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PrintableMarrk said: midnightmover said: Think again. He said he was tired and was using the ipod to keep alert. He never said the ipod belonged to the girl. I don't think they even had electricity in that village, so Lord knows how they would have used an ipod. And that "astounded" thing is a little off-base too. He was just saying how incredibly surreal it was to be witnessing this ancient ceremony on the one hand and to secretly have MJ blasting in his ear on the other. Bruce Parry is "astounded" in every moment of every one of his programs.  It wouldn't be much of a program if he was blase about it all. 
BTW, I'm not disputing MJ's worldwide popularity because that's self evident, but you misinterpreted what you saw in that program. Yep, dragged out the DVD, my fault for not paying full attention, i think i was on the org too at the time and looked up when i heard MJ mentioned, i'm just pissed you ruined my romanticised post!
However, it was just an mp3 player, they have power tools, so must have leccy. I had my ipod playing in the the Sahara desert a couple of years ago, so no matter how remote you are, it is possible. That's an understatement! | |
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It's threads like this that show up just how ignorant so many around here are. Is it a coincidence that the ignorance is mostly coming from MJ and Janet fans? I think not. Some of them seem to be equating influence with fame. MJ is much more famous than James Brown, but nowhere near as musically important. James spawned two whole new genres. Funk and hip-hop. For the first 15 years of hip-hop it was James Brown who's music provided the basis for the music. He was (and still is) the most sampled man in music. Back in the '60s when he put out jams like Papa's Got a Brand New Bag and Cold Sweat it changed the arrangements for black bands all over the world. He moved soul in a more rhythmic direction. Without him the music of the last 50 years would be very different.
MJ on the other hand had hardly any musical influence, because he innovated nothing. His influence was on the visual side of things. Videos and spectacle. You only have to look at his descendants (Chris Brown, etc.) to see what Mike's importance was. He was an entertainment genius, but musically he was not a leader. Bob Marley, by contrast, WAS an important musical figure. In the 70s and 80s white rock acts enthusiastically embraced reggae, which was a form they had derided before. The reason for that change was one man. Bob Marley. You could hear that change EVERYWHERE. However, he is not as influential as James Brown or Chuck Berry, who's absence from this list shows just how redundant it really is. “The man who never looks into a newspaper is better informed than he who reads them, inasmuch as he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.”
- Thomas Jefferson | |
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Michael is not more influential than James.
Yet. As time goes by, it is apparent he grows more influential. if a young black/white guy born in the 80's throws some MJ influenced moves and vocally tries to imitate his grunts and ad-libs and knows nothing of James apart from 'Rocky IV', James isn't influencing him, Michael is. |
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Marrk said: Michael is not more influential than James.
Yet. As time goes by, it is apparent he grows more influential. if a young black/white guy born in the 80's throws some MJ influenced moves and vocally tries to imitate his grunts and ad-libs and knows nothing of James apart from 'Rocky IV', James isn't influencing him, Michael is. Well the guy brought up in the '80s needs some lessons then because James can actually entertain me more than Mike can, and that's saying a lot. All people who copy Mike are doing is just adding more carbon to their imitations rather than becoming their own entertainer or musician. Another problem is MJ was more about the entertainment value than musical. No one who's "influenced" by him are taken by the fact that he created or invented any musical genre, they're more taken that the guy is or was one hell of a performer. He influenced the way people marketed their music and he influenced people to cross over into pop music. Technically he already achieved the crossover as member of The Jackson 5. James Brown brought funk to the mainstream and his funk music influenced hip-hop while Bob Marley brought reggae to the world. [Edited 2/19/09 14:06pm] | |
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midnightmover said: It's threads like this that show up just how ignorant so many around here are. Is it a coincidence that the ignorance is mostly coming from MJ and Janet fans? I think not. Some of them seem to be equating influence with fame. MJ is much more famous than James Brown, but nowhere near as musically important. James spawned two whole new genres. Funk and hip-hop. For the first 15 years of hip-hop it was James Brown who's music provided the basis for the music. He was (and still is) the most sampled man in music. Back in the '60s when he put out jams like Papa's Got a Brand New Bag and Cold Sweat it changed the arrangements for black bands all over the world. He moved soul in a more rhythmic direction. Without him the music of the last 50 years would be very different.
MJ on the other hand had hardly any musical influence, because he innovated nothing. His influence was on the visual side of things. Videos and spectacle. You only have to look at his descendants (Chris Brown, etc.) to see what Mike's importance was. He was an entertainment genius, but musically he was not a leader. Bob Marley, by contrast, WAS an important musical figure. In the 70s and 80s white rock acts enthusiastically embraced reggae, which was a form they had derided before. The reason for that change was one man. Bob Marley. You could hear that change EVERYWHERE. However, he is not as influential as James Brown or Chuck Berry, who's absence from this list shows just how redundant it really is. THIS LIST IS ABOUT INFLUENCIAL. NOT INNOVATION. if this was about innovation and creating a new genre of music JAMES BROWN WOULD WIN. but this is ABOUT INFLUENCE. AND MICHAEL HAS INFLUENCED MORE PEOPLE GLOBALLY THAN JAMES BROWN, AND THAT IS A FACT. if you want to be delusional thats fine. But its evident that michaels influence is still around. |
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Timmy84 said: Marrk said: Michael is not more influential than James.
Yet. As time goes by, it is apparent he grows more influential. if a young black/white guy born in the 80's throws some MJ influenced moves and vocally tries to imitate his grunts and ad-libs and knows nothing of James apart from 'Rocky IV', James isn't influencing him, Michael is. Well he needs some lessons then because James can actually entertain me more than Mike can, and that's saying a lot. All people who copy Mike are doing is just adding more carbon to their imitations rather than becoming their own entertainer. True. But i hope you get my point. People forget, children around now, in ten years time won't be influenced so much by MJ, but probably someone really derivative of him that is around today. |
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Marrk said: Timmy84 said: Well he needs some lessons then because James can actually entertain me more than Mike can, and that's saying a lot. All people who copy Mike are doing is just adding more carbon to their imitations rather than becoming their own entertainer. True. But i hope you get my point. People forget, children around now, in ten years time won't be influenced so much by MJ, but probably someone really derivative of him that is around today. No I get your point. I was just saying... lol | |
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Timmy84 said: James Brown was one of those who brought soul music to the pop mainstream and invented funk practically. MJ is influential in making music videos an art form and for creating "the modern pop album" after Thriller. Plus MJ was an icon in pop culture so of course his image is out there, doesn't mean he's THE most influential, lol.
[Edited 2/19/09 12:50pm] 
dude, you simply didn't understand what i have said,and you also mixing and confusing things , again, MJ is more infulential than james brown, you are saying music videos? who said anything about music videos? are you saying that the tons and tons of kids and artists we see around the world who dance like mj and sing like MJ are beacuse of music videos and the thriller album? not the talent? , don't confuse those things of what both brought to the table, Mj influenced the music industry with his music videos by changing the music video format to shot films.....do you get the point? the person who infulenced people more is Mj not James brown.
plus , this is not the point of who is being more innovating ,is teddy riley is more infulential than MJ? because teddy riley is responisble for creatin the new jack swing genre, he is an innovator but that doesn't mean he is more influential.....do you get the point? MICHAEL JACKSON
R.I.P مايكل جاكسون للأبد 1958 | |
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TotalAlisa said: midnightmover said: It's threads like this that show up just how ignorant so many around here are. Is it a coincidence that the ignorance is mostly coming from MJ and Janet fans? I think not. Some of them seem to be equating influence with fame. MJ is much more famous than James Brown, but nowhere near as musically important. James spawned two whole new genres. Funk and hip-hop. For the first 15 years of hip-hop it was James Brown who's music provided the basis for the music. He was (and still is) the most sampled man in music. Back in the '60s when he put out jams like Papa's Got a Brand New Bag and Cold Sweat it changed the arrangements for black bands all over the world. He moved soul in a more rhythmic direction. Without him the music of the last 50 years would be very different.
MJ on the other hand had hardly any musical influence, because he innovated nothing. His influence was on the visual side of things. Videos and spectacle. You only have to look at his descendants (Chris Brown, etc.) to see what Mike's importance was. He was an entertainment genius, but musically he was not a leader. Bob Marley, by contrast, WAS an important musical figure. In the 70s and 80s white rock acts enthusiastically embraced reggae, which was a form they had derided before. The reason for that change was one man. Bob Marley. You could hear that change EVERYWHERE. However, he is not as influential as James Brown or Chuck Berry, who's absence from this list shows just how redundant it really is. THIS LIST IS ABOUT INFLUENCIAL. NOT INNOVATION. if this was about innovation and creating a new genre of music JAMES BROWN WOULD WIN. but this is ABOUT INFLUENCE. AND MICHAEL HAS INFLUENCED MORE PEOPLE GLOBALLY THAN JAMES BROWN, AND THAT IS A FACT. if you want to be delusional thats fine. But its evident that michaels influence is still around.  MJ sure does attract the intellectuals doesn't he?
We're taking about MUSIC here. I outlined in brief some of James's influence. It wasn't just on a few singers. It was on two entire genres of music. Those two genres became the most dominant influences of the late twentieth century. James was the one who changed the grooves we all listen to. MJ did nothing remotely close to that. Do not bother responding to this post. Sometimes when you know nothing about a subject it's best to keep quiet and just listen to those who do, rather than screaming and shouting about something you have no knowledge of. “The man who never looks into a newspaper is better informed than he who reads them, inasmuch as he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.”
- Thomas Jefferson | |
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midnightmover said: It's threads like this that show up just how ignorant so many around here are. Is it a coincidence that the ignorance is mostly coming from MJ and Janet fans? I think not. Some of them seem to be equating influence with fame. MJ is much more famous than James Brown, but nowhere near as musically important. James spawned two whole new genres. Funk and hip-hop. For the first 15 years of hip-hop it was James Brown who's music provided the basis for the music. He was (and still is) the most sampled man in music. Back in the '60s when he put out jams like Papa's Got a Brand New Bag and Cold Sweat it changed the arrangements for black bands all over the world. He moved soul in a more rhythmic direction. Without him the music of the last 50 years would be very different.
MJ on the other hand had hardly any musical influence, because he innovated nothing. His influence was on the visual side of things. Videos and spectacle. You only have to look at his descendants (Chris Brown, etc.) to see what Mike's importance was. He was an entertainment genius, but musically he was not a leader. Bob Marley, by contrast, WAS an important musical figure. In the 70s and 80s white rock acts enthusiastically embraced reggae, which was a form they had derided before. The reason for that change was one man. Bob Marley. You could hear that change EVERYWHERE. However, he is not as influential as James Brown or Chuck Berry, who's absence from this list shows just how redundant it really is. Anything just to bash Mj fans  , this is not the point of being innovator, and your post is completely out of topic. all of this just to attack Mj fans, see what i have responded to timmy.....MICHAEL JACKSON
R.I.P مايكل جاكسون للأبد 1958 | |
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seeingvoices12 said: midnightmover said: It's threads like this that show up just how ignorant so many around here are. Is it a coincidence that the ignorance is mostly coming from MJ and Janet fans? I think not. Some of them seem to be equating influence with fame. MJ is much more famous than James Brown, but nowhere near as musically important. James spawned two whole new genres. Funk and hip-hop. For the first 15 years of hip-hop it was James Brown who's music provided the basis for the music. He was (and still is) the most sampled man in music. Back in the '60s when he put out jams like Papa's Got a Brand New Bag and Cold Sweat it changed the arrangements for black bands all over the world. He moved soul in a more rhythmic direction. Without him the music of the last 50 years would be very different.
MJ on the other hand had hardly any musical influence, because he innovated nothing. His influence was on the visual side of things. Videos and spectacle. You only have to look at his descendants (Chris Brown, etc.) to see what Mike's importance was. He was an entertainment genius, but musically he was not a leader. Bob Marley, by contrast, WAS an important musical figure. In the 70s and 80s white rock acts enthusiastically embraced reggae, which was a form they had derided before. The reason for that change was one man. Bob Marley. You could hear that change EVERYWHERE. However, he is not as influential as James Brown or Chuck Berry, who's absence from this list shows just how redundant it really is. Anything just to bash Mj fans , this is not the point of being innovator, and your post is completely out of topic. all of this just to attack Mj fans, see what i have responded to timmy.....Another intellectual giant from Team MJ. Dude, it's your post that's ignoring the topic, not mine. You just completely ignored the substance of my post. Try reading it again. I'm talking about influence on music. James is the most influential popular musician of the latter half of the twentieth century. Not the most famous. Not the most popular. But the most influential.“The man who never looks into a newspaper is better informed than he who reads them, inasmuch as he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.”
- Thomas Jefferson | |
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midnightmover said: TotalAlisa said: THIS LIST IS ABOUT INFLUENCIAL. NOT INNOVATION. if this was about innovation and creating a new genre of music JAMES BROWN WOULD WIN. but this is ABOUT INFLUENCE. AND MICHAEL HAS INFLUENCED MORE PEOPLE GLOBALLY THAN JAMES BROWN, AND THAT IS A FACT. if you want to be delusional thats fine. But its evident that michaels influence is still around. MJ sure does attract the intellectuals doesn't he?
We're taking about MUSIC here. I outlined in brief some of James's influence. It wasn't just on a few singers. It was on two entire genres of music. Those two genres became the most dominant influences of the late twentieth century. James was the one who changed the grooves we all listen to. MJ did nothing remotely close to that. Do not bother responding to this post. Sometimes when you know nothing about a subject it's best to keep quiet and just listen to those who do, rather than screaming and shouting about something you have no knowledge of. YOU are just bashing my intelligence because im an MJ fan. But really There are MILLIONS of MJ fans compared to James brown
How many people do you see imitating james brown???? How many people across different countries even know james brown????? I DON'T CARE ABOUT JAMES BROWN, HIS MUSIC IS BORING, HE DANCES LIKE A CHICKEN. MANY PEOPLE FEEL THIS WAY!!!!! I don't care to know anything about james brown, WHY because his music does NOT interest me. But I see that MANY people like michael jackson and these artist out today say Michael jackson influenced them. NOT JAMES BROWN. OH I DO KNOW ABOUT THAT |
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midnightmover said: seeingvoices12 said: Anything just to bash Mj fans , this is not the point of being innovator, and your post is completely out of topic. all of this just to attack Mj fans, see what i have responded to timmy.....Another intellectual giant from Team MJ. Dude, it's your post that's ignoring the topic, not mine. You just completely ignored the substance of my post. Try reading it again. I'm talking about influence on music. James is the most influential popular musician of the latter half of the twentieth century. Not the most famous. Not the most popular. But the most influential. YOU ARE JUST UPSET James loses to Michael jackson |
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Well, that told me. “The man who never looks into a newspaper is better informed than he who reads them, inasmuch as he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.”
- Thomas Jefferson | |
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midnightmover said: seeingvoices12 said: Anything just to bash Mj fans , this is not the point of being innovator, and your post is completely out of topic. all of this just to attack Mj fans, see what i have responded to timmy.....Another intellectual giant from Team MJ. Dude, it's your post that's ignoring the topic, not mine. You just completely ignored the substance of my post. Try reading it again. I'm talking about influence on music. James is the most influential popular musician of the latter half of the twentieth century. Not the most famous. Not the most popular. But the most influential.I'm interested to know your view on my post regarding time and influence Re: MJ and JB. If a kid never listened to James, but grew up and imitates Michael, who is the influence? That is what is happening TODAY. James's influence is diminishing, one day Michael's will too. Though their importance to those that choose to be educated in music will remain. For the record, James will always be a more important figure in musical history than Michael in my opinion. |
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midnightmover said: seeingvoices12 said: Anything just to bash Mj fans , this is not the point of being innovator, and your post is completely out of topic. all of this just to attack Mj fans, see what i have responded to timmy.....Another intellectual giant from Team MJ. Dude, it's your post that's ignoring the topic, not mine. You just completely ignored the substance of my post. Try reading it again. I'm talking about influence on music. James is the most influential popular musician of the latter half of the twentieth century. Not the most famous. Not the most popular. But the most influential.you just don't know what influential means do you? or you are just blinded by your overzealous enthusiasm to attack Mj fans, calling them stupid when your post in itself reflects stupidity and out of topic, and you also missed the point of the topic...and who's saying anything about popularity? music created to influence people and responsible for changing their lives, when you say that someone is more influential it means that he/she influences more people to the point they dance like them or sing like them or behave like them, get the point? if you are saying that we are talking about who influenced the music more then this list should be thrown out since jimi Hendrix is the last one, he should be the first one not james brown. you coming here talking like you know everything and attacking mj fans when your posts are completely laughable and out of topic. MICHAEL JACKSON
R.I.P مايكل جاكسون للأبد 1958 | |
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Marrk said: midnightmover said: Another intellectual giant from Team MJ. Dude, it's your post that's ignoring the topic, not mine. You just completely ignored the substance of my post. Try reading it again. I'm talking about influence on music. James is the most influential popular musician of the latter half of the twentieth century. Not the most famous. Not the most popular. But the most influential.I'm interested to know your view on my post regarding time and influence Re: MJ and JB. If a kid never listened to James, but grew up and imitates Michael, who is the influence? That is what is happening TODAY. James's influence is diminishing, one day Michael's will too. Though their importance to those that choose to be educated in music will remain. For the record, James will always be a more important figure in musical history than Michael in my opinion. Why continue to feed them? Sometimes, obsession and the cult of personality gets in the way of objective judgment and historical fact. Just accept it that some people's lives will be empty without the knowledge that MJ is the greatest of all. | |
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TotalAlisa said: midnightmover said: MJ sure does attract the intellectuals doesn't he?
We're taking about MUSIC here. I outlined in brief some of James's influence. It wasn't just on a few singers. It was on two entire genres of music. Those two genres became the most dominant influences of the late twentieth century. James was the one who changed the grooves we all listen to. MJ did nothing remotely close to that. Do not bother responding to this post. Sometimes when you know nothing about a subject it's best to keep quiet and just listen to those who do, rather than screaming and shouting about something you have no knowledge of. YOU are just bashing my intelligence because im an MJ fan. But really There are MILLIONS of MJ fans compared to James brown
How many people do you see imitating james brown???? How many people across different countries even know james brown????? I DON'T CARE ABOUT JAMES BROWN, HIS MUSIC IS BORING, HE DANCES LIKE A CHICKEN. MANY PEOPLE FEEL THIS WAY!!!!! I don't care to know anything about james brown, WHY because his music does NOT interest me. But I see that MANY people like michael jackson and these artist out today say Michael jackson influenced them. NOT JAMES BROWN. OH I DO KNOW ABOUT THAT There is no need for all of this lisa, james brown is alot of things. MICHAEL JACKSON
R.I.P مايكل جاكسون للأبد 1958 | |
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MrSoulpower said: Marrk said: I'm interested to know your view on my post regarding time and influence Re: MJ and JB. If a kid never listened to James, but grew up and imitates Michael, who is the influence? That is what is happening TODAY. James's influence is diminishing, one day Michael's will too. Though their importance to those that choose to be educated in music will remain. For the record, James will always be a more important figure in musical history than Michael in my opinion. Why continue to feed them? Sometimes, obsession and the cult of personality gets in the way of objective judgment and historical fact. Just accept it that some people's lives will be empty without the knowledge that MJ is the greatest of all. i like them both. MJ more than JB, but common sense plays a part, never saw MJ kiss anyone else at a funeral besides JB, don't expect i ever will again. That said it all to me. But influence moves with time. Who the hell remembers the first African to bang a drum? nobody. but isn't he the most influential musician ever? |
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Marrk said: MrSoulpower said: Why continue to feed them? Sometimes, obsession and the cult of personality gets in the way of objective judgment and historical fact. Just accept it that some people's lives will be empty without the knowledge that MJ is the greatest of all. i like them both. MJ more than JB, but common sense plays a part, never saw MJ kiss anyone else at a funeral besides JB, don't expect i ever will again. That said it all to me. But influence moves with time. Who the hell remembers the first African to bang a drum? nobody. but isn't he the most influential musician ever? True, but Jackson will not go in history as an influential musician. He was a great entertainer, and a great singer. But he never created an entire genre. When James Brown broke out Funk, he changed the way every single black musician (and white musician who enjoyed black music) heard and played music. The impact was unbelievable and is hard to understand today unless you truly study the history of contemporary music. | |
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MrSoulpower said: Marrk said: i like them both. MJ more than JB, but common sense plays a part, never saw MJ kiss anyone else at a funeral besides JB, don't expect i ever will again. That said it all to me. But influence moves with time. Who the hell remembers the first African to bang a drum? nobody. but isn't he the most influential musician ever? True, but Jackson will not go in history as an influential musician. He was a great entertainer, and a great singer. But he never created an entire genre. When James Brown broke out Funk, he changed the way every single black musician (and white musician who enjoyed black music) heard and played music. The impact was unbelievable and is hard to understand today unless you truly study the history of contemporary music. Again , if this is the topic then they should changed it to "The list of top 25 of most innovating artists in the music" if you create something new you are called an innovator not the most influential, you make an influence in the music that will make a great impact and infulence on people, that what mj achieved..... again, if thats the case then teddy riley is more influential than mj, since he is an innovator who created the new jack swing genre....you guys are confusing things. [Edited 2/19/09 15:11pm] MICHAEL JACKSON
R.I.P مايكل جاكسون للأبد 1958 | |
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seeingvoices12 said: MrSoulpower said: True, but Jackson will not go in history as an influential musician. He was a great entertainer, and a great singer. But he never created an entire genre. When James Brown broke out Funk, he changed the way every single black musician (and white musician who enjoyed black music) heard and played music. The impact was unbelievable and is hard to understand today unless you truly study the history of contemporary music. Again , if this is the topic then they should changed it to "The list of top 25 of most innovating artists in the music" if you create something new you are called an innovator not the most influential, you make an influence in the music that will make a great impact and infulence on people, that what mj achieved..... again, if thats the case then teddy riley is more influential than mj, since he is an innovator who created the new jack swing genre....you guys are confusing things. [Edited 2/19/09 15:11pm] I'll repost from post #229: When James Brown broke out Funk, he changed the way every single black musician (and white musician who enjoyed black music) heard and played music. The impact was unbelievable and is hard to understand today unless you truly study the history of contemporary music. That's both innovation and influence. Nuff said. | |
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TotalAlisa said: midnightmover said: MJ sure does attract the intellectuals doesn't he?
We're taking about MUSIC here. I outlined in brief some of James's influence. It wasn't just on a few singers. It was on two entire genres of music. Those two genres became the most dominant influences of the late twentieth century. James was the one who changed the grooves we all listen to. MJ did nothing remotely close to that. Do not bother responding to this post. Sometimes when you know nothing about a subject it's best to keep quiet and just listen to those who do, rather than screaming and shouting about something you have no knowledge of. YOU are just bashing my intelligence because im an MJ fan. But really There are MILLIONS of MJ fans compared to James brown
How many people do you see imitating james brown???? How many people across different countries even know james brown????? I DON'T CARE ABOUT JAMES BROWN, HIS MUSIC IS BORING, HE DANCES LIKE A CHICKEN. MANY PEOPLE FEEL THIS WAY!!!!! I don't care to know anything about james brown, WHY because his music does NOT interest me. But I see that MANY people like michael jackson and these artist out today say Michael jackson influenced them. NOT JAMES BROWN. OH I DO KNOW ABOUT THAT do you have any idea how fucking stupid you sound?  | |
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MrSoulpower said: Marrk said: i like them both. MJ more than JB, but common sense plays a part, never saw MJ kiss anyone else at a funeral besides JB, don't expect i ever will again. That said it all to me. But influence moves with time. Who the hell remembers the first African to bang a drum? nobody. but isn't he the most influential musician ever? True, but Jackson will not go in history as an influential musician. He was a great entertainer, and a great singer. But he never created an entire genre. When James Brown broke out Funk, he changed the way every single black musician (and white musician who enjoyed black music) heard and played music. The impact was unbelievable and is hard to understand today unless you truly study the history of contemporary music. Re: JB, i know. i'm not gonna argue with that at all. fully agree. I will say It's down to MJ, that i got into JB in the first place, same with Sly. Re: MJ. In reality, He'll go down in history (and he is now) as an influencial 'Artist' and entertainer. not 'musician'. Chicken and egg! |
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MrSoulpower said: seeingvoices12 said: Again , if this is the topic then they should changed it to "The list of top 25 of most innovating artists in the music" if you create something new you are called an innovator not the most influential, you make an influence in the music that will make a great impact and infulence on people, that what mj achieved..... again, if thats the case then teddy riley is more influential than mj, since he is an innovator who created the new jack swing genre....you guys are confusing things. [Edited 2/19/09 15:11pm] I'll repost from post #229: When James Brown broke out Funk, he changed the way every single black musician (and white musician who enjoyed black music) heard and played music.[/b] The impact was unbelievable and is hard to understand today unless you truly study the history of contemporary music.[/i] That's both innovation and influence. Nuff said. ????? MICHAEL JACKSON
R.I.P مايكل جاكسون للأبد 1958 | |
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seeingvoices12 said: MrSoulpower said: I'll repost from post #229: When James Brown broke out Funk, he changed the way every single black musician (and white musician who enjoyed black music) heard and played music.[/b] The impact was unbelievable and is hard to understand today unless you truly study the history of contemporary music.[/i] That's both innovation and influence. Nuff said. ????? i don't understand why you can't understand that post. |
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Timmy84 said: MrSoulpower said: Michael Jackson didn't introduce the world to music videos. MTV was a network starting off with white rock videos. Prince and MJ were among the first to break the racial barrier and be broadcast, but that was when MTV was long established. However, MJ had some pretty revolutionary videos. I give you that. People who introduce the world to music videos: Nancy Sinatra ("These Boots Were Made for Walking") The Beatles ("Yellow Submarine") The Carpenters ("Please Mr. Postman") Queen ("Bohemian Rhapsody") ...and the like. Music videos were just ways of promotion in the 1960s and 1970s. Some have said the music video concept went back further with Elvis' jail dance scene in "Jailhouse Rock" and in some scenes of "West Side Story" and some of Fred Astaire's choreographic scenes. MJ took great classes from studying those scenes for his own videos because he saw them in films and made them "mini-films", that's what made Michael so special. But music videos had been around for a long time. Marvin Gaye's "A Funky Space Reincarnation" had a music video too, it was one of the first videos by a black artist to air on TV. I think Rose Royce had some music videos in the '70s as did Earth, Wind & Fire (I think they were the first R&B act to do videos, not sure tho). After MTV, music videos began to take radio's place as the dominant factor in record sales and that's where Michael and Prince come in. Also black artists did have their videos play on MTV before MJ (Eddy Grant, The Bus Boys, Joan Armatrading or whatever her name is, and Herbie Hancock). R&B, funk and dance artists didn't get NO play because they felt "urban music" wasn't a big seller as so-called "guitar-driven rock music" was. They didn't play Rick James or Cameo or any of the funk acts, no hip-hop from Grandmaster Flash and Sugarhill, not even Luther Vandross got play on MTV (and I don't think he got any because his audience was the adult R&B community). Michael Jackson and Prince got in because they were marketable acts. In general though, Michael had a harder time than Prince because his music didn't fit the "rock" format that Prince's videos did though those videos of Prince's didn't get a lot of rotation though "Little Red Corvette" was the first video by a black artist to be regularly featured on MTV's playlist. With Michael, he had being an R&B and dance artist against him plus the fact MTV only play black videos for a short period of time angered MJ and CBS so badly CBS demanded to call them out for being racist though Rick James did that a few weeks before MTV played "Billie Jean". Compared to "Beat It" and "Thriller", the "Billie Jean" music video wasn't as revolutionary, you can say, though it did eventually become the first video by an "urban artist" to be regularly featured on MTV. After that, as MJ later said, "they kept asking for everything" and that's when the other barriers were broken where other R&B acts and hip-hop acts finally got through the door. MJ was influential in the way he produced his music videos bringing choreography, dialogue and a story line. With the "Thriller" album, he created an album where it became a true crossover album where pop, adult contemporary, rock and R&B radio and dance clubs ALL play the tracks. That format would inspire the successes of Whitney Houston, Janet Jackson, Run-DMC and others. THAT'S where MJ became very influential. [Edited 2/19/09 13:20pm] He was also one of the first black artists to truly cross over globally I've seen many artists who are big in Korea, Japan, Australia, the UK, and several other areas clearly influenced by Michael's music and presentation. He changed the way people around the world saw black music True, Michael didn't innovate by inventing a new genre, but the production in his work was also highly important. [Edited 2/19/09 15:28pm] "We may deify or demonize them but not ignore them. And we call them genius, because they are the people who change the world." |
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Marrk said: seeingvoices12 said: ????? i don't understand why you can't understand that post. the post indicates that James vorwn influenced both white and black musicians , im talking about a whole different thing. MICHAEL JACKSON
R.I.P مايكل جاكسون للأبد 1958 | |
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bboy87 said: Timmy84 said: People who introduce the world to music videos: Nancy Sinatra ("These Boots Were Made for Walking") The Beatles ("Yellow Submarine") The Carpenters ("Please Mr. Postman") Queen ("Bohemian Rhapsody") ...and the like. Music videos were just ways of promotion in the 1960s and 1970s. Some have said the music video concept went back further with Elvis' jail dance scene in "Jailhouse Rock" and in some scenes of "West Side Story" and some of Fred Astaire's choreographic scenes. MJ took great classes from studying those scenes for his own videos because he saw them in films and made them "mini-films", that's what made Michael so special. But music videos had been around for a long time. Marvin Gaye's "A Funky Space Reincarnation" had a music video too, it was one of the first videos by a black artist to air on TV. I think Rose Royce had some music videos in the '70s as did Earth, Wind & Fire (I think they were the first R&B act to do videos, not sure tho). After MTV, music videos began to take radio's place as the dominant factor in record sales and that's where Michael and Prince come in. Also black artists did have their videos play on MTV before MJ (Eddy Grant, The Bus Boys, Joan Armatrading or whatever her name is, and Herbie Hancock). R&B, funk and dance artists didn't get NO play because they felt "urban music" wasn't a big seller as so-called "guitar-driven rock music" was. They didn't play Rick James or Cameo or any of the funk acts, no hip-hop from Grandmaster Flash and Sugarhill, not even Luther Vandross got play on MTV (and I don't think he got any because his audience was the adult R&B community). Michael Jackson and Prince got in because they were marketable acts. In general though, Michael had a harder time than Prince because his music didn't fit the "rock" format that Prince's videos did though those videos of Prince's didn't get a lot of rotation though "Little Red Corvette" was the first video by a black artist to be regularly featured on MTV's playlist. With Michael, he had being an R&B and dance artist against him plus the fact MTV only play black videos for a short period of time angered MJ and CBS so badly CBS demanded to call them out for being racist though Rick James did that a few weeks before MTV played "Billie Jean". Compared to "Beat It" and "Thriller", the "Billie Jean" music video wasn't as revolutionary, you can say, though it did eventually become the first video by an "urban artist" to be regularly featured on MTV. After that, as MJ later said, "they kept asking for everything" and that's when the other barriers were broken where other R&B acts and hip-hop acts finally got through the door. MJ was influential in the way he produced his music videos bringing choreography, dialogue and a story line. With the "Thriller" album, he created an album where it became a true crossover album where pop, adult contemporary, rock and R&B radio and dance clubs ALL play the tracks. That format would inspire the successes of Whitney Houston, Janet Jackson, Run-DMC and others. THAT'S where MJ became very influential. [Edited 2/19/09 13:20pm] He was also one of the first black artists to truly cross over globally I've seen many artists who are big in Korea, Japan, Australia, the UK, and several other areas clearly influenced by Michael's music and presentation. He changed the way people around the world saw black music True, Michael didn't innovate by inventing a new genre, but the production in his work was also highly important. [Edited 2/19/09 15:28pm] True  [Edited 2/19/09 15:33pm] MICHAEL JACKSON
R.I.P مايكل جاكسون للأبد 1958 | |
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edit [Edited 2/19/09 16:29pm] “The man who never looks into a newspaper is better informed than he who reads them, inasmuch as he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.”
- Thomas Jefferson | |
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