Goldmine Magazine is currently running a poll on this subject.

Which member of the "27 Club" - musicians who all died at age 27 - represents the greatest loss to the music world?

Dave Alexander of The Stooges
Kurt Cobain of Nirvana
Pete Ham of Badfinger
Jimi Hendrix
Janis Joplin
Brian Jones of The Rolling Stones
Rudy Lewis of The Drifters
Ron "Pigpen" McKernan of The Grateful Dead
Jim Morrison of The Doors
Alan Wilson of Canned Heat
Amy Winehouse

If you so desire, you can vote here: http://www.goldminemag.com/

Or, you can state right here who you would select and specifically what you think they would have contributed had they lived.


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tA

Tribal Records

I think that's a terrible idea for a poll.

Well, I think we all know the correct answer anyway.

novabrkr said:

I think that's a terrible idea for a poll.

Well, I think we all know the correct answer anyway.

If we're on the same wavelength, it's currently a runaway.

Music for adventurous listeners

tA

Tribal Records

No one loss is greater than another IMO.....They are all missed in their respective genres.

Wasn't Otis Redding 27?

MickyDolenz said:

Wasn't Otis Redding 27?

Born: 9/9/1941

Died: 12/10/1967

That would've made him 26.

Music for adventurous listeners

tA

Tribal Records

1. The biggest lost was Jimi Hendrix, without question.

2. @theAudience.......Have any numerologists mention the symbolism behind the number 27?

The biggest loss was Kurt. You saw what he did with just three albums. Look at the remarkable growth between all three. As a songwriter myself, it's clearly obvious that "Nevermind" was leaps and bounds ahead of "Bleach", and "In Utero" was leaps and bounds ahead of "Nevermind". Look at the incredible stripped down beauty of the MTV unplugged.

Also, while there isn't much, the few songs that do exist from after "In Utero" and before his death show that trend continuing.

"You Know You're Right" was written and recorded literally weeks before Kurt's death and eventually found a release on the Greatest Hits compilation released in 2002. It's primal, guttural, emotive, heartfelt, incredibly written and up there with his best work. And there's another track, which a demo has leaked of (an acoustic version), a song called "Do Re Mi", which is hauntingly beautiful.

Word has it, there's a more complete version of that song, done on March 25th, 1994 (10 days before he died) with Pat Smear and Eric Erlandson (Hole) on drums and bass. Of course, by this stage Kurt had fallen out with both Dave Grohl and Krist Novoselic and intended to fire them from the band. I hope that version leaks out soon, as the song is just an astounding piece of work.

Nothing against any of the other artists on the list, and I love many of them, but Kurt has my heart. Even with as popular as Nirvana have continued to be, I still think he is incredibly, deeply misunderstood by the masses. I consider him one of the greatest artists of all time.

I think Hendrix is the most tragic case of how much incredible music could've been lost to the world, and how much he may've influenced the course of rock music. He was at the peak of his career and I feel would have only continued to grow as an artist, his playing was as awesome as ever, he proved how capable he was a producer and was starting to embrace other genres beyond blues-based guitar rock (jazz, soul, psychedelia, avant-garde, even anticipating prog rock).

Militant said:

The biggest loss was Kurt. You saw what he did with just three albums. Look at the remarkable growth between all three. As a songwriter myself, it's clearly obvious that "Nevermind" was leaps and bounds ahead of "Bleach", and "In Utero" was leaps and bounds ahead of "Nevermind". Look at the incredible stripped down beauty of the MTV unplugged.

Also, while there isn't much, the few songs that do exist from after "In Utero" and before his death show that trend continuing.

"You Know You're Right" was written and recorded literally weeks before Kurt's death and eventually found a release on the Greatest Hits compilation released in 2002. It's primal, guttural, emotive, heartfelt, incredibly written and up there with his best work. And there's another track, which a demo has leaked of (an acoustic version), a song called "Do Re Mi", which is hauntingly beautiful.

Word has it, there's a more complete version of that song, done on March 25th, 1994 (10 days before he died) with Pat Smear and Eric Erlandson (Hole) on drums and bass. Of course, by this stage Kurt had fallen out with both Dave Grohl and Krist Novoselic and intended to fire them from the band. I hope that version leaks out soon, as the song is just an astounding piece of work.

Nothing against any of the other artists on the list, and I love many of them, but Kurt has my heart. Even with as popular as Nirvana have continued to be, I still think he is incredibly, deeply misunderstood by the masses. I consider him one of the greatest artists of all time.

lol.

Spinlight said:

Militant said:

The biggest loss was Kurt. You saw what he did with just three albums. Look at the remarkable growth between all three. As a songwriter myself, it's clearly obvious that "Nevermind" was leaps and bounds ahead of "Bleach", and "In Utero" was leaps and bounds ahead of "Nevermind". Look at the incredible stripped down beauty of the MTV unplugged.

Also, while there isn't much, the few songs that do exist from after "In Utero" and before his death show that trend continuing.

"You Know You're Right" was written and recorded literally weeks before Kurt's death and eventually found a release on the Greatest Hits compilation released in 2002. It's primal, guttural, emotive, heartfelt, incredibly written and up there with his best work. And there's another track, which a demo has leaked of (an acoustic version), a song called "Do Re Mi", which is hauntingly beautiful.

Word has it, there's a more complete version of that song, done on March 25th, 1994 (10 days before he died) with Pat Smear and Eric Erlandson (Hole) on drums and bass. Of course, by this stage Kurt had fallen out with both Dave Grohl and Krist Novoselic and intended to fire them from the band. I hope that version leaks out soon, as the song is just an astounding piece of work.

Nothing against any of the other artists on the list, and I love many of them, but Kurt has my heart. Even with as popular as Nirvana have continued to be, I still think he is incredibly, deeply misunderstood by the masses. I consider him one of the greatest artists of all time.

lol.

Why the lol? Are you disagreeing?

First of all, you need to read this:

because he wrote as much in there.

Secondly, Krist and Dave have already acknowledged that this was most likely the case, so has Courtney. Dave and Kurt hadn't been on good terms for months and Krist had a big blowout fight with Kurt at Seattle airport because Kurt didn't want to go back to rehab.

Thirdly, if it WASN'T the case, why was Kurt recording with Eric Erlandson, Patty Schemel and Pat Smear instead of Dave and Krist?

I mean, the man's been dead for 17 years now, but this is fairly common knowledge amongst even casual fans, so I'm not sure what there is to laugh about.

Who knows whether he would have actually fired them (some people maintain that he actually DID, in March 94, and some people suggest he was about to) , he was so fucked up at that point that he couldn't remember half of what he said or wrote, but the fact is, it's right there written down that that's what he intended to do.

Pretty sure Charles R Cross, the author of "Heavier Than Heaven", the most comprehensive Kurt biography, acknowledges that Kurt pretty much hated Dave and Krist towards the end. I'll have to read it again soon, as well as Everett True's book.

[Edited 8/4/11 17:04pm]

[Edited 8/4/11 17:05pm]

[Edited 8/4/11 17:05pm]

I'd vote for Morrision - just his poetry on it's own is quite captivating. Who knows where he would have gone in all these lost years - that is if gave up the horse.

Militant said:

Spinlight said:

lol.

Why the lol? Are you disagreeing?

First of all, you need to read this:

because he wrote as much in there.

Secondly, Krist and Dave have already acknowledged that this was most likely the case, so has Courtney. Dave and Kurt hadn't been on good terms for months and Krist had a big blowout fight with Kurt at Seattle airport because Kurt didn't want to go back to rehab.

Thirdly, if it WASN'T the case, why was Kurt recording with Eric Erlandson, Patty Schemel and Pat Smear instead of Dave and Krist?

I mean, the man's been dead for 17 years now, but this is fairly common knowledge amongst even casual fans, so I'm not sure what there is to laugh about.

Who knows whether he would have actually fired them (some people maintain that he actually DID, in March 94, and some people suggest he was about to) , he was so fucked up at that point that he couldn't remember half of what he said or wrote, but the fact is, it's right there written down that that's what he intended to do.

Pretty sure Charles R Cross, the author of "Heavier Than Heaven", the most comprehensive Kurt biography, acknowledges that Kurt pretty much hated Dave and Krist towards the end. I'll have to read it again soon, as well as Everett True's book.

[Edited 8/4/11 17:04pm]

[Edited 8/4/11 17:05pm]

[Edited 8/4/11 17:05pm]

Kurt had been performing w/ Eric for 5 years by then. Dave is lucky he got the job because Patty nearly had it before him. I think there is a lot of stuff Kurt was going through at the time considering all that had happened in 1994 alone. I don't believe he ever would've actually booted them out of the group. He was also trying to divorce Courtney and Courtney has always been the main person fueling the fire behind the Kurt Hated You Guys campaign. The difference between the two subjects being that Kurt actually spoke with a real hollywood divorce lawyer and its on record. Yet its just speculation that he ever would've legitimately fired them from the band.

Spinlight said:

Kurt had been performing w/ Eric for 5 years by then. Dave is lucky he got the job because Patty nearly had it before him. I think there is a lot of stuff Kurt was going through at the time considering all that had happened in 1994 alone. I don't believe he ever would've actually booted them out of the group. He was also trying to divorce Courtney and Courtney has always been the main person fueling the fire behind the Kurt Hated You Guys campaign. The difference between the two subjects being that Kurt actually spoke with a real hollywood divorce lawyer and its on record. Yet its just speculation that he ever would've legitimately fired them from the band.

On and off, yeah. But there's a suggestion he wanted them as bandmates.

Krist admitted to Charles Cross that Kurt was going to fire them, so it's not just speculation. Read "Heavier Than Heaven" - I think Cross might have even quoted him verbatim on that. I know there's some anti-Courtney fans who think that she had too much of an influence on what Cross wrote, but I personally don't believe that. Cross is too reputable a journalist.

I actually think he might well have done both things - fired Dave and Krist AND divorced Courtney. Had a clean break, you know. And then reconciled with Krist but probably not Dave.

Had he not fired them though, I think he would at the least put the band on hiatus for a while and done the project with Michael Stipe that they'd been planning.

It is a helluva lot of stuff all happening within that Jan-March time frame, and all under the influence of a fuck-ton of heroin. Everything about that timeframe just disturbs me to no end, with the exception of the absolutely incredible music he was still writing/recording at that time, like "Do Re Mi" for example.

Between Hendrix, Morrison and Cobain to me.

I wish Kurt had never hired Dave, the Foo Fighters have made a career of shitty music of Kurt's legend.

Anyway I from the club members both Kurt and Amy are very dear to me, but I don't think comparing any of them is necessary. Besides I'm pretty sure Lindsey Lohan will die at 27 and ruin the entire myth.

Hendrix.

Cobain.

The Rest.

(and if you're 26, a n'westerner playing / writing music left-handed: take care of yourself!)

1. Hendrix

2.Morrison

3.Winehouse

Militant said:

Spinlight said:

Kurt had been performing w/ Eric for 5 years by then. Dave is lucky he got the job because Patty nearly had it before him. I think there is a lot of stuff Kurt was going through at the time considering all that had happened in 1994 alone. I don't believe he ever would've actually booted them out of the group. He was also trying to divorce Courtney and Courtney has always been the main person fueling the fire behind the Kurt Hated You Guys campaign. The difference between the two subjects being that Kurt actually spoke with a real hollywood divorce lawyer and its on record. Yet its just speculation that he ever would've legitimately fired them from the band.

On and off, yeah. But there's a suggestion he wanted them as bandmates.

Krist admitted to Charles Cross that Kurt was going to fire them, so it's not just speculation. Read "Heavier Than Heaven" - I think Cross might have even quoted him verbatim on that. I know there's some anti-Courtney fans who think that she had too much of an influence on what Cross wrote, but I personally don't believe that. Cross is too reputable a journalist.

I actually think he might well have done both things - fired Dave and Krist AND divorced Courtney. Had a clean break, you know. And then reconciled with Krist but probably not Dave.

Had he not fired them though, I think he would at the least put the band on hiatus for a while and done the project with Michael Stipe that they'd been planning.

It is a helluva lot of stuff all happening within that Jan-March time frame, and all under the influence of a fuck-ton of heroin. Everything about that timeframe just disturbs me to no end, with the exception of the absolutely incredible music he was still writing/recording at that time, like "Do Re Mi" for example.

Eric had once said that Kurt considered joining Hole. He seemed to be really unhappy about most situations he was involved in and I think he was tired of making music the way he was. I chalk most of that up to the drug use and just plain ol insecurity.

RE: Cross, I dunno man. Courtney and Cross are awfully tight. There's a reason that she picked Heavier Than Heaven to turn into a movie. I tend to err on the side of never really believing a damn thing Courtney says and I am aware that she has a tremendous charisma.

I'm pretty sure the Rome incident was a close call. Think Jim Morrison and Jimi Hendrix... It's almost perfect, you woulda thought it had been planned by someone. But anyway, being so close to death and all... I am sure Kurt had a lot of things going on in his head, perhaps including entertaining the idea of firing them despite them being the biggest band in the world at the time.

MarkThrust said:

Hendrix.

Cobain.

The Rest.

(and if you're 26, a n'westerner playing / writing music left-handed: take care of yourself!)

I will probably get totally slaughtered here for saying this, but fuck it - I think that even if all of them took immaculate care of themselves and never touched alcohol or substances, things would've still worked out this way. I think there's some kind of greater, metaphysical or spiritual explanation for the 27 Club thing; that really they were all meant to only be here up until that age, no matter what they did, and that they were sent here on a very important, specific mission that they accomplished and then they go.

But now that I think about it, I'm not so sure that age necessarily has anything to do with it; because John Lennon had the same effect on people and he lived past 27...I don't necessarily agree that location and right or left-handedness have much to do with it either because there's a whole slew of musicians who've had a huge influence on humanity as a collective like that, who don't really fit the specifications you mentioned. The Beatles as a group for starters; Elvis as well....

It a nutshell, I think some people are just meant to come here for a brief while, and kinda affect and move people on a large scale, and then move on.

Spinlight said:

Militant said:

On and off, yeah. But there's a suggestion he wanted them as bandmates.

Krist admitted to Charles Cross that Kurt was going to fire them, so it's not just speculation. Read "Heavier Than Heaven" - I think Cross might have even quoted him verbatim on that. I know there's some anti-Courtney fans who think that she had too much of an influence on what Cross wrote, but I personally don't believe that. Cross is too reputable a journalist.

I actually think he might well have done both things - fired Dave and Krist AND divorced Courtney. Had a clean break, you know. And then reconciled with Krist but probably not Dave.

Had he not fired them though, I think he would at the least put the band on hiatus for a while and done the project with Michael Stipe that they'd been planning.

It is a helluva lot of stuff all happening within that Jan-March time frame, and all under the influence of a fuck-ton of heroin. Everything about that timeframe just disturbs me to no end, with the exception of the absolutely incredible music he was still writing/recording at that time, like "Do Re Mi" for example.

Eric had once said that Kurt considered joining Hole. He seemed to be really unhappy about most situations he was involved in and I think he was tired of making music the way he was. I chalk most of that up to the drug use and just plain ol insecurity.

RE: Cross, I dunno man. Courtney and Cross are awfully tight. There's a reason that she picked Heavier Than Heaven to turn into a movie. I tend to err on the side of never really believing a damn thing Courtney says and I am aware that she has a tremendous charisma.

I'm pretty sure the Rome incident was a close call. Think Jim Morrison and Jimi Hendrix... It's almost perfect, you woulda thought it had been planned by someone. But anyway, being so close to death and all... I am sure Kurt had a lot of things going on in his head, perhaps including entertaining the idea of firing them despite them being the biggest band in the world at the time.

Agreed on the first paragraph. As far as Cross, I still think he's reputable, but yeah. They are tight..... but I don't think it's anywhere near her dictating or having a heavy influence over what he writes. Although that chapter about Kurt's final moments in "Heavier Than Heaven" was.... well.... a little bit weird. I know Cross has caught some negative press for that.

And I think Everett True acknowledged the same situation as far as Krist and Dave, despite being firmly against "Heavier Than Heaven", and him being probably the closest person to the circle that accused the book of being "Courtney-sanctioned". Still, True is somewhat of a loose cannon too. In general, I see both Cross' book and True's as being mostly accurate with some questionable parts. Between the two of them you get a pretty good account of everything.

Ha, Rome..... I'm not opening that can of worms! But, I think they really loved each other and I don't think she was trying to kill him, just that they had a very mutually explosive relationship heavily exacerbated by lots of drug use. I don't think she wanted him dead and to be honest, I find it all very distasteful when people state or insinuate that to her, like in the "Kurt & Courtney" documentary that Nick Broomfield made.

To be honest, I don't think he killed himself either though. There's things that don't add up. The electrician that found his body reported "no visible signs of trauma" other than a small amount of blood by his ear. Evidently, you blast yourself close range with a shotgun and there's going to be just a tad more blood than that, amongst other fragments. It's reported his prints weren't even on the gun, and while his tolerance would certainly have been high, the amount of heroin in his system would render him incapable of doing it anyway.

I think El Duce may have known something, I think Allen Wrench definitely knows something, I even think Cali DeWitt might know something, but I'm not convinced at all that it has anything directly to do with Courtney. I mean I'm not completely ruling it out, either, but I don't see any evidence for it and I think it's mostly a "witch-hunt" with people like Tom Grant and her own father just completely exploiting the situation for their own gains.

[Edited 8/5/11 7:21am]

This "club" sucks. Why are people always looking for commonalities among things?

I'm sure we could make a list of actors who died at 26 and football players who died at 42 too.

My vote is for Amy though because she's the only vocalist of the group.