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PrintableEmbattledWarrior said: mrsnet said: Well the 3 of them set the tone for the video age. I think Madonna is quite the entertainer. She may not have the best voice, but you cannot deny she puts on great show! I put Madonna right up there with MJ and Prince because they were all unique. And what can I say - I loveeeeed the 80s. 'like a virgin... touched for the very first timeeee.. Like a vir ir ir ir giiiiin' lol. Love it! Seriously though, I love her songs and showmanship. Putting on a great show has nothing to do with talent, that has to do with Charisma... The Bums on 42nd street NYC , put on a great show, with sock puppets... Doesn't mean theyy have any talent. Point being Madonna was a recording industry manufactured pop princess... Probably only wanted for a few petty pop hits. HEr longevity had nothing to do with talent, but her scandalous lifestyle and infectious personality. If it wasn't for that se would've fizzled out like everything else in the 80's Oh please. Madonna is one of the biggest stars in the world still! Sells out concerts WORLDWIDE. Could never have lasted this long without talent. Okay? And stage charisma is a talent. But it's more than that. She just has what it takes. She's a fairly good singer and I like her songs. Performancwise, she magnificent, even to this day. | |
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anon said: MikeMatronik said: Madonna's played guitar in the 70's when she had those bands in NY. And she was a drummer...  I'm not mad at you, I'm mad at the dirt. | |
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mrsnet said: EmbattledWarrior said: Putting on a great show has nothing to do with talent, that has to do with Charisma... The Bums on 42nd street NYC , put on a great show, with sock puppets... Doesn't mean theyy have any talent. Point being Madonna was a recording industry manufactured pop princess... Probably only wanted for a few petty pop hits. HEr longevity had nothing to do with talent, but her scandalous lifestyle and infectious personality. If it wasn't for that se would've fizzled out like everything else in the 80's Oh please. Madonna is one of the biggest stars in the world still! Sells out concerts WORLDWIDE. Could never have lasted this long without talent. Okay? And stage charisma is a talent. But it's more than that. She just has what it takes. She's a fairly good singer and I like her songs. Performancwise, she magnificent, even to this day. Totally agree buddy! Noone could last as long as Madonna without talent. Madge will go down as a legend, regardless of whether we like it or not. I have never understood why women dislike her. She has done alot for women in the music industry. She broke down all the boundaries. She showed us that women can kick arse and demand respect without the likes of men. Like Prince, she is a walking contradiction, she is feminine, yet masculine, slutty, yet prudish, classy, yet cheap. I'm intrigued! I think she was one of the first female artists to be given a 10 year contract with a record company. This was very uncommon during this period in music history, especially for a woman. We should applaud her for her efforts, she paved the way for future female artists. She commanded control and she recieved it. Madge has the "it" factor and she has it to the max. Madonna is not a stupid woman, she is well aware of the fact she isn't a great musician or a unique vocalist, she draws on other elements, like her sexuality. She is a savvy businesswoman. Madonna realises that controversy equals publicity, which ultimately leads to record sales, if that's what it takes to make sales then why not? Maybe if Prince did this nowadays he may be charting too and gaining more fans?  j/k (kind of)
I'm surprised Prince fans don't appreciate her, she pushes the envelope, as Prince does, however she gets slammed for her efforts...don't you see the glaring contradiction? The madge-hate is a clear example of the double-standards which exist in society. She always gets shit for apparently sleeping around, ummm hello people... Prince is a man whore and I'm sure a majority of men in the industry are too, why is it different if a woman fucks around? Who cares? She got sexed by different men, now she's happily married with children, that's more I can say for our beloved Princey. I doubt anything I have said will penetrate the Madge-haters hard heads :shrugs: Christina xx | |
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Tonylover said: mrsnet said: Oh please. Madonna is one of the biggest stars in the world still! Sells out concerts WORLDWIDE. Could never have lasted this long without talent. Okay? And stage charisma is a talent. But it's more than that. She just has what it takes. She's a fairly good singer and I like her songs. Performancwise, she magnificent, even to this day. Totally agree buddy! Noone could last as long as Madonna without talent. Madge will go down as a legend, regardless of whether we like it or not. I have never understood why women dislike her. She has done alot for women in the music industry. She broke down all the boundaries. She showed us that women can kick arse and demand respect without the likes of men. Like Prince, she is a walking contradiction, she is feminine, yet masculine, slutty, yet prudish, classy, yet cheap. I'm intrigued! I think she was one of the first female artists to be given a 10 year contract with a record company. This was very uncommon during this period in music history, especially for a woman. We should applaud her for her efforts, she paved the way for future female artists. She commanded control and she recieved it. Madge has the "it" factor and she has it to the max. Madonna is not a stupid woman, she is well aware of the fact she isn't a great musician or a unique vocalist, she draws on other elements, like her sexuality. She is a savvy businesswoman. Madonna realises that controversy equals publicity, which ultimately leads to record sales, if that's what it takes to make sales then why not? Maybe if Prince did this nowadays he may be charting too and gaining more fans? j/k (kind of)
I'm surprised Prince fans don't appreciate her, she pushes the envelope, as Prince does, however she gets slammed for her efforts...don't you see the glaring contradiction? The madge-hate is a clear example of the double-standards which exist in society. She always gets shit for apparently sleeping around, ummm hello people... Prince is a man whore and I'm sure a majority of men in the industry are too, why is it different if a woman fucks around? Who cares? She got sexed by different men, now she's happily married with children, that's more I can say for our beloved Princey. I doubt anything I have said will penetrate the Madge-haters hard heads :shrugs: Christina xx Prince could at least Sing, Play several Instruments well, and produce fairly well. Madonna Cannot sing, cannot play any instruments, though she does a good pantomime. and produce. Good ole madge is the female version of elvis without the talent plain and simple Her image and charisma is the sole reason for her fame... I don't doubt that she puts on a good show, i went to one, and enjoyed it. But as i said, it aint a talent... She can't write, She can't Sing, She can't produce... At least by herself... The day she does i will be truely impressed... It wouldn't even matter if it war a flop too. But the fact that she tried on her own whim would make her an Artist and would gain my respect But for now she's just another entertainer... And as the infamous Paul Simon said "Who's Gonna Love Ya When You're Looks are Gone?" I am a Rail Road, Track Abandoned
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EmbattledWarrior said: Tonylover said: Totally agree buddy! Noone could last as long as Madonna without talent. Madge will go down as a legend, regardless of whether we like it or not. I have never understood why women dislike her. She has done alot for women in the music industry. She broke down all the boundaries. She showed us that women can kick arse and demand respect without the likes of men. Like Prince, she is a walking contradiction, she is feminine, yet masculine, slutty, yet prudish, classy, yet cheap. I'm intrigued! I think she was one of the first female artists to be given a 10 year contract with a record company. This was very uncommon during this period in music history, especially for a woman. We should applaud her for her efforts, she paved the way for future female artists. She commanded control and she recieved it. Madge has the "it" factor and she has it to the max. Madonna is not a stupid woman, she is well aware of the fact she isn't a great musician or a unique vocalist, she draws on other elements, like her sexuality. She is a savvy businesswoman. Madonna realises that controversy equals publicity, which ultimately leads to record sales, if that's what it takes to make sales then why not? Maybe if Prince did this nowadays he may be charting too and gaining more fans? j/k (kind of)
I'm surprised Prince fans don't appreciate her, she pushes the envelope, as Prince does, however she gets slammed for her efforts...don't you see the glaring contradiction? The madge-hate is a clear example of the double-standards which exist in society. She always gets shit for apparently sleeping around, ummm hello people... Prince is a man whore and I'm sure a majority of men in the industry are too, why is it different if a woman fucks around? Who cares? She got sexed by different men, now she's happily married with children, that's more I can say for our beloved Princey. I doubt anything I have said will penetrate the Madge-haters hard heads :shrugs: Christina xx Prince could at least Sing, Play several Instruments well, and produce fairly well. Madonna Cannot sing, cannot play any instruments, though she does a good pantomime. and produce. Good ole madge is the female version of elvis without the talent plain and simple Her image and charisma is the sole reason for her fame... I don't doubt that she puts on a good show, i went to one, and enjoyed it. But as i said, it aint a talent... She can't write, She can't Sing, She can't produce... At least by herself... The day she does i will be truely impressed... It wouldn't even matter if it war a flop too. But the fact that she tried on her own whim would make her an Artist and would gain my respect But for now she's just another entertainer... And as the infamous Paul Simon said "Who's Gonna Love Ya When You're Looks are Gone?" I never said she was a great musician, instrumentalist or singer and I never compared her talent to Prince's - he is one of a kind. For someone who apparently can't sing, can't play instruments or produce, she has done awfully well for herself. I think some of her songs she can sing well live, others not so well. She has had a string of top ten hits. That's more than I can say for other "artists" who are in the limelight these days. Kylie Minogue is a great example of someone who can't sing, can't produce, can't write and can't play an instrument, yet she constantly gets praised, like she is God's gift or something. I find it interesting that an assertive woman in the business gets slammed, like Madonna, when others that are just as "untalented" as her are praised. I would rather see Madonna live, as opposed to Kylie anyday. For the record I think being a good performer is a talent, and Madonna is a brilliant performer, she pushes the envelope and I like it. I knew it wouldn't penetrate the hard heads.. God damn.. why do I continue to try? Christina xx | |
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Tonylover said: EmbattledWarrior said: Prince could at least Sing, Play several Instruments well, and produce fairly well. Madonna Cannot sing, cannot play any instruments, though she does a good pantomime. and produce. Good ole madge is the female version of elvis without the talent plain and simple Her image and charisma is the sole reason for her fame... I don't doubt that she puts on a good show, i went to one, and enjoyed it. But as i said, it aint a talent... She can't write, She can't Sing, She can't produce... At least by herself... The day she does i will be truely impressed... It wouldn't even matter if it war a flop too. But the fact that she tried on her own whim would make her an Artist and would gain my respect But for now she's just another entertainer... And as the infamous Paul Simon said "Who's Gonna Love Ya When You're Looks are Gone?" I never said she was a great musician, instrumentalist or singer and I never compared her talent to Prince's - he is one of a kind. For someone who apparently can't sing, can't play instruments or produce, she has done awfully well for herself. I think some of her songs she can sing well live, others not so well. She has had a string of top ten hits. That's more than I can say for other "artists" who are in the limelight these days. Kylie Minogue is a great example of someone who can't sing, can't produce, can't write and can't play an instrument, yet she constantly gets praised, like she is God's gift or something. I find it interesting that an assertive woman in the business gets slammed, like Madonna, when others that are just as "untalented" as her are praised. I would rather see Madonna live, as opposed to Kylie anyday. For the record I think being a good performer is a talent, and Madonna is a brilliant performer, she pushes the envelope and I like it. I knew it wouldn't penetrate the hard heads.. God damn.. why do I continue to try? Christina xx Then there's alot of talent on 42nd street  I am a Rail Road, Track Abandoned
With the Sunset forgetting, i ever Happened http://www.myspace.com/stolenmorning | |
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i watched the first song, ray of light, and saw her playing guitar. it looked like chords F# to B or G to C but it doesn't really matter. i couldnt hear it anyway.
but as i got used to the chords being played (G chord being on the '1' of the bar and C on the '2 and') i noticed later on in the song that she was playing them in reverse compared to the start of the song! maybe she couldnt hear the monitors.... maybe all them dancers just broke her concentration... maybe it was the occasion.... maybe it wasnt plugged in |
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EmbattledWarrior said: Tonylover said: I never said she was a great musician, instrumentalist or singer and I never compared her talent to Prince's - he is one of a kind. For someone who apparently can't sing, can't play instruments or produce, she has done awfully well for herself. I think some of her songs she can sing well live, others not so well. She has had a string of top ten hits. That's more than I can say for other "artists" who are in the limelight these days. Kylie Minogue is a great example of someone who can't sing, can't produce, can't write and can't play an instrument, yet she constantly gets praised, like she is God's gift or something. I find it interesting that an assertive woman in the business gets slammed, like Madonna, when others that are just as "untalented" as her are praised. I would rather see Madonna live, as opposed to Kylie anyday. For the record I think being a good performer is a talent, and Madonna is a brilliant performer, she pushes the envelope and I like it. I knew it wouldn't penetrate the hard heads.. God damn.. why do I continue to try? Christina xx Then there's alot of talent on 42nd street People use sarcasm when they have nothing intelligent to say.. Christina xx | |
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EmbattledWarrior said: Tonylover said: Totally agree buddy! Noone could last as long as Madonna without talent. Madge will go down as a legend, regardless of whether we like it or not. I have never understood why women dislike her. She has done alot for women in the music industry. She broke down all the boundaries. She showed us that women can kick arse and demand respect without the likes of men. Like Prince, she is a walking contradiction, she is feminine, yet masculine, slutty, yet prudish, classy, yet cheap. I'm intrigued! I think she was one of the first female artists to be given a 10 year contract with a record company. This was very uncommon during this period in music history, especially for a woman. We should applaud her for her efforts, she paved the way for future female artists. She commanded control and she recieved it. Madge has the "it" factor and she has it to the max. Madonna is not a stupid woman, she is well aware of the fact she isn't a great musician or a unique vocalist, she draws on other elements, like her sexuality. She is a savvy businesswoman. Madonna realises that controversy equals publicity, which ultimately leads to record sales, if that's what it takes to make sales then why not? Maybe if Prince did this nowadays he may be charting too and gaining more fans? j/k (kind of)
I'm surprised Prince fans don't appreciate her, she pushes the envelope, as Prince does, however she gets slammed for her efforts...don't you see the glaring contradiction? The madge-hate is a clear example of the double-standards which exist in society. She always gets shit for apparently sleeping around, ummm hello people... Prince is a man whore and I'm sure a majority of men in the industry are too, why is it different if a woman fucks around? Who cares? She got sexed by different men, now she's happily married with children, that's more I can say for our beloved Princey. I doubt anything I have said will penetrate the Madge-haters hard heads :shrugs: Christina xx Prince could at least Sing, Play several Instruments well, and produce fairly well. Madonna Cannot sing, cannot play any instruments, though she does a good pantomime. and produce. Good ole madge is the female version of elvis without the talent plain and simple Her image and charisma is the sole reason for her fame... I don't doubt that she puts on a good show, i went to one, and enjoyed it. But as i said, it aint a talent... She can't write, She can't Sing, She can't produce... At least by herself... The day she does i will be truely impressed... It wouldn't even matter if it war a flop too. But the fact that she tried on her own whim would make her an Artist and would gain my respect But for now she's just another entertainer... And as the infamous Paul Simon said "Who's Gonna Love Ya When You're Looks are Gone?" exactly [Edited 7/22/07 10:58am] | |
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Any time someone starts defending an artist on the basis of their commercial success, then you know they're not too clued up on the subject of music. It also says a lot about how little Madonna's fans truly care about music that they brag about how she used her sexuality to get ahead and sell records, as if that were a good thing. Also, anyone who proudly states that their tastes haven't changed since they were 10 years old (23 years ago) is not someone I can take too seriously. What else? Oh yeah, that shitty song Madonna co wrote for the hideous Gary Barlow ( at just the mention of his name) is not something Madonna fans should be reminding us of.“The man who never looks into a newspaper is better informed than he who reads them, inasmuch as he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.”
- Thomas Jefferson | |
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midnightmover said: Any time someone starts defending an artist on the basis of their commercial success, then you know they're not too clued up on the subject of music.
LOL, what a ridiculous statement! Commercial success is an indicator of what pleases the masses. "not clued up on music"??? WTF??? Most people aren't musicians. And yes, my 3 favorite artists TO THIS DAY are MJ, Prince & Madonna. From the 80s TO the present. Understand now? | |
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midnightmover said: Any time someone starts defending an artist on the basis of their commercial success, then you know they're not too clued up on the subject of music. It also says a lot about how little Madonna's fans truly care about music that they brag about how she used her sexuality to get ahead and sell records, as if that were a good thing. Also, anyone who proudly states that their tastes haven't changed since they were 10 years old (23 years ago) is not someone I can take too seriously. What else? Oh yeah, that shitty song Madonna co wrote for the hideous Gary Barlow (
at just the mention of his name) is not something Madonna fans should be reminding us of.don't cry lil'madonna hater and shit-hop fan! | |
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Tonylover said: She has done alot for women in the music industry. She broke down all the boundaries. She showed us that women can kick arse and demand respect without the likes of men.
oh please. by doing what, by releasing books of pornography and wearing ridiculous cone bras? by appearing in videos and on stage surrounded by "sexy" male dancers? oh, what a saint! what a breaker of boundaries! give me a break. joni mitchell, patti smith, kate bush, debbie harry, did far more for women in music and they all predated madonna (joni on madonna: "madonna has knocked the importance of talent out of the arena. she's manufactured. she's made a lot of money and become the biggest star in the world by hiring the right people.") i would argue madonna set women back in music, if anything Tonylover said: Madge has the "it" factor and she has it to the max. Madonna is not a stupid woman, she is well aware of the fact she isn't a great musician or a unique vocalist, she draws on other elements, like her sexuality.
that's a talent now? [Edited 7/22/07 14:14pm] | |
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You can only get so far by hiring the right people Anybody who takes Marketing 101 will tell you that in order for a product to last, it has to have quality. I think Madonna is extremely talented. I don't like some of the things she did during her career, but nobody is perfect. I do think she has exposed people of double standards in the record industry. | |
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i dont necessarily agree with that part of joni's statement so i wont defend it. i do think shes very good at hiring the right people, but shes also very good at being a star/celebrity. that doesnt stop her being an embarassing imbecile, and doesnt stop her being worthy of little respect as a musician, however | |
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I like to express my extreme point of view/ I'm not a christian and I'm not a Jew
My father went to work/ I thought he was a jerk Hey Britney/ I'd rather see you bare your soul/ If you think you're so hot/ Then show me what you got! Sigmund Freud- analyse this! Hey mr dj, I like to boogie woogie! [Edited 7/22/07 14:58pm] “The man who never looks into a newspaper is better informed than he who reads them, inasmuch as he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.”
- Thomas Jefferson | |
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theghostoftonym said: that doesnt stop her being an embarassing imbecile, and doesnt stop her being worthy of little respect as a musician, however
You should've added, "IMO". There are those who think Whitney Houston cannot sing. | |
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mrsnet said: theghostoftonym said: that doesnt stop her being an embarassing imbecile, and doesnt stop her being worthy of little respect as a musician, however
You should've added, "IMO". There are those who think Whitney Houston cannot sing. no, madonna being an embarassing imbecile has been proved by several scientific studies. i dont have the literature to hand, unfortunately | |
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Tonylover said: EmbattledWarrior said: Then there's alot of talent on 42nd street People use sarcasm when they have nothing intelligent to say.. Christina xx Unless you're such a dullard that my intellectual nuances bounce off you like a book on Jessica Simpson. No disrespect of course. 
I don't like attacking people personally unless they attack me first. So don't make it personal... Ok, Im a nice guy  I am a Rail Road, Track Abandoned
With the Sunset forgetting, i ever Happened http://www.myspace.com/stolenmorning | |
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EmbattledWarrior said: Tonylover said: People use sarcasm when they have nothing intelligent to say.. Christina xx Unless you're such a dullard that my intellectual nuances bounce off you like a book on Jessica Simpson. No disrespect of course.
I don't like attacking people personally unless they attack me first. So don't make it personal... Ok, Im a nice guy Actually, I didn't attack you personally. It is just obvious you didn't have a rebuttal, which is fine.... because you know there is some truth to what I am saying anyway . Whether people want to believe it or not is an entirely different situation.
And dw, I'm not insulted, just amused. Christina xx | |
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theghostoftonym said: Tonylover said: She has done alot for women in the music industry. She broke down all the boundaries. She showed us that women can kick arse and demand respect without the likes of men.
oh please. by doing what, by releasing books of pornography and wearing ridiculous cone bras? by appearing in videos and on stage surrounded by "sexy" male dancers? oh, what a saint! what a breaker of boundaries! give me a break. joni mitchell, patti smith, kate bush, debbie harry, did far more for women in music and they all predated madonna (joni on madonna: "madonna has knocked the importance of talent out of the arena. she's manufactured. she's made a lot of money and become the biggest star in the world by hiring the right people.") i would argue madonna set women back in music, if anything Tonylover said: Madge has the "it" factor and she has it to the max. Madonna is not a stupid woman, she is well aware of the fact she isn't a great musician or a unique vocalist, she draws on other elements, like her sexuality.
that's a talent now? [Edited 7/22/07 14:14pm] Prince has flaunted his sexuality for decades and the only reason he is accepted is because he is male. Prince has pranced around the stage with animal print bikini briefs on, with his pubes hanging out either sides, he has written extremely explicit lyrics, stimulated sex and masterbation on stage, not to mention is objectification of women in his clips... the list goes on. I don't condemn Prince for these things, it is what it is. Why should I condemn Madonna, who happens to be female, for similar things? And don't say, because she isn't talented, we all know that isn't emtirely true. For one, she is a great performer. And for God's sake man, if it wasn't for Prince's sexuality he wouldn't be where he is today. The same can be said for Madonna. I just don't understand why people are so harsh. It is evident alot of this hatred towards Madonna stems from sexism. Patti Smith and Kate Bush... who cares? Debbie Harry was a former Playboy Playmate (i think), and although she wasn't as extreme as Madge she was a little racy, she does pre-date Madge and things were a little bit more conservative back then. These sorts of things should be taken into account when making such a statement. As for Joni Mitchell, she is a TOTALLY different artist, so a comparison shouldn't even be made. Joni doesn't think much of any artist. I remember her saying on radio a few years back that she doesn't even think Prince is a musical genius. She said he was a great performer, but as an artist he is no wonder (something along those lines). With that said, her criticisms of Madge don't surprise me. Why the hate? Christina xx | |
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Tonylover said: EmbattledWarrior said: Unless you're such a dullard that my intellectual nuances bounce off you like a book on Jessica Simpson. No disrespect of course.
I don't like attacking people personally unless they attack me first. So don't make it personal... Ok, Im a nice guy Actually, I didn't attack you personally. It is just obvious you didn't have a rebuttal, which is fine.... because you know there is some truth to what I am saying anyway . Whether people want to believe it or not is an entirely different situation.
And dw, I'm not insulted, just amused. Christina xx I did have a rebuttal, but it was meaningless to point out cause i've already said it in previous posts. She doesn't write, produce by herself doesn't play any instruments everything else is moot And you can't compare her to prince cause prince does all that. As much as i don't like his current output of music. To mention that Madonna is even in the same league as prince is musical blasphemy. But fine she's a great entertainer... You win that but she's no artist, Wait for Joni's new album and you'll see real talent... and maybe Kate Bush's I am a Rail Road, Track Abandoned
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EmbattledWarrior said: Tonylover said: Actually, I didn't attack you personally. It is just obvious you didn't have a rebuttal, which is fine.... because you know there is some truth to what I am saying anyway . Whether people want to believe it or not is an entirely different situation.
And dw, I'm not insulted, just amused. Christina xx I did have a rebuttal, but it was meaningless to point out cause i've already said it in previous posts. She doesn't write, produce by herself doesn't play any instruments everything else is moot And you can't compare her to prince cause prince does all that. As much as i don't like his current output of music. To mention that Madonna is even in the same league as prince is musical blasphemy. But fine she's a great entertainer... You win that but she's no artist, Wait for Joni's new album and you'll see real talent... and maybe Kate Bush's You and "theghostoftonym" should have coffee sometime, you would have lots to agree on. Maybe dating isn't out of the question.. just a thought. Christina xx | |
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Tonylover said: EmbattledWarrior said: I did have a rebuttal, but it was meaningless to point out cause i've already said it in previous posts. She doesn't write, produce by herself doesn't play any instruments everything else is moot And you can't compare her to prince cause prince does all that. As much as i don't like his current output of music. To mention that Madonna is even in the same league as prince is musical blasphemy. But fine she's a great entertainer... You win that but she's no artist, Wait for Joni's new album and you'll see real talent... and maybe Kate Bush's You and "theghostoftonym" should have coffee sometime, you would have lots to agree on. Maybe dating isn't out of the question.. just a thought. Christina xx We did date, but him being a phantom was a problem for me you know... Sexually...  I am a Rail Road, Track Abandoned
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Tonylover said: Prince has flaunted his sexuality for decades and the only reason he is accepted is because he is male. Prince has pranced around the stage with animal print bikini briefs on, with his pubes hanging out either sides, he has written extremely explicit lyrics, stimulated sex and masterbation on stage, not to mention is objectification of women in his clips... the list goes on. yes...but the key difference is prince (im talking about the dirty mind era mostly here) did not flaunt his sexuality in the same way, say, robert plant or mick jagger or the old bluesmen did. he didnt do it in a macho, masculine way. he did it in a very feminine, gender-bending way which genuinely did push boundaries, which was consequently a positive thing. but before madonna, women had been just tits n ass, treated like objects, for decades anyway. so she was doing nothing positive by acting like a slut, all she was doing was reinforcing damaging stereotypes. its the kind of meaningless, degrading faux-empowerment which led to garbage like christina aguilera's "dirrrty" (an attitude which south park skewered brilliantly in their "stupid spoiled whore video playset" episode) and i find a lot of prince's sexual stuff - including simulating sex acts on stage with mayte, the crap with diamond & pearl on the diamonds & pearls tour - to be just as stupid and damaging as madonna's. and i find his "ladie's man" lifestyle to be just sad rather than admirable, and by all accounts he's a pretty terrible misogynist. i never said he wasn't. Tonylover said: Patti Smith and Kate Bush... who cares? whats that supposed to mean exactly? Tonylover said: she does pre-date Madge and things were a little bit more conservative back then.
it was only a few years earlier! [Edited 7/23/07 6:21am] | |
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theghostoftonym said: Tonylover said: Prince has flaunted his sexuality for decades and the only reason he is accepted is because he is male. Prince has pranced around the stage with animal print bikini briefs on, with his pubes hanging out either sides, he has written extremely explicit lyrics, stimulated sex and masterbation on stage, not to mention is objectification of women in his clips... the list goes on. yes...but the key difference is prince (im talking about the dirty mind era mostly here) did not flaunt his sexuality in the same way, say, robert plant or mick jagger or the old bluesmen did. he didnt do it in a macho, masculine way. he did it in a very feminine, gender-bending way which genuinely did push boundaries, which was consequently a positive thing. but before madonna, women had been just tits n ass, treated like objects, for decades anyway. so she was doing nothing positive by acting like a slut, all she was doing was reinforcing damaging stereotypes. its the kind of meaningless, degrading faux-empowerment which led to garbage like christina aguilera's "dirrrty" (an attitude which south park skewered brilliantly in their "stupid spoiled whore video playset" episode) and i find a lot of prince's sexual stuff - including simulating sex acts on stage with mayte, the crap with diamond & pearl on the diamonds & pearls tour - to be just as stupid and damaging as madonna's. and i find his "ladie's man" lifestyle to be just sad rather than admirable, and by all accounts he's a pretty terrible misogynist. i never said he wasn't. whats that supposed to mean exactly? Tonylover said: she does pre-date Madge and things were a little bit more conservative back then.
it was only a few years earlier! [Edited 7/23/07 6:21am] Hahahaha, umm excuse me are we talking about the same person? Madonna is certainly androgenous. She embodies alot of masculine qualities/stereotypes. What's amusing is she has taken the piss out of them 2 Like Prince, she is a "gender-bender", who constantly pushes the boundaries.. sorry dude.. what are you talking about? I think you don't fully understand Madonna, or what she has done. Why do people have to be so derogatory when referencing Madonna's sexual past? I mean she has dated alot of men, I don't think that makes her a slut... it may make her promiscuous at most. Hey, if I was in her position I would be sexing it with the best of them 2. If Madonna is a slut, then Prince is a slut 2 and so is a majority of the population according to your definition actually. I think we may have to agree to disagree. I just can't understand why so much hate towards her. Double standards suck balls!
On the other hand, I totally agree with you in regards to the Prince being a misogynistic loser sometimes..
I pray you see the light one day *prays* Christina xx | |
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Who fucking cares? Madonna's great songs outnumbers Prince's great songs!
There. I said it! | |
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Tonylover said: theghostoftonym said: it was only a few years earlier! [Edited 7/23/07 6:21am] Hahahaha, umm excuse me are we talking about the same person? Madonna is certainly androgenous. She embodies alot of masculine qualities/stereotypes. What's amusing is she has taken the piss out of them 2 Like Prince, she is a "gender-bender", who constantly pushes the boundaries.. sorry dude.. what are you talking about? I think you don't fully understand Madonna, or what she has done. Why do people have to be so derogatory when referencing Madonna's sexual past? I mean she has dated alot of men, I don't think that makes her a slut... it may make her promiscuous at most. Hey, if I was in her position I would be sexing it with the best of them 2. If Madonna is a slut, then Prince is a slut 2 and so is a majority of the population according to your definition actually. I think we may have to agree to disagree. I just can't understand why so much hate towards her. Double standards suck balls!
On the other hand, I totally agree with you in regards to the Prince being a misogynistic loser sometimes..
I pray you see the light one day *prays* Christina xx Vanity Fair said it best in 2000 in the Music of the last century issue. Madonna will never get the respect she's due because, she is not a folk singer with a guitar like all other respected female artiest and she caters to the gay auidence which is a no no in super macho world of Rock. that's why people like George Michael and Boy George don't get the respect they are due as well. You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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Dewrede said: MartyMcFly said: 
Hate the old bag! Hate her so much I can actually taste it in my mouth... 
[Edited 7/20/07 6:48am] me too those muscled arms make me wanna puke  She looks hot  | |
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JoeTyler said: Dewrede said: me too those muscled arms make me wanna puke She looks hot Yeah, a hot mess. She is the spiritual godmother of all the non-singing, lip-synching "performers". Janet Jackson, Paula Abdul, Jennifer Lopez, Britney Spears, etc, etc, etc. I like many of these people, but Madonna is such an insincere person that it's hard to root for her. I just wish she would go away with her fake British accent and devotion to Kabbalah or whatever else is fashionable at the moment.  
Some people tell me I've got great legs... | |
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