Janfriend said:

How did we get to this point? I know we're all entitled to an opinion, but what makes her a "fucking idiot?"
As I said in my earlier post, I hadn't paid much attention to Freddie Jackson's orientation until I saw his reaction to winning that award and then I was just "o-o-o-okay!" I don't think it was necessarily apparent unless you were looking for it. Some people, when they are performing or acting or whatever, look as straight as they can be, then you see them on an interview or in another setting and they show a different side.
And Luther....I don't think we were ignoring him in discussing this issue; it was just that Freddie just kinda jumped out there!

Najee said:

What I am saying is if he is it won't be surprising 2 me because of the way he comes off in some of those videos!

Jboogiee said:

Alexander O'Neal is not coming off gay in those videos in any manner. If you're talking about the fact you can see he has on makeup, keep in mind this was a time when recording artists actually cared about their appearance and didn't want their blemishes shown. If you're talking about some of his facial expressions, he's simply aping what Morris Day and to a degree Prince did (at times musically and in vocal expressions, O'Neal did sound like he was singing as if he was the lead singer of The Time -- which he was before Prince replaced him with Day).

If that is your logic, damn near every male '80s soul artist was gay in your opinion. Hell, Alex had a hyper-masculine approach, if anything -- and unlike a lot of his peers he was married at the time with children and still had a reputation for screwing around with women (particularly of the Caucasian persuasion while traveling in England).
[Edited 11/3/07 4:47am]

NewPowerSista said:

You mentioned you noticed Freddie Jackson's mannerisms during the 1989 American Music Awards. It was fairly common conversation that most soul music fans thought Freddie was s-s-s-weet by that time -- the question here is how did this train of thought apparently elude Sherri Shepherd until 2007. Hell, Freddie almost always has displayed such mannerisms especially during his heyday when he was a constant fixture, which is why most people on this thread mentioned his name almost immediately based on the description.

Najee said:

I remember when Freddie first came out..I NEVER thought he was gay, even up until now

So I guess I was in the dark with Sherri too

NewPowerSista said:

I meant she's an idiot in general. I wasn't referring to this situation. She doesn't know if the earth is round, she doesn't think a twelve-year old should be talked to about sex. She has this "man up" mentality that is wack. She's not a bright bulb at all

Janfriend said:

actually, she has acknowledged the world is round and explained her outburst as a moment of frustration during a debate that caused her to shut down...

as far as your other points, well....is it really fair to call someone stupid for having different moral values then ourselves?

Najee said:

Yep, that's why I don't believe it's him.

Janfriend said:

DAMN!

sosgemini said:

Moral values? One of the things that causes teenage pregnancy is the fact parents aren't talking to their children about sex. The "out of sight, out of mind" mentality is archaic and uneducated. A parent can promote abstinence as well as make sure their child knows how to protect themselves because it ultimately is the child's decision if they want to have sex, whether she likes it or not. I watch The View everyday and she is the dumbest person on that show. She's incapable of having religious, political, or societal debates. Whoopi checks her ass EVERY DAY!

Janfriend said:

all of this is based on your singular opinion...and none of it answers my question: is it really fair to call someone stupid for having different moral values then ourselves?

sosgemini said:

I'm not talking about moral values, so therefore I cannot answer your question in relation to Sherri. I don't call people stupid for not sharing my moral values. Sex and the "man up" attitude have nothing to do with moral values or differences of. You came up with that. I never said anything about moral values

Janfriend said:

so what are you talking about then...sex education and religion are all based on morality so maybe i am confused about your point...care to clarify?

sosgemini said:

It's not my problem you don't understand. I never said anything about religion. I mentioned the earth being round, sex education, and "manning up." What makes you think those issues have to do with religion? The earth being round or flat have nothing to do with morality. Sex education has nothing to do with morality. I'm talking about knowledge and EDUCATION, not whether or someone should condone or encourage sex. Manning up has nothing to do with morality.

Janfriend said:

sherri already copped to her misjudgment regarding the earth being round...she accepts that and explained her frame of mind when she didnt (on air)...her religious convictions are her primary justification for most of her her views so i ask, is it fair to call someone stupid for having different moral values then you?

---is it not enough to just to agree to disagree? after all, its all based on our own singular moral values...don't you think?

sosgemini said:

No. Your assumption of what I'm talking about is based on your own singular opinion. I don't know anything about the bitch's religious convictions and don't care to know. In the 3 things I mentioned, I never heard her say those opinions were based on her religious beliefs, so why are you even bringing religion into it? She's a complete dingbat. She proves it everyday. That's why she's an idiot. I only used a few examples of her dumbness. Why are your defending her? Are you a relative?

Janfriend said:

no, i am not a relative...i am simply explaining to you her own reality based on what i have witnessed...i tivo the view and watch it everyday...and i have learned alot of about her beliefs...i dont agree with them but i have grown to accept her opinion and am willing to accept the fact that i agree to disagree..so i ask you: is it fair to call someone stupid for having different moral values then you?

morality has nothing to do with religion and has everything to do with one's own convictions...yet you keep skirting the issue...and each time you do it you get more belligerent...can you answer my original question with sincerity?

sosgemini said:

1. I'm not talking about morality, you are

2. I'm not talking about religion, you are. You mentioned religion convictions, not I

3. I answered your question. I'm not judging her based on her morals that are different than mine. You don't know anything about my morals to ask such a question. I could agree with her morals. You don't know. The women's an idiot for many reasons. Is is fair for you to assume I'm calling some stupid because their moral values are different than mine?

Janfriend said:

is this or is this not your post?


and i ask...is it fair to judge someone based on their own moral code...the definition of morality is as follows:

mo·ral·i·ty (mə-rāl'ĭ-tē, mô-) Pronunciation Key
n. pl. mo·ral·i·ties

1. The quality of being in accord with standards of right or good conduct.
2. A system of ideas of right and wrong conduct: religious morality; Christian morality.
3. Virtuous conduct.
4. A rule or lesson in moral conduct.


so i ask one final time: is it fair to call someone stupid for having different moral values then you?

sosgemini said:[quote]

Janfriend said:

Whatever dude. Maybe you're not getting it. That post I posted didn't say anything about morals or a moral code. The definition you just posted supports that fact that those things I said have nothing to do with morals. The earth being round has nothing to due with right or good conduct, religious morality, virtuous conduct, or a lesson on moral conduct. Educating a pubescent person about sex has nothing to due with right or good conduct, religious morality, virtuous conduct, or a lesson on moral conduct. Manning up has nothing to due with right or good conduct, religious morality, virtuous conduct, or a lesson on moral conduct.

The answer to the question is it fair to call someone stupid for having different moral values then you? (I am assuming when you say "you" that you are making this question a personal one

The answer is: I am not calling someone stupid because their moral values are different than mine. Some of our moral values are the same. There are many reasons why I think she is stupid.

If you want to start a debate about moral values and conflict thereof, why not start it in p&r?

Janfriend said:

because i already pointed out to you that sherry admitted she made a mistake when she claimed the world was flat...she admitted she was frustrated by the debate so she stopped thinking..now, your other points had to be about when is it appropriate to discuss sex education and "man up"...well, our own opinions about those two topics are based on our own moral values...when is it appropriate to discuss sex with your child? thats based on your own singular moral code. how do you handle your relationship with a man? once again, based on your own moral code...

hence my original question: is it fair to call someone stupid for having different moral values then you?

and when was the last time anyone on the org admitted they allowed 'the frustration of the debate' to to get the best of them?

VinnyM27 said:

I love when he does that.

sosgemini said:

Says you. You're not the authority on what is considered a moral code for everyone. She never said those opinions were based on her morals. You're speaking for her in that regard as well as for me, which is dangerous. Why can't you speak for yourself? Getting frustrated in a debate means you don't know how to have one. Manning up has to do with moral values??? Are societal stereotypes the same as morals? No. It's a personal opinion that has nothing to do with right or wrong. Discussing sex has nothing to do the morality or immorality of the act. It has to do with being educated

You asked the question. I answered it. You obviously don't like my answer. Don't try to act like you know where I'm coming from

Janfriend said:

1) i am not speaking for anyone... i have shared her statements from the show and have not once implied or stated what your views

2) please quote where i have used a stereotype within this discussion...

3) who is frustrated?




if someone feels it's inappropriate to discuss sex with a child then that is part of their moral code...why can't you understand that? this is pretty basic principles here.

TonyVanDam said:

well i know that, but the fact remains, he was a gay man singing songs about romancing women.

I saw Freddie Jackson on some music channel last night, and he did come across kinda of effeminate. But then again it was the 80s and even the straightest men came across as effeminate with all that makeup they use to smother themselves with.

What I would like to know, however, can a man be effeminate or camp yet still be straight as an arrow? According to one of my gay friends any man that is a little camp, even if he has been married 4 times and has 10 children, is really gay.

whatsgoingon said:

well lets use common sense. The whole "Down low" phenomenon lets you know that someone can be masculine(if not not hyper masculine) and be gay so it would only make sense that someone can be feminine and straight

LoveAlive said:

That's what I was trying to argue with my gay friend, but he insists that it's not possible.

whatsgoingon said:

well ask your gay friend is he thinks all black people eat watermelon and fried chicken and sits on our porch all day

LoveAlive said: