LittleBLUECorvette said:

whatsgoingon said:

The funny thing about is that there was so little hype before and just after the album was released. Infact initial record sales were quite slow.

[Edited 1/1/11 14:12pm]

It probably had to do with the first single being "The Girl Is Mine"

Unlike the Bad and Dangerous albums there was just so little hype from the beginning. The Bad and Dangerous albums were hyped up before their release, this was not the case with Thriller, it got very little hype on the release.

whatsgoingon said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

It probably had to do with the first single being "The Girl Is Mine"

Unlike the Bad and Dangerous albums there was just so little hype from the beginning. The Bad and Dangerous albums were hyped up before their release, this was not the case with Thriller, it got very little hype on the release.

But the Bad and Dangerous hype probably steems from Thriller ...

LittleBLUECorvette said:

whatsgoingon said:

Unlike the Bad and Dangerous albums there was just so little hype from the beginning. The Bad and Dangerous albums were hyped up before their release, this was not the case with Thriller, it got very little hype on the release.

But the Bad and Dangerous hype probably steems from Thriller ...

Exactly.

Timmy84 said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

But the Bad and Dangerous hype probably steems from Thriller ...

Exactly.

Were any albums hyped up back then like they are now?

The only one I know of is Songs in The Key Of Life.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Timmy84 said:

Exactly.

Were any albums hyped up back then like they are now?

The only one I know of is Songs in The Key Of Life.

I doubt it though I kept hearing people were hotly anticipating Marvin's final album...

whatsgoingon said:

xlad said:

whatsgoingon said: I grew up during the Thriller era, that album was everywhere! A group of us neighborhood kids memorized the Thriller video, we used to perform it every night in the street to the audio of the video I recorded on my ghetto blaster! Every day there was something in the newspapers about Michael, his songs were constantly on the radio. I remember tuning into a French radio show just so I could hear one of the first plays of State Of Shock! The Thriller campaign truly was international.

The funny thing about is that there was so little hype before and just after the album was released. Infact initial record sales were quite slow.

[Edited 1/1/11 14:12pm]

I was looking around for articles from early to late 1982 about the album and there wasn't much, just some mentioning that it was coming. There was an article in December 1982 right after the album was released that stations were adding the official second single (Billie Jean) to playlists but pop stations were also playing Beat It too, which was unexpected

Here's some from Billboard Magazine

September 25, 1982

[img:$uid]http://i52.tinypic.com/2i95j81.jpg[/img:$uid]

December 11, 1982

[img:$uid]http://i52.tinypic.com/dvh7wp.jpg[/img:$uid]

[img:$uid]http://i53.tinypic.com/24vimac.jpg[/img:$uid]

December 18, 1982

[img:$uid]http://i52.tinypic.com/2u6dzls.jpg[/img:$uid]

[img:$uid]http://i56.tinypic.com/aaf3uw.jpg[/img:$uid]

[img:$uid]http://i54.tinypic.com/jhr3us.jpg[/img:$uid]

Timmy84 said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

But the Bad and Dangerous hype probably steems from Thriller ...

Exactly.

That is true. Bad and Dangerous were hyped up because of the success of Thriller. That's why Dangerous would have never sold as much as Thriller, even without the child-abuse allegations, inspite of what many fans liked to think. It was too hype led. The Dangeous and Bad albums sold on the basis of the initial hype and the fact that he did tours for both of these albums. Once the initial hype faded and the tours finished the album sales went down. That was not the case with Thriller.

Dang I Know Michael Jackson contributed alot to the less fortunate but i didn't know he did this much which is amazing

http://www.thesilencedtru...;Itemid=59

whatsgoingon said:

Timmy84 said:

Exactly.

That is true. Bad and Dangerous were hyped up because of the success of Thriller. That's why Dangerous would have never sold as much as Thriller, even without the child-abuse allegations, inspite of what many fans liked to think. It was too hype led. The Dangeous and Bad albums sold on the basis of the initial hype and the fact that he did tours for both of these albums. Once the initial hype faded and the tours finished the album sales went down. That was not the case with Thriller.

You're right. IMO Bad and Dangerous are stronger, songwriting wise, than Thriller but the hype was a disadvantage for both albums.

Thriller was in the Top 10 for for at least 70 weeks

Bad spent 39 weeks

Dangerous spent 18 weeks

whatsgoingon said:

That is true. Bad and Dangerous were hyped up because of the success of Thriller. That's why Dangerous would have never sold as much as Thriller, even without the child-abuse allegations, inspite of what many fans liked to think. It was too hype led. The Dangeous and Bad albums sold on the basis of the initial hype and the fact that he did tours for both of these albums. Once the initial hype faded and the tours finished the album sales went down. That was not the case with Thriller.

Yeah well about every artist has their peak and they slip on from there. I don't know of any other pop artist, including all forms of pop, that has sold such consistently high numbers as MJ. Even if Bad and Dangerous will never touch the sales of Thriller in this lifetime, they both have sold around similarly high numbers. In fact his sales in Europe for Bad and Dangerous are still pretty close. So I think that for every country...it's different. Example, in Germany his best selling album is HIStory. So, even though MJ's Thriller consistently sells in the states, it varies very much in other countries.

Actually, the US only accounts for about 1/3 of his total sales.

whatsgoingon said:

HAPPYPERSON said:

Dang I Know Michael Jackson contributed alot to the less fortunate but i didn't know he did this much which is amazing

http://www.thesilencedtru...;Itemid=59

It really IS amazing. Besides his musical achievements,MJ was an all-around AMAZING human being.

Militant said:

So I got an email back from of the professors/editors for Popular Music and Society and she said that the issue isn't going to come out until early 2012. Well...part of me is glad that they're going to take their time on it, but it's gonna be a long wait.

http://www.popms.org/

SherryJackson said:

Militant said:

bboy87 said:

whatsgoingon said:

That is true. Bad and Dangerous were hyped up because of the success of Thriller. That's why Dangerous would have never sold as much as Thriller, even without the child-abuse allegations, inspite of what many fans liked to think. It was too hype led. The Dangeous and Bad albums sold on the basis of the initial hype and the fact that he did tours for both of these albums. Once the initial hype faded and the tours finished the album sales went down. That was not the case with Thriller.

You're right. IMO Bad and Dangerous are stronger, songwriting wise, than Thriller but the hype was a disadvantage for both albums.

Thriller was in the Top 10 for for at least 70 weeks

Bad spent 39 weeks

Dangerous spent 18 weeks

You mean songwriting wise in your personal opinion. Dangerous and Bad aint even close to Off the Wall and Thriller.

BabyBeMine said:

bboy87 said:

You're right. IMO Bad and Dangerous are stronger, songwriting wise, than Thriller but the hype was a disadvantage for both albums.

Thriller was in the Top 10 for for at least 70 weeks

Bad spent 39 weeks

Dangerous spent 18 weeks

You mean songwriting wise in your personal opinion. Dangerous and Bad aint even close to Off the Wall and Thriller.

I said that I put the IMO right there

^ I've noticed on most message boards people don't respect the IMHO tag real well, they always gotta put their thought across as if it's a fact. I've noticed that.

Militant said:

is this for real?

Vanilli said:

Love this footage. Remember seeing it as a kid.

Oh Cool..I was just looking for this a couple days ago. There used to be a longer clip. Great quailty..

PurpleDiamond2009 said:

Militant said:

is this for real?

OF course not.

bboy87 said:

BabyBeMine said:

You mean songwriting wise in your personal opinion. Dangerous and Bad aint even close to Off the Wall and Thriller.

I said that I put the IMO right there

LOL read READ!!!

Ok I've only just come back to these threads after months of missing them so maybe all the talk on the new album is over, but I'm listening to some of the songs on youtube (as I'm refusing to buy it so far) and I have a few questions and comments.

So far out of the ones I've listened to is it Hollywood Tonight, Keep Your Head Up, Monster and Breaking News that people dont think are Michael? They're the ones that made me raise an eyebrow (especially Keep your head up which sounds like they've put a random snippet of the damn elephant part of earth song in it and maybe an invincible ad lib in Monster). It actually makes me furious as I continue listening as even if they were Michael they've distorted his voice beyond recognition where its not worth buying anyway. Its also like they've put every single Michael cliche they could possibly think of which is another reason I'm inclined to believe its not him at all. Those songs happen to be pretty bland too. So who here bought this and who didnt? I love the few songs that sounds like him so I'm torn on whether to get it or not just for them.

Arnotts said:

Ok I've only just come back to these threads after months of missing them so maybe all the talk on the new album is over, but I'm listening to some of the songs on youtube (as I'm refusing to buy it so far) and I have a few questions and comments.

So far out of the ones I've listened to is it Hollywood Tonight, Keep Your Head Up, Monster and Breaking News that people dont think are Michael? They're the ones that made me raise an eyebrow (especially Keep your head up which sounds like they've put a random snippet of the damn elephant part of earth song in it and maybe an invincible ad lib in Monster). It actually makes me furious as I continue listening as even if they were Michael they've distorted his voice beyond recognition where its not worth buying anyway. Its also like they've put every single Michael cliche they could possibly think of which is another reason I'm inclined to believe its not him at all. Those songs happen to be pretty bland too. So who here bought this and who didnt? I love the few songs that sounds like him so I'm torn on whether to get it or not just for them.

People think Monster, Keep Your Head Up and Breaking News is either someone else or Michael with someone else overdubbed

You NEED to check out Behind The Mask and Much Too Soon.....NOW

NOW!

bboy87 said:

Arnotts said:

Ok I've only just come back to these threads after months of missing them so maybe all the talk on the new album is over, but I'm listening to some of the songs on youtube (as I'm refusing to buy it so far) and I have a few questions and comments.

So far out of the ones I've listened to is it Hollywood Tonight, Keep Your Head Up, Monster and Breaking News that people dont think are Michael? They're the ones that made me raise an eyebrow (especially Keep your head up which sounds like they've put a random snippet of the damn elephant part of earth song in it and maybe an invincible ad lib in Monster). It actually makes me furious as I continue listening as even if they were Michael they've distorted his voice beyond recognition where its not worth buying anyway. Its also like they've put every single Michael cliche they could possibly think of which is another reason I'm inclined to believe its not him at all. Those songs happen to be pretty bland too. So who here bought this and who didnt? I love the few songs that sounds like him so I'm torn on whether to get it or not just for them.

People think Monster, Keep Your Head Up and Breaking News is either someone else or Michael with someone else overdubbed

You NEED to check out Behind The Mask and Much Too Soon.....NOW

NOW!

I cant find Much Too Soon on youtube but am listening to Behind the Mask right now and it truly is awesome. I already knew The Way you Love Me so didnt bother with that but is it better than the ultimate collection one? And I love the Lenny Kravits song (although I could only find the original leaked version). Why is it so damn hard to find this album on the net? Did you buy it and do you think its worth it? (And when I say worth it I mean contributing to sony and having them release more sham songs) I'm really starting to cave but I cant stand those other four songs. Oh so Hollywood Tonight is actually him? It didnt really sound like him either to me but maybe thats just the distortion and ridiculous talking part in the middle which I dont think they're even trying to pretend is him?

Arnotts said:

bboy87 said:

People think Monster, Keep Your Head Up and Breaking News is either someone else or Michael with someone else overdubbed

You NEED to check out Behind The Mask and Much Too Soon.....NOW

NOW!

I cant find Much Too Soon on youtube but am listening to Behind the Mask right now and it truly is awesome. I already knew The Way you Love Me so didnt bother with that but is it better than the ultimate collection one? And I love the Lenny Kravits song (although I could only find the original leaked version). Why is it so damn hard to find this album on the net? Did you buy it and do you think its worth it? (And when I say worth it I mean contributing to sony and having them release more sham songs) I'm really starting to cave but I cant stand those other four songs. Oh so Hollywood Tonight is actually him? It didnt really sound like him either to me but maybe thats just the distortion and ridiculous talking part in the middle which I dont think they're even trying to pretend is him?

Sony have been on lockdown with the sharing of the songs. The album leaked a week or 2 before it was released but in lower quality (it leaked in 192 while CD quality is 320)

I bought it for various reasons:

I'm a completist

The booklet and the complete cover

to read the liner notes

I wanted to hear them in the highest quality available

Hollywood Tonight BUT the spoken part is Taryll, which I happen to think is really cool

bboy87 said:

Arnotts said:

I cant find Much Too Soon on youtube but am listening to Behind the Mask right now and it truly is awesome. I already knew The Way you Love Me so didnt bother with that but is it better than the ultimate collection one? And I love the Lenny Kravits song (although I could only find the original leaked version). Why is it so damn hard to find this album on the net? Did you buy it and do you think its worth it? (And when I say worth it I mean contributing to sony and having them release more sham songs) I'm really starting to cave but I cant stand those other four songs. Oh so Hollywood Tonight is actually him? It didnt really sound like him either to me but maybe thats just the distortion and ridiculous talking part in the middle which I dont think they're even trying to pretend is him?

Sony have been on lockdown with the sharing of the songs. The album leaked a week or 2 before it was released but in lower quality (it leaked in 192 while CD quality is 320)

I bought it for various reasons:

I'm a completist

The booklet and the complete cover

to read the liner notes

I wanted to hear them in the highest quality available

Hollywood Tonight BUT the spoken part is Taryll, which I happen to think is really cool

Hmmm I just found the real album previews on another site so the stuff I was listening to on youtube was fake versions of the 'fake' songs! Ha no wonder there were History and invincible snippets on those songs. Unless I just missed it on repeated listenings. God I'm so confused by all of this I think I'll just buy the damn album! Overall though its still a dissapoinment from my initial expectations.

Arnotts said:

Ok I've only just come back to these threads after months of missing them so maybe all the talk on the new album is over, but I'm listening to some of the songs on youtube (as I'm refusing to buy it so far) and I have a few questions and comments.

So far out of the ones I've listened to is it Hollywood Tonight, Keep Your Head Up, Monster and Breaking News that people dont think are Michael? They're the ones that made me raise an eyebrow (especially Keep your head up which sounds like they've put a random snippet of the damn elephant part of earth song in it and maybe an invincible ad lib in Monster). It actually makes me furious as I continue listening as even if they were Michael they've distorted his voice beyond recognition where its not worth buying anyway. Its also like they've put every single Michael cliche they could possibly think of which is another reason I'm inclined to believe its not him at all. Those songs happen to be pretty bland too. So who here bought this and who didnt? I love the few songs that sounds like him so I'm torn on whether to get it or not just for them.

Breaking News, Keep Your Head Up, and Monster are the three fake songs.

Hollywood Tonight is real and is actually Michael, apart from the spoken part, which as bboy says, is done by Tarryl Jackson.

And yes, Keep Your Head Up does have pasted in adlibs from "Earth Song". There was even more of them in the version that leaked a couple weeks before the album lol. It's ridiculous.

Oh, and I'm with bboy. "Bad" and "Dangerous" smoke "Thriller" and "Off The Wall" for songwriting. Without question. Deeper topics, more of MICHAEL's personality shining through since he wrote more of the songs himself, more range. As a professional songwriter myself, it's "Bad", "Dangerous" and "HIStory" that inspire me the most of all Michael's work.

"Off The Wall" and "Thriller" are classic albums, no doubt. But the songwriting range is limited and dominated by simple love songs. The later albums covered racism, drugs, socio-political topics, oppression, discrimination, humanitarianism, betrayal, crime, greed, the agenda of the media and corporations, and more.

Even the love songs on these albums are deeper, covering lost love, unreturned feelings, people confusing lust with love, etc. As opposed to the "Girl you're so hot and I love you" simplicity of many of the songs on "Off The Wall" and "Thriller".

Anyone who thinks the songwriting palette on those first two albums is better than the later albums, is simply wrong. It's not a question of taste. You can PREFER which songs you want.

But objectively, Michael's songwriting improved dramatically throughout the 80's and 90's.

70's and early 80's Michael could not have written "Smooth Criminal", "Money", "Blood on The Dancefloor", "Earth Song", "Tabloid Junkie", "Why You Wanna Trip On Me?", "History", "Morphine", etc. He simply was not a skilled enough songwriter, at that time.

It's the same with most artists. Prince of 1978 probably could not have written things like "Sign O' The Times" or "Anna Stesia". The Beatles, when they first started, did not have the songwriting skills they later developed that led to such albums as "Sgt Peppers", etc.

Just like most skills, songwriting is something that you get better at, the more you do. This is the case for the vast majority of artists. I've been a professional artist for 7 years, and I know there's no way I could have written the songs I write now, when I started.