Yeah, they were the bomb. The male predecessors to Neo Soul, they don't get a lot of digital ink here. Saadiq especially. Sons of Soul is my fave from them and that album helped usher in the Neo Soul era.

Najee said:

Damn.....Mint Condition gets no LOVE.

Graycap23 said:

That's because Mint Condition wasn't as effective or creatively clever as Tony! Toni! Tone!

Mint Condition's strength was making ballads, but the Tonys did that as equally well. Where Tony! Toni! Tone! kills them is when it came to uptempo songs -- the Tonys made some slamming jams ("Little Walter," "Born Not to Know," "The Blues," "Feels Good," "If I Had No Loot," "Let's Get Down," "My Ex-Girlfriend") while Mint Condition's uptempo stuff was "blah."
[Edited 4/8/07 11:00am]

Najee said:

I sort of see where u are coming from. I like them both but I dig Mint more. I see your point though.

Graycap23 said:

Don't get me wrong, I liked Mint Condition. But despite they looked like a hard rock/funk band and displayed the ability to use and create diverse styles in their music, for all intents and purposes they were a ballad band. And while their ballads wasn't some soft-sounding stuff a la Switch, they never showed an ability to make more than a competent uptempo song.

Let's look at the best ballads from both Mint Condition and Tony! Toni! Tone!:

Mint: "Breakin' My Heart (Pretty Brown Eyes)," "Forever in Your Eyes," "U Send Me Swinging," "Someone to Love," "What Kind of Man Would I Be," "You Don't Have to Hurt No More," "If You Love Me."

3T: "It Never Rains in Southern California," "Whatever You Want," "(Lay Your Head on My) Pillow," "Anniversary," "Slow Wine," "Just Me and You," "Still a Man."

I would say most people would consider this category a draw. Both equally did ballads well, but the thing is the 3Ts also could make uptempo songs (and unlike Mint Condition's, theirs were slamming). Here are the best uptempo songs from both groups:

Mint: "Nobody Does It Betta."

3T: "Little Walter," "Born Not to Know," "Baby Doll," "For the Love of You," "The Blues," "Feels Good," "If I Had No Loot," "Oakland Stroke," "Let's Get Down (featuring DJ Quik)," "My Ex-Girlfriend."

The frightening thing is that those are mostly the released singles from 3T -- overall, their albums featured quite a few other uptempo songs that were strong. As good as Mint Condition was with ballads, I pretty much ended listening to them when the uptempo stuff came on. With 3T, their entire albums were strong throughout.
[Edited 4/8/07 11:50am]

I saw them in concert when they came with the Club MTV Tour. They put on a very good set. One of my favorite T.T.T songs is "My Ex-Girlfriend Is A Ho". It wasn't a hit but it's a Jam.

Najee said:

That's a good job, but I'd really miss "Boys & Girls." You could take out "Ask of You," which is just Raphael solo. I'd actually prefer original versions of remixes for 3T, but I'd use the "Baby Doll" remix by Teddy Riley. I think you got all the singles except "House Party," which isn't exactly a big loss.

BTW, my two favorites are definitely "Whatever You Want" and "(Lay Your Head on My) Pillow."

AlexdeParis said:

I thought the sound effects in the remix to "Baby Doll" overpowered Raphael's singing. With "Feels Good," the Tonys added a new verse and some other chants to the remix.

I like "Ask for You" because it's only available on the "Higher Learning" soundtrack and it was a solo hit. I may consider "Boys and Girls," even though it's basically "Let's Get Down Part II."
[Edited 4/8/07 16:24pm]

Najee said:

I LOVE ME SOME TONY! TONI! TONE! Got all the albums listed.

but this one:



IS THE SHIT!!!!! i still put this album on blast now and then, if only they could have a reunion album wishful thinking i guess. but it would be nice.

TTT's music is the type that can't be time capsuled, it sounds timeless. "Anniversary" still sounds like it was just released last week.

Najee said:

damn its been 10 years since "House of Music"????!!!! I didn't even realize that.

I strongly agree with you on TTT being the last great soul band.

the song "Wild Child" off of this album:



always touches me everytime i hear it.

Najee said:

Exactly!

Would y'all compare Guy to TTT ad Mint Condition.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

GUY was actually more popular than Tony! Toni! Tone! during their run together. While the 3T's "Who?" went gold and "The Revival" went platinum, GUY's self-titled album and "The Future" sold more than 2 million copies. The individual star power of Teddy Riley, Aaron Hall and Damion "Crazy Legs" Hall -- ignited by Riley's New Jack Swing style -- dominated the soul music scene from 1988 through 1991.

GUY and Tony! Toni! Tone! had the potential to be two of the biggest soul band concepts ever -- if they stayed together. The problem is GUY outgrew its collective membership quickly and the Tonys followed suit by the end of "House of Music" album.
[Edited 4/8/07 22:05pm]

ThePunisher said:

I'VE BEEN TRYING TO GET THAT SONG FOR MY BABY'S DADDY RINGTONE! SO I'VE SETTELED WITH WHODINI "I'M A HOE"

Never was into them much for some reason, but "Babydoll" was MY SHIT "Pillow" & "Just Me & You" are my second faves of theirs...

Najee said:

You have a point about the "Baby Doll" remix, but my copy doesn't have the best sound anyway. Regardless, it would be nice to have the one and only T.R./3T collaboration available. As for "Feels Good," it's just one of those songs that I think are already perfect and shouldn't be remixed. (Aaliyah's "One in a Million" is another.)


I know! Nothing against "Ask of You," of course. It's a good song.

One of my faves



http://www.youtube.com/wa...8raGKwVm5I

Najee said:

Toni toni tone did better mixing their style with the hip hop element and reaching that crowd but mint condition is way better live than toni toni tone
ever was. In fact just last year, mint, the tonies, rftw, and silk did a show in atlanta and raphael sadiqq wasn't even a part of the tonies they had some other dude named cousin something singing lead. Mint condition blew their ass off the map. When you go see mint perform live, they give you far more than what you get on the album. The signature hit ballads sound much better live because they tend to turn them into funk ballads. Believe it or not, the band plays some of their funk tracks that their earlier labels would not push on the radio and the band also does play rock. The tonies would not even have the balls to put rock songs on their album. Mint Condition is far more creative than the tonies. I cannot even believe you went there.
The tonies best album was their last because with the exception of let's get down, they had a lot of old school ballads on house of music unlike the sons of soul album where you had 20 different samples in one song.
Mint Condition would put the tonies to shame on their worst night.

Also let's not forget the jazz and latin infusion that mint adds to some of their songs and ewf like interludes in between songs which the tonies weren't
adept at. The tonies until the house of music were mostly a sampling band but not a fake ass band like joe public, basic black, or guy.
[Edited 4/9/07 18:10pm]

phunkdaddy said:

Good post PhunkDaddy. I agree with you. Mint Condition was a better band. But the Tonies had the hits, and that's what counts in the business. It could be that their record company worked harder for them then Mint Condition's did.

I love "Anniversary", "Whatever You Want" and "Feels Good".

Yes i agree the tonies may have had a few more radio hits than mint condition but mint conditions albums were generally more electic and there is no doubt that they were more versatile live than the tonies. Don't get me wrong i like the tonies too. Raphael is a good bass player which a lot of people probably did not know because he sang most of the lead on their songs. I also say that stokley is a more versatile vocalist than raphael. Stokley can hit notes much better than raphael and stokley can easily scat over music which raphael cannot. Once raphael hit a certain pitch his voice cracks. You can tell listening to the tonies songs. House of music was definitely their masterpiece even though it did not have the radio singles that the revival and sons of soul did. The ballads were quite nice on sons of soul but on the uptempo songs you had 20 damn samples in one song which was quite disturbing. The show they did in atlanta last year with mint, they had a guy name cousin pete singing lead and their sound system along with the music was very distorted.

ThePunisher said:

I love Tony Toni Tone and Mint. Mint would put great rock songs and the end of every album. Stokley was a better vocalist than Raphael and Mint put on a slightly better show than 3T. I think you are slightly off when you say that 3T sampled up until House of music. They did sample but they mix it with a lot of live instrumentation. Mint used a lot of sequincing on their albums especially their 1st. A lot of bass synths and drum machines on those records. Great arrangments on 3Ts albums and the songs concepts were interesting like "The Blues" and "My Ex Girlfriend" Theyt seemed to have a sense of humor. I think 3T were better producers and had more presence as a band. Raphael, Dwayne and Tim were great musicians. not to mention Elijah on bass. Don't forget they toure as Sheila E backing band for a while and prince wanted to sign them to paisley park. Raphael sings that in "Born not to know" "I ain't wearing paisley" . Mint did have Jellybean in their corner, but i have to give to The Tonyies.

Love them

babybrutha said:

Mint Condition produced their first album along with jellybean johnson to help
them get their feet wet in the business. The album had a bit of minneapolis flavor to it but you can tell the two hits from the first album pretty brown eyes and forever in your eyes had mint's stamp all over it because it did not
have that minneapolis flavor. Hey i love the tonies but i noticed you failed to mention that on the tonies first album Who that they had Denzil Foster & Thomas Mc Elroy produce their first album to help them get their feet wet in the business. I only liked born not to know and who from the first album.
When the tonies took over on the revival album it was much better and they
did bring something fresh to the table when music was going to shit during that
period. I should have said the tonies only oversampled a bit on sons of soul.
I still found house of music which is still a favorite of mine to be their best.
As far as mint goes, i still think overall they are more creative and a little more organic and dynamic than the tonies. Stokley is amazing. The guy sings, plays drums, guitar, and keyboards while jeffrey allen plays keyboards and plays sax like no other. Rick is one of the nastiest bassists i have seen outside of verdine white. This mutha plays bass while spinning and laying on the damn floor. O'dell is one hell of a lead guitarist too. Mint is also the only self contained band in the business and what is even more amazing they do the damn thing with just six musicians where as most r&b bands have 10 or more
members on stage. Dig the tonies but i just think mint set the bar as a live band higher.
[Edited 4/10/07 15:46pm]

House of Music