Militant said:

bboy87 said:

@ Militant looking white

I was about to reply, shit that's news to me. I guess Prince looks white too cos we have the same skin tone.

I can tell you that I didn't look white enough to the kids that called ME nigger, paki, arab, coon, niggerlips etc etc etc growing up. I can tell you that cats on the public transport in London after the bombings looked at me like a terrorist, I guess I didn't look white enough for them either.

I can tell you I didn't look white enough to the cops EVERY TIME I hung out with my white friends and I'd ALWAYS be the one singled out for a patdown/investigation.

I'm pretty damn certain I wouldn't have to deal with HALF the shit I've had to in my life if I "looked white". Shit, I even got told to "get your ass back to Africa" a couple times. I bust out laughing and said "wrong fucking continent, douche" both times.

Anyway, this ain't about me lol.

Thats messed up as all hell Sorry to hear about that.

Militant said:

I was about to reply, shit that's news to me. I guess Prince looks white too cos we have the same skin tone.

I can tell you that I didn't look white enough to the kids that called ME nigger, paki, arab, coon, niggerlips etc etc etc growing up. I can tell you that cats on the public transport in London after the bombings looked at me like a terrorist, I guess I didn't look white enough for them either.

I can tell you I didn't look white enough to the cops EVERY TIME I hung out with my white friends and I'd ALWAYS be the one singled out for a patdown/investigation.

I'm pretty damn certain I wouldn't have to deal with HALF the shit I've had to in my life if I "looked white". Shit, I even got told to "get your ass back to Africa" a couple times. I bust out laughing and said "wrong fucking continent, douche" both times.

Anyway, this ain't about me lol.

May I ask where do you live? Like the country...

Militant said:

bboy87 said:

@ Militant looking white

I was about to reply, shit that's news to me. I guess Prince looks white too cos we have the same skin tone.

I can tell you that I didn't look white enough to the kids that called ME nigger, paki, arab, coon, niggerlips etc etc etc growing up. I can tell you that cats on the public transport in London after the bombings looked at me like a terrorist, I guess I didn't look white enough for them either.

I can tell you I didn't look white enough to the cops EVERY TIME I hung out with my white friends and I'd ALWAYS be the one singled out for a patdown/investigation.

I'm pretty damn certain I wouldn't have to deal with HALF the shit I've had to in my life if I "looked white". Shit, I even got told to "get your ass back to Africa" a couple times. I bust out laughing and said "wrong fucking continent, douche" both times.

Anyway, this ain't about me lol.

Wow, that's pathetic what you went through, but it is good to hear the experiences of others outside the U.S. who have experienced racial prejudice. Goes to show that it's a global issue. It's a shame when ignorance becomes one's teacher and people don't take the time to embrace/accept/educate themselves about people from other racial/ethnic/religious groups. Instead they base their education about them on stereotypical BS, and act out on it. Your experience with racial prejudice sounds llike what many black males in the U.S. go through on a daily basis with racial profiling, based on others' ignorance. Thanks for sharing that information though.

[Edited 6/16/11 7:55am]

Regardless the origin of the word, the intent behind using the word, Richard Pryor and various other black commedians, or what goes on in the hood of any city...it doesn't sound right coming from her.

I doubt she will have much success incorporating the word into her music once she starts releasing singles to the general public and trying to get air time on MTV and BET.

Militant said:

bboy87 said:

@ Militant looking white

I was about to reply, shit that's news to me. I guess Prince looks white too cos we have the same skin tone.

I can tell you that I didn't look white enough to the kids that called ME nigger, paki, arab, coon, niggerlips etc etc etc growing up. I can tell you that cats on the public transport in London after the bombings looked at me like a terrorist, I guess I didn't look white enough for them either.

I can tell you I didn't look white enough to the cops EVERY TIME I hung out with my white friends and I'd ALWAYS be the one singled out for a patdown/investigation.

I'm pretty damn certain I wouldn't have to deal with HALF the shit I've had to in my life if I "looked white". Shit, I even got told to "get your ass back to Africa" a couple times. I bust out laughing and said "wrong fucking continent, douche" both times.

Anyway, this ain't about me lol.

wow, what kind of people and places are you hanging out

HotGritz said:

Regardless the origin of the word, the intent behind using the word, Richard Pryor and various other black commedians, or what goes on in the hood of any city...it doesn't sound right coming from her.

I doubt she will have much success incorporating the word into her music once she starts releasing singles to the general public and trying to get air time on MTV and BET.

Oh, they've started playing music videos again?

2elijah said:

vainandy said:

She's a dumb little young white bitch that doesn't realize the power of the word because she's never had it used on her in a way that she had to fear for her personal safety. The word has a lot of power and she sees it as just a word because she hears her black friends using it on each other and she thinks she's given a pass because she's "down with them". But if she's ever approached alone by a group of rednecks calling her a "nigger lover" and wonders if they are going to gang up and beat her ass, she'll see what power the word has. She's apparently never been put in that type of situation because if she had been, she'd know better.

I agree with most of your post and BK's, and you're both right on point. Some folks don't understand the power of the word. Those who are aware and hear it spewed from the mouth of any individual in public, will always hear it with only one spelling and one meaning. Just because people claim they hear rappers and some, not all, Black people using the term amongst themselves, does not give the ok for anyone outside that group to think it's ok to use it publically. I don't like it when I hear Black youth or adults use it. I don't care if they are using it as a so-called bs term of endearment, as an excuse to use it.

Although this girl may say it among her friends who know her, doesn't make it alright when she comes out and spews it publically. I think the poorest excuse and justification for its use is when someone states "Well some Black people, rappers/those in hip-hop use it, blah, blah". That's not an acceptable reason/excuse/justification for it to be used. Some folks seem to want to give it a pass and diminish its meaning, and compare it to some Blacks/rappers who use it, to justify their own reason to want to use it. The history behind the term regardless how many different ways you spell it or put cake on top of it will always remain the same

I dare her to go into a random, black-populated community alone and use that term, and just see how well she'll be embraced, because not everyone will understand "Where she's coming from" or where she grew up, which is still no reason/excuse or a pass to use it. Same as a Black person going into a Jewish community and suddenly yelling out a racist slur to people in that community-not acceptable. People forget, just because "you can," doesn't always mean "you should." Some people put themselves at harm when they think they can just spew any offensive term to others outside their group. A little common sense goes a long way. People need to stop making excuses for offensive terms, that's the bottom line.

[Edited 6/15/11 6:27am]

Well said. Most racial groups have derogatory terms that they use amongst themselves but that does not give others outside of that racial group to use that term. It isn't necessarily exclusive to Black people. Racism is still alive and well and Obama in office is great but it hasn't changed anything.

I'm in the UK. Outside of the major cities (London, Birmingham, Manchester, Leeds and a few more), this country is racist as all hell.

I grew up in Birmingham, and I live here now, and where I grew up and live now is mostly Jamaicans and Indians.

However, when I was around 10, my dad remarried and moved us out of the city. My dad is white (my late mother was Indian), and my dad's wife is white so basically they just did what they wanted to do and didn't really have a lot of perception of how it would affect me and my sister. We went to the nearest small city to school for a few years and that whole place was racist as hell.

There were a lot of Neo-Nazi's there, both on a street gang level and a political level of extreme right-wing conservatives, the kind of people who have slogans such as "Keep Britain British" etc, blame all problems on ethnic minorities, etc. Bad times. I got out as soon as I could.

After 4 pages and THIS thread isn't in P&R yet. Damn, these mods have gotten soft this month!

(j/k mods! I know the forum rules. )

Militant said:

I'm in the UK. Outside of the major cities (London, Birmingham, Manchester, Leeds and a few more), this country is racist as all hell.

I grew up in Birmingham, and I live here now, and where I grew up and live now is mostly Jamaicans and Indians.

However, when I was around 10, my dad remarried and moved us out of the city. My dad is white (my late mother was Indian), and my dad's wife is white so basically they just did what they wanted to do and didn't really have a lot of perception of how it would affect me and my sister. We went to the nearest small city to school for a few years and that whole place was racist as hell.

There were a lot of Neo-Nazi's there, both on a street gang level and a political level of extreme right-wing conservatives, the kind of people who have slogans such as "Keep Britain British" etc, blame all problems on ethnic minorities, etc. Bad times. I got out as soon as I could.

I'm laughing while reading this, not at you, but at these UK orgers who have tried their best to put out this smug "You Americans! We don't quibble on race like you peasants do" attitude in this board

I have NEVER met a UK born person of color who have tried to trivialized the racial climate in UK, its usually somebody white who's either genuinely ignorant about the situation, or know very well but still remain indifferent. Either way, I look at those people with great suspicion, because ignorance & indifference have a long history of putting black people's lives at risk in the USA, it didn't even matter that some of the ignorant/indifferent white people had good intentions to begin with and were busy with their own lives, that wasn't good enough.

Harlepolis said:

Militant said:

I'm in the UK. Outside of the major cities (London, Birmingham, Manchester, Leeds and a few more), this country is racist as all hell.

I grew up in Birmingham, and I live here now, and where I grew up and live now is mostly Jamaicans and Indians.

However, when I was around 10, my dad remarried and moved us out of the city. My dad is white (my late mother was Indian), and my dad's wife is white so basically they just did what they wanted to do and didn't really have a lot of perception of how it would affect me and my sister. We went to the nearest small city to school for a few years and that whole place was racist as hell.

There were a lot of Neo-Nazi's there, both on a street gang level and a political level of extreme right-wing conservatives, the kind of people who have slogans such as "Keep Britain British" etc, blame all problems on ethnic minorities, etc. Bad times. I got out as soon as I could.

I'm laughing while reading this, not at you, but at these UK orgers who have tried their best to put out this smug "You Americans! We don't quibble on race like you peasants do" attitude in this board

I have NEVER met a UK born person of color who have tried to trivialized the racial climate in UK, its usually somebody white who's either genuinely ignorant about the situation, or know very well but still remain indifferent. Either way, I look at those people with great suspicion, because ignorance & indifference have a long history of putting black people's lives at risk in the USA, it didn't even matter that some of the ignorant/indifferent white people had good intentions to begin with and were busy with their own lives, that wasn't good enough.

Absolutely. How could we forget how that went down in the P&R forum, with a clique that stalked some black orgers for even questioning if racism exists in the UK, as well as when some of us discussed our experiences/encounters of racial prejudice in America, and God forbid if any of us brought up America or any other country's involvement in the Transatlantic slave trade.

I couldn't believe how some UK orgers swore to the highest mountain that "Race didn't matter" in the UK or that there aren't any racial issues there, like in America and would tell many black orgers to "Get over it" or "Stop playing victim", when discussing those encounters/experiences had nothing to do with playing victim or trying to get over anything.

My niece whose grandmother and Uncles are of the Jamaican culture, lives in the UK, and they definitely told me and other family members, about the racism that exists there, and this was back in the late 90s that they told us this. This is why I couldn't understand how some UK orgers swore that racial prejudice didn't exist there or on the same level as in America. I'm glad Militant is honest about it, and didn't try to sugarcoat its existence, based on his own personal encounters/experiences living there.

It's good to know some UK orgers are not afraid to share their experiences with racial prejudice and expose it. I recently watched a documentary that orger "Deebee" posted in a thread in the P&R forum, which was very informative in the way of giving insight into how some UK orgers felt about race issues in their country, as well as, the non-british population of immigrants coming there to live.

[Edited 6/17/11 6:44am]

Militant said:

I'm in the UK. Outside of the major cities (London, Birmingham, Manchester, Leeds and a few more), this country is racist as all hell.

That's very interesting, because, as some people have said, a lot of people from the UK try to make it seem that the country embraces all races and ethnicities, but I had a feeling that couldn't be true. It's just impossible. It is as if they are trying to seperate themselves from the US, but I don't really think it's all that different in that case.

Though, I think the US's culture is based and has evolved around racism. Not sure about the UK though, but I know that racism exists within the very fabric of the US's existence. Also, the more the main culture tries to deny it the worse it's going to get...for all parties.

2elijah said:

Harlepolis said:

I'm laughing while reading this, not at you, but at these UK orgers who have tried their best to put out this smug "You Americans! We don't quibble on race like you peasants do" attitude in this board

I have NEVER met a UK born person of color who have tried to trivialized the racial climate in UK, its usually somebody white who's either genuinely ignorant about the situation, or know very well but still remain indifferent. Either way, I look at those people with great suspicion, because ignorance & indifference have a long history of putting black people's lives at risk in the USA, it didn't even matter that some of the ignorant/indifferent white people had good intentions to begin with and were busy with their own lives, that wasn't good enough.

Absolutely. How could we forget how that went down in the P&R forum, with a clique that stalked some black orgers for even questioning if racism exists in the UK, as well as when some of us discussed our experiences/encounters of racial prejudice in America, and God forbid if any of us brought up America or any other country's involvement in the Transatlantic slave trade.

I couldn't believe how some UK orgers swore to the highest mountain that "Race didn't matter" in the UK or that there aren't any racial issues there, like in America and would tell many black orgers to "Get over it" or "Stop playing victim", when discussing those encounters/experiences had nothing to do with playing victim or trying to get over anything.

My niece whose grandmother and Uncles are of the Jamaican culture, lives in the UK, and they definitely told me and other family members, about the racism that exists there, and this was back in the late 90s that they told us this. This is why I couldn't understand how some UK orgers swore that racial prejudice didn't exist there or on the same level as in America. I'm glad Militant is honest about it, and didn't try to sugarcoat its existence, based on his own personal encounters/experiences living there.

It's good to know some UK orgers are not afraid to share their experiences with racial prejudice and expose it. I recently watched a documentary that orger "Deebee" posted in a thread in the P&R forum, which was very informative in the way of giving insight into how some UK orgers felt about race issues in their country, as well as, the non-british population of immigrants coming there to live.

[Edited 6/17/11 6:44am]

I always remind them of Brixton, you should do the same, and just watch their reaction They'll either change the subject and the ones who won't quit while they're ahead usually resort to everybody's fave cop out "Its in the past" plea. The 80s are NOT that long ago, dear

Unholyalliance said:

Militant said:

I'm in the UK. Outside of the major cities (London, Birmingham, Manchester, Leeds and a few more), this country is racist as all hell.

That's very interesting, because, as some people have said, a lot of people from the UK try to make it seem that the country embraces all races and ethnicities, but I had a feeling that couldn't be true. It's just impossible. It is as if they are trying to seperate themselves from the US, but I don't really think it's all that different in that case.

Though, I think the US's culture is based and has evolved around racism. Not sure about the UK though, but I know that racism exists within the very fabric of the US's existence. Also, the more the main culture tries to deny it the worse it's going to get...for all parties.

England enslaved and invaded 3/4 of the Earth, USA included. They can miss me with their selective memory.

[Edited 6/17/11 7:40am]

Harlepolis said:

2elijah said:

Absolutely. How could we forget how that went down in the P&R forum, with a clique that stalked some black orgers for even questioning if racism exists in the UK, as well as when some of us discussed our experiences/encounters of racial prejudice in America, and God forbid if any of us brought up America or any other country's involvement in the Transatlantic slave trade.

I couldn't believe how some UK orgers swore to the highest mountain that "Race didn't matter" in the UK or that there aren't any racial issues there, like in America and would tell many black orgers to "Get over it" or "Stop playing victim", when discussing those encounters/experiences had nothing to do with playing victim or trying to get over anything.

My niece whose grandmother and Uncles are of the Jamaican culture, lives in the UK, and they definitely told me and other family members, about the racism that exists there, and this was back in the late 90s that they told us this. This is why I couldn't understand how some UK orgers swore that racial prejudice didn't exist there or on the same level as in America. I'm glad Militant is honest about it, and didn't try to sugarcoat its existence, based on his own personal encounters/experiences living there.

It's good to know some UK orgers are not afraid to share their experiences with racial prejudice and expose it. I recently watched a documentary that orger "Deebee" posted in a thread in the P&R forum, which was very informative in the way of giving insight into how some UK orgers felt about race issues in their country, as well as, the non-british population of immigrants coming there to live.

[Edited 6/17/11 6:44am]

I always remind them of Brixton, you should do the same, and just watch their reaction They'll either change the subject and the ones who won't quit while they're ahead usually resort to everybody's fave cop out "Its in the past" plea. The 80s are NOT that long ago, dear

Interesting. I think it's best when people are honest about these issues, because it makes room for better discussions on the topic, and I think too often many people let their egos get in the way, and so when people bring up discussions of racial discrimination or historical, racist crimes/acts of the past or present, many think that others are trying to impose guilt/blame on them, when that is not the case, but moreso to share/discuss/compare experiences of racial discrimination and the historical aspect of it, and to determine how/if the effects of it in the past, plays a major role in many of the racist beliefs/actions/behaviors of those living in the present.

Just like how the birth and use of the "n" word, and how the intention of it used in the past, was meant to degrade/humiliate specific human beings within the human population. No matter which way one spells the "n" word or use it, it still comes from the root of the same tree.

[Edited 6/17/11 7:52am]

Harlepolis said:

Militant said:

I'm in the UK. Outside of the major cities (London, Birmingham, Manchester, Leeds and a few more), this country is racist as all hell.

I grew up in Birmingham, and I live here now, and where I grew up and live now is mostly Jamaicans and Indians.

However, when I was around 10, my dad remarried and moved us out of the city. My dad is white (my late mother was Indian), and my dad's wife is white so basically they just did what they wanted to do and didn't really have a lot of perception of how it would affect me and my sister. We went to the nearest small city to school for a few years and that whole place was racist as hell.

There were a lot of Neo-Nazi's there, both on a street gang level and a political level of extreme right-wing conservatives, the kind of people who have slogans such as "Keep Britain British" etc, blame all problems on ethnic minorities, etc. Bad times. I got out as soon as I could.

I'm laughing while reading this, not at you, but at these UK orgers who have tried their best to put out this smug "You Americans! We don't quibble on race like you peasants do" attitude in this board

I have NEVER met a UK born person of color who have tried to trivialized the racial climate in UK, its usually somebody white who's either genuinely ignorant about the situation, or know very well but still remain indifferent. Either way, I look at those people with great suspicion, because ignorance & indifference have a long history of putting black people's lives at risk in the USA, it didn't even matter that some of the ignorant/indifferent white people had good intentions to begin with and were busy with their own lives, that wasn't good enough.

That has always tripped me out. They seem to forget that it was England that went over to Africa and brought the slaves over to America while it was still in it's infancy stages. They also seem to forget that most of us are descendants of the British.

vainandy said:

Harlepolis said:

I'm laughing while reading this, not at you, but at these UK orgers who have tried their best to put out this smug "You Americans! We don't quibble on race like you peasants do" attitude in this board

I have NEVER met a UK born person of color who have tried to trivialized the racial climate in UK, its usually somebody white who's either genuinely ignorant about the situation, or know very well but still remain indifferent. Either way, I look at those people with great suspicion, because ignorance & indifference have a long history of putting black people's lives at risk in the USA, it didn't even matter that some of the ignorant/indifferent white people had good intentions to begin with and were busy with their own lives, that wasn't good enough.

That has always tripped me out. They seem to forget that it was England that went over to Africa and brought the slaves over to America while it was still in it's infancy stages. They also seem to forget that most of us are descendants of the British.

Many also forget that many British men, during the infancy stages of America and in the Caribbean, during the slavery era, gave birth to a whole lot of black and brown children, where many of those children have descendants today, walking around in America and throughout the Caribbean, with the British surnames of many of those British men, who are their great-grandfathers (from a few generations back to the slave era).

[Edited 6/17/11 9:42am]

Any British person trying to downplay the racism of this country is deluded, likely white, and/or never been outside any of the 10 biggest cities.

And, the racism here on an institutional level is likely worse than it is in the US. The same rich landowner families have held the power for hundreds of years. That's what the House of Lords is. At least the US is in a position where there can be a black president. That could NEVER happen here. I'd be hard pressed to think of more than half a dozen minority politicians period, across ALL the different political parties. Hell, the current prime minister is descended from royalty and went to the same school as the princes.

The whole institution of landowners and the royal family, etc, should be broken down and abolished.

There's an EXTREMELY low glass ceiling of where you can get in the UK if you're not white. Even the BBC, a liberal media organisation, has almost no black people working there. Even the former head of the corporation said so. It's disgusting.

Even just a couple of years ago, a cousin of mine who is married to a white woman, went on a vacation to what seemed like a pleasant sea-side town not too far from where they live, they went into a fish and chip shop and the owner said "Get out, we don't serve your kind".

Yeah. In the 21st fucking century this shit still happens.

Militant said:

Any British person trying to downplay the racism of this country is deluded, likely white, and/or never been outside any of the 10 biggest cities.

And, the racism here on an institutional level is likely worse than it is in the US. The same rich landowner families have held the power for hundreds of years. That's what the House of Lords is. At least the US is in a position where there can be a black president. That could NEVER happen here. I'd be hard pressed to think of more than half a dozen minority politicians period, across ALL the different political parties. Hell, the current prime minister is descended from royalty and went to the same school as the princes.

The whole institution of landowners and the royal family, etc, should be broken down and abolished.

There's an EXTREMELY low glass ceiling of where you can get in the UK if you're not white. Even the BBC, a liberal media organisation, has almost no black people working there. Even the former head of the corporation said so. It's disgusting.

Even just a couple of years ago, a cousin of mine who is married to a white woman, went on a vacation to what seemed like a pleasant sea-side town not too far from where they live, they went into a fish and chip shop and the owner said "Get out, we don't serve your kind".

Yeah. In the 21st fucking century this shit still happens.

Somehow, I shouldn't be surprise about the BBC at all. I mean, how many years did it take for The Doctor to finally have a black companion on the TARDIS?!?

Militant said:

Any British person trying to downplay the racism of this country is deluded, likely white, and/or never been outside any of the 10 biggest cities.

And, the racism here on an institutional level is likely worse than it is in the US. The same rich landowner families have held the power for hundreds of years. That's what the House of Lords is. At least the US is in a position where there can be a black president. That could NEVER happen here. I'd be hard pressed to think of more than half a dozen minority politicians period, across ALL the different political parties. Hell, the current prime minister is descended from royalty and went to the same school as the princes.

The whole institution of landowners and the royal family, etc, should be broken down and abolished.

There's an EXTREMELY low glass ceiling of where you can get in the UK if you're not white. Even the BBC, a liberal media organisation, has almost no black people working there. Even the former head of the corporation said so. It's disgusting.

Even just a couple of years ago, a cousin of mine who is married to a white woman, went on a vacation to what seemed like a pleasant sea-side town not too far from where they live, they went into a fish and chip shop and the owner said "Get out, we don't serve your kind".

Yeah. In the 21st fucking century this shit still happens.

Wow. I think I'm beginning to learn a lot from you and orger Deebee about race issues in the UK. Thanks for enlightening some of us on this issue. I really never thought it was that deep, but based on what you're telling me, I guess it is. I think those who may not see racial issuesin the UK, the same way you and others do, are probably those whose daily lives are not affected by it. It will be interesting to hear the opinions of more UK orgers on this issue as well. Thanks for sharing.

[Edited 6/17/11 9:43am]

Sinead O'Conner's "Black Boys on Mopeds" Unplugged.....

Brilliant*