Here's the better case:

Who would win in a fight:

Joe or Matthew?

for some reason people cant seem to give janet her props when it comes to her career, of course being a jackson opened doors for her, but she had to bust through those doors.A&M was ready to drop her, it was john mcclain who asked for a chance to make 1 more janet jackson album, he hooked her up with jam&lewis, who rightfully gets alot of credit but its ridiculous to say that janet contributed nothing to her own success.i see alot of statements like if it wasnt for j&l janet wouldnt have done this or that, im gonna flip it and ask if you take away janet's catalog from their resume what would jam&lewis legacy as producers be? they have never had the success with various artists like say a babyface or teddy riley, the majority of their big hits came from janet.instead of trying to always diss janet how about admit the 3 of them had a great chemistry and made a great team.

lowkey said:

the majority of their big hits did not come from janet, it came from working with her, there's a difference. jj and tl has done great music with other artists whereas janet has been unable to do any good songs since she stopped working with jj and tl, that says a lot.

i'm not sure how she busted through any doors. janet is not a very good singer and i highly doubt, especially back in the day, that she would have gotten a record deal or given one more chance if she didn't come from a famous family.

i give janet much respect for her incredible success but in my opinion i still believe that she was very lucky to have all the pieces in place to make it happen, the family name, two excellent producers and incorporating signature dance moves in her performances (which i still say was influenced by her brother). its not a diss to janet, that's just how i see it.
[Edited 1/10/09 20:38pm]

wonder505 said:

Jimmy and Terry's hits without Janet are slim. There's was a tribute to them many years ago and there was a dance performance going through their catalog of hits. Most of the song where from Janet's albums

wonder505 said:

when i say their hits came from janet thats what im talking about...their work with her is what has made them as successful as they are. to say that janet has been unable to make ANY GOOD SONGS without them is not saying much, since she has worked with them on every album except her 1st 2 and last one, i think many people would agree that there are some good songs on those albums, do you base a good song on chart or sales performance? if she didnt bust through any doors she would have been gone a long time ago, janet was a case of somebody taking the opportunities before them and turning it into a success story. i know its popular to credit everybody except janet for her career but she's been in the game way too long and have had far too much success for it to just be luck.imo after her career took off her last name has hurt more than helped.

lowkey said:

no i do not credit songs with charts or sales, i base my opinion on the last three cds i've heard myself and they are not good. and i still say that if she didnt come from that famous family she would not have gotten a record deal to begin with because she was never a good singer. i credit her for her drive and hard work for putting on great performances but I still believe that jj and tl and their ability to produce and arrange great dance songs for her is was did it. we will have to agree to disagree.
[Edited 1/10/09 22:21pm]

wonder505 said:

ok we can agree to disagree,but the only album out of her last 3 that j&l didnt work on was discipline.so the 3 albums that you found not good happens to be the 3 that performed poorly sales wise? damita jo/20 y.o and discipline >>>>>all 4 you

bboy87 said:

Joe would beat Matt down!

wonder505 said:

I agree with that. Of course Janet does have talent and she even co-wrote most of her songs (nothing on the latest one though) but it's true she got a chance with Jimmy & Terry after 2 flops because of her name. And they used a currently hot sound, combined with her dancing skills and great videos, so it was obvious she' become a superstar. I once read even MJ was trying to capture the sound J&T gave Janet.

Her last 3-4 CDs have some good songs, but nothing stands out unlike 1986-1997. Discipline was her way of becoming another R&B songstress who does nothing in the production apart from delivering her usual and limited vocals...

This is going to be very unpopular, but I do not think Janet has as much talent as Beyonce even though Beyonce is not very likeable sometimes.

Beyonce I think she is so talented as a singer, but she seems to need to get out of her own way just like Christina Aguilera. They are both not very likeable as far as their their egos.

I read this article this AM about Janet's boyfriend being depresssed Janet's tour and cd were flops? He was fired or something? I do not think she was "propped-up" by her family but more by her former team, maybe?

MuthaFunka said:

no doubt...Joe would beat Matt with a guitar, spit on him while he's on the ground and then say "Bitch you betta have money in 2 hours or i'm pimping yo' daughters..."
[Edited 1/11/09 12:06pm]

missfee said:

MuthaFunka said:

cuz you know..Joe will never be too old to pimp somebody out....


[Edited 1/11/09 12:30pm]

system error
[Edited 1/11/09 12:29pm]

system error
[Edited 1/11/09 12:29pm]

missfee said:

missfee said:

Too late, Matt already did that.

wonder505 said:

Latoya worked with Full Force and Rebbie worked with Michael himself. They didn't produce great songs? Janet didn't dance for her first two albums, either, and they sold well for what they were - albums by a teen TV star. Control was her breakout and Jimmy & Terry helped bring things out in her, but Janet was strong enough to drop Joe as management and stand on her own and that says a lot about her drive and talent.



That's not what I'm telling you. I'm telling you that MJ didn't create the dance concept ergo Janet wasn't "borrowing" anything from him. MJ's success made it a lot easier for similar artists to emerge in his wake, however.

Timmy84 said:

Yeah, even Mike thought RN was a brilliant record.

VoicesCarry said:[quote]

wonder505 said:

Voicescarry we will never agree on this. IMO MJ layed the ground work for Janet dance wise though she made it her own, her name is what got her a record deal and getting the chance to work with JJ and TL which in my opinion was the reason for her success. Nothing will ever change my mind on this so we will just have to disagree. i just don't see janet in the same light that you do and never will. but i do appreciate her success and was even willing to pay for the rockwitu tour concert which i never got to see cuz it was cancelled.
[Edited 1/11/09 15:20pm]

^^I agree with you wonder505 Off topic but did Michael get a GED or did he graduate?

wonder505 said:

Then we agree to disagree.

NaughtyKitty said:

All nine Jacksons got a high school diploma last time I checked.

Timmy84 said:

Yeah that's what I thought, but I thought I'd double check. Thanks Timmy! Wow, so Beyonce dropped outta school and never got her GED? What was the last grade she completed?

NaughtyKitty said:

I heard 10th grade.

Timmy84 said:

And again I say

Did she leave to start rehearsing with her girl group? Did it take up so much time that she couldn't finish school? Or was there some other reason?

JackieBlue said:

Might've took so much time off the schedule. I don't know if Mathew and Tina even hired tutors like Joe and Katherine did.

Timmy84 said:

With all the money they had--being that they were upper class or whatever--maybe they should have invested in some. Or maybe they realized it was a deadend and the only way she was going to make it was by singing and dancing.

SCNDLS said:

missfee said:

Matthew didn't get the steps right so Joe made him a get a switch off the tree

I think Joe's a cool dude. Matthew and Tina seem like they're heads of a factory machine which is void of a personality and soul.....


hey, that describes Beyonce perfectly

and Solange seems to have a stank attitude