asg said:

They werent offered a renewal because many other property owners want to put more office space in this area, the same thing is going on in midtown and a few theaters and studios are not being offered lease renewals, Also rates are far from cheap anywhere in the city A 3 room apartment on Madison avenue is 4800 a month and thats "cheap"

lastdecember said:

They have a long term lease which will not expire anytime soon.But thier rates r very cheap compared to the current rates. The buyers know they have a goldmine they can sublease it at the current market rates. They got bought boughtout coz of this. I read this in the paper maybe 8months back

asg said:

For which location though? the 14th street one was basically a "neighborhood" issue where the lease was not renewed or offered, theres also a few other buildings in that area that are getting taken over. Midtown might have been the one with a long lease, but the store itself is losing shitloads of money everyday and hasnt been profitable for awhile now, despite its prime location, that general area of the city is going to see alot of turnover in the coming year, a few theaters will "go dark" as they say.

lastdecember said:

I am talking about the Time square location.

For next week, I think Britney might do better than whatever expectations there are out there for her. I think "Womanizer" actually appeals to people outside of her hardcore fans (who I wouldn't doubt bought multiple copies of "Gimmie More" to make it rise and fall on the charts so fast). Also, something happened when I went to Best Buy which I hadn't see happen in the longest time...I went to get "Chinese Democracy" and "Circus"....tons of GNR's album, of course since it is the exclusive....Britney's.....not single regular edition of "Circus" (although a healthy amount of the deluxe edition, which I wanted anyway although it was more for the tracks than the short promo DVD). I don't think I've seen that for a long time...granted, I don't think they had as much shelf space for Britney as did for even Beyoncé, for example. But maybe they'll make room now!

VinnyM27 said:

after first day sales. hitsdailydouble.com projected Britney world sell 450k , about 100k more than inital estimates

58 AGUILERA*CHRISTINA KEEPS GETTIN' BETTER 20,898 -33 31,256 125,02
Damn, Christina! Something tells me that exclusive deal with Target was not such a great ideas....Damn....you know this means that more and more people will go to exclusives for Wal-Mart. AC/DC might still be able to sell records on their own but would it really have done these gangbusters numbers?

VinnyM27 said:

the thing is that Target is not in certain places, and with something like a "best of" to put it in only in 1 store you can expect slow sales, but it is nothing but a profit, because its getting different dollars for her than her regular deal. The thing with Exlcusives is its best to make it for a "new record" not for songs already out there, true there are a few new songs on Xtina, but who is gonna hunt for a target location just for a few tracks? People will however go find a new "eagles" or "Acdc" or something like that. Like it or not "exclusives" are gonna be the way to go for older artists that have the benefit of NOT being on a label, but have the benefit of an audience.

lastdecember said:

I clearly fail to see how xtina is makin "nothing but profit" with an exclusive most label less acts clearly benefit and walmart makes a healthy profit, so all sides come out winners in that case. Xtina hits were funded by label and they aint goin to sacrifice their normal cut

asg said:

Because its not under the normal label % cut, though still with the label its very similar to what Mariah did with the MIMI Dvd by selling it only at Best Buy and signing with Redline Entertainment, its a whole different cut, a whole new contract for that one-off. I can almost guarantee that Xtina is not really caring about where this album is going, but more about that check she got for just doing something with the Target chain, plus the money she gets for doing the promo for them and the chain. These exclusive deals make label deals look like borderline slavery.

lastdecember said:

why would the labels agree to somethng that will make less money for them. DVD is different since act pays for the videos so it makes sense, please give a breakdown

lastdecember said:

How about the future, though? If the new songs are supposed to truly reflect what she will be doing later, wouldn't she want this to reach this masses. As it is, "Keeps Gettin' Better" was a quick top ten and is totally forgotten now.

asg said:

the label isnt losing anything, its just another person is taking on certain costs that before the label was undertaking, so just that alone the label makes more than before. Exclusives benefit labels more, because most of the time these deals are done on a consignment basis, which means the chain buys X amounts at a flat price and regardless of what sells the stores cannot return them for credit. With regular deals, the stores always could do returns for "stiffs" as we used to call them, this was a monthly pull that a store would do for credit from a label to buy other things. Exclusives do not have this option, you buy it, its yours, so its really a name your price. What Xtina is making more on, is the fact that whatever they printed, are treated as sales, regardless of what soundscan says, whatever the STORES bought at target is bought, no exceptions. Also added on is the endorsing that she does for Target, even though its her product, they are paying her for that too.

lastdecember said:[quote]

asg said:

the label isnt losing anything, its just another person is taking on certain costs that before the label was undertaking, so just that alone the label makes more than before. Exclusives benefit labels more, because most of the time these deals are done on a consignment basis, which means the chain buys X amounts at a flat price and regardless of what sells the stores cannot return them for credit. With regular deals, the stores always could do returns for "stiffs" as we used to call them, this was a monthly pull that a store would do for credit from a label to buy other things. Exclusives do not have this option, you buy it, its yours, so its really a name your price. What Xtina is making more on, is the fact that whatever they printed, are treated as sales, regardless of what soundscan says, whatever the STORES bought at target is bought, no exceptions. Also added on is the endorsing that she does for Target, even though its her product, they are paying her for that too.[/quote
]
I'm having the same reaction Britney Spears would when it was explained to her the benefits of releasing a store exclusive album.

"Y'all, this confusing as hell!"

Actually, I'm starting to understand. Always interesting to read this stuff.

VinnyM27 said:[quote]

lastdecember said:

Theres also 2 different ways to do "consignments", back when Sam Goody was still around full force, we were the first and really only supporters of "roots" reggae, no one else had a clue. We would get right in with neighborhood vendors and buy from them and they would send us their customers in force. we would also do this with local artists that wanted to sell their cds in a store, which is kind of what the exclusive is now, only back then with a local artist, they would give you the cds tell you how much they wanted for them, but then you had to make a profit for housing their stuff so you would generally go 2 -3 dollars more (had labels worked this way you would still have real music retailers still) but the bands would periodically check and see what sold, you would give them cash of what they sold, and then give back what didnt. The exclusives now like Xtina,AcDC,Elton,Manilow,Eagles etc..are all like this EXCEPT there is no return, those units the stores bought from them, are treated as SALES first and foremost, so an example would be the Eagles, they gave walmart 3 million copies, they got paid for those 3 million copies.

lastdecember said:

It works all the way around for the artist.

In a place like Wal-Mart, it will be heavily pushed in many ways and in full display at the store for a while. Huge amount of traffic. It will sell to hardcores and more than usual, a number of casual fans will also buy it. Not that AC/DC really needs to worry about those CDs being bought by the consumer as you said, however, if they sell, this is good for tickets and good for future projects (should AC/DC releases quite a few non-studio albums and have yet to release a hits set). It's all good.

Sadly, what does that mean for non-monsters like Donna Summer? If she got a Wal-Mart exclusive deal, they might buy a million if she was lucky as hell! But chances are she wouldn't and she would have a "Crayons" like release which is relatively small and is pretty much sold only to the hardcores. And let's face it....Donna is not only on a mainstream and while Burgandy is a smaller label, it's still Sony! So if you're a newer act or an older act but on a truly indie label, good luck!

VinnyM27 said:

Well thats really a whole other issue. Donna Summer isnt going to reach the masses unless she cuts a song with Tpain or akon or someone like that. But she could still maintain a steady success by doing her own thing, even if she isnt charting and just getting her stuff out through her label, or if she can score an exclusive. There are much smaller exclusives being done, the band Loverboy did it late last year and made a good piece of money for a record that didnt get any airplay, but just having a fan base and getting the word out and being able to play shows can still be the bread and butter. This year to me that was proven by Rick Springfield, his NEW album opened at Number 28, his highest album position since 1988, and overall soundscan had the album selling about 75,000 to date, though thats not tracking his site's sales, which offered an exclusive, so that number would double. But most impressive is getting that chart entry, this was a new record, not covers, and not a best of, this is new stuff from a 59 year old rock star, that has not had a top 40 single since 1988, and in a market full of AGE-ISM, it was quite an accomplishment for him to do this, without being propped up by anyone or an exclusive, just really his base.

amit1234 said:

defense force is go!

lastdecember said:

Donna did the same thing, actually, but than again her album had a nice push by "American Idol" ("Crayons" was likely her highest charting album since the early eighties). I would argue, though, that it was more than likely that she sold almost exclusively to her base (likely with many buying multiple copies).

I think without a doubt, that pop radio has been more biased than ever about age and I don't think it's helping them at all. Back in the eighties, it wasn't uncommon to hear artists in their forties or fifties with a top hit as long as it was appealing. Now I'm not sure about the market. After all, the trend I've noticed (although I was noticing it a few years ago more than today) was older artists selling. Cher had a fluke Greatest hits that end up becoming maybe her second biggest selling album overall. If people will buy it, they will stock it.

VinnyM27 said:

Yeah there is almost no-connection in album sales and what gets played on the radio. Radio Formats are nothing more than ringtone charts. Last year i remember an article pointing out how Bruce had the number one album and yet he wasnt on any rock radio playlists for the most part? How do you have rock radio and not play the new Bruce? The same can be said of Ac/dc and the Eagles, though the Eagles do see more play than the average Older artist. Like you said every now and then there is a fluke, like Cher having a dance hit or Lionel Richie with "Angel", but as you see both of those songs got their starts in the clubs, which is a little more embracing of more seasoned artists.

As for the buying of multiple copies, well thats what will happen now. Like i pointed out with Rick, he had a version in stores, a version on his site, and a download version at itunes, all came with a different track or two, plus if you bought it at Best Buy (the physical cd) you got two more cuts and an exclsuive 45 minute video link to his site etc.. so this may seem like "taking advantage" but its not, they are "your base" you worked hard to get them, there were discounts worked in and things like that. So i see it as giving people who dig you the most you can.

lastdecember said:

I don't think AC/DC hugely benefited from this, but they have a Sirius XM channel and not too shockingly, their new single also got played on the Hits 1 pop Top 40 station. Those kinds of things help. In general, I thought satelite radio by offering more formats would be kinder to older artists. It's somewhat true. I know the Spectrum would play some of Neil YOung's cuts from his newer albums at the time. Donna used to get airplay on the Beat and when she had an AC song, it got played on the one AC station they HAD (the Blend includes the 70s to now so it is so damn open, they aren't as hungry for new music, so bye bye Donna). The new Eagles song (or maybe it was songs) got played on that station, Starlite, too. Also notable, when Rick Springfield had a new Christmas CD, the 80s channel would frequently play a one hour special talking to Rick and playing those songs. Now that Sirius and XM merged their formats, I don't think that will be beneficial in hearing new music from older artists. It's all screwed up.

It's all about making the right connections now of days. Maybe that's why Madonna signed to Live Nation (unless she just doesn't care about making albums anymore, which is possible).
[Edited 12/10/08 0:51am]