Moonwalkbjrain said:

Curtwill1975 said:

Well, this is not going to happen because she will always work with producers. Producers are pretty much the backbone of the genre she's in. She's not Prince or R.Kelly and not trying to be(BBC Interview, it's on youtube...around the 7:25 mark). She brings in producers when composing songs from stratch or she gets demos and overseas her product and/or adds things(because she has her own studio) for whatever she wants for the track.

And people weren't saying this of MJ when all he did was work with Quincy or Janet when all she did was work with Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis(But i co sign everyone else who said that she needs to stop working with all the same people.). Especally when Bey works with a lot of different producers, she didn't work with the Neptunes(for example) or Rich Harrison on her last album era and they usually produce funk influenced tracks for her(Work it out, Kitty Kat, Green Light in the case of the Neptunes and CIL, Be with You and Freekum Dress in Rich Harrison's case).

[Edited 11/20/10 10:22am]

Well I know she's going to ALWAYS work with producers, and thats probably why she's not necesarily going to get where shes talking about going. And i dont mean to put forth that working with producers is bad BUT when you work with all the same people, or same TYPES of people your going to get the same sound. if i wanted to create a new type of music and i typically work with hip hop/ r b/ dance producersa i'm probably not going to do anything but create of fusion of those genres, BUT that is not new.

as far asthe mj/ janet comparison i'm NOT knocking beyonce @ all. BUT for her to say "i'm going to create a new genre of music" that takes ALOT of thinking outside of the box and takign risks by working with new people/ new types of sounds. i dnt ever recall mj (lets leave janet out of this cuz i'm not much of a jj rider) saying i'm going to create a new genre. i DO however, recall him being active in the writing/ producing process most if not all of the time. which if beyonce does that (which she has claimed to do) then that is great. more power to her.

i think she should if anything take a page from her sisters book. love or hate solange but that girl iss NOT doing the same thing as everyone else. she's not blindly riding bandwagons and her music is, if anything, more interesting as a result

[Edited 11/20/10 19:53pm]

I love the direction Solange is going in. She's definitely a rebel.

Timmy84 said:

Moonwalkbjrain said:

Well I know she's going to ALWAYS work with producers, and thats probably why she's not necesarily going to get where shes talking about going. And i dont mean to put forth that working with producers is bad BUT when you work with all the same people, or same TYPES of people your going to get the same sound. if i wanted to create a new type of music and i typically work with hip hop/ r b/ dance producersa i'm probably not going to do anything but create of fusion of those genres, BUT that is not new.

as far asthe mj/ janet comparison i'm NOT knocking beyonce @ all. BUT for her to say "i'm going to create a new genre of music" that takes ALOT of thinking outside of the box and takign risks by working with new people/ new types of sounds. i dnt ever recall mj (lets leave janet out of this cuz i'm not much of a jj rider) saying i'm going to create a new genre. i DO however, recall him being active in the writing/ producing process most if not all of the time. which if beyonce does that (which she has claimed to do) then that is great. more power to her.

i think she should if anything take a page from her sisters book. love or hate solange but that girl iss NOT doing the same thing as everyone else. she's not blindly riding bandwagons and her music is, if anything, more interesting as a result

[Edited 11/20/10 19:53pm]

I love the direction Solange is going in. She's definitely a rebel.

Solange is the best out of the two (not talking about the music just in general lol ) I don't listen to her music though.

Curtwill1975 said:

It's almost 7 mil actually, but I can deal with the mistake. Either way, that's still a lot of albums sold for today's music.

I think that 7 million number is just an estimation rather than 'confirmed' sales. =/

Unholyalliance said:

Beyonce said:

"... I'm actually in the studio writing songs...

[img:$uid]http://i33.tinypic.com/xmlan5.jpg[/img:$uid]

SoulAlive said:

I have a lot of live instruments that I'm putting into the tracks to change the sound and make my own genre of music."

So, by using live instruments, she is creating her "own genre of music"?? As if noboby else has ever done that before.

Hell, if you spent a lot of time "borrowing" other people music and putting your lame lyrics to it, "I wrote this song". You'd think this was a new concept too.

babybugz said:

Timmy84 said:

I love the direction Solange is going in. She's definitely a rebel.

Solange is the best out of the two (not talking about the music just in general lol ) I don't listen to her music though.

I listen to some of it, it's nice (not the crap she had when she first came out ). The new album is supposed to be influenced by new wave, hopefully she sticks to that lol

What will she be calling this new genre? Oooh, how about 'horse shit'...that's a good title for it. I'll believe she's making a new sound when she starts wearing her natural hair, which will probably be never so there ya go. Oh, and that trench coat was the only hot thing during that VMA performance so I'll give her props for picking it but even she said she stole the idea from Angelina Jolie in 'Mr. and Mrs. Smith' so I guess I'll give Angelina the props instead.

Let's face it, the world is Beyonce's oyster and no matter what she releases or says, the world is going to eat it up. I am what some would call a Beyonce "hater" because I have always felt her success was fraudulent in that vocally she is overrated, she doesn't have a original bone in her body, she has taken credit for work she didn't do SEVERAL TIMES, her "writing skills" are as shallow as a kiddy pool, and a huge part of her success is due to her big butt,, light skin and blonde hair.

The whole world has been decieved into believing this girl is the best thing since sliced Bread, resulting in practically everything she touches turning into gold. She is in the History books already and a new album, no matter who produces it, will only solidify her position even more.

[Edited 11/21/10 17:23pm]

Unholyalliance said:

Beyonce said:

"... I'm actually in the studio writing songs...

[img:$uid]http://i33.tinypic.com/xmlan5.jpg[/img:$uid]

stop

Creating your own genre of music is high risk. Everyone who does is a lone wolf.

She easily could do it under an assumed name... Norah Jones did a side project called El Madmo where she was in a rock band and was able to get away with it for a while.

"Writing" means she gets handed songs, she goes in the studio and starts rewriting, and gets partial credit."

Of course Prince has made a few nickels from "Bonnie and Clyde '03".

I've never heard anyone say they were trying to create a new genre. They just say "we're trying something different, but wait until you hear it."

Moonwalkbjrain said:

Curtwill1975 said:

Well, this is not going to happen because she will always work with producers. Producers are pretty much the backbone of the genre she's in. She's not Prince or R.Kelly and not trying to be(BBC Interview, it's on youtube...around the 7:25 mark). She brings in producers when composing songs from stratch or she gets demos and overseas her product and/or adds things(because she has her own studio) for whatever she wants for the track.

And people weren't saying this of MJ when all he did was work with Quincy or Janet when all she did was work with Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis(But i co sign everyone else who said that she needs to stop working with all the same people.). Especally when Bey works with a lot of different producers, she didn't work with the Neptunes(for example) or Rich Harrison on her last album era and they usually produce funk influenced tracks for her(Work it out, Kitty Kat, Green Light in the case of the Neptunes and CIL, Be with You and Freekum Dress in Rich Harrison's case).

[Edited 11/20/10 10:22am]

Well I know she's going to ALWAYS work with producers, and thats probably why she's not necesarily going to get where shes talking about going. And i dont mean to put forth that working with producers is bad BUT when you work with all the same people, or same TYPES of people your going to get the same sound. if i wanted to create a new type of music and i typically work with hip hop/ r b/ dance producersa i'm probably not going to do anything but create of fusion of those genres, BUT that is not new.

as far asthe mj/ janet comparison i'm NOT knocking beyonce @ all. BUT for her to say "i'm going to create a new genre of music" that takes ALOT of thinking outside of the box and takign risks by working with new people/ new types of sounds. i dnt ever recall mj (lets leave janet out of this cuz i'm not much of a jj rider) saying i'm going to create a new genre. i DO however, recall him being active in the writing/ producing process most if not all of the time. which if beyonce does that (which she has claimed to do) then that is great. more power to her.

i think she should if anything take a page from her sisters book. love or hate solange but that girl iss NOT doing the same thing as everyone else. she's not blindly riding bandwagons and her music is, if anything, more interesting as a result

[Edited 11/20/10 19:53pm]

But that's what music is about, especially in mainstream entertainment: Taking existing genres and creating their own sound within that. Like I said, what she probably means is this: So if let's say Beyoncé take a song that's electro pop and add instrumentation to it, then that alone would set her apart because electro-pop is that, electronic dance music.

And since Bey usually use live instrumentation, especially the first two albums, this will continue to set her sound apart from existing things that we hear on the radio. It will bring the "electronic sound" with the old school sound(live instrumentation). Let's face it, in contemporary R&B, hip hop is going to be a part of that genre. It is what it is. But Bey adds different sounds to her music, she even has folk on IASF. Who else in the "Hip POP Soul" genre does that?

Curtwill1975 said:

Moonwalkbjrain said:

Well I know she's going to ALWAYS work with producers, and thats probably why she's not necesarily going to get where shes talking about going. And i dont mean to put forth that working with producers is bad BUT when you work with all the same people, or same TYPES of people your going to get the same sound. if i wanted to create a new type of music and i typically work with hip hop/ r b/ dance producersa i'm probably not going to do anything but create of fusion of those genres, BUT that is not new.

as far asthe mj/ janet comparison i'm NOT knocking beyonce @ all. BUT for her to say "i'm going to create a new genre of music" that takes ALOT of thinking outside of the box and takign risks by working with new people/ new types of sounds. i dnt ever recall mj (lets leave janet out of this cuz i'm not much of a jj rider) saying i'm going to create a new genre. i DO however, recall him being active in the writing/ producing process most if not all of the time. which if beyonce does that (which she has claimed to do) then that is great. more power to her.

i think she should if anything take a page from her sisters book. love or hate solange but that girl iss NOT doing the same thing as everyone else. she's not blindly riding bandwagons and her music is, if anything, more interesting as a result

[Edited 11/20/10 19:53pm]

But that's what music is about, especially in mainstream entertainment: Taking existing genres and creating their own sound within that. Like I said, what she probably means is this: So if let's say Beyoncé take a song that's electro pop and add instrumentation to it, then that alone would set her apart because electro-pop is that, electronic dance music.

And since Bey usually use live instrumentation, especially the first two albums, this will continue to set her sound apart from existing things that we hear on the radio. It will bring the "electronic sound" with the old school sound(live instrumentation). Let's face it, in contemporary R&B, hip hop is going to be a part of that genre. It is what it is. But Bey adds different sounds to her music, she even has folk on IASF. Who else in the "Hip POP Soul" genre does that?

??????????????

Identity said:

Yes, that horrible mess penned by Ne-Yo.

I can hear him singing this to his ex...classic gay lines and all.

VelvetJ said:

Let's face it, the world is Beyonce's oyster and no matter what she releases or says, the world is going to eat it up. I am what some would call a Beyonce "hater" because I have always felt her success was fraudulent in that vocally she is overrated, she doesn't have a original bone in her body, she has taken credit for work she didn't do SEVERAL TIMES, her "writing skills" are as shallow as a kiddy pool, and a huge part of her success is due to her big butt,, light skin and blonde hair.

The whole world has been decieved into believing this girl is the best thing since sliced Bread, resulting in practically everything she touches turning into gold. She is in the History books already and a new album, no matter who produces it, will only solidify her position even more.

[Edited 11/21/10 17:23pm]

Cinnie said:

You aren't creating a new genre when you decide to record something "pop" within an existing genre. We're lucky if her producers bought new synth modules. Maybe she meant "live" as in less processing or takes on her studio vocals.

Some of that(I did a lot of things differently this time with my album. A lot of it was [recorded] live, less production with the vocals, I didn't do as many arrangements... that was with the I Am side http://www.guardian.co.uk...the-decade) but more than that. That's why I posted that blogger's comment in my first post in here because on B'day especially, she did use much live instrumentation. Horns, keyguitars, drums, even acoustic guitar(Irreplaceable): Hermansen also said the sound is so different — using a combination of a classic chord progression on an acoustic guitar, a modern-sounding 808 drumbeat and cellos — that it could have doomed the song to not fit any formats.

Since on her last album, one CD is more acoustic driven( Totally! Her new album has more guitar on it but the previous album, that we did for the Experience tour, the B’Day album .. there is no guitar on that album. It’s all key-guitar, which was really cool for me because I got to come into the situation, write my own guitar parts and do what I wanted to do. She has never said she didn’t like it, so that was really cool. http://iwontstfu.com/inde...interview/) while the other CD was more electronic and modern and that will help her to craft already into another lane because most producers don't do this.

Graycap23 said:

Curtwill1975 said:

But that's what music is about, especially in mainstream entertainment: Taking existing genres and creating their own sound within that. Like I said, what she probably means is this: So if let's say Beyoncé take a song that's electro pop and add instrumentation to it, then that alone would set her apart because electro-pop is that, electronic dance music.

And since Bey usually use live instrumentation, especially the first two albums, this will continue to set her sound apart from existing things that we hear on the radio. It will bring the "electronic sound" with the old school sound(live instrumentation). Let's face it, in contemporary R&B, hip hop is going to be a part of that genre. It is what it is. But Bey adds different sounds to her music, she even has folk on IASF. Who else in the "Hip POP Soul" genre does that?

??????????????

Why the Question Marks?

Curtwill1975 said:

Graycap23 said:

??????????????

Why the Question Marks?

I'm trying 2 figure put what your comments mean. I can't hear anything unique about the music coming from Beyonce.

Graycap23 said:

Curtwill1975 said:

Why the Question Marks?

I'm trying 2 figure put what your comments mean. I can't hear anything unique about the music coming from Beyonce.

It's like I posted in my first post: Musically, Beyonce’s best work takes the Hip Hop-meets-60’s soul sound pioneered by Lauryn Hill, and makes it danceable, club-ready, and pop-oriented. Listen to “Crazy in Love,” Beyonce’s crowning achievement musically, and you hear many of the same retro-influenced elements present in Hill’s “Do Wop (That Thing);” particularly the raw, live instrumentation, and those insistent, Motown-inspired horns that anchor the song.

In dance music(Urban Dance included), that kind of instrumentation isn't as prevalent in her genre. It is very polished, electronic, and slick. They aren't using much horns for example, if any artist of that genre does use "live" instrumentation, especially when they do "club-bangers"(Urban Dance music). Not to mention, she does more dance music than pretty much all of them. The usual formula in her genre is this: Two, maybe 3 club bangers at the most(and that's changing because of what Bey did with B'day), some mid-tempos and the rest ballads. That's across the board. Also, most of them still sample a lot. After DIL, there aren't much sampling in Bey's music only a couple of songs really, not counting Resentment which is cover anyway and she added Curtis Mayfield's Think to it. In fact, last album era, there were no collabs until she added Kayne and Gaga later.

With B'day for example, she went pre-dominately uptempo with her sound. In fact, she don't even much midtempos(a big part of what Urban Music is, going back to at least MJB), believe it or not. It's either uptempo or ballads(look up her music catalogue from her 3 solo albums). Not to mention, Bey uses a lot more genres too, not just Hip Hop. How many artists of her genre is going to record Ave Maria? How many artists are going to use Barbra Striesand and Karen Carpenter as her template as Bey did for her I AM CD(as opposed to the other CD, Sasha Fierce)?

I mean, even If I was a Boy and Halo was charting on Urban Formats and those aren't the kinds of songs that would chart that high because as I said, most artists use uptempos to sell the album(via their label suggesting them to do that and getting producers to craft their sound). They wouldn't think to record that and make it a single. It would be "white" for them and they would lose their audience and demographic even though some of them are starting to blend that sound in their music too(even MJB, listen to her song with TI, sounds very similar to Broken Hearted Girl, a song from Beyonce).

Now of course, the genres she is use is part of the landscape of pop but it's not a big part of the genre that she is. She even has her own band and they do a pretty good job of recreating the sound of her albums and even give it more richness much of the time.

But since she's known for her Uptempo stuff, here is a great analogy: Imagine Madonna deciding to combine what Lauryn Hill did with Miseducation of Lauryn Hill and MJB's sound beginning with What's the 411? with her existing sound which is mostly dance music(Madonna is the dance genre queen)? That's the Bey sound for the most part uptempo. And since Bey used more electronic last era, if she combines the instrumention that she did with B'day especially with that sound, that would set the genre apart because that's not how the sound of that genre is executed.

^

The sound used in 'Crazy in Love' was orginally created by Amerie, not Beyonce. There's nothing unique about Beyonce.

Interesting. I actually know a songwriter who submittted a song to Beyonce for inclusion on this album. He is not a rapper or a dj, but a piano based songwriter and plays in several bands that are all live instrument based. I haven't talked to him in awhile so I don't know if Beyonce is using his song or not. But this direction seems in line with the type of stuff he does.

Graycap23 said:

Curtwill1975 said:

Why the Question Marks?

I'm trying 2 figure put what your comments mean. I can't hear anything unique about the music coming from Beyonce.

And I am going to quote another part of the blog that I post in here:

The genius of Beyonce, as with any great artist, begins with the aspects of her music that have stylistically set her apart, and thus influenced her peers. Like Mary J. Blige and Lauryn Hill before her, Beyonce mixes Soul and R&B with elements of Hip Hop in a way that is neither forced nor haphazard. She can move seamlessly and assuredly between both aesthetically, attaining a certain level of believability that someone like Amerie never seems to reach in that arena. The core of what makes Beyonce’s take on Hip Hop/Soul so unique is her hiccupping, rapid-fire vocal style. Rather than going the Mary J. route, and basically utilizing a classically Soulful vocal style over Hip Hop-inflected beats, or the L-Boogie route, and both singing and rapping masterfully (but separately), Beyonce combines the two, delivering her soulful, R&B vocals in a stuttering, rhythmic fashion that almost sounds like rapping. Though Mariah Carey flirted with this style on her 1997 album Butterfly (particularly with “Breakdown,” her collaboration with Bone Thugs n’ Harmony), Beyonce clearly perfected it; she rides beats the way a rapper does, but never gets lost, staying focused and firmly on pitch. This was the key to the success of Destiny’s Child; heavily influenced by TLC (in which it was Left Eye’s job to convey the trio’s connection to Hip Hop vocally), the group improved upon their model by blurring the line between R&B and Rap vocals. The group’s debut single, the Wyclef Jean-remixed “No, No, No,” is a prime example of this, where Beyonce sings almost impossibly fast, while retaining a soulful delivery, melisma and all. Platinum-selling superstars like Usher (“Confessions [Part 2]”), Mariah Carey (“We Belong Together”), Chris Brown (“Kiss Kiss”), Rihanna (“Hard”), and basically every male or female artist that incorporates elements of Hip Hop into Pop music in the 2000s owe some debt to Beyonce in regards to this alone.

http://www.blackyouthproj...e-beyonce/

And the paragraph that I posted to you fits in with the quote that I gave you, much of the music that is heard today is "pioneered" by her going back to her Destiny's Child days and she has expanded on it with what does now. No one of her age group is as a great "rhythmic" singer as Bey is, at least if they are mainstream. That's what sets her apart. In fact, and this is one last thing: There is a world of difference between being a good soul singer and a good funk singer. Mariah Carey, for example, is a good sweet soul singer, but if she were to suddenly start grunting into the mic and demanding snare kicks from the drummer, her people would rush the stage within seconds to drag her off to the mad house. Presumed breakdown. She hasn’t got the funk. Sadly, neither have many of today’s fine young singers, with the possible exceptions of Beth Ditto, Mary J, Beyonce and that’s about it. Even the greatest soul singer of them all, Aretha Franklin, doesn’t quite have the funk chops to be a BOLD SOUL SISTER. http://www.interestment.c...l-sisters/

Once you understand the genre in which Bey is in...then you will understand her uniqueness in it. You can't compare Bey to say...Sade. That's like Comparing Shirley Ceasar to Mary Mary. You have to compare her to those who in her lane from a genre standpoint.

Curtwill1975 said:

Graycap23 said:

I'm trying 2 figure put what your comments mean. I can't hear anything unique about the music coming from Beyonce.

And I am going to quote another part of the blog that I post in here:

The genius of Beyonce, as with any great artist, begins with the aspects of her music that have stylistically set her apart, and thus influenced her peers. Like Mary J. Blige and Lauryn Hill before her, Beyonce mixes Soul and R&B with elements of Hip Hop in a way that is neither forced nor haphazard. She can move seamlessly and assuredly between both aesthetically, attaining a certain level of believability that someone like Amerie never seems to reach in that arena. The core of what makes Beyonce’s take on Hip Hop/Soul so unique is her hiccupping, rapid-fire vocal style. Rather than going the Mary J. route, and basically utilizing a classically Soulful vocal style over Hip Hop-inflected beats, or the L-Boogie route, and both singing and rapping masterfully (but separately), Beyonce combines the two, delivering her soulful, R&B vocals in a stuttering, rhythmic fashion that almost sounds like rapping. Though Mariah Carey flirted with this style on her 1997 album Butterfly (particularly with “Breakdown,” her collaboration with Bone Thugs n’ Harmony), Beyonce clearly perfected it; she rides beats the way a rapper does, but never gets lost, staying focused and firmly on pitch. This was the key to the success of Destiny’s Child; heavily influenced by TLC (in which it was Left Eye’s job to convey the trio’s connection to Hip Hop vocally), the group improved upon their model by blurring the line between R&B and Rap vocals. The group’s debut single, the Wyclef Jean-remixed “No, No, No,” is a prime example of this, where Beyonce sings almost impossibly fast, while retaining a soulful delivery, melisma and all. Platinum-selling superstars like Usher (“Confessions [Part 2]”), Mariah Carey (“We Belong Together”), Chris Brown (“Kiss Kiss”), Rihanna (“Hard”), and basically every male or female artist that incorporates elements of Hip Hop into Pop music in the 2000s owe some debt to Beyonce in regards to this alone.

http://www.blackyouthproj...e-beyonce/

And the paragraph that I posted to you fits in with the quote that I gave you, much of the music that is heard today is "pioneered" by her going back to her Destiny's Child days and she has expanded on it with what does now. No one of her age group is as a great "rhythmic" singer as Bey is, at least if they are mainstream. That's what sets her apart. In fact, and this is one last thing: There is a world of difference between being a good soul singer and a good funk singer. Mariah Carey, for example, is a good sweet soul singer, but if she were to suddenly start grunting into the mic and demanding snare kicks from the drummer, her people would rush the stage within seconds to drag her off to the mad house. Presumed breakdown. She hasn’t got the funk. Sadly, neither have many of today’s fine young singers, with the possible exceptions of Beth Ditto, Mary J, Beyonce and that’s about it. Even the greatest soul singer of them all, Aretha Franklin, doesn’t quite have the funk chops to be a BOLD SOUL SISTER. http://www.interestment.c...l-sisters/

Once you understand the genre in which Bey is in...then you will understand her uniqueness in it. You can't compare Bey to say...Sade. That's like Comparing Shirley Ceasar to Mary Mary. You have to compare her to those who in her lane from a genre standpoint.

These comments are laughable at best.

My ears tell me different.

Cookie cutter music is the best way 2 describe her material.

midiscover said:

^

The sound used in 'Crazy in Love' was orginally created by Amerie, not Beyonce. There's nothing unique about Beyonce.

Amerie didn't create anything. For one, RICH HARRISON was Amerie's primary producer. She didn't produce anything. That sound was CRAFTED FOR HER, just like he crafted a sound for a group that he discovered named Rich Girl later on which is heavily influenced by the Bey/DC template. She wasn't even the executive producer(overseeing the production of her music) of her music UNTIL THE 3rd ALBUM which was done WITHOUT Rich Harrison(Not Bey didn't even use him last album era). At least Bey helped in the production of the song and especially lyric wrote the bridge:

Unpleasant reminders of the night before notwithstanding, Harrison stepped up and wrote the verses and the hook, leaving the bridge for Beyoncé.(note that whole bridge is pretty harmonic arrangements) He wound up playing all the instruments on the track, too.

http://www.mtv.com/news/a...once.jhtml

Secondly, the sound you're talking about is GO-GO which is a subgenre of FUNK(a subgenre that goes back to the 70s, way before Amerie was born) and just to let you know...Bey had been doing Funk even before she became a solo artist but I won't even get into that. Just so you know, she already was doing funk, doing a horn heavy sound when she did Work It Out back in 2002, which by the way was produced by THE NEPTUNES who also did Kitty Kat and GREEN LIGHT. That's one of the reason why she did Austin Powers. She was been going in that direction with her "solo sound"(remember that Bey was still DC and she's the one that DC was built around this is THEIR sound and one of the reasons why the other two had different sounds with their albums) , even when she was discouraged from doing so(Naughty Girl was going to be the first single but Bey decided on CIL). In fact, even on a ballad, Be With You, that's also from Rich Harrison, that's funk too, even has a Shuggie Otis sample to make it so(One of Bey's fave artists).

In fact, Amerie's first album was mostly the kind of R&B that was being heard on the radio at that time: Mostly Ballad Heavy. She wasn't even using Funk/Go-Go until the NEXT ALBUM and she didn't even use that much and she worked with other producers when that happened. You're wrong.

[Edited 11/22/10 13:59pm]

Graycap23 said:

Curtwill1975 said:

And I am going to quote another part of the blog that I post in here:

The genius of Beyonce, as with any great artist, begins with the aspects of her music that have stylistically set her apart, and thus influenced her peers. Like Mary J. Blige and Lauryn Hill before her, Beyonce mixes Soul and R&B with elements of Hip Hop in a way that is neither forced nor haphazard. She can move seamlessly and assuredly between both aesthetically, attaining a certain level of believability that someone like Amerie never seems to reach in that arena. The core of what makes Beyonce’s take on Hip Hop/Soul so unique is her hiccupping, rapid-fire vocal style. Rather than going the Mary J. route, and basically utilizing a classically Soulful vocal style over Hip Hop-inflected beats, or the L-Boogie route, and both singing and rapping masterfully (but separately), Beyonce combines the two, delivering her soulful, R&B vocals in a stuttering, rhythmic fashion that almost sounds like rapping. Though Mariah Carey flirted with this style on her 1997 album Butterfly (particularly with “Breakdown,” her collaboration with Bone Thugs n’ Harmony), Beyonce clearly perfected it; she rides beats the way a rapper does, but never gets lost, staying focused and firmly on pitch. This was the key to the success of Destiny’s Child; heavily influenced by TLC (in which it was Left Eye’s job to convey the trio’s connection to Hip Hop vocally), the group improved upon their model by blurring the line between R&B and Rap vocals. The group’s debut single, the Wyclef Jean-remixed “No, No, No,” is a prime example of this, where Beyonce sings almost impossibly fast, while retaining a soulful delivery, melisma and all. Platinum-selling superstars like Usher (“Confessions [Part 2]”), Mariah Carey (“We Belong Together”), Chris Brown (“Kiss Kiss”), Rihanna (“Hard”), and basically every male or female artist that incorporates elements of Hip Hop into Pop music in the 2000s owe some debt to Beyonce in regards to this alone.

http://www.blackyouthproj...e-beyonce/

And the paragraph that I posted to you fits in with the quote that I gave you, much of the music that is heard today is "pioneered" by her going back to her Destiny's Child days and she has expanded on it with what does now. No one of her age group is as a great "rhythmic" singer as Bey is, at least if they are mainstream. That's what sets her apart. In fact, and this is one last thing: There is a world of difference between being a good soul singer and a good funk singer. Mariah Carey, for example, is a good sweet soul singer, but if she were to suddenly start grunting into the mic and demanding snare kicks from the drummer, her people would rush the stage within seconds to drag her off to the mad house. Presumed breakdown. She hasn’t got the funk. Sadly, neither have many of today’s fine young singers, with the possible exceptions of Beth Ditto, Mary J, Beyonce and that’s about it. Even the greatest soul singer of them all, Aretha Franklin, doesn’t quite have the funk chops to be a BOLD SOUL SISTER. http://www.interestment.c...l-sisters/

Once you understand the genre in which Bey is in...then you will understand her uniqueness in it. You can't compare Bey to say...Sade. That's like Comparing Shirley Ceasar to Mary Mary. You have to compare her to those who in her lane from a genre standpoint.

These comments are laughable at best.

My ears tell me different.

Cookie cutter music is the best way 2 describe her material.

Your ears are wrong. (LOL!!!!). Nah, like I said, that's why you have to listen to her catalogue going back to her work with Destiny's Child and you will the progression that I am talking about because the Bey of DC era would NOT sing Ave Maria and put it on her CD. Maybe you assume that any artist who uses any R&B songstress using Hip Hop in at any time is cookie-cutter(I know a lot in here don't like Hip Hop and think ALL OF IT, is cookie cutter and generic). Which is crazy because a lot of people praise Janelle Monae's music(I bet especially in here) but her music is primarily funk and Hip Hop also(Note I said mostly).

She's not Prince, but she is unique especially for her generation. No one in her age group could really sing her songs, especially songs that are rhythmic in nature and do them justice. Not really. That's why a lot of artists in her genre pale in comparison to her. No one rides Hip Hop beats like her and then can turn around a sing a ballad at the drop of a dime. How many in her lane even have a live band?

Okay I can ride for a vocal styling argument, just not a "new genre of music" argument.

Beyonce probably couldn't write an amazing rap verse, but I bet she could spit one!

Curtwill1975 said:

midiscover said:

^

The sound used in 'Crazy in Love' was orginally created by Amerie, not Beyonce. There's nothing unique about Beyonce.

Amerie didn't create anything. For one, RICH HARRISON was Amerie's primary producer. She didn't produce anything. That sound was CRAFTED FOR HER, just like he crafted a sound for a group that he discovered named Rich Girl later on which is heavily influenced by the Bey/DC template. She wasn't even the executive producer(overseeing the production of her music) of her music UNTIL THE 3rd ALBUM which was done WITHOUT Rich Harrison(Not Bey didn't even use him last album era). At least Bey helped in the production of the song and especially lyric wrote the bridge:

Unpleasant reminders of the night before notwithstanding, Harrison stepped up and wrote the verses and the hook, leaving the bridge for Beyoncé.(note that whole bridge is pretty harmonic arrangements) He wound up playing all the instruments on the track, too.

http://www.mtv.com/news/a...once.jhtml

Secondly, the sound you're talking about is GO-GO which is a subgenre of FUNK(a subgenre that goes back to the 70s, way before Amerie was born) and just to let you know...Bey had been doing Funk even before she became a solo artist but I won't even get into that. Just so you know, she already was doing funk, doing a horn heavy sound when she did Work It Out back in 2002, which by the way was produced by THE NEPTUNES who also did Kitty Kat and GREEN LIGHT. That's one of the reason why she did Austin Powers. She was been going in that direction with her "solo sound"(remember that Bey was still DC and she's the one that DC was built around this is THEIR sound and one of the reasons why the other two had different sounds with their albums) , even when she was discouraged from doing so(Naughty Girl was going to be the first single but Bey decided on CIL). In fact, even on a ballad, Be With You, that's also from Rich Harrison, that's funk too, even has a Shuggie Otis sample to make it so(One of Bey's fave artists).

In fact, Amerie's first album was mostly the kind of R&B that was being heard on the radio at that time: Mostly Ballad Heavy. She wasn't even using Funk/Go-Go until the NEXT ALBUM and she didn't even use that much and she worked with other producers when that happened. You're wrong.

[Edited 11/22/10 13:59pm]

Either way the sound belonged to Amerie, not Beyonce. Also Beyonce doesn't producer or write she just purchase the rights.

midiscover said:

Curtwill1975 said:

Amerie didn't create anything. For one, RICH HARRISON was Amerie's primary producer. She didn't produce anything. That sound was CRAFTED FOR HER, just like he crafted a sound for a group that he discovered named Rich Girl later on which is heavily influenced by the Bey/DC template. She wasn't even the executive producer(overseeing the production of her music) of her music UNTIL THE 3rd ALBUM which was done WITHOUT Rich Harrison(Not Bey didn't even use him last album era). At least Bey helped in the production of the song and especially lyric wrote the bridge:

Unpleasant reminders of the night before notwithstanding, Harrison stepped up and wrote the verses and the hook, leaving the bridge for Beyoncé.(note that whole bridge is pretty harmonic arrangements) He wound up playing all the instruments on the track, too.

http://www.mtv.com/news/a...once.jhtml

Secondly, the sound you're talking about is GO-GO which is a subgenre of FUNK(a subgenre that goes back to the 70s, way before Amerie was born) and just to let you know...Bey had been doing Funk even before she became a solo artist but I won't even get into that. Just so you know, she already was doing funk, doing a horn heavy sound when she did Work It Out back in 2002, which by the way was produced by THE NEPTUNES who also did Kitty Kat and GREEN LIGHT. That's one of the reason why she did Austin Powers. She was been going in that direction with her "solo sound"(remember that Bey was still DC and she's the one that DC was built around this is THEIR sound and one of the reasons why the other two had different sounds with their albums) , even when she was discouraged from doing so(Naughty Girl was going to be the first single but Bey decided on CIL). In fact, even on a ballad, Be With You, that's also from Rich Harrison, that's funk too, even has a Shuggie Otis sample to make it so(One of Bey's fave artists).

In fact, Amerie's first album was mostly the kind of R&B that was being heard on the radio at that time: Mostly Ballad Heavy. She wasn't even using Funk/Go-Go until the NEXT ALBUM and she didn't even use that much and she worked with other producers when that happened. You're wrong.

[Edited 11/22/10 13:59pm]

Either way the sound belonged to Amerie, not Beyonce. Also Beyonce doesn't producer or write she just purchase the rights.

No it don't. For one, she didn't use it when Rich Harrison produced the whole album for her as I said. Secondly, Bey was already doing that sound(sonically funk-influenced songs) before she even got involved with Rich....Work It out(With the Neptunes) and then she did without him afterwards(Again, with The Neptunes).

And also, if I was you, I would recant that last statement after I post this to you:

'Déjà Vu'

"Basically, this song is a take on what Quincy Jones did with pre-Thriller Michael Jackson. Beyoncé really wanted it to have a street feel to it. On top of the kick pattern there's an 808 and a really busy live bass, which is great. The horns are also live. The potential problem with a record like this is that the drum and bass patterns are very busy, and there is a lot of frequency information that can cause a loss of dynamics and clarity. This was the real challenge for me. I was very concerned, and voiced this to Rodney and Beyoncé, that when the mastering engineer slapped his limiter on the mix to bring up the volume, all the low end would come up as well and you would lose all the bounce, which is the great thing about this record. So I ended up printing a couple of versions with the 808 pulled back, which is what they went with."

http://www.soundonsound.c...k_0407.htm

Which Bey herself confirmed in this video speaking of the song during the B'day era: http://www.youtube.com/wa...IMgVaPp8Lk, as I posted in another thread. Yes, Bey gets demos given to her and then she adds to them or changes things: Lyrically, production-wise and more importantly, she re-arranges them. Or she might suggest things(because she has a good ear), the producers add what she wants if she is working with them on the track so she gets production credit for that which she should even if she's not "behind the boards". That's why I gave you the article on CIL from MTV, every one knows she's not a big lyric-writer, even she said it but she did wrote the lyrics to the bridge and the whole thing is harmonic arrangement which is every one knows is her lane going back to DC days because she arranged their harmonies. Rich harmonies are actually a big part of her sound and she pretty much produces them herself.

[Edited 11/22/10 14:57pm]

No, I won't recant my last statement. It's the truth. Beyonce takes credit from other talented writers and producers. This is what she's known for in the industry. Now stop with these stan deluded essays.

Cinnie said:

Okay I can ride for a vocal styling argument, just not a "new genre of music" argument.

Beyonce probably couldn't write an amazing rap verse, but I bet she could spit one!

She did it on Kitty Kat. LOL.