In the 90s,these two artists were everywhere...writing and producing songs for others,in addition to making kickass albums of their own.But now they seem to have just vanished.


Babyface's last album 'Face To Face' (2002) came and went without a trace.Lauryn's recent 'Unplugged' CD (2002) didn't do much damage,either.

Without these two players in the game,the future of R&B looks very bleak.

DavidEye said:

Babyface hit the age of 40. And unless he does a song with one of the young popular entertainters his stuff will not be on Urban or Pop radio. That last single he released was played on Adult Urban Comtemporary mostly. Plus, the single and the video were trying to hard to fit into the 20-something music scene.

As for Lauren Hill, I felt she was overrated from the get. The fact that she got sued for not crediting the co-writers and co-producers on her first album was the first clue. The fact that they produced evidence and she settled the case speaks volumes. Her second album pretty much confirms that she was not the hot shit musician/writer/producer she was made out to be.

Ifsixwuz9 said:

I agree with your comments about Babyface.His last album was a disaster.He was working with "trendy" producers like The Neptunes and Snoop Dogg.For the first time in his career,he was following trends instead of being a leader.I think he needs to grab his guitar,and concentrate on making "adult" music,since that's where his real audience is at.Would Sade ever do a song with Snoop? Not likely,because she knows she doesn't have to do that.Remember Babyfaces' song "When Will I See You Again"(1993),or his collaboration with Eric Clapton,"Change The World"(1996)? Those were "mature" songs that weren't geared to the hip-hop crowd.


With Lauryn,I think it's just a case of her not being able to deal with the pressures of fame and superstardom.She doesn't seem eager to record a real "follow-up" to 'The Miseducation' CD and recent comments suggest that she is bored with the music biz.

BABYFACE was forced to the outskirts due to shift in predominant musical tastes...lauryn aside from that rather nasty law suit, seems to be emotionally unready to handle the fame she gained( listened to that mediocre unplugged album and that conflict seems to be a recurring theme in the album)

Babface- I may get some flames for this. But I never really cared for Babyface style of production. I respect what he has accomplished, but his music doesn't do much for me. I like what he did on Karyn White debut album and I love "Something In Your Eyes" by Bell Biv Divoe. But when I hear a Babyface song, I turn the station. For one thing, his music is not really groove oriented{as opposed to Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis}. You know that rhythm section has to be bangin.

Lauryn Hill- Still to early in her career to past judgement on where she will end up. Her sophomore album wasn't bad. It surely had some great moments. She probably should have trimmed it down to one disc.

'There She Goes' was wild,i love that song still. . .always gets me in a wild mood.

TheDay was great i got that when it hit in 96.Seven Seas is so beautiful & LL on ThisIs4TheLoverInU is brilliant.

AprilMichelle said:

Yes,that's true.From what I heard,Babyface completed a new album in the late 90s.But when he presented it to the record company,they didn't think it would be successful.So,they encouraged him to bring in some other producers (something he had never done before),and an entire new CD was recorded.The shelved album is undoubtedly a "real" Babyface album that I would still like to hear someday.

Brother915 said:

Did you ever hear his songs "For The Cool In You"(1993) and "Rock Bottom"(1993)? He can groove alright!

DavidEye said:

Actually I'm not a Babyface fan. And I hated the stuff he did with Eric Clapton. But, I did like "When Will I See You Again" and some of the stuff he produced for After 7, Toni Braxton, and Tevin Campbell.




To an extent, yes. But, I think Lauryn also got a case of "the big head" after "Mis Ed" and it came back to bite her in the ass. She pretty much kicked the Fugees to the side. And time has shown that Wyclef was probably resposible for a lot of the Fugees success when it comes to production, etc.


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[This message was edited Thu Jan 9 6:40:12 PST 2003 by Ifsixwuz9]

DavidEye said:

Yeah...It's alllight. Every now and then, he'll come up with a heavy groove. But a lot of his stuff just seems lightweight to me. He's a great writer and in the 80's and early 90'he was hot as a firecracker. Everything he touched was a hit.

Ifsixwuz9 said:

Ifsixwuz9.I think you may have a point here.

L-Boogie didn't produce 4 alot of ppl like Babyface and she's still in her early career. Give her sometime.

Ifsixwuz9-Obeviously you didn't take any time to hear the Unplugged and read the (((lyrics))). You wouldn't say what you just said.

I don't care about Face but L-Boogie will shut everybody up.

Babyface should stick to producing - he spreads himself to thin by trying to be a pop star at the same time. Its like Ashford & Simpson trying to cross over from writers to performers. They are good performers its just that other people can do their material a little better then they can.
Babyface is good but Johnny Gill or Whitney Houston or Luther Vandross or Boys 2 Men can rip his songs out with just a little something more then Babyface adds.

"Hands Up", the new single by TLC, is produced by Babyface. It should be hitting radio next week.

I was surprised to see Babyface producded a lot of stuff for artists that should have had hit albums like Toni Braxton, TLC and Whitney but all of those albums aren't doing that well. Of those mentined, I only own Whitney's "Just Whitney" and he added some really good stuff on there. I wouldn't be suprised if "Try It On My Own", the only song he producded by himself becomes a single and a hit. It's a really lovely ballad and I heard is getting a remix by Thunderpuss, which could help make it a hit.

great Question: Babyface had a Helluva Run.He was a Songwriter that came at the right time&had the right Formula too work.but aside from a Few Songs&the "for The Cool in You" Album he could never make that turn as a SuperStar Artist on Himself.He down-played Himself as a Artist&now He is just assed out.10 years ago a Mellow Vibe with some Mid-Tempo thrown in was wanted at the time.now His Sound is too Soft too get Pop&R&B Play&Push. Lauyrn Hill:She needs too be inspired by Wyclef more often too bring some fumes too Her Material.She isn't the only act too have the Credits twisted but put it like this:we would be dropping Names like Crazy if we named all the acts that did the same thing.anyway She is Talented but a Bit too much&She better get back too Her Studio vibe because the "Mad Truck Driver" unplug Performance will have Her in a Wendy's near you if She don't get them Hits out???

Harlepolis said:

I heard enough of it to know she can barely play acoustic guitar and the songs were not fully thought out enough to stick on an album.

mistermaxxx said:

Yes there are a ton of folks who don't write and produce their own songs but have that credit on their albums. However, most of them do not then go to the media and make a big hoohah over the fact that when they were in such and such group they never got any credit for their contributions. But, then turn around get a solo deal and do the same thing to other people.

Ifsixwuz9 said:

She had the Hype&the money behind Her.TOmmy Mottola&the Sony Gang lips were sealed as long as the Money is Green?

a better question is what happend to kriss kross?

hopefully the're not homeless or doing man porn.

Hell, whateva happend to Missy Elliott and her potna. They used to produce alot of hiphop-RnB jams but in ONE night they stopped. Whats wrong?

DavidEye said:

---
I got on this board and said this record was going to bomb when it came out.

It is sad but, Babyface is 40 years old and radio will not play the music of a 40 year old guy. In addition, he should not have let other producers come in and do the record.

It is the same crap that would have happen to Prince if he had stayed with Arista .

laurarichardson said:

Radio WILL play it - Adult Contemporary radio, that is People gotta realize where they are in life & get cozy where they fit in. He had no business trying to come slick, that shit was beyond whack. He's talented, I like his stuff but he's gotta stick to what he knows.

As for Lauren, I hope she finds a balance, chills out & continues to make music. I heard the acoustic album but it was like one long complaining-ass song. She's on a 180 tangent that nobody's ready for, I hope she finds her way back. She doesn't have to be superwoman up in here (b/c she probably was trying to do too much), but the stripped down purity is too drastic a departure, she's not equipped to handle it & it's just boring...

& btw, we get the message, now put on some makeup already! She's too beautiful for this drab nonsense & I almost died when she cut off her beautiful locs It's gon' be alright, baby girl!

CalhounSq said:

Calhoun,I agree with your ENTIRE post! Babyface needs to come back to reality and stop trying to appeal to a crowd that couldn't care less about him.Like I said before,he needs to pick up his guitar and make some soulful,mature songs that HIS audience would dig.The funny thing is,this is exactly what he was doing BEFORE his last CD! He was doing REAL music fromn his heart before he decided to jump on "The Neptunes bandwagon".

DavidEye said:

Babyface didn't have much choice.He was dropped by Sony&then He re-Hooked-up with La Reid who gave Him a Deal.it's not a matter of who Cats want to do.it's that in this day&Age of PAYOLA Producer Driven Music you don't have alot of Artistic Rights like in the past.too be played you gotta go with the flow or just go.if you get a chance too read Toni Braxton's Cover&Interview Story in Vibe that came out a month or two Back you can read between the lines of what is going down.Face had His Time&Say on Payola Radio&Now it's The Neptunes,Murder Inc,Puffy,Dre,DarkChild,Missy&Timberland,Jermaine Dupri,and a select few others that are allowed too Pimp there Sound on the _Airwaves.too be frank Superstar or Not in 2003:in Corperate World now this ain't Pepsi or Coke.it's this or the Door.

DavidEye said:

I wouldn't agree there. Babyface was, is and always will be crap.

Lauryn ought to give The Haitian Sensation ('Cleff) a call and get back in the studio with the boys. Her last album was so bad it was funny.

I love Lauren and I too wish she would get back with Clef and make more great music with him. Wyclef has great talent. I love his solo cd's. Lots of fun and some great tunes too. His version of "wish you were here" kicks ass!

She ain't gotta get with Clef but she needs to get w/ somebody - the lone guitar thing ain't cuttin' it...

CalhounSq said:

the Mad Trucker Driver Routine Scared you as Well???I heard SOny Claimed they lost the Tapes of that Performance&I see why they were playing that off.

mistermaxxx said:

:O Whoa, which performance are you talking about, Maxxx? DO TELL

I was refering to her stripped down, unplugged approach in general - she's talented but not THAT talented, lol!