paligap said:

Let's Groove, Evolution Orange, I Wanna Be With You, I've Had Enough.....

Yeah, I'd say that's classic material right there

intha916 said:

I've always hated that I AM album because of the Adult contemporary schmaltz of "After The Love Is Gone" and the disco sellout of "Boogie WOnderland". There are some great EWF classic tunes like "In the Stone" and "Let Your Feeulings Show" and "Rock That" is a blistering horn cavalcade. Personally I like the double album Faces a lot more.

RAISE! is ok in places ("Lets Groove" is "Boogie Wonderland, Pt.2"), but it is not "classic" EWF. Both Al McKay and Johnny Graham are gone. The orignal gutarist Roland Bautista filled in and he's good, but this the first move to a single guitar. Also, sax and horn parts are diminished.

Sheldon Reynolds has a great voice and he's a great player, but if it's an EWF album the lead vocals are supposed to Maurice and Phil. No one else. So if Maurice ain't singing, thrn nobody else should even consider singing his parts. LOL! Poor Phil.

I liked IN THE NAME OF LOVE and even parts of THE PROMISE, but one of the dstrengths if ILLUMINATION is Maurice sounds loud and strong.

Funny I still can't forgive EWF for ELECTRIC UNIVERSE or HERITAGE (the Hammer album). Those still sound dreadful

PFunkjazz said:

I agee with most of your points. I do like the song "Touch" on the EU album but other than that, it was a mess. And Heritage had a song or two but other than that it's a poor excuse for an EWF album. But I can't understand you liking Faces more than I Am. I remember being very let down when Faces came out. "Turn It Into Something Good" is a great song, but most of that album just seemed flat to me. Let Me Talk was a poor lead single by EWF standards. I remember Raise seeming like a comeback album because a lot of folks thought they wered done after Faces. Funny, 25 years later and those cats are still here.
[Edited 9/29/05 11:37am]

intha916 said:

noway, there are so many great tracks on Faces I'd never wanna miss

Dancelot said:

I forgot "Take It To The Sky" too. But for a double album, I thought it was rather weak.

which album is System of Surival on and what do folks think of that one?

intha916 said:

OH NO FACES kills straight thru the three sides, then it falls flat on side 4 (songs written with outside riters). I remember making a killer tape from that. The Freaking instrumental kills! "Take It To The Sky! is cold and Phil
shines on "Sailaway" (a la "We Write A Song) and I dug "Let Me Talk". Much better jam than "Let's Groove",IMO. And the interludes were so freakin' cool.

(HA! this was one of the last LPs I ever bought and dubbed selected CD onto cassette).

They didn't tour behind FACES and Al had aleady left. Some of this was stuff in the can, so that may explain why it went flat. Folks was fadein' on RAISE!. They were still booking large venues and doing multiple nights, but the place was 2/3rds full I remember going to the FORUM in LA and getting great tickets ON THE FLOOR on the day of the gig. Man! I loved it so much I went back for a 2nd night. That electro-mechanical hawk swooping down was the bomb!

AS for now, the core is Maurice Verdine Phil and Ralph. Maurice masterminds and sings occassionally, but his disease limits him. Nobody knows what Ralph does except for being a "founding member (lucky bastard). Phil maintains a separate solo recording career (he must have bought into a limited partnership with Maurice and Verdine cuz he talks about ILLUMINATION originally being parts of his next album but he turned it over to Maurice as a group album). Verdine is 100% full-time all-time EWF. Personally, I really think that DEVOTED SPIRITS band with Larry Dunn and Sheldon Reynolds sounds better.

sosgemini said:

"SoS" was the lead single track. The album was TOUCH THE WORLD. It was a better techno album thanEU. Good enough to go see them and it was a great performance. Maurice's last stand. They did "Magic Mind" from ALL N ALL. Maurice was condcting the horn section, which was arranged in a pyramid. They blared touches of Art Ensemble in a free jazz freakout. They sounded great!

PFunkjazz said:

thats right...w/ Thinking Of You...

damn..i loved Thinking OF You..that was my song....

intha916 said:

oh come on, there's more delightful moments on Faces than just those two songs you mentioned?? "And love goes on" is classic EWF in my book, I can fully enjoy the joyful sound of Sparkle, the rock inspired guitar & chants of Back on the road... Let me talk, Win or lose, You went away.. In time... Sailaway.. I even can very much enjoy a schmaltzy yet highly melodic MOR ballad like "You" (i.e After the love has gone Pt.II)... and maybe there's even more songs I forget about now, I have to check at home

Dancelot said:

Don't forget "Pride"!!!!

PFunkjazz said:

What happened to Fred White, even his own brother left?? The horns departed. Basically an entire new band except Verdine.

PFunkjazz said:

That just wasn't the way it was up here (northern cali) I remember defending the band over that Faces album. I heard so many people doggin that record. When "Let's Groove" first dropped I remember feeling almost vindicated for staying with them. I remember how all of the sudden everyone was luvin them again. They sold out 2 or 3 straight nights in Oakland. As a matter of fact, the concert DVD they have from around that time was shot over the course of those nights.

I hear "heritage" quite alot at the moment.


Yay, "for the love of you" with hammer made rnb top #20


"daydreaming" is a classic song, why this didn't appear to be a single is beyond me. Superb intro

HardcoreJollies said:

Just who and what did they "sell out" to?

I can't help but compare the new Soulive to the new EWF and George Clinton releases. The instrumentation is real and fresh without making concessions to crappy ass hiphop.

Yeah I gotta put this on the One Nation board.

Dancelot said:

My problem with 'Faces' is...considering that it's a 2-record set,it is not as diverse as it could have been.They had plenty of room to stretch out and really make it interesting and profound,but too many of the songs are similiar.There are a few songs that take them into new directions..."Back On The Road" has a rock feel to it,and the title track is a delightful,Latin-styled jazz workout.I wanted to see more songs like those two! More experimentation.

Having said that,I think it is a pleasant album.There are enough good songs there,so it's not a failure by any means.I love "Share Your Love","Sailaway" (one of their best slow jams ever),"Win Or Lose",plus the two songs that I previously listed.A good album,but I felt that it could have been much better.

Dancelot said:

'I Am' is actually my favorite EW&F album.I never understood why some people had issues with this album.The entire Side One ("In The Stone","Can't Let Go","After The Love Is Gone","Let Your Feelings Show") is the strongest side of any EW&F album,imo.Those four songs alone make it an essential album.But then you flip the record over,and you get more great stuff like "Star","Rock That" and "You And I",one of their best,most soulful slow jams ever.

intha916 said:

'Electric Universe' has three great songs:"Touch","We're Living In Our Own Time" and my favorite "Could It Be Right".The latter should have been a single,it's a wonderful ballad in the vein of "After The Love Is Gone".I don't hate this album the way most fans do (lol),but I rarely listen to it.

thesexofit said:

I agree withg you,"Daydreaming" is a great song.It's the best thing on 'Heritage' and yes,it really should have been a single.


daydreamin when I'm thinking of you
missin' all the things that we used to do
dancin' at the party on a Saturday night
it was cool

sosgemini said:

It's from their 1987 album 'Touch The World'.This was their first album since 1983 and it was considered a huge comeback for them.The first two singles "System Of Survival" and "Thinking Of You" were big hits.It's a well-produced,consistent album with no filler.There are a couple of nice ballads with Philip Bailey on lead vocals ("You And I" and "Here Today and Gone Tomorrow")....there are some great uptempo jams with clever lyrics and strong messages ("Evil Roy","Victim Of The Modern Heart","Money Tight").The music throughout is very late-80s sounding...alot of synths and drum machines.But I still appreciate this album and I was thrilled to see them back on top.

DavidEye said:

You're almost contradicting yourself here; "not as diverse", but "more experimentation". HUH? This had was their longset instrumental since "Zanzibar" and it's pretty tight. Plus the interludes were pretty amazing.
The bum tracks on there were "Song in My Heart" "You Went Away" "Win or Lose". They "sound like anuthing. They went flat, but the rest of it, put it way past I AM .

PFunkjazz said:

Experimentation means more diverse sounds


The album should have covered alot more ground.In other words,it should have been their 'SITKOL'.Since it is a 2-record set,they had alot of room to really do some exciting things.But most of the songs are predictable,and many of the uptempo tracks sound alike.


The interludes were pretty amazing? I think there's only one interlude,between "Turn It Into Something Good" and "Pride".Where are the other ones at?

intha916 said:

'Raise' is a damn good album.They often get criticized for "selling out" in the 80s,but that is not a valid criticism because 'Raise' is funky as hell.There is very little pop on this album.

intha916 said:

Actually,Maurice sings alot on 'The Promise'.He handles the lead vocals on most of the songs.Granted,his voice is not what it used to be,but he's still there,doing his thing.

paligap said:

When I used to see EW&F in concert in the 90s,I was really impressed with Sheldon and what he contributed to the band.He would sing the lead vocals on songs like "After The Love Is Gone" and he sounded great.Nobody can replace Maurice,but Sheldon was the perfect choice to share the lead vocals with Philip.Since he's been gone,I don't think their live performances are nearly as good.Plus,I think Sheldon totally "gets" EW&F and the whole concept.His Devoted Spirits CD of EW&F covers is just amazing.

PFunkjazz said:

poor Ralph,he gets no respect


Seriously,he is a percussionist who has been with the band since 1972.In concert these days,he mostly does background vocals.Makes sense,because EW&F has no shortage of percussionists and drummers,lol.He's a nice guy.He once saw something I wrote on an EW&F message board,and then emailed me to anwer my question

DavidEye said:

Speaking of the message board, I can't believe Startalk is still down!

DavidEye said:

Exactly! I hate to keep going back to Faces, but this is why I loved Raise so much. Faces doesn't have much funkiness IMO. With Raise we get a full healthy dose. One song from the album most people don't talk about is Changing Times. I love the funk/rock mix of that song. Great closing track.
[Edited 9/30/05 9:57am]