krayzie said:

I'm sorry, but everything R Kelly produces sounds like R Kelly to me.

It's perfectly okay to admit that R. Kelly is a better producer of other artists than Prince...Flaws and all (and there are many...), Kelly's outside production has been suprisingly diverse (from Aaliyah to Maxwell), while Prince tends to stamp his style, soul and sound on other artists...Now that doesn't mean P is not a good producer (Those Time albums are better than most people's career...lol)...It just means that if you are looking for an outside producer, Kelly works because he lets the artist's individuality stand out...

Now ask me who, at their peak, was the more groundbreaking and brilliant producer...That's another story...

BlaqueKnight said:

Just put it like this R Kelly caters to the mainstream and Prince tries to do something different. Of course labels are going to try to go with what sells and that's one reason why the music industry is going downhill.It's not about good music it's about what sells, but pretty soon R Kelly will have his time when what he can deliver won't sell either.

fantasticjoy said:

And when that day comes, I'm gonna jump for joy because I can't stand his music for the most part but that's not gonna make Prince any better of a producer. Prince SUCKS as a producer because he does not take the artist's own sound into account. He only uses artists as faces to put on his own music. That's not good producing. That is narcissism.
The music business has ALWAYS been about what sells; its just that in the past, creativity played a much bigger part in the decisions made. Now, its completely a numbers game to them.

Oh my... is MisterMaxxx back on the org?

Cinnie said:

[Edited 4/20/08 18:12pm]

Cinnie said:

He used to post here, y'all

SoulAlive remembers him well

fantasticjoy said:

I agree with you on the fact that labels go with what sells. But Has Prince ever produced good music for other artists ??? I don't think so...

never as good as his own stuff...

krayzie said:

Okay Krayzie...I think most sensible folks would agree that R. Kelly as a outside producer edges out P (As noted, it comes down to Prince forcing his sound and swagger on the acts that he has produced while Kelly allows artists' individuality to shine...)...So yes, you are correct...

But let's not go over a cliff here..."Has Prince ever produced good music for other artists?" is a stretch...I think the Time's first two albums, singles by Vanity 6, Apollonia 6, Sheila E, Patti Labelle, The Bangles (yeah yeah I know he wrote Manic Monday and didn't produce it...but you get my point...), ect, ect were very strong...

I think you can make your point, which is very strong, without resorting to revisionist history...LOL

Cinnie said:

God forbid

murph said:

When this question was first asked, I was quick to say Prince but yesterday, Maxwell's Fortunate came on my iPod and then I rememebered this thread and that R Kelly produced this song. To me, this doesn't sound like an R. Kelly song and to me, that's major in producing. Prince is great as a producer but Kells is slightly better because as stated from others, he can make the person singing his song sound like it's their own song and not the producer's (R. Kelly) song.
[Edited 4/21/08 9:04am]

purplecam said:

We are saying the same thing....

murph said:

I find it interesting that folks say Prince didn't produce Manic Monday when the Bangles re-did it. The Bangles version is exactly the same as Prince and Apples version. The only difference in the two are the singers. Not even the melody changed. Say that to say this, if Prince produced his version which the Bangles didn't alter in any way, who produced their version? Or who was given credit for producing their version?

purplecam said:

purplecam, I thought you were on our side

j/k

Cinnie said:

I believe it. He posts daily on the MJJF/C.

BlaqueKnight said:

-----
Prince SUCKS as a producer because he does not take the artist's own sound into account. He only uses artists as faces to put on his own music. That's not good producing. That is narcissism.

Based on what he did with the The Time and Sheile E your statement is off the chain. He was a songwriter and a producer trying to get as much music out as he could while the iron was hot. Nothing wrong with what he was doing. Just making a living putting out what was hot at the time.

R Kelly sucks ass with the same tired predictable RnB that he has produced for all of this projects. This guy did not make his own Genre of music or standout in his generation. If you want to say someone like Stevie Wonder is a better artist or Jam and Lewis are better producers great but R Kelly WTF

laurarichardson said:

I didn't say R. Kelly was a great producer. I said he was a better producer than Prince. There's a huge difference. There are MUCH better producers than both of them but my point was that at least R. Kelly knows how to take an artist's own sound into account when producing. That is a more important factor in being a good producer than just making a good song that sounds like something you did, which is what Prince does. Audio narcissism. For the record, I can't stand R. Kelly and as I have said on here many times, he is the definition of a mediocre R&B artist. Still, if you're not helping an artist develop their own sound and attempting to take their work in a direction then that negates the very definition of producing. Prince just takes his songs and has other artists sing them and perform them. That's the worst kind of producer regardless of how good the material is because the artist suffers for it.

BlaqueKnight said:

-----
"I said he was a better producer than Prince." I still disagree. I enjoy the productions that P has worked on, I do not enjoy anything that R Kelly has done for anyone including his own stuff. Your puting the reason for producing the artist over the actual product. As a music lover I could care less about some industry standard of taking an artist to the next level. I care about the music I am listening to and may purchase.

In addtion, you cannot possibly think that a lot of P's side projects were going to go to any next level. Most of them were just creative or finaicial outlets.
He worked the industry at the right time the way a player should.

Prince doesn’t have the personality (at least yet, though he certainly could get there) to be a great producer of other people’s visions.

But he’s a genius producer of HIMSELF.

Prince, for the most part, has used side projects as an outlet for his own musical creativity; a way to be more straight laced, free himself from the diversity of his own mind.

What would I sound like if I were a funk band (The Time), a gospel singer (Mavis Staples), a jazz ensemble (Madhouse) – or, most commonly, a girl or girl group (Vanity/Apollonia 6, Jill Jones, Sheila E., Mayte)?

And sometimes Prince perhaps produces people as a means of keeping them around.

Perhaps only Chaka Khan has had the guts to partially stand up to him in the studio, and I’d love to see some of the bloody outtakes.

So to me Prince is a million miles ahead of R. Kelly in terms of producing quality music. He often does everything, including laying down the guide vocals (not much space left for another artists here).

But in terms of producing in a collaborative sense and making hits, right now by default I’ll go with almost any other producer, including R. Kelly.

Or, in other words, in keeping with the spirit of this rather twisted thread:

Prince never came up with the genius that is Trapped in the Closet!

As insane as that...soap opera song thingy...is, it gets you hooked!

Anyway, when's the last time Prince had a global hit as big as Ignition Remix was?





I also like this song he released last year :



Once Prince proves he has the magic he once posessed in his overall sound, we'll talk. Until then, R.Kelly's the one proving he still has something resembling creativity left in him.

Anyway, why does everyone on here get so outraged about R.Kelly's teen obsession? PRINCE ain't exactly that innocent in that department either. Sure, he waited til she was 18 but the point is he fell in love with a MINOR and her parents had no problem with that!
[Edited 4/22/08 2:11am]

krayzie said:

Well I guess the answer to that is a matter of opinion, because I really enjoyed The Time, The Family, Sheila E, Jill Jones, Andre Cymone, Vanity 6,etc.. Although T.C. Ellis I would say would be an exception.Who did he have to sleep with to get a record deal?

bboy87 said:

Oh don't get it twisted I want that child molesting dirty rotten little cunt to be destroyed in a jail cell, I really do. I can't even say all the things I want to see happen to R on this forum cause he's worst than a pile of dog shit on the sidewalk but for the sake of this argument and objectivity, R does have a slight leg up on P but Prince is still The Man and that will ALWAYS be the case. Remember that!
[Edited 4/22/08 6:38am]

purplecam said:

Say It!

Let that hate out!

purplesweat said:

-----
"Prince never came up with the genius that is Trapped in the Closet! "

No P came up with Sign Of The Times a cd that turns up on every crtitics top ten list and has dozens of cover version of the songs on the CD.
No one and I mean no is every going to fell R Kelly like that.
I think black people have sometimes lost their damm minds to praise this hack.

laurarichardson said:

I disagree on both points.

I'm with BK...I've never liked R. Kelly's music much (sans "Chocolate Factory") R. Kelly's genre, if you will, is Modern R&B, and it is his own style that's influenced a lot of artists. Did R.borrow heavily from the great artists of the past? Of couse, just like all artists do. Much like you knew a Prince song, or a song with the Minneapolis Sound in the 80's, R.'s influence has been all over modern R&B since his debut.

Adisa said:

-----
Please tell me who he has influenced. I do not hear a distinct R Kelly sound and lucky for us we do not have other fools in RnB doing "Trapped In The Closet" like bullshit. So who has this guy influneced.

TO ME.....IT'S A DRAW (SORT OF):

R. KELLY CAME OUT SOUNDING LIKE A ONE-MAN "GUY"!!!!!
SING IT W/ME (TO THE TUNE OF "WE GOT THAT VIBE"):
"GUY.....GUY.....WE SOUND LIKE GUYYYYY"!!!!!
THEN THE NI**A THOUGHT HE WAS THE FREAKIEST NI**A ON THE PLANET NEXT TO THE LATE MARVIN GAYE, WHICH I THINK HE HAS HIM BEAT!!!! U NEVER HEARD OF MARVIN PISSIN' ON JAN OR ANYONE ELSE!!!!!
NOW I DON'T GIVE A SH*T ABOUT HIM ANYMORE!!!!!
TO HIS CREDIT, THE "IGNITION" REMIX WAS COOL!!!!!


PRINCE- WHOSE MUSIC I LOVE DEARLY (MOST OF IT), BUT OUTSIDE OT THE FIRST TWO TIME LP'S AND SHEILA E'S FIRST TWO LP'S EVERYTHING ELSE WAS A "TAX WRITE-OFF"!!
JILL JONES COULDA BEEN BIG....SO COULD'VE VANITY/APOLLONIA 6. BUT YOU CAN'T FU*K THE HELP!!!!! THE VERDICT IS STILL OUT ON HIM & SHEILA, WHICH IS THE BIG EXCEPTION IF THAT WERE THE CASE!!!!!
MAZARATI SHOULD'VE BEEN THE BEST SIDE PROJECT SINCE THE TIME, BUT HE FU**ED BROWNMARK OVER BIG TIME!!!!!

I COULD GO ON FOR DAYS & DAYS, BUT I GO BACK TO THE MPLS. SOUND MORE THAN THE P.I.S.S. SOUND!!!!!