smoothcriminal12 said:

mimi07 said:

Alot of MJ fans well maybe most of the newer ones dont seem to check for anything pre 1982. It's a shame because some of Michael's best work was before Thriller IMO. I dont' undertsand how someone could be a fan of his music and not explore his entire catalog, i understand people have preferences but those who only love bad era or dangerous era should give the others a chance too.

Exactly. I was just re-exploring young Michael's/Jackson Five catalog and I was just blown away. I despise it when fans refuse to listen to anything before Thriller and dismiss just because he was part of The Jackson Five.

I've been an MJ fan for 5 years or so, and I just heard Goin' Places and The Jacksons for the first time ever a few weeks ago. Great albums too! I don't love the Motown too much, though..

[Edited 7/8/11 5:47am]

The1592 said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Exactly. I was just re-exploring young Michael's/Jackson Five catalog and I was just blown away. I despise it when fans refuse to listen to anything before Thriller and dismiss just because he was part of The Jackson Five.

I've been an MJ fan for 5 years or so, and I just heard Goin' Places and The Jacksons for the first time ever a few weeks ago. Great albums too! I don't love the Motown too much, though..

[Edited 7/8/11 5:47am]

Le gasp!

[Edited 7/8/11 5:48am]

smoothcriminal12 said:

The1592 said:

I've been an MJ fan for 5 years or so, and I just heard Goin' Places and The Jacksons for the first time ever a few weeks ago. Great albums too! I don't love the Motown too much, though..

[Edited 7/8/11 5:47am]

Le gasp!

[Edited 7/8/11 5:48am]

I didn't say I didn't like any of it. There were some great songs (I'll Be There, I Wanna Be Where You Are, Never Can Say Goodbye, etc.), I just don't love all of the songs. I like most of the big motown hits, and a few lesser known songs, but a lot of it I don't think is that good.

The1592 said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Le gasp!

[Edited 7/8/11 5:48am]

I didn't say I didn't like any of it. There were some great songs (I'll Be There, I Wanna Be Where You Are, Never Can Say Goodbye, etc.), I just don't love all of the songs. I like most of the big motown hits, and a few lesser known songs, but a lot of it I don't think is that good.

Swa said:

NaughtyKitty said:

Well? Anyone?

I think Michael was bred to equate number 1 with worth. Regardless of whether or not he would have made Thriller, he would have still strived to achieve being bigger that he was at the OTW stage.

As you say Thriller was a blessing and a curse for him. When someone is THAT successful, everything else you do that doesn't equal it (an no one has) will always be seen as failure, in your own eyes and in the eyes of critics - despite the fact he was still outselling in most instance and selling comparable in later years with the acts lauded by the press at the time.

Thanks Swa and Bboy for responding! I agree with both your viewpoints

Star Magazine has published some of MJ's sketches that are supposedly being put up for auction right now (http://www.radaronline.co...alued-900m)

Scans pics are too big to post so I will just post the links:

http://img14.imageshack.u...led15i.jpg

http://img190.imageshack....led25z.jpg

http://img26.imageshack.u...led35z.jpg

http://img23.imageshack.u...nled45.jpg

http://img225.imageshack....nled55.jpg

Taken from: http://muzikfactorytwo.bl...s-900.html

Great sketches!

The1592 said:

So, Unholyalliance, what are your favorite MJ tracks post-Bad??

Oh damn...where do I even begin? His 90s work is some of my most favorite part of his catalog.

Some of my favorite tracks are:

Dangerous:

Remember The Time

Dangerous

Give In To Me

Heal The World

She Drives Me Wild

In The Closet

Who Is It

Black or White (sometimes I do...it depends what kind of mood I'm in)

HIStory:

Stranger in Moscow

They Don't Really Care About Us

Tabloid Junkie

This Time Around

Money

History

Little Susie

BOTDF:

Blood on the Dancefloor

Morphine

Is It Scary

Invincinble:

Heaven Can Wait

Threatened

Butterflies

You Rock My World (Love the Tag Team and Rock remixes to this song as well)

The Lost Children (haters gonna hate')

Invincible

2000 Watts (haters gonna' hate)

That being said, Bad is my most favorite album of his.

I lived thought his entire career and am firmly a member of the demographic that was Jackson's audience. I would have literally lived under a rock not to hear Jackson's music as it was being released. As has been pointed out, generally the lion's share of his albums were eventually released as individual singles.

I love all of the Jackson 5 singles. Many of the album tracks and covers they did were fun too, with young Michael's energy and soprano really keeping it in the pocket. But I do think J5's very best work was their singles. (I base this on the Soulsation box. I've also heard several of the Epic Records, as well as the domestic and import Jackson's Eric compilations.)

I actually like all of the Quincy albums, but still regard Bad as disappointing in that it was SO formulaic a follow-up to Thriller. That said, some of the tracks and singles were real ear-candy, "Bad," "The Way You Make Me Feel," and "Dirty Diana" being my favorites. I always hated when Jackson got preachy, so "Man in the Mirror" is not my cup o' tea. From Dangerous, I only liked "Black and White," even though it is a little preachy, it's got an amazing hook. As an admirer of Janet (much more than Michael, I feel that Janet has the stronger canon of material, (especially her earlier work which I really consider to be Janet, Jam & Lewis albums), so I also love "Scream," but was unmoved by anything else on HIStory, including unfortunately the other J&J tracks.

Once Jackson got lyrically defensive in his music, it was just not as compelling or relatable IN MY OPINION. (I feel I have to add that every once in a while, even though it seems obvious that I'm discussing my opinions.) I think it was a failure as as a lyricist that he couldn't express his feelings about the issues he was going through in a more accessible way. (Regardless of the truth, I think the defensiveness prevalent in his later music worked against him and made him come off as more guilty. i.e. "Thou protest too much.")

I skipped Invincible like the rest of the world. One of the singles really would have had to jump out at me, for me to check it out after Dangerous and HIStory. The parts I did hear suffered from the same preachiness and defensiveness that I think defined the worst of his latter day music.

I listened to Michael once, but it was mostly out of morbid curiosity.

I'm sure if a killer posthumous single comes along, I will hear it.

Imaginative said:

Once Jackson got lyrically defensive in his music, it was just not as compelling or relatable IN MY OPINION. (I feel I have to add that every once in a while, even though it seems obvious that I'm discussing my opinions.) I think it was a failure as as a lyricist that he couldn't express his feelings about the issues he was going through in a more accessible way. (Regardless of the truth, I think the defensiveness prevalent in his later music worked against him and made him come off as more guilty. i.e. "Thou protest too much.")

Actually wait:

How can you claim that and then claim to like Scream? Did you even listen to the HIStory album?

Oh wait...you didn't.

Well, guess it'll take you a few days to research the Jacksons and Jackson 5 singles.

[Edited 7/8/11 9:37am]

Unholyalliance said:

Imaginative said:

I actually like all of the Quincy albums, but still regard Bad as disappointing in that it was SO formulaic a follow-up to Thriller. That said, some of the tracks and singles were real ear-candy, "Bad," "The Way You Make Me Feel," and "Dirty Diana" being my favorites.

What made it so formulaic? Can you please go into more detail?

Considering that New Jack Swing was in, I don't really see that much of a difference between In The Closet & Remember The Time and other songs such as Love Will Never Do Without You and Escapade. Doesn't make any sense. What also doesn't make any sense is that all of the singles that you have pointed out tend to be popular amongst rock fans, but yet you find Janet's to be stronger, when her stuff delves way more into r&b and dance-pop. Like wtf?!?!?!?! You didn't even mention anything about Black Cat...at all which would be more in line with what you like.

Imaginative said:

I just listened to Michael today, but it was mostly out of morbid curiosity and because you guys are calling me out on my bullshit.

FTFY

It seems that you took the time to do your research last night. Guess it's gonna take you a couple of more days to research all the singles that the Jackson 5 and Jacksons released.

MORE black pixels in my honor!

When I stare and blur my eyes they make a pretty pattern. More please!!

(I think Pavlov's dogs learned faster than you.)

[Edited 7/8/11 9:39am]

Imaginative said:

When I stare and blur my eyes they make a pretty pattern. More please!!

Is that really the best you got?

Oh wait, I forgot about your illiteracy issues. My bad.

Unholyalliance said:

Is that really the best you got?

No, it's actually the very least I could do, or to put it another way... all that you deserve. But you can keep typing all about me and my illiteracy.

Frank Cascio's book "My Friend Michael: Growing Up with the King of Pop" wont be out until November but its available for pre-order on Amazon's website.

Imaginative said:

I lived thought his entire career and am firmly a member of the demographic that was Jackson's audience. I would have literally lived under a rock not to hear Jackson's music as it was being released. As has been pointed out, generally the lion's share of his albums were eventually released as individual singles.

I love all of the Jackson 5 singles. Many of the album tracks and covers they did were fun too, with young Michael's energy and soprano really keeping it in the pocket. But I do think J5's very best work was their singles. (I base this on the Soulsation box. I've also heard several of the Epic Records, as well as the domestic and import Jackson's Eric compilations.)

I actually like all of the Quincy albums, but still regard Bad as disappointing in that it was SO formulaic a follow-up to Thriller. That said, some of the tracks and singles were real ear-candy, "Bad," "The Way You Make Me Feel," and "Dirty Diana" being my favorites. I always hated when Jackson got preachy, so "Man in the Mirror" is not my cup o' tea. From Dangerous, I only liked "Black and White," even though it is a little preachy, it's got an amazing hook. As an admirer of Janet (much more than Michael, I feel that Janet has the stronger canon of material, (especially her earlier work which I really consider to be Janet, Jam & Lewis albums), so I also love "Scream," but was unmoved by anything else on HIStory, including unfortunately the other J&J tracks.

Once Jackson got lyrically defensive in his music, it was just not as compelling or relatable IN MY OPINION. (I feel I have to add that every once in a while, even though it seems obvious that I'm discussing my opinions.) I think it was a failure as as a lyricist that he couldn't express his feelings about the issues he was going through in a more accessible way. (Regardless of the truth, I think the defensiveness prevalent in his later music worked against him and made him come off as more guilty. i.e. "Thou protest too much.")

I skipped Invincible like the rest of the world. One of the singles really would have had to jump out at me, for me to check it out after Dangerous and HIStory. The parts I did hear suffered from the same preachiness and defensiveness that I think defined the worst of his latter day music.

I listened to Michael once, but it was mostly out of morbid curiosity.

I'm sure if a killer posthumous single comes along, I will hear it.

I don't think that people are going to believe or take you seriously as an OBJECTIVE fan of music in general , I say save face and log off , you are starting to sound like a

[img:$uid]http://1-2knockout.typepad.com/.a/6a00e5505fc4968834010536e09336970b-800wi/[/img:$uid]

[Edited 7/8/11 11:27am]

This thread has gone ta hell....

Imaginative said:

No, it's actually the very least I could do, or to put it another way... all that you deserve. But you can keep typing all about me and my illiteracy.

seeingvoices12 said:

I don't think that people are going to believe or take you seriously as an OBJECTIVE fan of music in general , I say save face and log off , you are starting to sound like a...

LOL. I guess I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't. I really don't really want to repeat myself, but I keep getting asked and challenged to by the members of the thread. UA, asked me to repeat the songs I liked, which percentage wise, is probably most of them, and still I was told that my taste was "wrong!"

The only people ruining this thread are the idiots that keep responding. It gets awfully lonely talking to yourself if nobody responds to you.

GettOffMyLand said:

The only people ruining this thread are the idiots that keep responding. It gets awfully lonely talking to yourself if nobody responds to you.

This thread is dead anyway.

Timmy84 said:

GettOffMyLand said:

The only people ruining this thread are the idiots that keep responding. It gets awfully lonely talking to yourself if nobody responds to you.

This thread is dead anyway.

JoeTyler said:

is this thread eternal?

Yep!

Timmy84 said:

GettOffMyLand said:

The only people ruining this thread are the idiots that keep responding. It gets awfully lonely talking to yourself if nobody responds to you.

This thread is dead anyway.

Dead at 11+ pages. Now ain't that a shame.

Imaginative said:

Vanilli said:

Sooooo last night I went to Half Price Books with a friend...I got some comics and sure enough,

what I did I see on the display shelf for $19.98!!!! Bonus: The VHS copy of Ghosts inside was NTSC!

It is clearly even marked "GHOSTS NTSC." I told the person checking out, "I have wanted this since I was 12 years old!" So happy!!! THRILLED!!!

[Edited 7/8/11 5:08am]

[Edited 7/8/11 5:09am]

SCORE!!

EmeraldSkies said:

Vanilli said:

Sooooo last night I went to Half Price Books with a friend...I got some comics and sure enough,

what I did I see on the display shelf for $19.98!!!! Bonus: The VHS copy of Ghosts inside was NTSC!

It is clearly even marked "GHOSTS NTSC." I told the person checking out, "I have wanted this since I was 12 years old!" So happy!!! THRILLED!!!

[Edited 7/8/11 5:08am]

[Edited 7/8/11 5:09am]

SCORE!!

I still have my original copy - did it include the CD Single as well. The booklet has some great shots too.

Anyone else get the Panini trading cards yet? I was going through my hobby boxes,and let out a scream when I found this...

Swa said:

EmeraldSkies said:

SCORE!!

I still have my original copy - did it include the CD Single as well. The booklet has some great shots too.

I don't have it myself,but I have seen pictures. The Deluxe Box Set came with a CD single.

[Edited 7/8/11 20:49pm]

Swa said:

My point was though in this instance many of the elements of the song that really elevated Kiss from a blues based song to a distinctive funk hit were Mazarati's contribution. Either way they received no credit for it, not even as arrangers. Without derailing the conversation I would be interested to see how you view artists like jay-z and kanye. Are they just doing cover versions? After all, *all* they are doing are putting new and original lyrics to preexisting music. [Edited 7/8/11 18:35pm]

I honestly have no idea what you're talking about now; it's so far removed from anything close to what I've said. I never criticized anyone for doing cover versions. I also never criticized Jackson for embellishing "Mask". You really don't seem to be following along too well. You seem nice, but you're going to have to get with the program. I would reiterate my views, but even I have no desire to sound like a broken record. You're going to have to go back and read and figure it out for yourself. I've made myself abundantly clear.

I really don't pay much attention to artists like Jay-Z and Kanye. I've never heard them do anything objectionable.

[Edited 7/8/11 23:22pm]