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Timmy84 said: lastdecember said: But the bigger thing is that no one wants to see him regardless or any of these other acts. Everyones sells have dropped, Elton John sold only 250,000 of his last studio album in the States and yet he has never had a show not sell out and never need a HIP opener to "get asses to fill seats". Now that's true. I think even bigger issue is that his music despite selling millions of records, isnt having long time effect on people were they wanna go see his show, and thats not just on R Kelly thats on alot of big selling acts in the last decade, they can sell, but cant "put asses in seats" to quote Pete Rose. "We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F | |
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lastdecember said: Another point would be, doesnt R Kelly have something like 10-12 albums already? WTF with three opening acts, if he's the KING of RB like he preaches in everyone of his lame songs, then why does the king needs so much help to sell a ticket?
Exactly. When I first heard the news of the Keysha Cole incident, I was like why does he have both of them together? Then I found out J Holiday was on there too and I'm damn he need that many people on stage before his wack ass goes on? Something must be seriously up with that cat. I wouldn't be surprised if one of those "contract" requirements that Ne-Yo refused to do included literally sucking R. Kelly's dick before Kells hit the stage. I will forever love and miss you...my sweet Prince. | |
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lastdecember said: Timmy84 said: Now that's true. I think even bigger issue is that his music despite selling millions of records, isnt having long time effect on people were they wanna go see his show, and thats not just on R Kelly thats on alot of big selling acts in the last decade, they can sell, but cant "put asses in seats" to quote Pete Rose. Yeah, you think an artist who sold as much as he had could be an easy concert draw. If you that big, you don't need three other people to help your ass out. You can sell out the Garden in a minute just like Stevie did but I guess he don't have it like that. | |
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Timmy84 said: lastdecember said: I think even bigger issue is that his music despite selling millions of records, isnt having long time effect on people were they wanna go see his show, and thats not just on R Kelly thats on alot of big selling acts in the last decade, they can sell, but cant "put asses in seats" to quote Pete Rose. Yeah, you think an artist who sold as much as he had could be an easy concert draw. If you that big, you don't need three other people to help your ass out. You can sell out the Garden in a minute just like Stevie did but I guess he don't have it like that. An even better point would be on the last Christina Aguilera tour at one show, Rihanna was opening, so here you have 2 of the biggest in pop at the time playing a show together and couldnt sell out the venue, two weeks later STYX sold it out with no opening act, and not having a chart hit in about 20 years. "We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F | |
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A few years ago,I read an article about how today's R&B artists are having trouble selling out arenas.That's why nearly every major R&B act has to do a "package tour" with one or more other hot acts on the bill with them.
If R.Kelly were to tour without other acts,his tour would be doomed. | |
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qvgangsta18 said: lastdecember said: But the bigger thing is that no one wants to see him regardless or any of these other acts. Everyones sells have dropped, Elton John sold only 250,000 of his last studio album in the States and yet he has never had a show not sell out and never need a HIP opener to "get asses to fill seats". stupid ass comparison, you are comparing R. kelly an rnb star, who has never really made too many crossover songs, to Elton John a pop singer , no offense but how many black acts, who have been in the industry for over 18yrs, still has a platinum selling LP, still tours big arena's, and fill them up like that, NOT TOO MANY Rolling Stones had guns n roses and living colour open up for them, on there tours, back in the day, a lot of people have opening acts, so r. kelly having an opening act is a crime nowadays But be real here, hes selling millions of records and no one is coming to see him. Its not a crime to have an opening act but give me a break, you got 10 albums or so and all these double crap albums and you cant do a show on your own? I mean Mariah is a POP star and she couldnt sell out and had opening acts, so it just RB. As for Elton i think the last time he had an opener was 1970. "We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F | |
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You have to be able to really perform to put "asses in the seats"
A lot of acts just can't perform. R Kelly is really one of the worst live performers. Throwing people off of his tour is just an act of disperation. I have said all along this guy is a no talent hack and sooner or later the public will get tired of him. lastdecember said: Timmy84 said: Now that's true. I think even bigger issue is that his music despite selling millions of records, isnt having long time effect on people were they wanna go see his show, and thats not just on R Kelly thats on alot of big selling acts in the last decade, they can sell, but cant "put asses in seats" to quote Pete Rose. | |
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lastdecember said: Well not to stick up for anyone in this matter, because its all EGO's gone wild, but Keyshia is right she shouldnt be opening for Ne-Yo she has been around longer. Also the dressing room shit, deal with it Ne-yo, this is the way the opener always gets treated, stop crying over it. I have heard stories of back in 1983 when INXS had to open for Adam Ant on his tour and Inxs had no dressing room and had to change in the hallway on the way to the stage. So suck it up everyone, its always been this way
No, it has not "always been this way". Not unless the the headliner is an absolute ass. To begin with, that kind of stuff is usually worked out beforehand in the rider. So boo boo on the opener's management for not having that hammered out in ink. Secondly, even if the opening act gets a shower curtain in the corner of the venue's kitchen, they generally get somewhere to change. I've even witnessed acts considered to be the less important on a bill have to share a tiny room the size of a broom closet with the headliner's underlings, or in a production office, but they do not get left to change in a fucking hallway, again, unless it is a cruel and intentional act on the part of the headliner, out of pure spite. | |
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a)R&B acts are gonna have to start doing smaller venues
b)Bobby Brown did it to Shabba back in the day cuz Shabba was whoopin' his ass on the "Humpin' Around" tour....we all know about the R.Kelly/Jay-z fiasco and now this.....THEY SHOULDA NEVA GAVE U NIGGAZ MONEY!!!!! c)C'mon folks....who are we dealin' with here???? Here's a man who has gone "schizo" right in front of your eyes who can't stop making videos talkin' to himself!!!!! A Ne-Yo/Chris Brown/Omarion/Bow Wow tour would be tha shiznit right now!!!! Although I don't care 4 some of 'em, that would be a SERIOUS DRAW!!!!! Let Keyshia Cole tour with R. Kelly.....  | |
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lastdecember said: Timmy84 said: Yeah, you think an artist who sold as much as he had could be an easy concert draw. If you that big, you don't need three other people to help your ass out. You can sell out the Garden in a minute just like Stevie did but I guess he don't have it like that. An even better point would be on the last Christina Aguilera tour at one show, Rihanna was opening, so here you have 2 of the biggest in pop at the time playing a show together and couldnt sell out the venue, two weeks later STYX sold it out with no opening act, and not having a chart hit in about 20 years. pink opened for Justin... so I guess it depends on the act | |
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woogiebear said: a)R&B acts are gonna have to start doing smaller venues
b)Bobby Brown did it to Shabba back in the day cuz Shabba was whoopin' his ass on the "Humpin' Around" tour....we all know about the R.Kelly/Jay-z fiasco and now this.....THEY SHOULDA NEVA GAVE U NIGGAZ MONEY!!!!! c)C'mon folks....who are we dealin' with here???? Here's a man who has gone "schizo" right in front of your eyes who can't stop making videos talkin' to himself!!!!! A Ne-Yo/Chris Brown/Omarion/Bow Wow tour would be tha shiznit right now!!!! Although I don't care 4 some of 'em, that would be a SERIOUS DRAW!!!!! Let Keyshia Cole tour with R. Kelly..... bobby brown didn't drop shabba cuz of performance, he dropped him because Bobby's tour supporters where going to pull out because of shabba's homophobic comments, bout killin gays | |
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The are still promoting the Houston show as if Ne-Yo's still on the bill for some reason... | |
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woogiebear said: a)R&B acts are gonna have to start doing smaller venues
b)Bobby Brown did it to Shabba back in the day cuz Shabba was whoopin' his ass on the "Humpin' Around" tour....we all know about the R.Kelly/Jay-z fiasco and now this.....THEY SHOULDA NEVA GAVE U NIGGAZ MONEY!!!!! c)C'mon folks....who are we dealin' with here???? Here's a man who has gone "schizo" right in front of your eyes who can't stop making videos talkin' to himself!!!!! A Ne-Yo/Chris Brown/Omarion/Bow Wow tour would be tha shiznit right now!!!! Although I don't care 4 some of 'em, that would be a SERIOUS DRAW!!!!!Let Keyshia Cole tour with R. Kelly..... They already did that except Omarion wasn't with the group about a year ago. Quite possibly they'll do it next summer for another Scream tour... | |
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Timmy84 said: The media likes to glamorize R. Kelly as having a great career but in fact, he is destroying what the media had considered "great" considering his circumstances. Now that his publicist of FOURTEEN years has quit and Ne-Yo dropping out of his tour because of Kells' ignorant behavior, it's clear Kells is burning a lot of bridges in the entertainment world as well as the criminal justice system who either wanna get the guy locked up or let him go because the preliminary case has gone on for 100 years, lol.
You are a big Marvin fan and him and R Kelly are alike musically and in their personal lives. Marvin was messing with underage females married one and had a kid by one and was strung out on drugs and crazy when he died. And R kelly has messed with underage females and is crazy. So they both have alot in common. | |
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Timmy84 said: banks said: It's more like an assumption (I was referring to the part about other male artist and under age children) Oh, I gotcha, lol. My thing ain't really about what he did outside the studio (and I think everyone KNOWS that he's not the only musician that flirted with underage children... in fact he joins a long list, lol) Marvin being one of those on that list. | |
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Rhondab said: R Kelly needs therapy.
Many artist do. | |
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missfee said:[quote] lastdecember said: I wouldn't be surprised if one of those "contract" requirements that Ne-Yo refused to do included literally sucking R. Kelly's dick before Kells hit the stage. Ne-yo probably would of liked that. | |
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Ottensen said: lastdecember said: Well not to stick up for anyone in this matter, because its all EGO's gone wild, but Keyshia is right she shouldnt be opening for Ne-Yo she has been around longer. Also the dressing room shit, deal with it Ne-yo, this is the way the opener always gets treated, stop crying over it. I have heard stories of back in 1983 when INXS had to open for Adam Ant on his tour and Inxs had no dressing room and had to change in the hallway on the way to the stage. So suck it up everyone, its always been this way
No, it has not "always been this way". Not unless the the headliner is an absolute ass. To begin with, that kind of stuff is usually worked out beforehand in the rider. So boo boo on the opener's management for not having that hammered out in ink. Secondly, even if the opening act gets a shower curtain in the corner of the venue's kitchen, they generally get somewhere to change. I've even witnessed acts considered to be the less important on a bill have to share a tiny room the size of a broom closet with the headliner's underlings, or in a production office, but they do not get left to change in a fucking hallway, again, unless it is a cruel and intentional act on the part of the headliner, out of pure spite. Ne-yo is lying about the dressing room thing. He claims that R took all of them. Well not only was Keyshia mad about going on before him, it was also reported that she was mad cause his dressing room was bigger. Now if R took all of them ,then how was Keyshia complaining about ne-yo's room being bigger. Ne-yo is making up stuff and he knows that R never responds to any of the stuff they run to these radio stations to say about him. If ne-yo claims to be so great then why don't he find a promoter who is willing to let him headline his own tour. ATLANTA--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Leonard Rowe, president of Rowe Entertainment announces that the tour line up has changed for the nine-week long DOUBLE UP TOUR which currently features R. Kelly, Keyshia Cole, and J. Holiday.
Def Jam Recordings’ R&B vocalist, Ne-Yo, was a part of the line-up through Thursday, November 15th. It was Rowe Entertainment’s decision to revamp the line-up, minus the Def Jam Recordings’ artist, because Rowe Entertainment could not obtain the final, fully-executed contract from Ne-Yo’s agent. The decision to release Ne-Yo was made solely by Leonard Rowe the national tour promoter. Contrary to previously published reports, R. Kelly exerted no influence upon Leonard Rowe’s decision. “From a business perspective, it would have been extremely difficult for me to continue under this cloud of uncertainty. Unfortunately it was decided that in the best interest of all involved, since I was unable to receive the fully-executed contract, I had no other alternative but to release Ne-Yo from the tour,” said Leonard Rowe. “We are currently surveying the availability of other artists in order to fill this void.” Contact: JS MEDIA RELATIONS Juanita Stephens, 404-494-9156 JSMEDIAREL@AOL.COM or Denise L. Mc Iver, 323-229-9409 Dmciver167@aol.com http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/0....html?.v=1 [Edited 11/26/07 4:02am] | |
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LaCienega said: Rhondab said: R Kelly needs therapy.
Many artist do. oh brother 
We're not talking about many artist though. I think some of what Ne-yo is probably true mainly because of R's situation with Jay-Z. I think its a little BS that Ne-yo would be so easily dropped because of some freakin' paperwork. the Diva thing, from both sides, is so lame. | |
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Rhondab said: LaCienega said: Many artist do. oh brother
We're not talking about many artist though. I think some of what Ne-yo is probably true mainly because of R's situation with Jay-Z. I think its a little BS that Ne-yo would be so easily dropped because of some freakin' paperwork. the Diva thing, from both sides, is so lame. I don't buy that shit either... I'm with you on this one | |
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lastdecember said: Timmy84 said: Yeah, you think an artist who sold as much as he had could be an easy concert draw. If you that big, you don't need three other people to help your ass out. You can sell out the Garden in a minute just like Stevie did but I guess he don't have it like that. An even better point would be on the last Christina Aguilera tour at one show, Rihanna was opening, so here you have 2 of the biggest in pop at the time playing a show together and couldnt sell out the venue, two weeks later STYX sold it out with no opening act, and not having a chart hit in about 20 years. Yeah but people who go to Styx shows are, for the most part, Baby Boomers wanting to relive their golden days, wheras folks like Rihanna and Christina don't have fans so much as they have fans of their songs. Fans of songs don't buy concert tickets, and that's what's going on with R.Kelly too. | |
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Rhondab said: LaCienega said: Many artist do. oh brother
We're not talking about many artist though. I think some of what Ne-yo is probably true mainly because of R's situation with Jay-Z. I think its a little BS that Ne-yo would be so easily dropped because of some freakin' paperwork. the Diva thing, from both sides, is so lame. Cause of the Jay situation. LOL Jay filed his own suit against R and the judge dismissed it. The judge ruled that from evidence that Jay caused the breakup of the tour not R. Jay settled out of court and had a clause signed were it couldnt be discussed ever again. Jay is a shady ass and he knows it. Jay isnt credible. And you say some freaking paperwork won't get you dropped huh? So if you don't sign you lease papers for a apartment do you think you can move in and just stay there. if you buy a car and don't finish the paperwork is the dealer gonna let you keep the car. You believe who you want, and i'll believe the promoter on this. | |
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Rhondab said: LaCienega said: Many artist do. oh brother
We're not talking about many artist though. After reading through this entire thread I see many artist being discussed. And like I said many artist do. | |
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LaCienega said: Rhondab said: oh brother
We're not talking about many artist though. After reading through this entire thread I see many artist being discussed. And like I said many artist do. 
you're special huh?  So what does many artist needing therapy do for the fact that R. Kelly needs it? You're being argumentative for the hell of it.
You think R. Kelly is credible? The implication says a lot.
I'm saying I don't buy the story. I think the story is convenient. It seems that Ne-yo wanted on the tour and I'm sure "paperwork" isn't the reason for this to end in this manner. Nice analogies though  ....has nothing to do with R. Kelly being a diva. You have Ne-yo being a queen and R. Kelly being butt. This is the issue.
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Rhondab said: LaCienega said: After reading through this entire thread I see many artist being discussed. And like I said many artist do.
you're special huh? So what does many artist needing therapy do for the fact that R. Kelly needs it? You're being argumentative for the hell of it.
You think R. Kelly is credible? The implication says a lot.
I'm saying I don't buy the story. I think the story is convenient. It seems that Ne-yo wanted on the tour and I'm sure "paperwork" isn't the reason for this to end in this manner. Nice analogies though ....has nothing to do with R. Kelly being a diva. You have Ne-yo being a queen and R. Kelly being butt. This is the issue.
Let me clarify this for you...I never mentioned R being credible. I said I believe the promoter the man who put the money up and organized this tour and the one who removed ne-yo from the tour cause he could. Ne-Yo is the one trying to make this all about R. when it was clearly the promoter who removed him from the tour due to him not signing the contract. Later on ne-yo admitted to not signing them after the promoter came forward, then ne-yo had a excuse to why he didnt sign them. He blamed it on some insurance for the tour. Ne-yo needs to place the blame where it belongs and its with him and his camp for not getting things straightened out with the promoter. The End for me anyway. BTW nice try with the kiddie insults. Not my style though, but nice try anyway with trying to bait me into a name calling fight over the net.  [Edited 11/27/07 13:08pm] | |
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guitarslinger44 said: lastdecember said: An even better point would be on the last Christina Aguilera tour at one show, Rihanna was opening, so here you have 2 of the biggest in pop at the time playing a show together and couldnt sell out the venue, two weeks later STYX sold it out with no opening act, and not having a chart hit in about 20 years. Yeah but people who go to Styx shows are, for the most part, Baby Boomers wanting to relive their golden days, wheras folks like Rihanna and Christina don't have fans so much as they have fans of their songs. Fans of songs don't buy concert tickets, and that's what's going on with R.Kelly too. Yeah but still in their "commercial" heights and even before they could sell out, my point is how come artists now cant sell out shows, i think alot of the blam can be placed on media and the fact that you see these artists everywhere, tabloids, tv shows,videos etc... I think Eddie Murphy said it best in the mid 80's when he said he wouldnt do commercials, they asked him why not and he said "because im a movie star and to get someone to come out of their house and put down money to see you is too precious, so if they can see everytime they turn on a tv why bother" "We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F | |
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LaCienega said: Rhondab said:
you're special huh? So what does many artist needing therapy do for the fact that R. Kelly needs it? You're being argumentative for the hell of it.
You think R. Kelly is credible? The implication says a lot.
I'm saying I don't buy the story. I think the story is convenient. It seems that Ne-yo wanted on the tour and I'm sure "paperwork" isn't the reason for this to end in this manner. Nice analogies though ....has nothing to do with R. Kelly being a diva. You have Ne-yo being a queen and R. Kelly being butt. This is the issue.
Let me clarify this for you...I never mentioned R being credible. I said I believe the promoter the man who put the money up and organized this tour and the one who removed ne-yo from the tour cause he could. Ne-Yo is the one trying to make this all about R. when it was clearly the promoter who removed him from the tour due to him not signing the contract. Later on ne-yo admitted to not signing them after the promoter came forward, then ne-yo had a excuse to why he didnt sign them. He blamed it on some insurance for the tour. Ne-yo needs to place the blame where it belongs and its with him and his camp for not getting things straightened out with the promoter. The End for me anyway. BTW nice try with the kiddie insults. Not my style though, but nice try anyway with trying to bait me into a name calling fight over the net.
[Edited 11/27/07 13:08pm] Kiddie insults, huh?  ....look like ya took the bait and swallowed the hook
But anyway - to the topic, If it all comes out in the wash that Ne-yo was wrong, then he's an idiot and a diva (as I mentioned earlier) but I think its believeable that R would behave in such a manner because of past reports. Its believable.  | |
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Who cares about R. anymore, he sold out his artistic credibility, and is whoring out musical swill. The sad thing about him is he use to make some very well written tunes (also some bad ones) and has traded that stuff in for formulated shit that only sells because his name was on it.
But now he is falling, One because he's getting old and new artist like Ne Yo have become more appealing because he has a fire, A fire that the so calld pied piper had, a while ago... Thats gone now He raised the ghetto up then spat back at it. His mama wouldn't even answer his prayers. He can go fuck himself. I am a Rail Road, Track Abandoned
With the Sunset forgetting, i ever Happened http://www.myspace.com/stolenmorning | |
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LaCienega said: Timmy84 said: The media likes to glamorize R. Kelly as having a great career but in fact, he is destroying what the media had considered "great" considering his circumstances. Now that his publicist of FOURTEEN years has quit and Ne-Yo dropping out of his tour because of Kells' ignorant behavior, it's clear Kells is burning a lot of bridges in the entertainment world as well as the criminal justice system who either wanna get the guy locked up or let him go because the preliminary case has gone on for 100 years, lol.
You are a big Marvin fan and him and R Kelly are alike musically and in their personal lives. Marvin was messing with underage females married one and had a kid by one and was strung out on drugs and crazy when he died. And R kelly has messed with underage females and is crazy. So they both have alot in common. Er, I dunno about that. I feel Robert is still trying to clone himself into Marvin (hence his latest statement that he was "the Marvin" of today, lol). They are alike at one point and not alike at other points...musically. Clearly, personally he is taking on habits that maybe someone like Marvin picked up (except for video tape allegedly) too but I don't remember him or Smokey (he was reportedly messing with a 16-year-old around the '70s, least that's what I heard) allegedly peeing on the young girls they messed around with. Marvin was rumored to have been coerced to getting one of the younger Gordy women pregnant in order to have Marvin's first child but I doubt it since none of the Gordys have come out personally to confirm the story so the story of Marvin III being adopted still stamps out rather than what Eric Michael Dyson claimed he found out in the book (he also said Marvin and Tammi had a romantic relationship but everybody who knew them said they were best friends). Janis was pretty much 17 when the two first met (everyone knew that). But her parents allowed Marvin to take her out (even though nowadays I would think parents would be more sensible to NOT let their 17-year-old daughter go out with a nearly middle-aged music superstar). I know Marvin was lucky that Janis was 18 when Nona was born. So I don't know if I can say that they're that similar though I agree both of them were disturbed. But as for musically, let's see What's Going On > I Believe I Can Fly... no comparison.
Matter of fact, a lot of entertainers have been in Marvin and Robert's shoes, it's just that Robert was CAUGHT, that's the difference. Plus the girl was not even thirteen when they allegedly started messing around. It's still a rumor and likely we will never ever figure it out but that's just between Robert and the girl, who won't testify against him. Remember Jerry Lee messed around with his 13-year-old second cousin but he didn't get arrested since it was awkwardly law in parts of the South to marry someone even if it was a second cousin, still it didn't make his career go up as Robert's has. In fact, Jerry Lee's career tanked tremendously and he spent years trying to erase that stigma and today he's regarded as a respectable music legend. Chuck Berry was also caught with a young girl and he was rumored to have spied on women (and girls) peeing and yet he didn't get the dirt Robert's getting. We know about Elvis and Priscilla, lol. Jimmy Page and his 14-year-old groupie, Steven Tyler and a young groupie around 15 were messing around in the '70s (I saw it on VH-1, not too sure when). In fact, I say Marvin shared a similarity with Ted Nugent, who also had a relationship with a 17-year-old girl and was allowed to by her parents. Robert probably chose a different way to get the girls allegedly... allegedly now. I'm not saying he DID it. I'm just saying with the case, I don't understand why there's even a need for a case if you can't figure out what to do with defense or prosecution. R. Kelly's alleged lust for girls won't end his career though (it never really did). His stupidity and ignorance will and it's starting (the Jay-Z tour, this recent one, the guy who's suing him for stealing songwriting royalties from his "Step in the Name of Love", the Belgian guys who caught Robert stealing their melodies for "You Are Not Alone", etc.) So if we're gonna bring Marvin into this, might as well bring the whole gang with me.
But if you wanna compare Robert to somebody, I'm gonna have to point out about a man Patti LaBelle said allegedly attempted to rape her when she was very young herself - Jackie Wilson. This is just allegedly though. But it clearly states that most of the guys in music at the time nearly got away with murder but it doesn't mean shit compared to how the media is today. Robert should've existed back in that time period (then again, what would he do but be called a Sam Cooke clone). [Edited 11/28/07 21:06pm] | |
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