i think clapton sold 128 million copies of his greatest hits cd, and the remaining 1 million sales are from his combined albums over the 40+ year period from the yardbirds and cream to his solo stuff. i wonder if it includes guest slots such as the pro's and cons of hitchiking by roger waters. that's some of his best ever playing on that record. imagine if roger fired dave and nick after he fired rick, and he started a new version of floyd with clapton on guitar. imagine clapton on money or comfortably numb? well you don't need to imagine, you have the live shows on bootleg that he did those songs during the hitchiking tour

i think bon jovi were omitted as they are shite and each album sounds the same. i once compared 3 of the albums in soundforge and they looked exactly the same in the zx spectrum analyser. 100 million people were wrong. computer says no

blackbob said:

could you tell me where you got this info ?

The author is MJDangerous. He's one of the most trusted people in charts & sales along w/Nelson. The estimates I posted are from here (each artist links to their own section w/sales breakdowns:

http://www.chartsinfrance...us-de-30m/

He also has his own site: http://fanofmusic.free.fr...orldAlbums

In that link, you can choose an artist and see the sales breakdown p/album and for some you can see the breakdown p/country. I guess the site, itself though is under construction, but he used to have the Beatles, MJ, and Elvis under the best sellers list. I know that some Elvis stans were giving him grief, because they couldn't agree with the numbers.

Lastly, this place is dedicated to chart and sales analysis for various artists:

http://www.ukmix.org/foru...mp;start=0

Unholyalliance said:

blackbob said:

could you tell me where you got this info ?

The author is MJDangerous. He's one of the most trusted people in charts & sales along w/Nelson. The estimates I posted are from here (each artist links to their own section w/sales breakdowns:

http://www.chartsinfrance...us-de-30m/

He also has his own site: http://fanofmusic.free.fr...orldAlbums

In that link, you can choose an artist and see the sales breakdown p/album and for some you can see the breakdown p/country. I guess the site, itself though is under construction, but he used to have the Beatles, MJ, and Elvis under the best sellers list. I know that some Elvis stans were giving him grief, because they couldn't agree with the numbers.

Lastly, this place is dedicated to chart and sales analysis for various artists:

http://www.ukmix.org/foru...mp;start=0

i wonder why they wouldn't trust a michael jackson fan to manipulate sales figures. the sales figures for thriller were long fiddled with. before modern scanning, they relied on various methods for recording sales, such as handwritten returns and various other scams. cbs/sony used to fiddle themselves so they could keep saying it was the best selling album of all time etc. as for elvis, he was screwed left right and centre, but the other way around so less sales were reported so he got less money. he had a deal like 50/50 with his manager, who would then do deals with other people for things like 50/50 with promotors, so out of say each $100, the manager would get $75 and elvis $25. then all the writers who wrote songs that elvis would only record if he got a split in song writing credits, even though he did nothing, but they gave up the rights as a 50% share of a million records is more than 100% of 300,000 records if anyone less famous had recorded it

Good for them. I might not listen to their music but I do understand the inpact they made and their cultural significance. I sometimes tend to believe they are a tad bit overrated but..hey its just what i see from my point of view.

unique said:

i wonder why they wouldn't trust a michael jackson fan to manipulate sales figures. the sales figures for thriller were long fiddled with. before modern scanning, they relied on various methods for recording sales, such as handwritten returns and various other scams. cbs/sony used to fiddle themselves so they could keep saying it was the best selling album of all time etc. as for elvis, he was screwed left right and centre, but the other way around so less sales were reported so he got less money. he had a deal like 50/50 with his manager, who would then do deals with other people for things like 50/50 with promotors, so out of say each $100, the manager would get $75 and elvis $25. then all the writers who wrote songs that elvis would only record if he got a split in song writing credits, even though he did nothing, but they gave up the rights as a 50% share of a million records is more than 100% of 300,000 records if anyone less famous had recorded it

Even though he has MJ in his name he is still trusted amongst the community, including the ones for the Beatles. He has, more than a few occasions, proved his techniques for his calculations and has proven himself to be correct and/or very close. That is more than what most of the people who criticize him can say as many of them still rely on those articles who claim that Elvis sold 1 billion records as that is absolutely insane. I'm more than certain that he took everything you said into consideration, and you can go to his site and see it for yourself.

Also, I wanted to say something about the CBS/Sony accusations, I was always under the impression that record companies, big ones, usually try to understate record sales in an attempt to underpay their artists. So why just fiddle the numbers for Thriller and not any other album? Now could you image Whether it be another album of his or someone else's? This would also mean that everyone else's sales were fiddled with as well. Including Elvis and the Beatles. CBS/Sony would not be alone in that. While it could seem viable, I feel that you haven't given a valid reason for why they would do it for just that album and not anyone else's. Because whatever you are saying can really be applied to anyone really.

While you may have a point with Elvis, other people still need to get paid, besides Elvis. Even though they may have been giving him a small cut they would still want more money themselves. So why would they ignore or not take real tallies of his sales? Doing so means that everyone else doesn't get paid and I know they don't want that. I think those unknown sales are Elvis's stans biggest excuse when doing his numbers even though there's no proof of it. His biggest selling album is the Christmas one, clocking in under 17 million copies. Elvis's biggest sellers would probably be his singles, seeing how it was a singles market for a good long while. Hell, even some of The Beatles earlier albums from the 60s are still low sellers as opposed to their later ones and they were really popular for a good long while.

Unholyalliance said:

unique said:

i wonder why they wouldn't trust a michael jackson fan to manipulate sales figures. the sales figures for thriller were long fiddled with. before modern scanning, they relied on various methods for recording sales, such as handwritten returns and various other scams. cbs/sony used to fiddle themselves so they could keep saying it was the best selling album of all time etc. as for elvis, he was screwed left right and centre, but the other way around so less sales were reported so he got less money. he had a deal like 50/50 with his manager, who would then do deals with other people for things like 50/50 with promotors, so out of say each $100, the manager would get $75 and elvis $25. then all the writers who wrote songs that elvis would only record if he got a split in song writing credits, even though he did nothing, but they gave up the rights as a 50% share of a million records is more than 100% of 300,000 records if anyone less famous had recorded it

Even though he has MJ in his name he is still trusted amongst the community, including the ones for the Beatles. He has, more than a few occasions, proved his techniques for his calculations and has proven himself to be correct and/or very close. That is more than what most of the people who criticize him can say as many of them still rely on those articles who claim that Elvis sold 1 billion records as that is absolutely insane. I'm more than certain that he took everything you said into consideration, and you can go to his site and see it for yourself.

Also, I wanted to say something about the CBS/Sony accusations, I was always under the impression that record companies, big ones, usually try to understate record sales in an attempt to underpay their artists. So why just fiddle the numbers for Thriller and not any other album? Now could you image Whether it be another album of his or someone else's? This would also mean that everyone else's sales were fiddled with as well. Including Elvis and the Beatles. CBS/Sony would not be alone in that. While it could seem viable, I feel that you haven't given a valid reason for why they would do it for just that album and not anyone else's. Because whatever you are saying can really be applied to anyone really.

While you may have a point with Elvis, other people still need to get paid, besides Elvis. Even though they may have been giving him a small cut they would still want more money themselves. So why would they ignore or not take real tallies of his sales? Doing so means that everyone else doesn't get paid and I know they don't want that. I think those unknown sales are Elvis's stans biggest excuse when doing his numbers even though there's no proof of it. His biggest selling album is the Christmas one, clocking in under 17 million copies. Elvis's biggest sellers would probably be his singles, seeing how it was a singles market for a good long while. Hell, even some of The Beatles earlier albums from the 60s are still low sellers as opposed to their later ones and they were really popular for a good long while.

the generally accepted reason why the thriller sales were fiddled with so much was simply because MJ's reputation stood on the sales of that album making him a top selling artist. whilst MJ's reputation turned to shit for all the kiddie fiddling stories, his long term drug abuse, sham marraiges, plastic surgery, changing skin colour, and monkey for a best friend, the record company could still say that despite all that shit he's still got the best selling album. MJ may well have been in on it, he may have instigated it, or maybe his manager did. his manager had a reputation for being a shitbag cunt, just like the most famous and ruthless managers. you sound like you haven't heard this story before, but it's being around for a long time, it's not some shit i pulled out my arse

why didn't other companies do this? they simply didn't need to. the beatles put out albums at the rate of two per year in the early days and one per year after that, plus non album tracks as singles in between. the beatles didn't need hype to sell anything, they had beatlemania, and they left behind a strong catalogue of songs to last for decades. elvis was churning out material with his 28 shitty movies and corresponding 28 shitty soundtrack albums, more than one per year

MJ on the other hand released so little product under his name in his adult life, his solo albums were many years apart after thriller, and the releases after thriller were not a patch on that album. ask a few beatles fans what the favourite album is and you'll get a multiple choice of answers, it might be revolver, or sgt pepper or the white room or abbey road, albums equally adored and critically acclaimed. whislt you point to the earlier material, they were essentially a boy band for the first 4 or so albums, but matured with rubber soul and went on to mature and improve musically as they went on. elvis on the other hand had his bestmusic at the start of his career, and things just turned to shit for him as his manager used him to make money at the expense of anythingn else, he didn't care about reputation, which is why he signed elvis to the long movie contract. elvis strived to regain his credibility, thus the 68 comeback special and his vegas attempt to revitalise his career

whilst of course a number of people are involved in creating an artist and deserve to be paid, in elvis case people were getting their cut, but his manager was creating double deals behind elvis back, so when i use the $100 split as an example, i mean the money left after everyone else got a chunk and got paid, his manager usually took 50%, and he had a deal that he got 50% of what elvis got, so for every $25 elvis got, his manager got $75. those figures are just an example, i'm not sure the exact percentages, but his manager got more money than elvis did because of his double dealing

Unique, are you disputing the universally accepted fact that 'Thriller' is the biggest selling record in the world?

Marrk said:

Unique, are you disputing the universally accepted fact that 'Thriller' is the biggest selling record in the world?

no, i'm not saying it is or it isn't. i'm just referring to the long standing stories regarding it's sales figures being bullshit

unique said:

Marrk said:

Unique, are you disputing the universally accepted fact that 'Thriller' is the biggest selling record in the world?

no, i'm not saying it is or it isn't. i'm just referring to the long standing stories regarding it's sales figures being bullshit

My goodness, if there is any bullshit to the sales figures of Thriller, it's that they stopped counting somewhere along the line.

Cinnie said:

unique said:

no, i'm not saying it is or it isn't. i'm just referring to the long standing stories regarding it's sales figures being bullshit

My goodness, if there is any bullshit to the sales figures of Thriller, it's that they stopped counting somewhere along the line.

even MJ fanatics agree his reported sales figures were bullshit

http://www.maximum-jackson.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=6377

and it was only around last year that it was in line to become the biggest selling album of all time due to increase sales after his death

http://www.billboard.com/news/michael-jackson-s-thriller-approaches-eagles-1003995326.story#/news/michael-jackson-s-thriller-approaches-eagles-1003995326.story

unique said:

Cinnie said:

My goodness, if there is any bullshit to the sales figures of Thriller, it's that they stopped counting somewhere along the line.

even MJ fanatics agree his reported sales figures were bullshit

http://www.maximum-jackson.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=6377

and it was only around last year that it was in line to become the biggest selling album of all time due to increase sales after his death

http://www.billboard.com/news/michael-jackson-s-thriller-approaches-eagles-1003995326.story#/news/michael-jackson-s-thriller-approaches-eagles-1003995326.story

Worlwide (where it counts), maybe or maybe not Stateside, Thriller is undisputably the biggest seller and has been for 20 years+

Greatest Hits compilations don't count for shit as far as i care.

Marrk said:

unique said:

even MJ fanatics agree his reported sales figures were bullshit

http://www.maximum-jackson.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=6377

and it was only around last year that it was in line to become the biggest selling album of all time due to increase sales after his death

http://www.billboard.com/news/michael-jackson-s-thriller-approaches-eagles-1003995326.story#/news/michael-jackson-s-thriller-approaches-eagles-1003995326.story

Worldwide (where it counts), maybe or maybe not Stateside, Thriller is undisputably the biggest seller and has been for 20 years+

Greatest Hits compilations don't count for shit as far as i care.

so,we're all clear on that? 'Thriller' is the biggest selling album of all time.

SoulAlive said:

so,we're all clear on that? 'Thriller' is the biggest selling album of all time.

Yep.

blackbob said:

here is the latest list of the biggest selling album artists in americian history....figures are in millions..these are all the acts who have been certified to have sold at least 30 million ...interesting to see how far behind the beatles that michael jackson is ??....over 100 million albums !!...mind you ..no one is within 50 million of them apart from surprise good ol boy garth brooks ?...country music really sells in the us, doesnt it...amazing....good to see how popular one of my favs is...billy joel on almost 80 million....always been underrated as a songwriter for me...and he has outsold elton john...?....interesting....rock music does well in america has the figures show...prince on almost 40 million....he should go up as the years go by i think.....can anyone tell me who alan jackson is..?....thats the one name here who has passed me by.......

.

.

BEATLES, THE 177
BROOKS, GARTH 128
PRESLEY, ELVIS 121.5
LED ZEPPELIN 111.5
EAGLES 100
JOEL, BILLY 79.5
PINK FLOYD 74.5
STREISAND, BARBRA 71.5
AC/DC 71
JOHN, ELTON 70
JACKSON, MICHAEL 69.5
STRAIT, GEORGE 68.5
AEROSMITH 66.5
ROLLING STONES, THE 66
SPRINGSTEEN, BRUCE 64
MADONNA 64
CAREY, MARIAH 63
METALLICA 60
VAN HALEN 56.5
HOUSTON, WHITNEY 55
U2 51.5
ROGERS, KENNY 51
DION, CELINE 50
DIAMOND, NEIL 48.5
FLEETWOOD MAC 48.5
KENNY G 48
TWAIN, SHANIA 48
JOURNEY 47
ALABAMA 46
SANTANA 43.5
GUNS 'N ROSES 43.5
JACKSON, ALAN 43
CLAPTON, ERIC 42.5
MC ENTIRE, REBA 41
SEGER, BOB AND THE SILVER BULLET BAND 41
PRINCE 39.5
CHICAGO 38.5
SIMON & GARFUNKEL 38.5
FOREIGNER 37.5
2 PAC 37.5
STEWART, ROD 37
BACKSTREET BOYS 37
DYLAN, BOB 37
MC GRAW, TIM 35.5
DEF LEPPARD 35
NELSON, WILLIE 35
BON JOVI 34.5
COLLINS, PHIL 33.5
TAYLOR, JAMES 33
KELLY, R. 33
DENVER, JOHN 32.5
DOORS, THE 32.5
QUEEN 32.5
SPEARS, BRITNEY 32
MATTHEWS, DAVE BAND 32
PEARL JAM 31.5
BOSTON 31
DIXIE CHICKS 30.5
RONSTADT, LINDA 30

.

.

http://www.riaa.com/goldandplatinumdata.php?table=tblTopArt

[Edited 9/10/10 5:03am]

[Edited 9/10/10 5:07am]

Wow no EWF! I guess there is no accounting for taste.

Who is buying all those Eagles greatest hits anyway? I don't know any fans of theirs. And a real fan wouldn't be buying a comp anyway.

unique said:

*snip* - Disputing the fact that Thriller is the biggest selling album of all time w/flimsy arguments and "evidence."

Also, with that link to the Max Jackson forum, the reason they were disputing the numbers was b/c the ones released recently sort of conflicted w/MJDangerous's highly TRUSTED ones (which I have repeatedly said in this thread.) Come back when you have some actual numbers for us instead of conspiracy theories.

michael jackson sold approxiatmly 80 million albums in the U.S. according to Sony/Universal Records and Sony's releasing michael jackson's updated certifications later this year or in 2011, in the U.S, Canada, United Kingdom, Brazil, Argentina and Finland. Only Australia and New Zealand are always updated for all artists.

Unholyalliance said:

unique said:

*snip* - Disputing the fact that Thriller is the biggest selling album of all time w/flimsy arguments and "evidence."

Also, with that link to the Max Jackson forum, the reason they were disputing the numbers was b/c the ones released recently sort of conflicted w/MJDangerous's highly TRUSTED ones (which I have repeatedly said in this thread.) Come back when you have some actual numbers for us instead of conspiracy theories.

come back when you have some facts instead of absolute bullshit and the need to misquote people

Cinnie said:

Who is buying all those Eagles greatest hits anyway? I don't know any fans of theirs. And a real fan wouldn't be buying a comp anyway.

wtf do u live?

it's not about fans, most people who bought most of the artists records in the list aren't fans, they are consumers. it's mostly normal folks who buy records, not the fanatics, that's why sales are big, because the records have mass appeal. discounting the eagles record cuz it's a comp is some more moronic shit from MJ fans who have emotional issues if MJ isn't number 1

unique said:

Cinnie said:

Who is buying all those Eagles greatest hits anyway? I don't know any fans of theirs. And a real fan wouldn't be buying a comp anyway.

wtf do u live?

it's not about fans, most people who bought most of the artists records in the list aren't fans, they are consumers. it's mostly normal folks who buy records, not the fanatics, that's why sales are big, because the records have mass appeal. discounting the eagles record cuz it's a comp is some more moronic shit from MJ fans who have emotional issues if MJ isn't number 1

You have yet to prove he isn't, even counting an Eagles comp (whose sales figures could be just as easily questioned).

[Edited 9/12/10 11:56am]

Cinnie said:

unique said:

wtf do u live?

it's not about fans, most people who bought most of the artists records in the list aren't fans, they are consumers. it's mostly normal folks who buy records, not the fanatics, that's why sales are big, because the records have mass appeal. discounting the eagles record cuz it's a comp is some more moronic shit from MJ fans who have emotional issues if MJ isn't number 1

You have yet to prove he isn't, even counting an Eagles comp (whose sales figures could be just as easily questioned).

[Edited 9/12/10 11:56am]

i have nothing to prove. i don't give two shits, it's not me, so why should i care who is? i don't need to try and manipulate figures to justify or prove a point. i like listening to both the eagles and MJ music, as well as loads of other people. shame you don't too, it's your loss not mine. the eagles had some great music, the greatest hits is perfection on a record

unique said:

Cinnie said:

Who is buying all those Eagles greatest hits anyway? I don't know any fans of theirs. And a real fan wouldn't be buying a comp anyway.

wtf do u live?

it's not about fans, most people who bought most of the artists records in the list aren't fans, they are consumers. it's mostly normal folks who buy records, not the fanatics, that's why sales are big, because the records have mass appeal. discounting the eagles record cuz it's a comp is some more moronic shit from MJ fans who have emotional issues if MJ isn't number 1

It's not that at all. It's the USA biggest selling thing that pisses me off. They even begrudge MJ his biggest seller status Worldwide by mentioning a lesser acheivement. It's like having a 'World Series' in a sport and not inviting the rest of the World to play!

Let the shit-kicking cowboy cunts in the white media over there have their glorious moment, let you and others be fooled as usual. The Beatles, Elvis and The Eagles do not have the biggest selling album ever. A black man does.

[Edited 9/12/10 13:39pm]

Marrk said:

unique said:

wtf do u live?

it's not about fans, most people who bought most of the artists records in the list aren't fans, they are consumers. it's mostly normal folks who buy records, not the fanatics, that's why sales are big, because the records have mass appeal. discounting the eagles record cuz it's a comp is some more moronic shit from MJ fans who have emotional issues if MJ isn't number 1

It's not that at all. It's the USA biggest selling thing that pisses me off. They even begrudge MJ his biggest seller status Worldwide by mentioning a lesser acheivement.

Let the shit-kicking cowboy cunts in the white media over there have their glorious moment, let you and others be fooled as usual.

wtf would you care who was number 1 if you didn't write or record it? you don't get any money out of it or anything, so why are you bothered? i couldn't give two of your shits. why hate on the eagles cuz they sold more albums? their music is great. why the racist comments?

unique said:

Marrk said:

It's not that at all. It's the USA biggest selling thing that pisses me off. They even begrudge MJ his biggest seller status Worldwide by mentioning a lesser acheivement.

Let the shit-kicking cowboy cunts in the white media over there have their glorious moment, let you and others be fooled as usual.

wtf would you care who was number 1 if you didn't write or record it? you don't get any money out of it or anything, so why are you bothered? i couldn't give two of your shits. why hate on the eagles cuz they sold more albums? their music is great. why the racist comments?

edited above, and answered in doing so.

Yeah it has to be outdated, there are artists who have sold over 30 million that aren't listed on there, and artists on there that have sold more than they have listed on there.

Cinnie said:

Who is buying all those Eagles greatest hits anyway? I don't know any fans of theirs. And a real fan wouldn't be buying a comp anyway.

I'm a huge fan of them

unique said:

wtf would you care who was number 1 if you didn't write or record it? you don't get any money out of it or anything, so why are you bothered? i couldn't give two of your shits. why hate on the eagles cuz they sold more albums? their music is great. why the racist comments?

Four question marks? you claim not to give a shit? okay then. Truth be told,I'm actually quite proud of Michael's acheivement and think it deserves protection from lying bastards.

I thought i was being quite eloquent not racist. But if i'm wrong i apologise to those lying cunts in the media and any other cunt i might have offended.

[Edited 9/12/10 13:58pm]

The troll is active again , Just disappear

SoulAlive said:

Cinnie said:

Who is buying all those Eagles greatest hits anyway? I don't know any fans of theirs. And a real fan wouldn't be buying a comp anyway.

I'm a huge fan of them

Seriously? No one ever talks about them like they are an ultimate group. I just don't understand why they are on top like that.

I missed the 70s though.