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PrintableVoicesCarry said: Meloh9 said: Another issue I was wondering about, I'm not saying this is going on with the org at all let me make that clear. I was thinking maybe complaining about Hip Hop is a slick way to complain about black people for some. That is not to say that Hip Hop reflects the actions of the black community as a whole. But there are those that probably feel that is does, so they replace Hip Hop with the word black or nigger and say things like "rappers are lazy" - because they sample.
I'm sure there are a lot of people simply tired of rap, but rap has a face attached to it and it is still a black art form. Hip Hop may become the new N word. There are a LOT of BLACK PEOPLE who are PISSED OFF at the way mainstream hip-hop stereotypes and homogenizes the black experience. And in fact reinforces racist notions of black culture. And I am one of those people, I'm not a fan of Soul Plane culture at all. What I said is more aimed at those non minorities that choose to lump everybody into mainstream Hip Hop culture. Ranting about a certain music art form can easily turn racist and just another way to say they don't like black folks. | |
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VoicesCarry said: Meloh9 said: Another issue I was wondering about, I'm not saying this is going on with the org at all let me make that clear. I was thinking maybe complaining about Hip Hop is a slick way to complain about black people for some. That is not to say that Hip Hop reflects the actions of the black community as a whole. But there are those that probably feel that is does, so they replace Hip Hop with the word black or nigger and say things like "rappers are lazy" - because they sample.
I'm sure there are a lot of people simply tired of rap, but rap has a face attached to it and it is still a black art form. Hip Hop may become the new N word. There are a LOT of BLACK PEOPLE who are PISSED OFF at the way mainstream hip-hop stereotypes and homogenizes the black experience. And in fact reinforces racist notions of black culture. Indeed, some of the genre's most vocal critics are black. There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently | |
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Meloh9 said: VoicesCarry said: There are a LOT of BLACK PEOPLE who are PISSED OFF at the way mainstream hip-hop stereotypes and homogenizes the black experience. And in fact reinforces racist notions of black culture. And I am one of those people, I'm not a fan of Soul Plane culture at all. What I said is more aimed at those non minorities that choose to lump everybody into mainstream Hip Hop culture. Ranting about a certain music art form can easily turn racist and just another way to say they don't like black folks. Racists will use anything as justification for their opinions. Has nothing to do with hip-hop specifically. I am absolutely sure that corporate America has shifted the focus to gangsta rap, hypersexual images and excessive violence in order to pander to racist tendencies. There is no question about that. It sells because it reinforces the status quo. | |
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Another thing, I am madder at Viacom than Hip Hop as a whole. They are the ones that put the money behind that shit and they carefully decide what is seen and heard in videos etc. A lot of white people with suits, not rappers with chains and guns decide what you see and hear. | |
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Meloh9 said: Another thing, I am madder at Viacom than Hip Hop as a whole. They are the ones that put the money behind that shit and they carefully decide what is seen and heard in videos etc. A lot of white people with suits, not rappers with chains and guns decide what you see and hear.
Actually, the rappers with chains and guns DO decide what we see and hear because they are the ones who sign the contracts and go along with it because there is money in it. So I consider them complicit in their own degradataion. | |
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VoicesCarry said: Meloh9 said: Another thing, I am madder at Viacom than Hip Hop as a whole. They are the ones that put the money behind that shit and they carefully decide what is seen and heard in videos etc. A lot of white people with suits, not rappers with chains and guns decide what you see and hear.
Actually, the rappers with chains and guns DO decide what we see and hear because they are the ones who sign the contracts and go along with it because there is money in it. So I consider them complicit in their own degradataion. The corporations don't have to back it but they do. Who do you think is over their heads telling them what they think will sale based on their very limited perception of black culture. Artist like Dr Dre still have to answer to folks like Jimmy Ivene. I'm not saying we shouldn't take any responsibility at all, but you are way more likely to hear positive rap on an indie label or on the underground and there are reasons for that. Like you said earlier.. “I am absolutely sure that corporate America has shifted the focus to gangsta rap” | |
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Meloh9 said: VoicesCarry said: Actually, the rappers with chains and guns DO decide what we see and hear because they are the ones who sign the contracts and go along with it because there is money in it. So I consider them complicit in their own degradataion. The corporations don't have to back it but they do. Who do you think is over their heads telling them what they think will sale based on their very limited perception of black culture. Artist like Dr Dre still have to answer to folks like Jimmy Ivene. I'm not saying we shouldn't take any responsibility at all, but you are way more likely to hear positive rap on an indie label or on the underground and there are reasons for that. Like you said earlier.. “I am absolutely sure that corporate America has shifted the focus to gangsta rap” My point is that they are both at fault. | |
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Meloh9 said: Another issue I was wondering about, I'm not saying this is going on with the org at all let me make that clear. I was thinking maybe complaining about Hip Hop is a slick way to complain about black people for some. That is not to say that Hip Hop reflects the actions of the black community as a whole. But there are those that probably feel that is does, so they replace Hip Hop with the word black or nigger and say things like "rappers are lazy" - because they sample.
I'm sure there are a lot of people simply tired of rap, but rap has a face attached to it and it is still a black art form. Hip Hop may become the new N word. GREAT point!! [Edited 12/22/06 12:04pm] | |
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mul2std said: 1. crunk culture (especially Lil'Jon)
2. 50Cent, his boyfriend Lloyd Banks & the G-Unit ** WORD. 3. RIAA ** not sure what that is... 4. All jungle bunnies (Lil'Kim, Khia, Jaci-O, Trina, etc.) ** okay, by "jungle bunnies", is that a term that THEY used to describe themselves or is that a term YOU are using to describe them because i don't know if i should be feeling offended right now or not. 5 Dr.Dre for standing by 50Cent by abandoning The Game. ** $.50 sucks. this much i know. i used to like dre back in his NWA days. 6. Suge Knight ** goes w/out saying he sucks. 7. Flavor Flav for dating Brigette Nilsen. ** whatever... 8. The Fugees for not being able to solve their personal differences. ** i have to admit that they are pretty disappointing. 9. Jay-Z for not staying "retired". ** heheheh! 
10. Snoop Dogg for failing drug rehab. ** i don't take that guy seriously so i can't be disappointed when he fucks up. 11. The Neptune for ruining Gwen Stefani's career ** how'd they do that? 12. will.i.am for making Fergie look like an complete idiot ** err.... she can look like an idiot on her own. ever see kids incorporated? 13. All rapper from Houston, Texas that sounds the same (except for The Geto Boyz) ** this i can't really comment on but i am tired of "the dirty south". 3. RIAA = Record Industry Association of America All of the current 4 major labels are represented by RIAA. And all 4 labels are responsible for promoting only one style of rap (gangsta) and ignore the others. 4. I hate to admit this, but some black female rappers have reinvented the negative stereotypes of the black woman. So to me (TVD, a black man), it's the ugly truth. And I don't care for it one bit. And BTW, I know there a lot of white females (Britney, Paris, etc.) that enforce the negative stereotypes of white women too. And I don't care for that neither. | |
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Meloh9 said: Another issue I was wondering about, I'm not saying this is going on with the org at all let me make that clear. I was thinking maybe complaining about Hip Hop is a slick way to complain about black people for some. That is not to say that Hip Hop reflects the actions of the black community as a whole. But there are those that probably feel that is does, so they replace Hip Hop with the word black or nigger and say things like "rappers are lazy" - because they sample.
I'm sure there are a lot of people simply tired of rap, but rap has a face attached to it and it is still a black art form. Hip Hop may become the new N word. CORRECTION: The new "n-words" are thug & chav (from what I notice thoughout the world wide web). And the new "honky" is trailer park trash & redneck. But staying on subject.....It's all bad news in general if too many children (all colors) are being exposed to this negativity within music. | |
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Meloh9 said: Another thing, I am madder at Viacom than Hip Hop as a whole. They are the ones that put the money behind that shit and they carefully decide what is seen and heard in videos etc. A lot of white people with suits, not rappers with chains and guns decide what you see and hear.
Besides ViaCON, you should also blame Clear Channel Communications & Ennis Communications for doing the same damn thing to FM Radio. | |
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This thread and the various opinions given are the very reason why I asked on this forum a little while ago: Will this generation have a legacy of music like many of us had? (I asked about R n B but rap can certainly be included) | |
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TonyVanDam said: Meloh9 said: Another issue I was wondering about, I'm not saying this is going on with the org at all let me make that clear. I was thinking maybe complaining about Hip Hop is a slick way to complain about black people for some. That is not to say that Hip Hop reflects the actions of the black community as a whole. But there are those that probably feel that is does, so they replace Hip Hop with the word black or nigger and say things like "rappers are lazy" - because they sample.
I'm sure there are a lot of people simply tired of rap, but rap has a face attached to it and it is still a black art form. Hip Hop may become the new N word. CORRECTION: The new "n-words" are thug & chav (from what I notice thoughout the world wide web). And the new "honky" is trailer park trash & redneck. But staying on subject.....It's all bad news in general if too many children (all colors) are being exposed to this negativity within music. Chav refers to white trash. For example, you could describe Britney as a chav. | |
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VoicesCarry said: TonyVanDam said: CORRECTION: The new "n-words" are thug & chav (from what I notice thoughout the world wide web). And the new "honky" is trailer park trash & redneck. But staying on subject.....It's all bad news in general if too many children (all colors) are being exposed to this negativity within music. Chav refers to white trash. For example, you could describe Britney as a chav. Britney was also consider "white trash" while still married to K-Fed. And I also notice (according to critics) that Christina was first-class chav. | |
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Heavensgirl said: This thread and the various opinions given are the very reason why I asked on this forum a little while ago: Will this generation have a legacy of music like many of us had? (I asked about R n B but rap can certainly be included)
The children/teen of the 1990's? Yes The children/teen of the 2000's? No IMHO of course. But I'll be very surprise if I'm wrong. | |
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TonyVanDam said: VoicesCarry said: Chav refers to white trash. For example, you could describe Britney as a chav. Britney was also consider "white trash" while still married to K-Fed. And I also notice (according to critics) that Christina was first-class chav. It's a British term. Celebs like Jodie Marsh, Peter Andre & Jordan are chav. 
I have never heard it used to refer to a black person. | |
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VoicesCarry said: TonyVanDam said: Britney was also consider "white trash" while still married to K-Fed. And I also notice (according to critics) that Christina was first-class chav. It's a British term. Celebs like Jodie Marsh, Peter Andre & Jordan are chav.
I have never heard it used to refer to a black person. Because "chav" is the british way of saying "wiggaz" (READ: whites & latinos trying too hard to be street, gangsta, or ghetto). And yes, it's insulting! But damn, that a lot of white teens that grew up watching NWA, 2pac, Biggie, and dirty south hip-hop in general. | |
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TonyVanDam said: VoicesCarry said: It's a British term. Celebs like Jodie Marsh, Peter Andre & Jordan are chav.
I have never heard it used to refer to a black person. Because "chav" is the british way of saying "wiggaz" (READ: whites & latinos trying too hard to be street, gangsta, or ghetto). And yes, it's insulting! But damn, that a lot of white teens that grew up watching NWA, 2pac, Biggie, and dirty south hip-hop in general. Maybe it WAS, once, but you can hardly consider Jodie Marsh a "wigga"  Now it's applied to any trashy white celeb it seems. | |
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VoicesCarry said: TonyVanDam said: Because "chav" is the british way of saying "wiggaz" (READ: whites & latinos trying too hard to be street, gangsta, or ghetto). And yes, it's insulting! But damn, that a lot of white teens that grew up watching NWA, 2pac, Biggie, and dirty south hip-hop in general. Maybe it WAS, once, but you can hardly consider Jodie Marsh a "wigga" Now it's applied to any trashy white celeb it seems.Jodie Marsh? Never heard of her. Is she pretty? | |
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TonyVanDam said: VoicesCarry said: Maybe it WAS, once, but you can hardly consider Jodie Marsh a "wigga" Now it's applied to any trashy white celeb it seems.Jodie Marsh? Never heard of her. Is she pretty? CHAV 
 [Edited 12/22/06 16:09pm] | |
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VoicesCarry said: TonyVanDam said: Jodie Marsh? Never heard of her. Is she pretty? CHAV
[Edited 12/22/06 16:09pm] She looks like an adult film actress!  | |
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First off, I don't hate Hip-Hop.
I dislike the negative Gangsta Rap element that's leeched itself onto it. Out of curiosity, I Googled the term Gangsta Rap to see if there were any intelligent discussions or essays on the subject. A sample, from the reasoned (1994)... Sexism and Misogny: Who Takes the Rap? - Bell Hooks http://race.eserver.org/misogyny.html To the somewhat humorous (1996)... How Ronald Reagen Created Gangsta Rap - Matthew Yeomans, James Ledbetter & Thomas Goetz http://www.lycaeum.org/dr...eganr.html To the most recent of the 3 (2006)... Hang the MC (Blaming hip hop for violence: a four-part series) http://www.cbc.ca/arts/mu...themc.html tA  Tribal Disorder
http://www.soundclick.com...dID=182431 "Ya see, we're not interested in what you know...but what you are willing to learn. C'mon y'all." | |
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I just HAD to post this: http://www.youtube.com/wa...PDgLRL38Vc | |
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notto stray too far, but have you noticed that the backlash and discussion of whites and hip hop mirrors that of the 50s and 60s of whites and R n B? Back then , Pat Boone was the disgrace. In our recent eras, it was Vanilla Ice, for the same reasons (not only obviously ripping off Queen, but rapping badly and stealing a chant AND a move from Alpha Phi Alpha.) White parents not enjoying their teens dancing to that negro music to white parents not enjoying their children dressing and speaking like thugs.
And really, it isn't about race today. It's more about classism and trying to look and ACT respectable and real. Case in point, check out that show "Made" on MTV. There was an episode where a girl wanted to be a rapper. She was from this upper middle class school in Costa Mesa. She had to battle this dude. Half those kids were trying to act so "gangsta" when they were more Robbie Van Winkle than anything. Hip hop has become a style of dress and fake image, when it used to be a state of mind and storytelling, whether positive or negative stories. I really don't even see gangsta rap anymore. It's drowning in image. When Hulk's daughter is singing with Paul Wall, there are major issues. | |
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TonyVanDam said: VoicesCarry said: It's a British term. Celebs like Jodie Marsh, Peter Andre & Jordan are chav.
I have never heard it used to refer to a black person. Because "chav" is the british way of saying "wiggaz" (READ: whites & latinos trying too hard to be street, gangsta, or ghetto). And yes, it's insulting! But damn, that a lot of white teens that grew up watching NWA, 2pac, Biggie, and dirty south hip-hop in general. Sorry Tony, but "chav" isn't the British word for "wigga". It means white trash. Trust me, I'm British.  [Edited 12/23/06 4:25am] There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently | |
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CinisterCee said: pbrite said: Man, every genre is dead at one point or another. It's sad that The Roots song and video for "what they do" is still relevant. BTW, how relevant was Paul Revere to Gangsta rap? Didn't it pre-clude a lot of NWA?
Schoolly D and Ice T lead the pack. Funny I never thought of "Paul Revere" in the gangsta category before.  YO Cinister. Did u happen to glimpse Ice T on Jimmy Kimmel? This fool still talkin' about killin' cats? Isn't this N word in his 40's!?!? | |
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Meloh9 said: One of the things that I don't like is the influence gangster rap has had on modern R&B and love songs. We once had classic love songs with lines like..
"If God one day struck me blind Your Beauty I'll still see" What happened to such romantic lyrics? Now love songs are like.. "I need a down ass bitch like youuuuu giiirl! " I thought the police was checkin' me but they was just scoping you girl!" wtf? This must be how the church felt when gospel music was spliced with the everyday subject matter of the blues. Sometimes I feel outraged, other times I'm like hey, maybe this is what everyday folks want to hear and this is everyday talk. Me being a Libra I try to see both sides, but I miss love songs that actually talk about love you know. Yo that statement made me add you to my MYSPACE page fam. LOL! | |
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MikeMatronik said: I want a "I hate Madonna thread"
Wait...we have one of those everyday here! No we don't. It's basically always a Madonna love-fest here all the time. "I saw a woman with major Hammer pants on the subway a few weeks ago and totally thought of you." - sextonseven | |
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"I saw a woman with major Hammer pants on the subway a few weeks ago and totally thought of you." - sextonseven | |
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