The decline of hip-hop into the state of hit-pop is like an aggravating symptom of the larger problems that have plagued the black community before Kool Herc rocked the party, or for that matter, before Bird met Diz.

But it's hard to dispute that hit-pop has more of a negative influence on the black community than virtually any other art form has in recent memory, And everyone knows it.

But it isn't THE cause of our problems. And to say so amounts to a copout.

BLACK PEOPLE... if you think it's JUST MUSIC.. keep this in mind.

Why the fuck are our black males selling drugs when they live in the SUBURBS and go to high-end schools?

Why are black girls embracing "PORNOGRAPHY"/WHORE/STRIPPER CULTURE. What happened to the pride black girls once had?

HIP HOP HAS DEGENERIZED BLACK AMERICA. OUR YOUTH HAVE WHOLEHEARTEDLY EMBRACED LOW-LIFE, THUG CULTURE. PEOPLE WHO WE USED TO SCORN WE NOW SEE AS HEROES.

I think your post is very intelligent, but the fault isn't the record companies'. It's the audience's. I find the whole blaming record company argument tired. Companies don't make money if people aren't buying.

u2prnce said:

And thats exactly why record labels are gettin away with it because alot of people wanna exclude them - they think blaming the empires are "tired" or "ridiculous". They wanna point their finger at the puppets but not the puppet-masters over them pulling the strings.

Listen, when these record labels "push" artists, this "push" (pay-for-play) puts them all over the TV and all over the radio. You wanna say its the consumers, but it aint even so much about who's buyin the records anymore (after all, we're still in an era of rampant illegally file-sharing and bootlegging *ahem!*hustlin'*ahem!*). What about those (especially of the young generation) who just personify what see on the TV or hear on the radio? What you fail to realize is that kids watch TV and listen to the radio, and they admire it and idolize it. They make it cool to be ghetto, hood, convicts, etc. so that most likely becomes their future. And that fucks off another generation and we as black people continue to be "trapped".

And you wonder why negative shit is so cool to young kids nowadays - mostly every artist on TV is doing it and talkin about it, so its the "in" thing. And its like I was sayin earlier, TV/radio dont segregate shit like they should - right after a Bow Wow record comes a song with somebody talkin about how they pimpin, hustlin, etc. While these labels are "pushing" to get consumers, their poisoning minds in the process.

Now, some of the songs that were mentioned in the original post of this thread, I do acutally like, but its just music to me, its doesnt influence me at all. But thats probably because Im grown and mature enough.

And its like America would much rather scrutinize on how McDonalds is making people obese, but not how record companies poison minds.
[Edited 4/27/06 9:53am]

Prospect said:

I don't completely agree with you, but you bring up some very valid points.

You mentioned that you like some of the songs, but that's it's just music to you. Do you think kids who aren't even 18 yet should be exposed to the messages in much of hip hop right now? As in advertising, the person affected doesn't always realize they're being manipulated. Isn't this what makes it possible for kids to pick up smoking at this point in modern consciousness?

Peace.

I don't completely agree with you, but you bring up some very valid points.

You mentioned that you like some of the songs, but that's it's just music to you. Do you think kids who aren't even 18 yet should be exposed to the messages in much of hip hop right now? As in advertising, the person affected doesn't always realize they're being manipulated. Isn't this what makes it possible for kids to pick up smoking at this point in modern consciousness?

Peace.

Kids will seek out and be exposed to objectionable material. That is what kids do.

That is part of the reason I am posting on prince.org now. Parents should raise them to recognize and deal with the shitty messages that they will inevitably see in life. Kids will be alot better off for it in the long run.


.
[Edited 4/27/06 10:30am]

It's not true.

So STFU already.

People want to blame hip hop because it's easy to do.

There is no/none evidence to support this argument.

If you think it is true, then you really need some help.
[Edited 4/26/06 20:24pm]

u2prnce said:

And thats exactly why record labels are gettin away with it because alot of people wanna exclude them - they think blaming the empires are "tired" or "ridiculous". They wanna point their finger at the puppets but not the puppet-masters over them pulling the strings.

Listen, when these record labels "push" artists, this "push" (pay-for-play) puts them all over the TV and all over the radio. You wanna say its the consumers, but it aint even so much about who's buyin the records anymore (after all, we're still in an era of rampant illegally file-sharing and bootlegging *ahem!*hustlin'*ahem!*). What about those (especially of the young generation) who just personify what see on the TV or hear on the radio? What you fail to realize is that kids watch TV and listen to the radio, and they admire it and idolize it. They make it cool to be ghetto, hood, convicts, etc. so that most likely becomes their future. And that fucks off another generation and we as black people continue to be "trapped".

And you wonder why negative shit is so cool to young kids nowadays - mostly every artist on TV is doing it and talkin about it, so its the "in" thing. And its like I was sayin earlier, TV/radio dont segregate shit like they should - right after a Bow Wow record comes a song with somebody talkin about how they pimpin, hustlin, etc. While these labels are "pushing" to get consumers, their poisoning minds in the process.

Now, some of the songs that were mentioned in the original post of this thread, I do acutally like, but its just music to me, its doesnt influence me at all. But thats probably because Im grown and mature enough.

And its like America would much rather scrutinize on how McDonalds is making people obese, but not how record companies poison minds.
[Edited 4/27/06 9:53am]

AquafineDream said:

Finally - someone with some sense!!

I think MLK and many others that fought and died for black civil rights would be totally disgusted.

It's a 3 prong problem, people:

1 - PARENTS: Get involved. Sneak. Snoop. Find out what your kids are up to. Don't let MTV raise your kids. GET INVOLVED.

2 - KIDS: They need to realize that the shit these rappers talk about and display in their songs and videos is fantasy for the most part. MOST haven't sold drugs, MOST haven't killed anyone, MOST don't own fancy cars and big houses and MOST don't get those fine women they see in the videos. The kids have to be educated on that.

3 - ARTISTS: They have to change the landscape themselves. If they don't think they influence these kids then why would they do "positive" PSA raps when the activists come calling? Their music influences. Period. They need to stop hiding behind that "It's just music" credo and realize they have the power to influence kids, negatively and positively.

The record companies only put out what the demand is. If these artists change their style, they change the demand and then the supply changes. Period. Just think back to when Positive Rap/Conscious Rap/African Movememnt Rap was popular...why? Because that's what the artists were giving us back then and we almost had no choice but to like it. Same with this trash-ass "Crunk" shit we here now: If that's all you give to the public then that's all they'll want.

Don't forget the networks who broadcast this shit. Although it's gotten a little better, I swear sometimes I think BET is working against us.

3 - ARTISTS: They have to change the landscape themselves. If they don't think they influence these kids then why would they do "positive" PSA raps when the activists come calling? Their music influences. Period. They need to stop hiding behind that "It's just music" credo and realize they have the power to influence kids, negatively and positively.

It's not true.

So STFU already.

People want to blame hip hop because it's easy to do.

There is no/none evidence to support this argument.

If you think it is true, then you really need some help.
[Edited 4/26/06 20:24pm]

basically. people want to blame the media in general for alot peoples problems. we were talkin about this in school today, discussin why men abuse women and the media got brought up and the music. my thing is where the fuck does PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY come in???? u can hang w/ ho's but not be a ho, u can hang w/ dealers but not be a dealer, u can listen to rap with all the bs and violence but at the end of the day its YOU that makes the choice to make all that ur hearing real in ur life. i def. think the media is an influence BUT its not the cause

Universaluv said:

I blame Viacom.

StoneCrib said:

So?
It's not their responsibility to teach kids something...
If some rapper wants to rap about bitches and ho's or hustlers and pimps because he/she thinks it's fun then they should and if people don't like it then they should change the channel, that's what remote controls were invented for...
Let's blame Hip Hop for the stupidity of black American kids... Yeah pure logic working there...
Blame the ignorant and neglecting parents for their stupidity...

Neversin.

I just said that's one of the ways you attack the problem.

StoneCrib said:

I get what you're saying but you're not attacking the problem here, what you're saying is is that these artists (and I use the term lightly with these "new-skool" rappers) should change their stance to influence (or indoctrinate) the stupid kids with socially accepted behaviour...
These artists shouldn't change this so-called landscape, the parents should teach their kids to use their brain and not let it be filled by products on TV/radio be it positive or negative (from rappers or movies or cartoons or whatever...)
Communication between the parents and the kids is what is needed since that is what's lacking...

Neversin.

Well, right, but that's why I listed the parents 1st, then the kids 2nd and THEN the artists because that's the way the problem should be attacked from start to end.

the sad part is record excectives know what they are doing.by only signing acts with thug images they feed our youth this picture and sure enough thats what they want to become. when was the last time you saw a black band being signed.no you have to look like a thug your lyrics have to be thugged out and your video has to exploit our black women or we have to b going to jail in them.these songs have no feelings or substance like in the day.maybe we will look back on this rap mess like we do the old superfly movies and relize we look like idiots and have been played by the record companies. i pray we relize this b 4 a whole generation kills each other in the name of hip hop, god help us.

joelmarable said:

You don't have to be thuggged out to get a deal.

Common has a deal. So does Talib Kweli. So does Kanye. So do The Roots, etc..

StoneCrib said:

No it shouldn't, artists have nothing to do with the stupidity of their listeners, they shouldn't be blamed for some strangers idiocy...

Neversin.

woogiebear said:

Hip-Hop Instrumentals is he way of the future. Just make the beats without the lyrics.

Calling up DJ Premier, Pete Rock, Marley Marl, Paul C, The Bomb Squad, Showbiz, Diamond D, Buckwild, Large Professor, etc., isn’t going solve anything for any of our “legends.” That sound is no longer relevant to the masses and it never will be. Boom Bap in a commercially viable sense is dead.