"You'll see" is a nice song. Nice collab with MOR master David Foster.

thesexofit said:

"You'll see" is a nice song. Nice collab with MOR master David Foster.

I think it's amazing that Madonna was able to pull a "You'll See" out of David Foster in 1995. His adult contemporary mojo was pretty played out and stale by that point.

Same for what she was able to get out of Babyface the year before.

errant said:

I think it's amazing that Madonna was able to pull a "You'll See" out of David Foster in 1995. His adult contemporary mojo was pretty played out and stale by that point.

Same for what she was able to get out of Babyface the year before.

Yeah, I love Foster but he and Babyface pretty much fully converted to MOR sludge around 1993/1994 and beyond. You could barely tell them apart (same with Wally Affanaseif). Foster's work with Michael Jackson was great aswell. Shows that producers can bring the best out of artists and vice versa.

I always assumed Babyface produced "Unbreak my heart", but it was David Foster. Thats a good pop song mind, but my point being both those guys to me, along with Wally, sounded indistinguible to me around the mid 90's when before you could tell them apart.

errant said:

I think it's amazing that Madonna was able to pull a "You'll See" out of David Foster in 1995. His adult contemporary mojo was pretty played out and stale by that point.

Same for what she was able to get out of Babyface the year before.

agreed.

ugh to those years..lawd that whole 1995-1998 period was HARD for me..

it was cute to all you folks who liked falling asleep but I needed some funk. I wasnt with that era at all...I was through with every song being some deep emotional ballad for the lil gay boys at the clubs.

to all you guys that didnt like Hard Candy and don't know ish about 80's funk and experiementation. That album was heat.

paisleypark4 said:

ugh to those years..lawd that whole 1995-1998 period was HARD for me..

it was cute to all you folks who liked falling asleep but I needed some funk. I wasnt with that era at all...I was through with every song being some deep emotional ballad for the lil gay boys at the clubs.

to all you guys that didnt like Hard Candy and don't know ish about 80's funk and experiementation. That album was heat.

So you hate Ray of Light too?

thesexofit said:

errant said:

I think it's amazing that Madonna was able to pull a "You'll See" out of David Foster in 1995. His adult contemporary mojo was pretty played out and stale by that point.

Same for what she was able to get out of Babyface the year before.

Yeah, I love Foster but he and Babyface pretty much fully converted to MOR sludge around 1993/1994 and beyond. You could barely tell them apart (same with Wally Affanaseif). Foster's work with Michael Jackson was great aswell. Shows that producers can bring the best out of artists and vice versa.

I always assumed Babyface produced "Unbreak my heart", but it was David Foster. Thats a good pop song mind, but my point being both those guys to me, along with Wally, sounded indistinguible to me around the mid 90's when before you could tell them apart.

I think Babyface always sounded different from Foster, and he had a bigger variation in his own tracks. With David Foster you always had the same dramatic dated drums before the choruses, that's in not only YS but "Earth Song", "Un-Break My Heart" etc. I do agree Wally was constantly being a Foster wannabe though.

But was DF really "played out and stale" in 1995? Yes, there was the Bodyguard soundtrack and Celine's "The Power Of Love" (which, in a way, was the template to what Madonna was trying to do with YS), but it's around the time YS dropped that DF got on a hit roll yet stopped evolving and basically became the arranger of Diane Warren tracks and certain horrible duets.

I do think Babyface peaked both commercially and artistically in 1994-1995, Madonna both helped on that and managed to ride the wave.

And yes I agree with paisleypark4, it's kinda ironic M gets the praise for working with David Foster yet gets bashed for the Timbaland stuff. Maybe it has to do with pop music aimed to young people, like you were 15 years ago?

TRON said:

paisleypark4 said:

ugh to those years..lawd that whole 1995-1998 period was HARD for me..

it was cute to all you folks who liked falling asleep but I needed some funk. I wasnt with that era at all...I was through with every song being some deep emotional ballad for the lil gay boys at the clubs.

to all you guys that didnt like Hard Candy and don't know ish about 80's funk and experiementation. That album was heat.

So you hate Ray of Light too?

I didbnt like that at the time either...I couldnt dance to any of it really except for Nothing Really Matters ...didnt like Ray Of Light either....too ....bland..or european sounding for my taste. The hard thumping snares and bass..none..the songwriting on the album was great though actually. i did not really appreciate this album until American Life failed me big time.

CHIC0 said:

"Bad Girl" was one of her biggest flops at that point, its video got bad reactions because of the smoking and it was way too attached to the Erotica controversies anyway to feature on such a "clean" project like STR.

LiveToTell86 said:

"Bad Girl" was one of her biggest flops at that point, its video got bad reactions because of the smoking and it was way too attached to the Erotica controversies anyway to feature on such a "clean" project like STR.

the fact that it was her biggest flop as a single only 2 years prior is probably the reason why it wasn't included, i'll grant you that.

but i don't remember any controversy about the smoking. the only controversy i remember from it (considering the video barely registered on the pop culture radar at all at the time) was the implied kinky sex scene that killed her in it.

I loved that video and song the minute I discovered it, though it was like 2-3 years after it came out. It was madonna like I never saw her and it scared the shit out of me, but I love it.

errant said:

LiveToTell86 said:

"Bad Girl" was one of her biggest flops at that point, its video got bad reactions because of the smoking and it was way too attached to the Erotica controversies anyway to feature on such a "clean" project like STR.

the fact that it was her biggest flop as a single only 2 years prior is probably the reason why it wasn't included, i'll grant you that.

but i don't remember any controversy about the smoking. the only controversy i remember from it (considering the video barely registered on the pop culture radar at all at the time) was the implied kinky sex scene that killed her in it.

Well I only know it from this site:

"The video was rarely shown in the USA due to the anti-tobacco campaigns at that time - Madonna is constantly seen smoking throughout the video."

http://www.madonna-online...-facts.htm

I think that would explain why it barely registered on pop culture radar, because just after that "Rain" was supposedly overplayed by MTV (Madonna herself referred to that when she was asked about a 6th video for Erotica, she said why bother, MTV only plays the last one).

LiveToTell86 said:

errant said:

the fact that it was her biggest flop as a single only 2 years prior is probably the reason why it wasn't included, i'll grant you that.

but i don't remember any controversy about the smoking. the only controversy i remember from it (considering the video barely registered on the pop culture radar at all at the time) was the implied kinky sex scene that killed her in it.

Well I only know it from this site:

"The video was rarely shown in the USA due to the anti-tobacco campaigns at that time - Madonna is constantly seen smoking throughout the video."

http://www.madonna-online...-facts.htm

errmmm, yeah, no. that's bullshit.

The best part about this collection is her cover of I want You with Massive Attack. It's one of her most unfairly ignored songs and I'd love it if she sang it live one day. But I don't really listen to the whole album that much because usually I'm not in the mood to listen to that many slow songs all in a row. I prefer a mix of ballads and uptempo things.

The only song I really don't like on it is One More Chance. I think it's one of the worst things she ever did. I would have preferred another new song or even another old song to that.