MyLuv229 said:

Someone talked about Lady in my life a few posts back and I realized I hadn't heard this song in a long time!!

Lady in my Life (uncut)

One of my all time favorites.. Gives me heart palpatations...

I miss you Michael.

Timmy84 said:

babybugz said:

I know and for a kid at that (at that time).

I knew dude was special when I heard Who's Loving You. The guy was still ten when they recorded that song in Hitsville (they didn't go to California until late July '69) in Detroit and to hit those notes while the Funk Brothers and Detroit Symphony were laying down the music... it was truly majestic. That's when I knew Michael was more than just a pop star.

AMEN To that!

suga10 said:

When you have some doctor giving propofol to somebody on daily basis for no valid reason, that is not healthy by any means.

Maybe not, but he was taking propofol to help him sleep as far back as the HIStory tour and it had never been a problem.

But then he wasn't given a lethal amount by a neglegent doctor back then.

MattyJam said:

suga10 said:

When you have some doctor giving propofol to somebody on daily basis for no valid reason, that is not healthy by any means.

Maybe not, but he was taking propofol to help him sleep as far back as the HIStory tour and it had never been a problem.

But then he wasn't given a lethal amount by a neglegent doctor back then.

Is that true?

suga10 said:

Swa said:

^^ Doubles - oh come on now. There were no doubles used in This Is It. I have watched that film more times than I care to mention and trust me there is no use of doubles. What they do is cut up various rehearsals over serveral weeks and put them together - WBSS is a classic example of this. They pull together pieces of the performance from various takes depending on the coverage they had to add more excitement to the film.

If anyone can point out a real double then be glad to see it.

Swa

I have a hard time believing that it was all Michael through that whole movie. Why would Karen Faye- his makeup artist- have such issues against this movie if it was a really genuine film.

Why would Janet not bother to see the movie? Why did LaToya and Joe ignore the movie?

[Edited 8/23/10 21:49pm]

It was Michael..

Karen's issues are because Kenny and Randy Phillips both knew that Michaels was not well.

Michael had no control whatsoever as far the the TII 02 shows. AEG was worse than Sony.

I sincerely believe that Karen Faye was a true friend to Michael.

MOL said:

suga10 said:

I have a hard time believing that it was all Michael through that whole movie. Why would Karen Faye- his makeup artist- have such issues against this movie if it was a really genuine film.

Why would Janet not bother to see the movie? Why did LaToya and Joe ignore the movie?

[Edited 8/23/10 21:49pm]

Janet didn't watch the movie because of the pain seeing her brother alive instilled in her.

Joe and Latoys were the ones who started the doubles rumors. They were the ones who, as soon as they realized they were not getting a paycheck (remember the schemes Joe came up with in order to get a % of the movie?) started this whole "there are body doubles in the movie" B.S..

Karen Faye, prior to Michael's death, was amazingly excited over the concerts. She would talk about how strong and ready Michael was and how she looked forward to the 02 dates. Then MJ dies and Faye's tone completely changes.

The truth is: Michael was strong and ready for the concerts. The "he was weak, uncapable, drugged, forced and frail" was invented by some vultures (we all know who those 4 are) as soon as they realized they couldn't worm their way into AEG's payroll and as soon as their Texas pay-per-view concert was denied by MJ.

EVERYBODY who was in contact with Michael claims he was strong, healthy and ready. Then, on the other hand, you have the likes of Latoya, Leonard Rowe, Oxman and Joe saying the contrary. Someone is lying and we know DAMN WELL who is doing so. It's not as if the ones who rant about MJ's invented poor health didn't have an agenda that includes creating a lawsuit against AEG in hopes to get an enormous payday.

I have loved Michael for all of his 8 years an up life.. He was not healty in TII.

mozfonky said:

MattyJam said:

Maybe not, but he was taking propofol to help him sleep as far back as the HIStory tour and it had never been a problem.

But then he wasn't given a lethal amount by a neglegent doctor back then.

Is that true?

Apparently so. One of his doctors who followed him around on the European leg of the HIStory tour gave an interview a while back and said that he had been giving Michael propofol after the shows to help him unwind.

MattyJam said:

mozfonky said:

Is that true?

Apparently so. One of his doctors who followed him around on the European leg of the HIStory tour gave an interview a while back and said that he had been giving Michael propofol after the shows to help him unwind.

Wow, you'd think he could get himself into big trouble with an admission like that. Just makes you wonder what is so fucking hard about say NO to someone? No one has so much power that you can't just say it. Not like he would have been sent to the gallows. Just goes to show education does nothing for morality.

sag10 said:

MOL said:

Janet didn't watch the movie because of the pain seeing her brother alive instilled in her.

Joe and Latoys were the ones who started the doubles rumors. They were the ones who, as soon as they realized they were not getting a paycheck (remember the schemes Joe came up with in order to get a % of the movie?) started this whole "there are body doubles in the movie" B.S..

Karen Faye, prior to Michael's death, was amazingly excited over the concerts. She would talk about how strong and ready Michael was and how she looked forward to the 02 dates. Then MJ dies and Faye's tone completely changes.

The truth is: Michael was strong and ready for the concerts. The "he was weak, uncapable, drugged, forced and frail" was invented by some vultures (we all know who those 4 are) as soon as they realized they couldn't worm their way into AEG's payroll and as soon as their Texas pay-per-view concert was denied by MJ.

EVERYBODY who was in contact with Michael claims he was strong, healthy and ready. Then, on the other hand, you have the likes of Latoya, Leonard Rowe, Oxman and Joe saying the contrary. Someone is lying and we know DAMN WELL who is doing so. It's not as if the ones who rant about MJ's invented poor health didn't have an agenda that includes creating a lawsuit against AEG in hopes to get an enormous payday.

I have loved Michael for all of his 8 years an up life.. He was not healty in TII.

The big thing for me was just that he didn't seem to be that into it. They had enough footage to pick the most impressive but that doesn't mean he was really all there. I don't know, I just don't know.

mozfonky said:

MattyJam said:

Apparently so. One of his doctors who followed him around on the European leg of the HIStory tour gave an interview a while back and said that he had been giving Michael propofol after the shows to help him unwind.

Wow, you'd think he could get himself into big trouble with an admission like that. Just makes you wonder what is so fucking hard about say NO to someone? No one has so much power that you can't just say it. Not like he would have been sent to the gallows. Just goes to show education does nothing for morality.

babybugz said:

I only watch This Is it once and something was off about his Appearance nothing else anybody can say makes me think otherwise.

I totally agree.

There is more to this story than we even know.

I hate greed.

babybugz said:

I only watch This Is it once and something was off about his Appearance nothing else anybody can say makes me think otherwise.

You know, last night I was watching the Madison Square Garden concert and even there he looked better. But he still didn't look right there, his eyes were blurry and he didn't seem to want to look at anyone which just wasn't michael the performer, maybe the person but never the performer. You know, we all get manipulated sometimes by things that we have to do and it usually shows in our performance, why would Michael be any different?

might need some help with this:

<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/...;<param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/...p;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>

mozfonky said:

MattyJam said:

Apparently so. One of his doctors who followed him around on the European leg of the HIStory tour gave an interview a while back and said that he had been giving Michael propofol after the shows to help him unwind.

Wow, you'd think he could get himself into big trouble with an admission like that. Just makes you wonder what is so fucking hard about say NO to someone? No one has so much power that you can't just say it. Not like he would have been sent to the gallows. Just goes to show education does nothing for morality.

suga10 said:

mozfonky said:

Wow, you'd think he could get himself into big trouble with an admission like that. Just makes you wonder what is so fucking hard about say NO to someone? No one has so much power that you can't just say it. Not like he would have been sent to the gallows. Just goes to show education does nothing for morality.

The fact of the matter is that no ethical doctor would have agreed to Michael's demands. Michael would go for the shady doctors.

I don't even think it is shady doctors, but greedy doctors. Greedy managers, greedy family, greedy friends, greedy employees.

babybugz said:

I only watch This Is it once and something was off about his Appearance nothing else anybody can say makes me think otherwise.

His appearance was off throughout the movie because they used doubles (genuine ones which looked realistic to the public). I think Michael wasn't really coming to rehearsal all that much as they would like to make us think. If he was really healthy, he would have done something similar to the Dangerous Tour rehearsals. These rehearsals were nothing like the Dangerous Tour rehearsals, where he would start and finish the song in its entirety. I really think he gave it his all only in the Jackson 5 Medley and Black or White. These AEG guys did a lot of editing.

And as nutty as Karen Faye maybe, I think she's telling the truth. She just wasn't saying much before because Michael was still alive. She is angered after what happened to him and is speaking out now

[Edited 8/24/10 10:44am]

sag10 said:

suga10 said:

I have a hard time believing that it was all Michael through that whole movie. Why would Karen Faye- his makeup artist- have such issues against this movie if it was a really genuine film.

Why would Janet not bother to see the movie? Why did LaToya and Joe ignore the movie?

[Edited 8/23/10 21:49pm]

It was Michael..

Karen's issues are because Kenny and Randy Phillips both knew that Michaels was not well.

Michael had no control whatsoever as far the the TII 02 shows. AEG was worse than Sony.

I sincerely believe that Karen Faye was a true friend to Michael.

I think Karen isn't that cool either actually. Obsessed.

NMuzakNSoul said:

sag10 said:

It was Michael..

Karen's issues are because Kenny and Randy Phillips both knew that Michaels was not well.

Michael had no control whatsoever as far the the TII 02 shows. AEG was worse than Sony.

I sincerely believe that Karen Faye was a true friend to Michael.

I think Karen isn't that cool either actually. Obsessed.

mozfonky said:

babybugz said:

I only watch This Is it once and something was off about his Appearance nothing else anybody can say makes me think otherwise.

You know, last night I was watching the Madison Square Garden concert and even there he looked better. But he still didn't look right there, his eyes were blurry and he didn't seem to want to look at anyone which just wasn't michael the performer, maybe the person but never the performer. You know, we all get manipulated sometimes by things that we have to do and it usually shows in our performance, why would Michael be any different?

This is the kinda stuff I'm really curious about as a fan. During the MSG shows, Michael just seemed drastically different from his HIStory shows, and even from his MJ & Friends shows, which weren't that far off. I just wish people could could be respectful towards Michael when discussing these types of things. I know it is a fine line to walk between speculation and being disrespectful, but at the same time, I would think, as fans, there is a common understanding that we all admire/respect MJ and are just curious about the live he lived.

Maybe, Vanilli, but sometimes discussing like this, which has been talked over and over even when MJ was among the living, becomes tired when none of us know the answers to why. All we can do is remember the man for who he was and not for what caused him to "look that way". Stress was a major factor in how he dealt with situations you guys are mentioning. I'll just leave that alone.

mozfonky said:

might need some help with this:

<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/...;<param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/...p;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>

Why even bring this? They ain't got answers either.

NMuzakNSoul said:

sag10 said:

It was Michael..

Karen's issues are because Kenny and Randy Phillips both knew that Michaels was not well.

Michael had no control whatsoever as far the the TII 02 shows. AEG was worse than Sony.

I sincerely believe that Karen Faye was a true friend to Michael.

I think Karen isn't that cool either actually. Obsessed.

Yeah something about her threw me off back in 2003 when she was in the MJJF talking to fans. Another issue with her recently was the thing about her making pages to boycott the "This Is It" movie on Facebook. While it was true MJ fired, then hired her back for the "This Is It" tour, I don't know if I put any trust in her. But that's just me.

If you were in Michael's shoes, would you know who to trust? Because maybe it's just me, but I think for someone like Michael who was trying to deal with this hardcore business, even those who claim to be their best friend, would turn on him for anything, mainly money.

So its easier said than done that people think so and so were "true friends" to Michael. It's like with some of his family, who do you trust?

Then again I said, what's discussing any of this gonna do but bring more pain to you guys? Just wondering, you know? What's the point? It leaves more questions than answers.

I don't know if he was suffering a cold or going through another vocal transition (I say it's possibly the latter) but he still sounded great here.

Timmy84 said:

NMuzakNSoul said:

I think Karen isn't that cool either actually. Obsessed.

Yeah something about her threw me off back in 2003 when she was in the MJJF talking to fans. Another issue with her recently was the thing about her making pages to boycott the "This Is It" movie on Facebook. While it was true MJ fired, then hired her back for the "This Is It" tour, I don't know if I put any trust in her. But that's just me.

If you were in Michael's shoes, would you know who to trust? Because maybe it's just me, but I think for someone like Michael who was trying to deal with this hardcore business, even those who claim to be their best friend, would turn on him for anything, mainly money.

So its easier said than done that people think so and so were "true friends" to Michael. It's like with some of his family, who do you trust?

Then again I said, what's discussing any of this gonna do but bring more pain to you guys? Just wondering, you know? What's the point? It leaves more questions than answers.

I think it has more to do with the fact that she's always around him for the past 25 years. It became more than just a professional relationship with him. She did cross the line many times.

Timmy84 said:

Maybe, Vanilli, but sometimes discussing like this, which has been talked over and over even when MJ was among the living, becomes tired when none of us know the answers to why. All we can do is remember the man for who he was and not for what caused him to "look that way". Stress was a major factor in how he dealt with situations you guys are mentioning. I'll just leave that alone.

Timmy84 said:

mozfonky said:

might need some help with this:

<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/...;<param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/...p;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>

Why even bring this? They ain't got answers either.

Well, I don't have a tv, everybody but me probably saw that. But thanks again. Anyway, why did Mike fire her before? Has she sold him out before? Tragic thing is, when it comes to money eventually everyone has to sell out. My old Martial Arts teacher was a senior student of Bruce Lee, he went decades before his son finally conned him into trying to make money off of Bruce. He swore he never would, and probably still says he didn't but the fact is, they started a business based on Bruce's legacy to make money. All of which i guess points to the fact that well, after a point, trust has to be forgotten about just so we can get through day to day life in a competent manner. It's a helluva feeling though, knowing that you really can't trust anyone, I've been there and it's just a cold lonely feeling. One that just will make you sit alone and stare into space for a good while.

babybugz said:

Timmy84 said:

Maybe, Vanilli, but sometimes discussing like this, which has been talked over and over even when MJ was among the living, becomes tired when none of us know the answers to why. All we can do is remember the man for who he was and not for what caused him to "look that way". Stress was a major factor in how he dealt with situations you guys are mentioning. I'll just leave that alone.

That's why I rarely discuss these things lol , trust me I know all about the jacksons past , rumored past whatever you want to call it I just feel those things are so Irrelevant now.

Well I guess so but when someone suddenly dies it's only natural to want answers. You know they initially called Elvis' death a heart attack and it was a long time until they came up with an answer which doesn't really seem conclusive either. That he had a valsalva manouver which is a heart attack but that the drugs and diet he ate had alot to do with it. Then, some people close to him said he had bone cancer. It was not an overdose though in the true meaning of the term.