MsLegs said:

so ugly chocolate sistas, which is what snoop said, should not try to sell records. How am I color coding when snoop said.....I am just talking on what snoop said and am acknowledging his incorrectness in his statement.

SNOOP SAID ( i was trying not to bring the statement back up but).....Here’s a taste of Snoop’s kooky stream of consciousness rant on women, thanks to the friends at BET.com’s Hip Hop Vs. America blog.

“How many ugly women selling records? None! Only the pretty ones sell records. Beyonce, Mary J, Keyshia Cole, the ugly ones don’t sell. I ain’t gon say no names, but they don’t sell records. They just be singing their little hearts out, but they don’t get no sales, cause they ugly. Now, that’s my fault? I can see this on TV now: ‘Snoop Dogg called me, ugly.’ You beautiful on the inside, baby. What I wanna say to go on top of that, to the chocolate women, the dark-skinned women,"

so whose names is he calling.? who is counting degrees of blackness? not me, just noticing that that is what snoop is referring to. I agree jim crow needs to go.

CalhounSq said:


See, no one is doubting that. Read carefully, and I don't doubt it.

But your statement is way too general. If men bought records based on looks, then the industry's sales wouldn't be down. Ask yourself -- why are these women always here today, and gone tomorrow? Because their popularity hinges on their looks, their videos and the quality of their "production," which is flimsy at best. If men are watching the videos, they increase their popularity. But I bet as many if not more women are ACTUALLY BUYING the product.

But your implication that men buy records based on the looks of a woman just isn't wholly justified because I don't think that a lot of men will buy a record based on whether the singer is bangin'. You have a point to the extent that men might subscribe to magazines or watch videos with these divas on the cover. But men aren't going out in droves buying these records.

I'd bet that young girls are going out and buying these records.



Not what I was saying at all, but only hit dogs holler. I must have hit a nerve.

The actual point was this: women can't take the video industry to task for putting fem-dolls out in front when that same video industry uses male beefcakes to appeal to women. Both performing in the videos and playing the romantic interests. If the images of women in music are responsive to male consumer demand, then the images of men in music are responsive to female demand. If the industry is producing what men want to see, then it is also producing what women want to see.

On information and belief, men and women are both humans and both find certain traits appealing.

So your high ground ain't as high as you might think it. That was all I was saying.




Again, I don't disagree with the premise that there's a double standard. But surely you see the weakness in your argument.

Absolutely nothing wrong with Jill and Angie putting hotties in their vids. When in Rome, et cetera.

But when they do so -- and you refer to overweight brothers negatively -- the message is, "big girls can pull the male models too . . . and if given the choice, they wouldn't choose a big guy." Affirming their own beauty while also affirming the bias against big people in general.

Michael Corleone makes the point better than I do: "We're both part of the same hypocrisy."

So when you're trying to play the game and show you can be just like the guys, you're buying into the same message they send to you. Which, of course, somewhat discredits your outrage. Not completely, but it's a chink in the armor.

Surely you understand that.




No one's playin'. I'm trying to get you to see that the game isn't as one-sided as you'd have us believe.

You are undoubtedly right about the state of today's videos, but again the videos take away from your comparative analysis. I grant you that, when it comes to hue or ethnicity, the female artists cast a wider net video-wise. But they're all lean or cut, or muscular. The criteria isn't way deeper, come on, you can do better than that.



No one ever said the burden on female artists isn't heavier, or the image consciousness projected on females in music isn't more strenuous.

All I pointed out was that the chasm isn't as wide as you portray it to be. In fact, it's closing.

The industry is image-conscious period. Men catch more breaks than women, and get more leeway in the looks department than women, but increasingly, shape and size is becoming a gender-neutral requirement.

You can point out men's base desires as a root cause of shallow female imagery in music, I was only pointing to something that you only grudgingly admit in the last part of your post: men aren't entirely to blame.

PS -- Ruben Studdard's last album went copper. That tell you anything?
[Edited 3/19/08 11:52am]

TonyVanDam said:

Who is this chick anyway and why is she acting like a fool?

Ifsixwuz9 said:

Tocarra - she used to be on Tyra's America's Next Top Model show as a contestant. She didn't win but she left an impressive mark on enough people to land her a job as a correspondent on B.E.T. She was on this reality show (I'm not qualified to answer anything else because the only reality show I've watched was Am. Nxt. Top Model) I assume was the biggest loser where contestants loose weight. This was an uncensored rant posted on youtube.
Despite the rant, she's very charismatic (and a little ghetto).

Ifsixwuz9 said:[quote]

TonyVanDam said:

Who wants 2 here, "have some class", when they are pissed off?

BlaqueKnight said:

Your description sounds pretty accurate to me. Her appearance on the show did set a precedence and put her on notice to the entertainment industry.
[Edited 3/19/08 12:27pm]

namepeace said:

Man, you just like talking I agree with you on a lot of things, as you seem to agree with me on a lot of things though you still wanna nitpick mine & take me to task over the trivial I'm sticking to everything I said, supposed armor chinks & all

& I do see your point about men actually buying the product - you're right, it probably is a more female audience actually purchasing the shit. But females would purchase it with or without the overly sexualized component, I think. It's the attention the singer gets initially for her looks that gets people talking, men in particular...


.
[Edited 3/19/08 12:29pm]

MsLegs said:

CO-SIIIIIGN!!!

MsLegs said:

So the follower doesn't like to be followed around??

People don't time for your foolishness.The midget pictured below needs to stop confusing other orgers with his princeless hoe 3rd Hag wife in Houston Texas. He needs to realize that its juvenile and (federal crime persucutable in a federal court of law) to keep going under multiple aliaes to harass/stalk others online on a a message board. Its obvious the man pictured below needs a life an enema to clean himself out b/c he damn sure isn't fooling nobody online or in the industry. He needs to take his nonesense back to HQ or NPG, leave me alone, stop harassing my family and friends,stalking me online/ off ,and illegally eavesdropping in household mentioning my personal/family business online. From now on, I will ignore you from this point on and report you to the authorities and my ISP( Time Warner) because I am tired of the abuse.

MsLegs said:

I'm up to TWO "you be Prince!" accusations! Who can out-score me?? WHO??!! I wooooon! I'm na besssss!

People don't time for your foolishness.The midget pictured below needs to stop confusing other orgers with his princeless hoe 3rd Hag wife in Houston Texas. He needs to realize that its juvenile and (federal crime persucutable in a federal court of law) to keep going under multiple aliaes to harass/stalk others online on a a message board. Its obvious the man pictured below needs a life an enema to clean himself out b/c he damn sure isn't fooling nobody online or in the industry. He needs to take his nonesense back to HQ or NPG, leave me alone, stop harassing my family and friends,stalking me online/ off ,and illegally eavesdropping in household mentioning my personal/family business online. From now on, I will ignore you from this point on and report you to the authorities and my ISP( Time Warner) because I am tired of the abuse.

<<<<< delighted... make that THREE accusations




If I'm Prince, I should either go play somethin' pretty or gaze @ my ass in the mirror right now


.
[Edited 3/19/08 12:58pm]

muse87 said:

OMG, when I got home from work tonight I was just watching clips from "The View". Snoop just made a guest appearance there & I was thinking "wooooow...Snoop has transformed into such a female-friendly, family guy who respects and sees value in women beyond the physical "...

ummm....

Not.

I see someone forgot to take their meds again.

CalhounSq said:

"Haven't you heard?" -- Patrice Rushen



"There ain't no good side . . . there ain't no bad side . . . there's only you and me and we just disagree . . ." -- Dave Mason



I don't know about that highlighted comment. Young females, especially teen girls, have always loved these sexualized women stars, since they started rocking the lace and bras (maybe the main reason teenaged dudes loved Madonna). I think image has as much to do with the product these days, which is basically what this whole thread is about. If what you said were true, Jill Scott would have sold millions more records.

We do agree as much if not more than we disagree.

namepeace said:

True & TRUE

CalhounSq said:

I disagree.....

Graycap23 said:

AWW SHIT

CalhounSq said:

Graycap23 said:[quote]

Ifsixwuz9 said:

I get that she's pissed, but about what? During her whole rant I never got a handle on what she was pissed about. I can dig being pissed, but at least be clear as what you're pissed about.

Ifsixwuz9 said:

True.

BlaqueKnight said:

Ah ha, ok. I recognize the show she was ranting on I think it's called "Celebrity Fit Club".

Ifsixwuz9 said:

Yea, that's the show. My mother had it on when I went to visit yesterday - from the looks of that particular episode Tocarra's sole purpose for being on the show (this time, at least, she's repeating it for the 2nd time) is to get exposure & cause a ruckus. Maybe she's trying to prove she can act or something When they informed her of her current weight & what her goal weight needed to be, she said she was cool with her weight & didn't feel like she needed to lose ANY. Which begs the question, "Why the FUCK are you on Celebrity Fit Club???"



.
[Edited 3/21/08 9:21am]

CalhounSq said:

You know... when she walked up there and from the pic that was posted of her I wondered the same thing. But, then I chalked it up to maybe she lost weight and this is what she looks like now. But based on what you just posted I'm assuming that her weight hasn't changed much from when she signed on for the show. And it does beg the question -- what the hell is she doing on there?

.
[Edited 3/21/08 14:34pm]

Scorpion said:

He is right & could have said it in a way not to offend anyone. You can sell records if ya have the right look yes that is true. As for his explanation of women in videos...he should have just said we would play videos on BET with women naked if we can get away with it.

It's funny that ugly men don't seem to have any trouble selling records.