Janis wasn't particularly undercover about her bisexuality nor were many others of the rock crew.....back then music folks just didn't talk much about their sexuality as they do now. Folks just assumed (rightly in most cases) that they were TRYsexuals. Janis probably attracted both sexes pretty equally.
Funny thing about Cass, she was actually much more popular than Michelle Phillips even tho Michelle was the dime. That whole M&P crew was out there in every way.
All the women described so far in this thread have what the French call "chien" IMHO. It translates literally as "dog" but it doesn't mean that on this case. It's like they have a feral sexuality that shows in their faces...it's not about "pretty" or "ugly" more of having an IT quality that defies and is independent of conventional beauty.
That is exactly what I meant. Janis was never caught on camera.
Uh...not sure what you mean by that statement... Janis was filmed performing several times...
"Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination and life to everything." --Plato
This thread now has me pondering who is the ugliest successful female singer?
I would go with Whitney Houston as I've always thought she was extremely ugly even in the 80's but I've been shocked to find out shes considered beautiful by alot of people.
As for Madonna, yes she was very sexy in the Virgin years but I think gained alot of respect when she changed her look up for True Blue even though it wasn't considered a very attractive look. She went back to being beautiful for Like A Prayer and then made herself over the top again for Erotica. I noticed thats what Madonna tends to do, go back and forth between traditionally sexy and ugly looks. Thats why some consider her beautiful and some consider her ugly.
She's had some great photographs taken of her, but I wouldn't consider her a beautiful woman.
Agreed it's not like she's Shitney Spears...
Eye Was Born & Raised On The Same Plantation In The United States Of The Red, White And Blue Eye Never Knew That Eye Was Different Til Dr. King Was On The Balcony
Lying In A Bloody Pool......Call me a Dreamer 2 - R.I.P - James Brown and Michael Jackson
That is exactly what I meant. Janis was never caught on camera.
Uh...not sure what you mean by that statement... Janis was filmed performing several times...
I think he means Janis wasn't caught having sex on camera w/ a woman or a man. It's kinda strange to say this because given when she died, home video of any sort (cameras, VHS/Beta, etc) was almost non existant and/or mind blowingly expensive in 1970. It did exist but it was in a very primitive stage and few had access to it.
Even if she had been caught on tape, I'm not so sure she'd have cared about how people viewed her because of her sexuality.
Besides Janis had Albert Grossman for management, so even if something had emerged then, he'd have handled the sitch just the same as it was frequently handled w/ the male stars pre-video, pre-net.
One thing emerges here...almost all the "ugly" women named in this thread started their careers BEFORE the music video era began. Most were firmly established artists by then. Madonna, Celine, Mariah, etc...started after that and none were considered particularly "ugly" even if they weren't thought "beautiful". IOW I doubt most would have made it AFTER the music video era if they had been thought ugly outright. Could Patti Smith have made it in 1985? I have serious doubts.
Video really did kill the radio star in some ways.
One thing emerges here...almost all the "ugly" women named in this thread started their careers BEFORE the music video era began. Most were firmly established artists by then. Madonna, Celine, Mariah, etc...started after that and none were considered particularly "ugly" even if they weren't thought "beautiful". IOW I doubt most would have made it AFTER the music video era if they had been thought ugly outright. Could Patti Smith have made it in 1985? I have serious doubts.
Video really did kill the radio star in some ways.
That's not true, the variety show format was a staple of U.S. TV programming from TV's inception until the late 70's / early 80's; that format sole purpose was to push music. This notion that artist weren't seen or people didn' knew what artisti/bands/musicians look like, is baseless. Vairety shows were weekly and aired 6 days a week. . . not to speak of the talk shows and local TV programming in major metropolitan areas in the US. In highsight, the diversity and the artist that were shown were amazing. They'd had Opera, Country & Western, Blues, Jazz and R&B artist on the same show. Should I add American Band Stand and Soul Train?
Less not speak of the magazine such a Life and Look. . .
That is exactly what I meant. Janis was never caught on camera.
Uh...not sure what you mean by that statement... Janis was filmed performing several times...
Plus she seemed photogenic. I've seen photos of her and I think naturally she was beautiful for what she is.
What made Madonna successful contributes to a lot of things:
She's photogenic.
She has good connections.
She knows what kind of music she wants to sell.
She was always a great negotiator.
It has less to do with her looks but for the most part because she also came at the right time when music videos started to become in sync and she was part of the first big wave of that when music videos became a pop culture moment.
If it was for just looks, I doubt she'd last this long. Leif Garrett can't sing worth a damn but back in his day he was a boyish dream. Now he's a sad sack losing his mind on heroin and cocaine.
One thing emerges here...almost all the "ugly" women named in this thread started their careers BEFORE the music video era began. Most were firmly established artists by then. Madonna, Celine, Mariah, etc...started after that and none were considered particularly "ugly" even if they weren't thought "beautiful". IOW I doubt most would have made it AFTER the music video era if they had been thought ugly outright. Could Patti Smith have made it in 1985? I have serious doubts.
Video really did kill the radio star in some ways.
That's not true, the variety show format was a staple of U.S. TV programming from TV's inception until the late 70's / early 80's; that format sole purpose was to push music. This notion that artist weren't seen or people didn' knew what artisti/bands/musicians look like, is baseless. Vairety shows were weekly and aired 6 days a week. . . not to speak of the talk shows and local TV programming in major metropolitan areas in the US. In highsight, the diversity in the artist that were shown was amazing. They'd have Opera, Country & Western, Blues, Jazz and R&B artist on the same show. Should I had American Band Stand and Soul Train?
Less not speak of the magazine such a Life and Look. . .
Yes she would. Madonna is more sexy than pretty. Sex appeal carries more weight than "prettiness" and the more sexy Madonna got, the more successful she became.
I'M NOT SAYING YOU'RE UGLY. YOU JUST HAVE BAD LUCK WHEN IT COMES TO MIRRORS AND SUNLIGHT! RIP Dick Clark, Whitney Houston, Don Cornelius, Heavy D, and Donna Summer.
MEMO: Janis Joplin, Wendy O. Williams, & Nina Hagen are THE only ugly women that ever had a music career.
No way is Nina Hagen ugly
With a very special thank you to Tina: Is hammer already absolute, how much some people verändern...ICH hope is never so I will be! And if, then I hope that I would then have wen in my environment who joins me in the A....
MEMO: Janis Joplin, Wendy O. Williams, & Nina Hagen are THE only ugly women that ever had a music career.
No way is Nina Hagen ugly
Thank you! Looking at those old vids of her and pics of her up until her mid 30s she was quite pretty and needed little makeup unlike some of these chicks trolliping around today.
I'M NOT SAYING YOU'RE UGLY. YOU JUST HAVE BAD LUCK WHEN IT COMES TO MIRRORS AND SUNLIGHT! RIP Dick Clark, Whitney Houston, Don Cornelius, Heavy D, and Donna Summer.
Debbie Harry is said to be the first female singer to be a sex symbol.
True?
I guess you've never heard of any of these:
Nina Mae McKinney
Lena Horne
Rita Hayworth
Josephine Baker
Peggy Lee
Blanche Calloway
Ethel Waters
The Ronettes
Astrud Gilberto
June Christy
Tammi Terrell
Iris Chacon
Charro
Marlyn McCoo & Florence LaRue
You can take a black guy to Nashville from right out of the cotton fields with bib overalls, and they will call him R&B. You can take a white guy in a pin-stripe suit who’s never seen a cotton field, and they will call him country. ~ O. B. McClinton
One thing emerges here...almost all the "ugly" women named in this thread started their careers BEFORE the music video era began. Most were firmly established artists by then. Madonna, Celine, Mariah, etc...started after that and none were considered particularly "ugly" even if they weren't thought "beautiful". IOW I doubt most would have made it AFTER the music video era if they had been thought ugly outright. Could Patti Smith have made it in 1985? I have serious doubts.
Video really did kill the radio star in some ways.
That's not true, the variety show format was a staple of U.S. TV programming from TV's inception until the late 70's / early 80's; that format sole purpose was to push music. This notion that artist weren't seen or people didn' knew what artisti/bands/musicians look like, is baseless. Vairety shows were weekly and aired 6 days a week. . . not to speak of the talk shows and local TV programming in major metropolitan areas in the US. In highsight, the diversity and the artist that were shown were amazing. They'd had Opera, Country & Western, Blues, Jazz and R&B artist on the same show. Should I add American Band Stand and Soul Train?
Less not speak of the magazine such a Life and Look. . .
==================
[Edited 1/19/11 11:01am]
LOL...where'd you get all this from? I never said Janis was unseen and I know there was the variety show format, but can you really compare seeing an artist a few times a year on tv to seeing them several times in rotation in a single day? It was the high rotation that made image so much more important than ever. Madonna and a few other video pioneers got that. Those that didn't tended to be left by the wayside. "Video killed the radio star" was indeed true because it did for quite a few.
Seeing these artists was a special event, but most people were familiar w/ them via their records and perhaps (if lucky) live performances. Music videos changed dramatically how people consume music and artists.
There's a saying "familiarity breeds contempt" and that's definitely true for music artists that are constantly being accused of being overexposed these days.
Debbie Harry is said to be the first female singer to be a sex symbol.
True?
I guess you've never heard of any of these:
Nina Mae McKinney
Lena Horne
Rita Hayworth
Josephine Baker
Peggy Lee
Blanche Calloway
Ethel Waters
The Ronettes
Astrud Gilberto
June Christy
Tammi Terrell
Iris Chacon
Charro
Marlyn McCoo & Florence LaRue
To add to your list the marvelous Julliette Greco, BB (Brigitte Bardot), Marianne Faithfull, and Jane Birkin. LOL...I'm just mainly on the French 60s, but there have been plenty more.
That's not true, the variety show format was a staple of U.S. TV programming from TV's inception until the late 70's / early 80's; that format sole purpose was to push music. This notion that artist weren't seen or people didn' knew what artisti/bands/musicians look like, is baseless. Vairety shows were weekly and aired 6 days a week. . . not to speak of the talk shows and local TV programming in major metropolitan areas in the US. In highsight, the diversity and the artist that were shown were amazing. They'd had Opera, Country & Western, Blues, Jazz and R&B artist on the same show. Should I add American Band Stand and Soul Train?
Less not speak of the magazine such a Life and Look. . .
==================
[Edited 1/19/11 11:01am]
LOL...where'd you get all this from? I never said Janis was unseen and I know there was the variety show format, but can you really compare seeing an artist a few times a year on tv to seeing them several times in rotation in a single day? It was the high rotation that made image so much more important than ever. Madonna and a few other video pioneers got that. Those that didn't tended to be left by the wayside. "Video killed the radio star" was indeed true because it did for quite a few.
Seeing these artists was a special event, but most people were familiar w/ them via their records and perhaps (if lucky) live performances. Music videos changed dramatically how people consume music and artists.
There's a saying "familiarity breeds contempt" and that's definitely true for music artists that are constantly being accused of being overexposed these days.
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Janis wasn't particularly undercover about her bisexuality nor were many others of the rock crew.....back then music folks just didn't talk much about their sexuality as they do now. Folks just assumed (rightly in most cases) that they were TRYsexuals. 
It did exist but it was in a very primitive stage and few had access to it.
And neither is Janis nor Wendy O. (though those injuries to her face didn't help matters over the years).
Now from the neck to toes, she was definitely fit. 