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PrintableSee there, I knew you were secretly family. You're listening to music that touches you. Shit, you're gayer than I am. Hell, I'm just looking for music to make my ass move.
. Keep focussing on cheesy discofied, funk and guys with unshaved balls i would say, maybe we can expect a late seventies disco-revival in 20 years or so... | |
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Riverpoet31 said: See there, I knew you were secretly family. You're listening to music that touches you. Shit, you're gayer than I am. Hell, I'm just looking for music to make my ass move.
. Keep focussing on cheesy discofied, funk and guys with unshaved balls i would say, maybe we can expect a late seventies disco-revival in 20 years or so... And you keep focusing on show tunes and blonde haired blue eyed guys with little three inch shaved pink dicks that turn blood red if you suck them too hard, and maybe the producer of "The Sound Of Music" will give you a call.  Andy is a four letter word. | |
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Riverpoet31 said: I realize that they may not have near the talent that musical geniuses like Public Enemy or NWA have, but everyone can't be geniuses.
I sense your sarcasm, but IMO Rick James is discofied funk with bad vocals, and... well... a lack of funk. Definitely one of the most overrated musicians on the 'org'. Public Enemy are better and have been more important then him, NWA is just a bunch of whiners going for ghetto-excuses.  Don't laugh at my funk
This funk is a serious joint | |
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vainandy said: And you keep focusing on show tunes and blonde haired blue eyed guys with little three inch shaved pink dicks that turn blood red if you suck them too hard, and maybe the producer of "The Sound Of Music" will give you a call.  LMFAODon't laugh at my funk
This funk is a serious joint | |
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Public Enemy | |
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phunkdaddy said: vainandy said: Both groups had about as much rhythm as a Barbara Streisand album. In their early years, both groups were underground in my area because, when it came to rap, R&B radio in those days only played the funky jams (in other words, something that is actually music and worthy of airplay, none of that dull storytelling shit).
Back in those days, I used to buy records that I had never heard yet and take a chance that it might be good. I bought a lot of rap 12 Inches that way since jams from folks like 2 Live Crew, Gigolo Tony, or Afro Rican were mainly club jams and got little or no airplay due to all the Shitney Houston adult contemporary type stuff that was dominating the airwaves. I bought Public Enemy's first album thinking it might be good. Hell, that shit was more boring than Shitney Houston and I threw it in the trash. As for NWA or Dr. Dre, he should have stayed his ass in the World Class Wrecking Crew. At least they knew how to throwdown with jams like "The Fly" and "Bionic".This is where i disagree with you Vain. 2 Live Crew shouldn't even be mentioned when you talk about rap. They were just a plain minstrel show even more so than the NWA days after Ice Cube. As far as who was better NWA or PE. I definitely vote PE. As far as the person talking that nonsense about Rick James being mediocre,i shouldn't even address that shit. Some of Rick James lesser known songs like Moonchild,(which Mary J.Blige sampled for Love is All we need),When Love Is Gone, Spacey Love, Fool on the Street, Slow and Easy, and 69 times are better than 75% of the bullshit you hear on the radio now. D'Angelo could even come back and make 3 albums in the next 3 years and still couldn't touch Rick James legacy.[Edited 10/1/09 13:55pm] Preach!    *R.I.P MJ*...*And Thank You SO Much!* | |
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BlaqueKnight said: vainandy said: Both groups had about as much rhythm as a Barbara Streisand album.
You know P.E. sampled a LOT of James Brown's beats, right? So are you going to say James Brown is not funky? cool, debating funk with vainandy. gosh why not ask him what the expert thinks about cunnilingus? he might have read about it in some magazine as well? come to think of it... better debate cheap simplistic generic casio beats out of a 29$ Walmart keyboard with no funk at all I bet my bottom dollar that he owns more Bar Kays plastic-era albums than James Brown and P-Funk combined. and Kool & the Gang only got interesting for him once JT entered the stage. so much for real funk [Edited 10/1/09 14:50pm] Has anyone tried unplugging the United States and plugging it back in? | |
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BombSquad said:
cool, debating funk with vainandy. gosh why not ask him what the expert thinks about cunnilingus? he might have read about it in some magazine as well? I like funk but I'll never like anything that funky. I bet my bottom dollar that he owns more Bar Kays plastic-era albums than James Brown and P-Funk combined.
And you would win that bet. I like several eras of funk but naturally the funk I'm going to prefer and own the most of, is the funk I lived through. Not the extremely popular funk that has been praised by critics in magazines for decades, or funk that Prince has mentioned as his influences, or funk that has been sampled to death in rap songs. A lot of folks that didn't even grow up on funk may rush to the record store to buy those type of artists first so they can seem "cultured" or "musically diverse". Well, ain't nothing fake about me. I was into funk back then and I'm still into funk. I didn't discover it later and then try to go buy up a bunch of stuff that's been praised by critics in an attempt to look like a funk lover. Most of the funk I own, is on vinyl and I bought it while it was brand new and still in style. I bought it out of a genuine love for the music, my taste, not Prince's taste, nor some music critic's taste, nor some rapper's taste. I discovered funk on my own and lived the era. I didn't need anyone to school me on what funk to buy so I can look like some musical snob. Oh, don't get me wrong, I'm definately a musical snob. But my opinions are my own, not some magazine critic's, or Prince's, or rapper's. . . . [Edited 10/1/09 16:07pm] Andy is a four letter word. | |
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NDRU said: Well, I prefer Public Enemy as a group, though I liked Straight Outta Compton & Cube & Dre solo albums as well.
I might say that NWA was more influential, but without PE I am not sure NWA would have been the same. It's weird how PE seems to have lost all cred in the hip hop community, while maintaining it in the more mainstream music community. Chuck D & Professor Griff still have cred for being entertainingly, politically & socially responsible (their past fallouts with the Jewish community over out of context statements NOT included of course!). The only PE member that has been f***ing up in recent years is Flavor Flav with his hot mess involvement in reality TV. As for Terminator X, he's happy retired from the music industry. But his replacement DJ Lord has done well on the live stage. | |
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vainandy said: Both groups had about as much rhythm as a Barbara Streisand album. In their early years, both groups were underground in my area because, when it came to rap, R&B radio in those days only played the funky jams (in other words, something that is actually music and worthy of airplay, none of that dull storytelling shit).
Back in those days, I used to buy records that I had never heard yet and take a chance that it might be good. I bought a lot of rap 12 Inches that way since jams from folks like 2 Live Crew, Gigolo Tony, or Afro Rican were mainly club jams and got little or no airplay due to all the Shitney Houston adult contemporary type stuff that was dominating the airwaves. I bought Public Enemy's first album thinking it might be good. Hell, that shit was more boring than Shitney Houston and I threw it in the trash. As for NWA or Dr. Dre, he should have stayed his ass in the World Class Wrecking Crew. At least they knew how to throwdown with jams like "The Fly" and "Bionic".No disrespect, but Barbara doesn't have the courage to sing or rap a song like F*** The Police like N.W.A. did, and you know it.
As for tempo, Public Enemy had plenty of uptempo tracks that you overlook. 911 Is A Joke, Fight The Power, Bring The Noize, Shut'em Down, Brothas Gonna Work It Out, Terminator X At The Edge Of Panic & Can't Do Nuttin' For You Man are real jams that you can dance to.  | |
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Timmy84 said: NDRU said: Well, I prefer Public Enemy as a group, though I liked Straight Outta Compton & Cube & Dre solo albums as well.
I might say that NWA was more influential, but without PE I am not sure NWA would have been the same. It's weird how PE seems to have lost all cred in the hip hop community, while maintaining it in the more mainstream music community. That's because the hip-hop community never quite got them. But the mainstream understood. Why do you think Anthrax collaborated with them? Public Enemy nowadays perform mostly to enthusiastic white crowds. Then again they were always performing mainly to them. Their parents probably never understood their kids' fascination with Public Enemy (or even NWA) but the kids dug it anyway. That said, PE never gets acknowledgment for what they did to hip-hop. Without them, NWA, Pac and 'em wouldn't have existed. Real talk. And don't forget the college crowd. They were the main reason why PE was able to get mainstream success WITHOUT any help from FM radio. | |
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BlaqueKnight said: vainandy said: Both groups had about as much rhythm as a Barbara Streisand album.
You know P.E. sampled a LOT of James Brown's beats, right? So are you going to say James Brown is not funky? Besides James Brown, Public Enemy and their main producers The Bomb Squad also sampled Queen, Prince, P-Funk, Kool & The Gang, Sly Stone, Issac Hayes, Curtis Mayfield, and loads of classic rock AND classic funk.  | |
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TonyVanDam said:
No disrespect, but Barbara doesn't have the courage to sing or rap a song like F*** The Police like N.W.A. did, and you know it. Oh, but I wish she did. Remember when folks like her, Ethel Mermon, Sesame Street, and others that were considered "uncool" made a disco record and it helped to kill the genre because some listeners didn't want to be associated with a genre that was considered "uncool"? I'd love to see Barbara or someone like her make a shit hop record and rap it out in an operatic type voice....bitch better have my moneyyyyy.... I don't think it would work today though because these folks would just laugh at her. Hell, they'd probably even like it considering what they already listen to. Andy is a four letter word. | |
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vainandy said: As did so many of the other underground rap groups of the late 80s. It didn't sound funky at all. It sounded like a James Brown record that had a scratch in it and it just kept repeating that same section over and over. Then they added something that sounded like continuous grinding over the scratched record and then yelled out verses on top of that which made it sound even worse. I felt like I was listening to a dog fight.
. . . [Edited 10/1/09 12:27pm] It's call a audio loop. All a DJ/producer/beatmaker have to do is listen for THE best instrument part of any James Brown classic, record THAT part with a (drum OR keyboard) sampler and used it however they wanted to use it in their production. Another way to get an audio loop is to have 2 copies of the same vinyl record to play on 2 turntables at the same time. When they get to THE best instrument part of any James Brown classic, they can scratch the vinyls back within 2-3 seconds apart from each other and just re-play that loop as long as they wanted. THIS works great when the loops is back by a drum machine (mostly a Roland TR-808). | |
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TonyVanDam said: vainandy said: As did so many of the other underground rap groups of the late 80s. It didn't sound funky at all. It sounded like a James Brown record that had a scratch in it and it just kept repeating that same section over and over. Then they added something that sounded like continuous grinding over the scratched record and then yelled out verses on top of that which made it sound even worse. I felt like I was listening to a dog fight.
. . . [Edited 10/1/09 12:27pm] It's call a audio loop. All a DJ/producer/beatmaker have to do is listen for THE best instrument part of any James Brown classic, record THAT part with a (drum OR keyboard) sampler and used it however they wanted to use it in their production. Another way to get an audio loop is to have 2 copies of the same vinyl record to play on 2 turntables at the same time. When they get to THE best instrument part of any James Brown classic, they can scratch the vinyls back within 2-3 seconds apart from each other and just re-play that loop as long as they wanted. THIS works great when the loops is back by a drum machine (mostly a Roland TR-808). Oh, I know what a loop is. I've made loops the primitive way by getting the best part of a breakdown of a song, or maybe the intro, and recording that section onto a cassette tape, then hit the pause button, then record it again, then hit the pause button again. Afterwards, burn it onto a CD and then mix another song by another artist on top of it. But then again, I like to make a loop to mix with, I'm not making it as a foundation to put vocals on top of and release as an actual song. That's what instruments are for. The problem these days, is that people that are in reality nothing but overpaid DJs and are being paid money as if they were musicians. And these days, they aren't even as talented as a DJ because computers are doing the work for them.
. . . [Edited 10/1/09 16:59pm] Andy is a four letter word. | |
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phunkdaddy said: vainandy said: Both groups had about as much rhythm as a Barbara Streisand album. In their early years, both groups were underground in my area because, when it came to rap, R&B radio in those days only played the funky jams (in other words, something that is actually music and worthy of airplay, none of that dull storytelling shit).
Back in those days, I used to buy records that I had never heard yet and take a chance that it might be good. I bought a lot of rap 12 Inches that way since jams from folks like 2 Live Crew, Gigolo Tony, or Afro Rican were mainly club jams and got little or no airplay due to all the Shitney Houston adult contemporary type stuff that was dominating the airwaves. I bought Public Enemy's first album thinking it might be good. Hell, that shit was more boring than Shitney Houston and I threw it in the trash. As for NWA or Dr. Dre, he should have stayed his ass in the World Class Wrecking Crew. At least they knew how to throwdown with jams like "The Fly" and "Bionic".This is where i disagree with you Vain. 2 Live Crew shouldn't even be mentioned when you talk about rap. They were just a plain minstrel show even more so than the NWA days after Ice Cube. As far as who was better NWA or PE. I definitely vote PE. As far as the person talking that nonsense about Rick James being mediocre,i shouldn't even address that shit. Some of Rick James lesser known songs like Moonchild,(which Mary J.Blige sampled for Love is All we need),When Love Is Gone, Spacey Love, Fool on the Street, Slow and Easy, and 69 times are better than 75% of the bullshit you hear on the radio now. D'Angelo could even come back and make 3 albums in the next 3 years and still couldn't touch Rick James legacy. [Edited 10/1/09 13:55pm] I disagree. you can mention all 3 groups in the same discussion. Look at it in the context of style: Public Enemy is political rap. N.W.A. is gangsta rap. 2 Live Crew is party rap. Also look at the groups lead vocalists: Public Enemy had Chuck D. N.W.A. had Ice Cube & MC Ren. 2 Live Crew had Fresh Kid Ice & Brother Marquis. Also look at the groups comic foils: Public Enemy had Flavor Flav. N.W.A. had Eazy-E. 2 Live Crew had Luke. Also look at the groups DJs: Public Enemy had Terminator X & (in recent years) DJ Lord. N.W.A. had Dr.Dre & DJ Yella 2 Live Crew has Mr.Mixx And finally, their respected anthems: Public Enemy had Fight The Power & Bring The Noize N.W.A. has Gangsta Gangsta & F*** The Police 2 Live Crew had Me So Horny & Hey, We Want So Pussy | |
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TonyVanDam said: Timmy84 said: That's because the hip-hop community never quite got them. But the mainstream understood. Why do you think Anthrax collaborated with them? Public Enemy nowadays perform mostly to enthusiastic white crowds. Then again they were always performing mainly to them. Their parents probably never understood their kids' fascination with Public Enemy (or even NWA) but the kids dug it anyway. That said, PE never gets acknowledgment for what they did to hip-hop. Without them, NWA, Pac and 'em wouldn't have existed. Real talk. And don't forget the college crowd. They were the main reason why PE was able to get mainstream success WITHOUT any help from FM radio. That's so true. | |
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vainandy said: Oh, I know what a loop is. I've made loops the primitive way by getting the best part of a breakdown of a song, or maybe the intro, and recording that section onto a cassette tape, then hit the pause button, then record it again, then hit the pause button again. Afterwards, burn it onto a CD and then mix another song by another artist on top of it. But then again, I like to make a loop to mix with, I'm not making it as a foundation to put vocals on top of and release as an actual song. That's what instruments are for. The problem these days, is that people that are in reality nothing but overpaid DJs and are being paid money as if they were musicians. And these days, they aren't even as talented as a DJ because computers are doing the work for them.
. . . [Edited 10/1/09 16:59pm] Remember, they're not programming their beats with computers too often. They're using Fisher Price toys from Toys R US!  | |
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vainandy said: And you keep focusing on show tunes and blonde haired blue eyed guys with little three inch shaved pink dicks that turn blood red if you suck them too hard, and maybe the producer of "The Sound Of Music" will give you a call. What's wrong with "The Sound Of Music"? hm  "So Long, Farewell" is da jam!
It's P.E. for me. | |
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TonyVanDam said: vainandy said: Oh, I know what a loop is. I've made loops the primitive way by getting the best part of a breakdown of a song, or maybe the intro, and recording that section onto a cassette tape, then hit the pause button, then record it again, then hit the pause button again. Afterwards, burn it onto a CD and then mix another song by another artist on top of it. But then again, I like to make a loop to mix with, I'm not making it as a foundation to put vocals on top of and release as an actual song. That's what instruments are for. The problem these days, is that people that are in reality nothing but overpaid DJs and are being paid money as if they were musicians. And these days, they aren't even as talented as a DJ because computers are doing the work for them.
. . . [Edited 10/1/09 16:59pm] Remember, they're not programming their beats with computers too often. They're using Fisher Price toys from Toys R US! Terminator X was a genius anyways, these others wish they could produce as well as he did. | |
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TonyVanDam said: phunkdaddy said: This is where i disagree with you Vain. 2 Live Crew shouldn't even be mentioned when you talk about rap. They were just a plain minstrel show even more so than the NWA days after Ice Cube. As far as who was better NWA or PE. I definitely vote PE. As far as the person talking that nonsense about Rick James being mediocre,i shouldn't even address that shit. Some of Rick James lesser known songs like Moonchild,(which Mary J.Blige sampled for Love is All we need),When Love Is Gone, Spacey Love, Fool on the Street, Slow and Easy, and 69 times are better than 75% of the bullshit you hear on the radio now. D'Angelo could even come back and make 3 albums in the next 3 years and still couldn't touch Rick James legacy. [Edited 10/1/09 13:55pm] I disagree. you can mention all 3 groups in the same discussion. Look at it in the context of style: Public Enemy is political rap. N.W.A. is gangsta rap. 2 Live Crew is party rap. Also look at the groups lead vocalists: Public Enemy had Chuck D. N.W.A. had Ice Cube & MC Ren. 2 Live Crew had Fresh Kid Ice & Brother Marquis. Also look at the groups comic foils: Public Enemy had Flavor Flav. N.W.A. had Eazy-E. 2 Live Crew had Luke. Also look at the groups DJs: Public Enemy had Terminator X & (in recent years) DJ Lord. N.W.A. had Dr.Dre & DJ Yella 2 Live Crew has Mr.Mixx And finally, their respected anthems: Public Enemy had Fight The Power & Bring The Noize N.W.A. has Gangsta Gangsta & F*** The Police 2 Live Crew had [i]Me So Horny & Hey, We Want So Pussy[/i] 2 Live Crew like i said, a 90's minstrel act Don't laugh at my funk
This funk is a serious joint | |
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PE the best Rap Group of all time?
Chuck. The Messages. The Production. The Attitude.  Good shit."Hyperactive when I was small, Hyperactive now I'm grown, Hyperactive 'till I'm dead and gone"
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ ___ "Midnight is where the day begins" |
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vainandy said: godyssey said:
Public Enemy by far, although they had to grow on me. They really were "in your face", but I liked the positive messages. They did spark lot's of confusion in me though, because as a young teen I had no idea that racism even existed. Damn, where did you live? Mister Rogers' Neighborhood? Uh no, but most kids fortunately, don't have those experiences. In my neighborhood there were whites, blacks, mixed kids...we all got along. | |
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As a woman whose favorite MC happens to be Ice Cube, I vote NWA. While PE had a message and more depth to their material (and a larger catalogue) I think NWA hit the ground running. It was clever, bold, yet raw. When Cube when behind the rhymes, they were their best. PE doesn't exactly sound like rapping to me. Chuck D kinda barked his message. It wasn't singing so it was classified as rap. But there are factors such as Flavor Flav's coonery that tarnish the legacy. It seems like as a militant I should flock to PE, but I've often felt Chuck was preachy. I dig aggressive lyrics, that's why I like Cube. But Chuck never changed it up. I can't listen to a rapper that sounds the exact same way every song.
As far as the lyrics concerning women, Cube is married to a Black woman. His mom is a Black woman. So I'm pretty sure he doesn't hate me or any other Black women. People take rap far too literally, yet that doesn't happen when someone writes another work of fiction such as a book or screenplay. This is the same thing. The only difference is there is a heavy depedency on using actual elements of your life in your music. That's what makes it different. Of course hyperbole is used, but it's used in a lot of poetry/creative writing. NWA made a lasting impression on me because they provided me with my favorite MC. Of course, I wasn't a fan of NWA without Cube, and as much as I heard PE, I never really took it on. Truthfully: I actually own every Cube album (even complilations). In my young age, I find myself more into rappers who say things well, but aren't stupid. So that explains my preference to Nas and Common. I don't like party rappers, but I like rappers who know profanity doesn't cheapen or ruin good music. Sometimes you feel like screaming "F*CK". I have to be open minded. And despite the strong "gangster" tones of NWAs music, that was teaching the youth on that side of the map. You want to be aware, even if that means seeing the ugly side of things. And to be really honest, I like groups like OutKast, Wu-Tang and UGK more than both. Sorry I strayed, it's just that I love talking Hip Hop and I splurge when I can. LOL! Peace & b Wild. Peace, Hip Hop & Purple Rain Goddess Cru Love is 2 Weak 2 Define, Just What U Mean 2 Me - ADORE | |
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scriptgirl said: I'm down for PE
 these are the days of wild.... | |
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Public Enemy! Better music and better message. NWA went from 'reporting" about the violence and crime in South Central to gloryfying it. That's where they lost me as a fan.  | |
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Riverpoet31 said: I sense your sarcasm, but IMO Rick James is discofied funk with bad vocals, and... well... a lack of funk. Definitely one of the most overrated musicians on the 'org'. Which just goes to show how little you know about funk or Rick James. | |
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GangstaCru said: As a woman whose favorite MC happens to be Ice Cube, I vote NWA. While PE had a message and more depth to their material (and a larger catalogue) I think NWA hit the ground running. It was clever, bold, yet raw. When Cube when behind the rhymes, they were their best. PE doesn't exactly sound like rapping to me. Chuck D kinda barked his message. It wasn't singing so it was classified as rap. But there are factors such as Flavor Flav's coonery that tarnish the legacy. It seems like as a militant I should flock to PE, but I've often felt Chuck was preachy. I dig aggressive lyrics, that's why I like Cube. But Chuck never changed it up. I can't listen to a rapper that sounds the exact same way every song.
As far as the lyrics concerning women, Cube is married to a Black woman. His mom is a Black woman. So I'm pretty sure he doesn't hate me or any other Black women. People take rap far too literally, yet that doesn't happen when someone writes another work of fiction such as a book or screenplay. This is the same thing. The only difference is there is a heavy depedency on using actual elements of your life in your music. That's what makes it different. Of course hyperbole is used, but it's used in a lot of poetry/creative writing. NWA made a lasting impression on me because they provided me with my favorite MC. Of course, I wasn't a fan of NWA without Cube, and as much as I heard PE, I never really took it on. Truthfully: I actually own every Cube album (even complilations). In my young age, I find myself more into rappers who say things well, but aren't stupid. So that explains my preference to Nas and Common. I don't like party rappers, but I like rappers who know profanity doesn't cheapen or ruin good music. Sometimes you feel like screaming "F*CK". I have to be open minded. And despite the strong "gangster" tones of NWAs music, that was teaching the youth on that side of the map. You want to be aware, even if that means seeing the ugly side of things. And to be really honest, I like groups like OutKast, Wu-Tang and UGK more than both. Sorry I strayed, it's just that I love talking Hip Hop and I splurge when I can. LOL! Peace & b Wild. Peace, Hip Hop & Purple Rain Goddess Cru NWA was definitely raw and in your face and they accomplished exactly what they wanted to, yes. They did have a couple of songs I liked, but it was the friendly for radio songs like "Express Yourself." I just couldn't take the constant disrespect towards women in their lyrics, even as a little girl, I knew something wasn't right with that. I agree with you on Chuck's barking, his style is not rapping in the technical sense. But it's very recognizable. I've lost the use of my heart, But I'm still alive, Still looking for the life, The endless pool on the other side, It's a wild wild west, I'm doing my best, I'm a soldier of love, Every day and night, I'm soldier of love, All the days of my life. | |
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probably public enemy, but i dig the members of n.w.a.'s respective solo projects a whole lot more than any of p.e.'s stuff For all time I am with you, you are with me. | |
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vainandy said: Oh, I know what a loop is. I've made loops the primitive way by getting the best part of a breakdown of a song, or maybe the intro, and recording that section onto a cassette tape, then hit the pause button, then record it again, then hit the pause button again. Afterwards, burn it onto a CD and then mix another song by another artist on top of it.
But then again, I like to make a loop to mix with, I'm not making it as a foundation to put vocals on top of and release as an actual song. That's what instruments are for. The problem these days, is that people that are in reality nothing but overpaid DJs and are being paid money as if they were musicians. And these days, they aren't even as talented as a DJ because computers are doing the work for them.
 Ouch!
Graycap23 said: Truth can be a biatch..... [Edited 10/4/09 6:33am] | |
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