

As for that "blinkered US standpoint", not so. Plenty of artists who weren't born on the shores of the USA have cited Janet as an inspiration. Peter Andre based his "Defender" video off of Rhythm Nation. Kylie Minogue is a fan of Janet's, and even sampled "Control" in one of her own songs. Some of the Spice Girls have commented on their respect for Janet. Robyn has covered "When I Think of You" in concert. Members of the British Boyband JLS attended Janet's recent London concert. When she and Tyler Perry showed up in London for the premeire of For Colored Girls, there were tons of screaming fans outside clamouring for her autograph. As for her latest tour, I've seen plenty of people from Australia to South America on various sites who are dying to have her re-visit their cities, because it's been so long since she's toured there. She is also huge in the Asian market, as well. She still holds the record for fastest sell-out of the Tokyo Dome.

She's been honored at the World Music Awards. Check out the reaction from these German fans, beginning at 1:54...

Janet has toured the world extensively in the past, so why some folks are quick to claim that she's a virtual unknown in other countries other than the United States is a mystery to me.

If you can read this, and look at the plethora of music videos that I posted on the previous page (which only scratch the surface) and still say that she's about as legendary as Huey and Cyndi, then that's on you.

[Edited 8/8/11 11:41am]

The "Jackson" family is the First Family of music here in the USA. They are Music Royalty. Janet has made her mark in TV, Film and Ultimately the Music Industry. Call her an ICON, Call her a LEGEND, but she will ALWAYS be the ONE and ONLY Ms. Jackson.

mancabdriver said:

ThePopLover2 said:

Then wouldnt the rest of her family be famous too? I mean that line gets so old.

Yup. It is just a weak argument for people who actually don't have any knowledge about Janet or her music.

EVERY single Jackson tried to make it as a solo star and they all failed apart from two. If anything Janet's surname has made it even harder for her.

I only credit her family (i.e. Joe) for landing her a record deal - If it wasn't for him she would not be singing and performing. But I also think to some extent Michael wouldn't have gone far without his father pushing him. Not because he lacks natural talent, but I think he lacked the confidence and charisma to go for a record deal.

[Edited 8/8/11 9:15am]

Michael lacked charisma? Now i've heard it all.

And actually he made it in spite of Joe, Joe didn’t want him in the group at first despite MJ begging him to join. It was only after seeing MJ perform in a school talent show did Joe decide to put him in the group. Jermaine was originally the lead singer until Jermaine replaced him.

Of course Joe has to be given credit, but I believe MJ would have made it no matter what. He definitely did not lack self confidence especially not as a child. I have no idea what where you got that from lol. If you watch interviews with other artists like Gladys Knight or interviews of MJ himself as a child, you’d know that nothing could be farther from the truth.

Is Janet a legend all by herself? No, not in my opinion. Is the unit of Janet Jackson, Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis legendary? Maybe. Take away Jam and Lewis and where would Janet be?

rialb said:

Is Janet a legend all by herself? No, not in my opinion. Is the unit of Janet Jackson, Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis legendary? Maybe. Take away Jam and Lewis and where would Janet be?

Hmmmph and where would Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis be if it wasnt for Janet?? The world will never know

rialb said:

Is Janet a legend all by herself? No, not in my opinion. Is the unit of Janet Jackson, Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis legendary? Maybe. Take away Jam and Lewis and where would Janet be?

As if other artists who are deemed "legendary" did it all by themselves. Pffttttt...

Cinnamon234 said:

mancabdriver said:

Yup. It is just a weak argument for people who actually don't have any knowledge about Janet or her music.

EVERY single Jackson tried to make it as a solo star and they all failed apart from two. If anything Janet's surname has made it even harder for her.

I only credit her family (i.e. Joe) for landing her a record deal - If it wasn't for him she would not be singing and performing. But I also think to some extent Michael wouldn't have gone far without his father pushing him. Not because he lacks natural talent, but I think he lacked the confidence and charisma to go for a record deal.

[Edited 8/8/11 9:15am]

Michael lacked charisma? Now i've heard it all.

And actually he made it in spite of Joe, Joe didn’t want him in the group at first despite MJ begging him to join. It was only after seeing MJ perform in a school talent show did Joe decide to put him in the group. Jermaine was originally the lead singer until Jermaine replaced him.

Of course Joe has to be given credit, but I believe MJ would have made it no matter what. He definitely did not lack self confidence especially not as a child. I have no idea what where you got that from lol. If you watch interviews with other artists like Gladys Knight or interviews of MJ himself as a child, you’d know that nothing could be farther from the truth.

I think i'd like to stick to my opinion. thanks for your two cents though.

SEANMAN said:

rialb said:

Is Janet a legend all by herself? No, not in my opinion. Is the unit of Janet Jackson, Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis legendary? Maybe. Take away Jam and Lewis and where would Janet be?

As if other artists who are deemed "legendary" did it all by themselves. Pffttttt...

That's whats Im sayin. Janet and Jam and Lewis were just a perfect match, same with MJ and Quincy Jones. All of MJ's memorable records were made with quincy, same can be said for Janet and jam and lewis.

SEANMAN said:

rialb said:

Is Janet a legend all by herself? No, not in my opinion. Is the unit of Janet Jackson, Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis legendary? Maybe. Take away Jam and Lewis and where would Janet be?

As if other artists who are deemed "legendary" did it all by themselves. Pffttttt...

And I never claimed that they did. But Janet worked with Jam and Lewis almost exclusively from 1986-2004. The vast majority of her major successes were accomplished in tandem with Jam and Lewis. Someone like Madonna worked with many different collaborators but for most of her career, particularly the most successful part, Janet worked with Jam and Lewis. They are connected in a way that most pop stars are not with their collaborators. Don't you think that they deserve most of the credit for her success in music?

[Edited 8/8/11 11:52am]

rialb said:

SEANMAN said:

As if other artists who are deemed "legendary" did it all by themselves. Pffttttt...

And I never claimed that they did. But Janet worked with Jam and Lewis almost exclusively from 1986-2004. The vast majority of her major successes were accomplished in tandem with Jam and Lewis. Someone like Madonna worked with many different collaborators but for most of her career, particularly the most successful part, Janet worked with Jam and Lewis. They are connected in a way that most pop stars are not with their collaborators. Don't you think that they deserve most of the credit for her success in music?

[Edited 8/8/11 11:52am]

I'm sorry, what you are saying makes no sense to me at all. If Jam and Lewis were doing music way before Janet came along and it WAS NOT groundbreaking, But When Janet was ABLE to control her music and collaborated with Jam and Lewis. HOW DO YOU KNOW that Jam and Lewis took more involvemet in Janet's music? You just basing it on assumptions

[Edited 8/8/11 12:09pm]

rialb said:

SEANMAN said:

As if other artists who are deemed "legendary" did it all by themselves. Pffttttt...

And I never claimed that they did. But Janet worked with Jam and Lewis almost exclusively from 1986-2004. The vast majority of her major successes were accomplished in tandem with Jam and Lewis. Someone like Madonna worked with many different collaborators but for most of her career, particularly the most successful part, Janet worked with Jam and Lewis. They are connected in a way that most pop stars are not with their collaborators. Don't you think that they deserve most of the credit for her success in music?

[Edited 8/8/11 11:52am]

When they won their Grammy for Producer of the Year in '87 odds are it wasn't mainly for their R&B hits from artist like Cherrelle and S.O.S Band. It was the Janet hits that helped garnered them that award. I'm not taking anything away from my boys, don't get me wrong. But more than likely, it was the recognition of their work with Jan and probably Human League that really got them noticed by the academy. For Reals.

I guess what I'm saying is that they basically helped put each other on a more POPular map. No disrespect to my early Flyte Tyme productions either! Still love those songs.

[Edited 8/8/11 12:25pm]

ThePopLover2 said:

rialb said:

And I never claimed that they did. But Janet worked with Jam and Lewis almost exclusively from 1986-2004. The vast majority of her major successes were accomplished in tandem with Jam and Lewis. Someone like Madonna worked with many different collaborators but for most of her career, particularly the most successful part, Janet worked with Jam and Lewis. They are connected in a way that most pop stars are not with their collaborators. Don't you think that they deserve most of the credit for her success in music?

[Edited 8/8/11 11:52am]

I'm sorry, what you are saying makes no sense to me at all. If Jam and Lewis were doing music way before Janet came along and it WAS NOT groundbreaking, But When Janet was ABLE to control her music and collaborated with Jam and Lewis. HOW DO YOU KNOW that Jam and Lewis took more involvemet in Janet's music? You just basing it on assumptions

[Edited 8/8/11 12:09pm]

Who said anything about groundbreaking music? Not me.

How do I know that Jam and Lewis took more involvement in her music? I'm not entirely sure I understand what you are saying but Jam and Lewis are musicians while Janet is not. If you compare her first two albums with what came after I think it is crystal clear what Jam and Lewis did.

My point is that as far as her music goes Jam and Lewis deserve at least equal credit and I would argue more credit than Janet.

Musicslave said:

rialb said:

And I never claimed that they did. But Janet worked with Jam and Lewis almost exclusively from 1986-2004. The vast majority of her major successes were accomplished in tandem with Jam and Lewis. Someone like Madonna worked with many different collaborators but for most of her career, particularly the most successful part, Janet worked with Jam and Lewis. They are connected in a way that most pop stars are not with their collaborators. Don't you think that they deserve most of the credit for her success in music?

[Edited 8/8/11 11:52am]

When they won their Grammy for Producer of the Year in '87 odds are it wasn't mainly for their R&B hits from artist like Cherrelle and S.O.S Band. It was the Janet hits that helped garnered them that award. I'm not taking anything away from my boys, don't get me wrong. But more than likely, it was the recognition of their work with Jan and probably Human League that really got them noticed by the academy. For Reals.

I guess what I'm saying is that they basically helped put each other on a more POPular map. No disrespect to my early Flyte Tyme productions either! Still love those songs.

[Edited 8/8/11 12:25pm]

I think we are basically on the same page. I just think that when we are talking about Janet Jackson's music that it is impossible to overstate how important Jam and Lewis were to her success. If Janet is a legend it is largely due to the music that Jam and Lewis created.

ThePopLover2 said:

Musicslave said:

This question always tickle me concerning Janet. If you were to take all of her success throughout her entire career, and give it to another artist not named Janet Jackson that artist would still be considered a legend

Heck If anything she would be MORE successfulf imo! She couldn't go anywhere with being introduced as "Michael Jackson's Sister Janet!".

people would have more respect for her. but since she is related to MJ, they think she is only famous because of his merits.

actually people were looking for reasons not to like janet. and if she didn't bring it like she did, her career would have ended up like latoya jacksons.

i don't understand why people can't accept that there are two very talented jackson kids. they act like MJ only can be the talented one of the family. Obviously if he can be talented so can his siblings.