dag said:

I think so.....

seeingvoices12 said:

Ameen on that!

seeingvoices12 said:

Thanks.

What did Toy Toy, the Pope Of Pop, the most talented Jackson, say on "Devil's Advocate"?
[Edited 11/19/09 13:36pm]

dag said:

yeah it's a popular vacation spot in mexico
[Edited 11/19/09 13:52pm]

bboy87 said:

I could orgnote it to you [/quote]

It doesn't bother me if people have my e-mail address.

I'm here chillin' and I have love for all.

(And a Spam Filter.)

Thanks for the PDF. I'll send a link where you can download "This Is It"

(Until the DVD comes out. Everyone Buy the DVD.)

MOL said:

well, i think the d.a. is going to make an end run around these allegations by either a) going after murray for prescribing to a patient that he knew or suspected was under the influence. any way you slice it, murray had taken up the task of being mj's personal 24/7 doctor. the man had access to him in ways his other docs didn't so he's not going to get a pass with the 'i didn't know'. he could have demanded blood tests, could have drawn blood while mj was 'sleeping', asked the insurance doctor about the nature of mj's health, etc. or b) they will show while there may be evidence that mj was an addict, there's no evidence he was using during the two months that murray was with him. conversely, the autopsy will show that whatever other drugs mj had in his system, they did not combine with the stuff murray gave him to kill him; it was all the stuff murray gave. and let's not forget the timeline of events. murray had enuf time to get mj to the hospital to save him, but didn't do it.

and with respect to joe, the judge has ruled that he has absolutely no standing to make a challenge to the will. i doubt the appeals court will overturn the probate judge's ruling. unless katherine herself comes out with her own accusations about her son's mental instability, then it's going nowhere. that won't stop joe from trying, though!
[Edited 11/19/09 14:26pm]

kibbles said:

I give her 2 years to do that. Remember that Randy just moved into Hayvenhurst...
[Edited 11/19/09 14:45pm]

MOL said:

Really?

MOL said:

Excuse them at the KOP forum, but Tito was the one to tell the public about Michael's on-again/off-again drug problems long BEFORE Janet did.

Perfect post I found in KOP forum:

"I feel that janet loved michael very much and always supported him but I have major problems with some of the things:

1. Janet herself has said that sometime she has not seen michael in two years and since after the trial he was mostly out of the country I don't think she saw much of him to really know what he was doing.

2. Again, I wish the illness that michael had would be discussed and because people are left to believe that michael wanted drugs just to get high and not because he had a physical need for the pain killers if he was still taking them. He may have not wanted to stop because that would have meant dealing with physical pain.

3. THe autopsy report says there were no other drugs in his system. If he was constantly using other drugs I think there would have been some evidence of organ damage or a build up in his system.

4. Also, I do not believe Michael would want his personal business all over the media for these hater reporters to talk about.

5. She is hurting the criminal case because the doctor's defense was that Michael was so addicted to the drug that he kept begging for it. She is giving credibility to that claim.

6. Also, let us not forget she has an album to sell and Janet has not had a hit album since the superbowl fiasco and she has releasd 4 albums in 5 years and they have all tanked. Even she talked about the problems with the last album and she know that talking about Michael will get he this publicity.

7. Another thing if michael was under emotional stress maybe it was because the family expected him to take care of them and did not bother janet for anything. Michael was under the financial stress of giving his mother 40,000 a month not janet. Even now she could come in and tell Joe that she will take care of him so he does continue these stupid proceedings or get more of an allowance from his grandchildren's money."

MOL said:

please tell me that's not true.

Alhumduallah..the brother was blessed!

dag said:

It's actually Cancun... a city in Mexico... big vacation spot. I like MJ's phonetic spelling.

Jackson pharmacy search records to be unsealed
By KEN RITTER, Associated Press Writer

Thursday, November 19, 2009

(11-19) 17:56 PST LAS VEGAS, (AP) --

A Nevada judge decided Thursday to unseal records of a warrant served at a pharmacy where authorities believe Michael Jackson's doctor bought the drug blamed in the pop star's death.

The documents will be available Friday, after Clark County District Court Judge Valerie Adair signs a court order being drafted to make the ruling official, said Adair's clerk, Penny Wisner.

"The court finds there is not a sufficient basis to keep the affidavit sealed," Adair said in a written order after speaking privately by telephone with a Los Angeles County prosecutor seeking to keep a seal on the warrant documents.

A day earlier, a Los Angeles police detective asked the judge by phone to keep the records of the Aug. 11 police raid at Applied Pharmacy Services sealed until Jan. 18. He argued releasing them would jeopardize the investigation.

Attorney Colby Williams, representing The Associated Press, Los Angeles Times, TMZ Productions Inc. of Los Angeles and Stephens Media LLC, the parent company of the Las Vegas Review-Journal, argued there was no reason for the documents to remain secret.

"We consider this to be an important investigation into the death of one of the world's most well-known entertainers," Williams said. "The public has a right how these investigations are conducted."

A law enforcement source told AP after the raids that investigators believed Jackson's personal physician, Dr. Conrad Murray, bought the powerful sedative propofol from the Las Vegas pharmacy on May 12, and administered doses from that purchase to Jackson in the hours before he died June 25.

Murray is the focus of a homicide investigation, but has not been charged with a crime.

Affidavits already made public show that Murray told investigators he gave Jackson propofol and other sedatives to help the 50-year-old singer sleep in the hours before he died in a rented Los Angeles mansion.

Murray, through a spokeswoman, maintains he neither prescribed nor administered anything to Jackson that should have killed him.

MOL said:

sorry but anybody who needs to be put under with an iv drip in order to sleep at night is obviously addicted, i wish some of you fans stop acting like this is some normal behavior.

TonyVanDam said:

not only that but his drug problems has been discussed constantly since the day he died. listen we all loved mj, he provided the soundtrack to our childhoods but the man had some serious problems and addiction was one of them. why are people saying he had NO drugs in his system when he died? the man died from an overdose.the doctor is responsible for his death because he is the one that administered the drugs outside of a hospital setting, he showed a total disregard for human life (by the way janet said she felt murrey was responsible), but mj wanted that drug because he was addicted.these fans need to cut it out with all the stabbing in the back bs, janet has always stood by her brother. what does her saying she would love to see her brothers perform together again have to do with michael being addicted? michael was a great artist but he wasnt perfect and he wasnt god, the man was human and he had faults.

lowkey said:

There were more than just Dr. Murray responsible for this tragic.

And BTW, am I the only person to notice the "Lee Harvey Oswald" treatment that Dr. Murray is getting. What about all of those other people that Michael knew were out to get him?!?

lowkey said:

EXACTLY. It doesnt matter whether he was what most people would consider a drug addict or not. Even if Michael had never touched a drug in his life, getting something as hardcore as PROPOFOL injected into him just for sleep is pretty damn deep, just like Janet said.

seeingvoices12 said:

DAMN!

DesireeNevermind said:

You've obviously never heard D.S

seeingvoices12 said:

Seems like some lyrics were changed. I'd love to hear the original

http://www.huffingtonpost...04820.html

Sleepless Supernova: Propofol Lullabies In Neverland

Michael Jackson's death is already a fading memory despite an acute expression of global despair as we witnessed the untimely extinction of a supernova. For physicians, struggling against a climate of national examination in this era of healthcare reform, there is a distinctly darker anguish which must finally be examined, an anguish which has been little discussed in the public arena. What has become of a profession which repeatedly fails its most important client: the patient, all the while profiting from the hapless same? At a time when an entire industry stands accused of cavalier profiteering, this is an important question to consider.

Michael Jackson was a patient failed by those who attended him. Even though some (including Jack Kevorkian in a recent article here on HuffPost) may argue that 'he got what he wanted", the discovery of propofol in his home brought our profession to new levels of mercenary depravity. Physician colleagues expressed shock and disbelief. Patients in consultation talked about their fears of becoming dependent on sleep aids, sometimes even referring to Michael's cautionary tale. The cumulative pain from these decades of assaults on Michael's privacy, identity, and self, all contributed to the erosion of his identity. Was it any wonder the man would be in severe psychological pain from his first memories until perhaps his last hours? The accounts of a desperate insomniac entertainer craving propofol-induced 'sleep' were, to me, the most staggering salvo in the final, painful ballad of a dying star. Propofol lullabies in an unmonitored, non-sterile bedroom could be no more certain a prescription for death than a smoking gun.

A drug I have prescribed with due respect in the critical care arena when I was a practicing intensivist, propofol was a wonderful tool to induce sedation and facilitate difficult procedures which my patients needed. But using this agent required a team of monitoring professionals and devices in an advanced, high-tech environment to maintain both the safety of my patients and the peace of mind of their doctor. That an anesthesiologist could be on tour with Michael administering this drug for sleep onset is both baffling and repugnant. The King of Pop was effectively anaesthetized every night, while our profession was asleep at the wheel. Everyone recognizes the disability of the poor but few recognize how handicapping extreme wealth can be, holding its victims hostage to boundless access. In the world of the uberwealthy, doctors become enablers, dispensers, predators, little more than licensed pushers.

Michael Jackson had spent a lifetime entertaining us at late, adult schedule hours from the time when he was barely out of infancy himself. This was a man who never had the benefit of unscheduled time, never learned the first experience of parental discipline so fundamental to a child's development: a fixed sleep-wake routine. Instead, at five he was already performing during the evening. By the time he appeared at the Apollo in 1969, he was a veteran of late night entertainment. Peter Pan's insomnia was yet another feature of not being allowed a full and healthy childhood.

Entertainers often experience delayed sleep phase syndrome.....a delayed physiologic timing in the arrival of sleep which the patient experiences as sleep onset insomnia. Bill Maher has described suggestive features reporting in one interview in his own words that he 'keeps VERY late hours'. Unsurprising, if one thinks about this. A natural tendency to sleep later and stay up later, easily described as being a night owl, may be a draw to the professional nightlife. While some entertainers may gravitate to the industry because of their night owl tendencies, most are likely permanently rendered 'delayed sleep phase types' because of their exposure to late night bright light, stimulation, social interaction and stimulating substances including caffeine, nicotine or in some instances recreational drugs which all drive to delay the bedtime further.

Television itself can inhibit sleep onset because of the impact of ambient light from the screen on the body's intrinsic hormone of darkness, melatonin, Television watching, in a recent American survey published this spring in the Journal Sleep "Dubious bargain: trading sleep for Leno and Letterman' has been identified to be responsible for delaying sleep by up to 52 minutes in 68% of Americans. A dubious bargain indeed, when the nation is so frequently sleep deprived.

Out of desperation, insomniacs may problem-solve independently, most commonly resorting to alcohol as a self medication, not understanding that there is in this country, more so than anywhere else, a certified subspecialist sleep medicine community which exists to solve exactly these problems. Michael would have been exposed to this environment and these behaviors at an extremely early age, setting the scene for a lifetime of sleep disorders and drug dependencies.

The absence of response from the professional sleep medicine community to the abuse of propofol as a sleep aid in the setting of profound insomnia is puzzling to me but possibly intentional. Michael's insomnia, like that of Heath Ledger's was a lost teachable moment and in their lifetimes, a lost opportunity for intervention. Unrecognized insomnia has become a familiar motif in our most vulnerable icons, one which steals them away in the night. Too frequently insomnia is ascribed to 'drugs' without looking at why these individuals may have resorted to drug dependency in the first place.

Trouble sleeping is a serious multi-factorial disorder, one which needs careful evaluation. Insomnia is a disorder characterized by symptom focused definitions: trouble falling asleep, trouble staying asleep, waking up before socially desirable or sleep which is simply not rejuvenating, Insomnia patients can have several of these symptoms together. Insomnia however is no longer considered merely a symptom but seen as a viable disorder itself, requiring detailed evaluation, multidisciplinary approaches and sometimes long term therapies. Board certified sleep specialists can guide a patient to treatment, which often involves more than solving an isolated psychiatric disorder or drug addiction but actually involves the teaching of new behaviors, restructuring disordered beliefs relating to insomnia, examining medical conditions, searching for primary sleep disorders and exploring all the factors which are contributing to disrupted sleep. Many patients who are resistant to seeking psychiatric help which may be very much needed, can be coaxed to such aid through a sleep specialist. An ethical sleep specialist in the setting of Michael Jackson's insomnia could have been a life line into the chaos surrounding him, though agreed, Michael was recalcitrant to sensible intervention, as Dr. Deepak Chopra sadly relayed in his CNN interviews shortly after Michael's death.

Unrecognized sleep disorders are often a harbinger of coexistent anxiety and depression. We know that Michael could well have experienced major depression at being stripped of a childhood and compelled 'to be an adult' very early, in the words of Brooke Shields as she eulogized him. Finally, the last decade of his life punctuated by a punishing trial would be very likely to have triggered severe depression as a reaction whether or not it touched on the truth of his inner life.

Most of all this event speaks to the national culture of Sleep Machismo a phrase which captures American workaholism as a disordered belief system, almost uniquely American. Imagine a performer so desperate for sleep he resorts to anesthetic sedation and yet so pressured to perform he was committed to dozens of concerts in a compressed time frame. His doomed concert was even aptly named as 'THIS IS IT". For Michael at that point in his career it was 'Do or Die'. Unfortunately, this time it would be 'Die'.

In this country, we value, emulate and even laud sleep loss in the pursuit of achievement, accolade and advancement. Michael's lifestyle and his learned behaviors of self-medicating sleep disorders were an exaggerated form of Sleep Machismo which appears in my office every day in a number of guises. His loss leaves many questions and an agitated hunger to pin blame on a single miscreant. Indeed major responsibilities are borne by the clinicians prescribing and administering him drugs at the patient's whim, which ultimately would be likely to act as cumulative respiratory depressants. Yet to me his loss was, in sum, a collective responsibility of an unfettered culture which has become almost singularly oral and consumptive, a culture with an insatiable appetite for interminably 'more' at the expense of our icons, our sanity and often our sleep.

As physicians we would do well to remember the Hippocratic Oath of first doing no harm. Clearly in the misery of his sleeplessness, his physicians betrayed the most basic of ethical boundaries. They put self interest ahead of patient interest. Sadly, the icon had become the golden goose for failing careers. These physicians too suffered from the drive to consume and appease an insatiable appetite for cash, celebrity and personal gain. My profession failed a national treasure, no matter how disordered, and failed him in pursuit of personal greed. We failed in his diagnosis, in his treatment, in disengaging from the dance with a manipulative addict and ultimately failed in the recognition of a critically important sleep disorder. Let us not fail in his wake to examine the lessons to found in the debris of destruction and share them with Americans everywhere.

http://charlesthomsonjour...media.html

Chandler Suicide Highlights Media Bias Against Jackson
by Charles Thomson

When it emerged yesterday that two weeks go Evan Chandler, father of Jordan Chandler, shot himself in the head, few tears were shed despite the media's best efforts to eulogise him.

Most media outlets are touting Chandler as 'the father of the boy who accused Jackson of child molestation'. Wrong. Chandler was the father who accused Jackson of molesting his son.

The initial allegations against Jackson were made not by Jordan Chandler but by his father Evan, in spite of Jordan's insistence that Jackson never touched him inappropriately, a stance that the boy maintained for several months.

Relations between the boy's father and Jackson had soured in early 1993 when Evan asked the popstar to build him a house and Jackson politely declined. A failed screenwriter, Chandler contacted Jackson shortly afterwards and asked him to negotiate three scriptwriting deals on his behalf. If Jackson did not comply, he said, he would accuse him of molesting his son. Jackson didn't comply - and the rest is history.

As revealed by Mary Fischer in her 1994 GQ article 'Was Michael Jackson Framed?' - Jordan Chandler only claimed to have been molested by Jackson after Evan - a dentist by trade - plied him with a mind-bending drug called sodium amytal, which is known to induce false memory syndrome.

Even once Jordan Chandler began to toe his father's line, his testimony was so unconvincing that DA Tom Sneddon took his case to three separate grand juries and none of them allowed him to bring charges against Michael Jackson. Contrary to widely reported myth, Jordan Chandler did not accurately describe Jackson's genitals. Among other inaccuracies, he claimed that Jackson was circumcised while police photographs proved that he was not.

Unsurprisingly, none of this information has made its way into the mainstream media's reportage of Evan Chandler's death. Instead, Chandler's suicide is seen as another opportunity to sling mud at Michael Jackson and perpetuate the same, tired old myths about the 1993 allegations - particularly with regard to the settlement.

News outlets the world over are once more reporting that in 1994 Jackson paid the Chandlers a settlement. This is total fiction.

Court documents from the time state clearly that Jackson's insurance carrier "negotiated and paid the settlement over the protests of Mr Jackson and his personal legal counsel."

Jackson didn't even agree with the settlement, let alone pay it.

Amongst the publications that rehashed this age old nonsense was The Sun, to which I often contribute as a Michael Jackson expert. I was contacted yesterday and asked to provide information about Evan Chandler and the 1993 allegations, which I did. However, none of my information was used - most likely because it reflected too well on Jackson. Myths that imply Jackson's guilt are evidently more important than truths which exonerate him.

Noticing that The Sun's article on Chandler's suicide contained several factual inaccuracies (most promintently that Jordan initiated the claims of molestation and that Jackson paid the family a settlement) I contacted two members of staff at the newspaper - my usual contact and the journalist who wrote the article. Neither email was replied and the article was not changed.

Elsewhere, The Mirror ranked several places higher on the adbsurdity scale as it attempted to portray Chandler as a martyr of some kind. 'Michael Jackson sex case dad Evan Chandler wanted justice but ended up destroyed', read the headline.

Justice?

If Evan Chandler had wanted justice, why did he contact Jackson and ask for a three-movie script deal before he went to the police? If he wanted justice, why did he accept a settlement from Jackson's insurance carrier?

Indeed, the settlement included a clause which stated that accepting the payment in lieu of a civil trial would not affect the family's ability to testify in a criminal case. So if Evan Chandler wanted justice, why didn't he allow the police to press ahead with their investigation?

The headline, along with much of the article, is nonsense.

Having taken Jackson's insurance carrier for just under $15million (not the $20million usually alluded to by the press), in 1996 Evan Chandler tried to sue Jackson for a further $60million after claiming that the star's album HIStory was a breach of the settlement's confidentiality clause. In addition to trying to sue Jackson, Chandler requested that the court allow him to produce a rebuttal album called EVANstory.

Yes, really.

So the man who The Mirror claims only 'wanted justice' thought that the best course of action after the initial media storm died down would be to release an album of music about the supposed abuse of his pre-pubescent son.

The Mirror alluded to the fact that relations between Jordan and his parents were strained after 1993, but laid the blame at Jackson's door, claiming that the trauma of the case had driven them apart.

In actuality, Jordan Chandler went to court when he was 16 and gained legal emancipation from both of his parents. When called to appear at Jackson's 2005 trial, he refused to testify against his former friend. Had he taken the stand, Jackson's legal team had a number of witnesses who were prepared to testify that Jordan - who now lives in Long Island under an assumed name - had told them in recent years that he hated his parents for what they made him say in 1993, and that Michael Jackson had never touched him.

The evidence surrounding the 1993 allegations overwhelmingly supports Michael Jackson's innocence. It is for this reason that during the lengthy investigation, which continued for many months before Jackson's insurance carrier negotiated a settlement, Michael Jackson was never arrested and he was never charged with any crime.

The evidence overwhelmingly suggests that Evan Chandler masterminded the allegations as a money making scheme, believing it would help him to achieve his dream of working in Hollywood. Tape recorded telephone conversations heard him dismiss the boy's wellbeing as 'irrelevant' and claim that he was out to take Jackson for all he was worth. (Click here for Mary Fischer's GQ article, which contains transcripts of the telephone calls.)

Mary Fischer's evidence shows that as well as falsifying the sexual abuse of his own son in an elaborate extortion plot, when Jordan refused to play along Evan plied him with mind-altering drugs in a bid to trick him into believing that he was molested.

But even drugging a child as part of an extortion plot wasn't Evan Chandler's lowest point. That came when he petitioned the court to allow him to release an album of music about the supposed sexual abuse of his own son.

If Evan Chandler wanted justice, he got it two weeks ago.

As for the media, this latest incident cements once more the industry's almost total unwillingness to report fairly or accurately on Michael Jackson, particularly on the bogus allegations of sexual abuse that were levelled against him. None of the aforementioned information and evidence was included in any article about Chandler's suicide that I have read so far, despite the fact that I personally delivered it to at least one newspaper which has repeatedly paid me as a Jackson expert on other stories.

Exculpatory facts are overlooked in favour of salacious myths. A black humanitarian is tarred as a paedophile and his white extortionist is painted as a martyr.

As for Jordan Chandler, maybe with his father gone he will find the courage to do the honourable thing. Perhaps he will surface somewhere and tell the world what he's been telling his friends for over a decade now - that Michael Jackson never laid a finger on him. Until then, I suspect he will live with the same torment that it seems eventually claimed his father, suspiciously soon after the demise of the biggest victim in all of this; Michael Jackson.

Hilton: 'Michael Jackson's Kids Are 'Wonderful'
November 2009

Five months after their father's death, Michael Jackson's three children are thriving in their grandmother's care, longtime family friend Kathy Hilton tells People magazine.

Paris, 11, Prince 12, and Blanket, 7 are "wonderful, their grandmother is incredible and ... they could not be in better hands," Hilton said Tuesday at the launch of daughter Paris's beauty line at the Thompson Hotel Rooftop in Beverly Hills.

"I believe they are being home-schooled, which I think is appropriate for this year," adds Hilton, 50, who has known the family since she was 13. "They're getting along and they have an incredible family. They really are, I promise
you."



http://www.people.com/peo...ok_comment

i hope that cowardly bastard evan died painfully and very slowly.greedy and evil scumbags like him deserve NO sympathy