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Printablethesexofit said: MsLegs said:  Young bloke, you have no idea what you are talking about. So save the drama for your mama. Unlike your self, I am actually an musician and so you can save the melodramatic banter for the amatures.
[Edited 8/1/05 12:40pm] I didn't pull the colour card. But saying she is more famous then Prince because of skin colour is silly. Her music is more radio friendly, this has been said. And i play guitar and was in bands. So u better take my name out ur mouth  Young Bloke, what's so comical is you've graduated from pampers and now on to  ing into  and think you know something when you know nothing and still learning. Just sit back and relax  . Legs is here to be your teacher. There's no need to get uptight, it's only music.  [Edited 8/1/05 12:51pm] | |
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meltwithu said: madonna became huge for doing shocking things..showing her tits, racy videos, french kissing girls half her age.
 She was her own greatest  . You got to give her that. | |
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MsLegs said: meltwithu said: madonna became huge for doing shocking things..showing her tits, racy videos, french kissing girls half her age.
She was her own greatest . You got to give her that. imagine the fallout if Michael Jackson french kissed Bow Wow on Live tv whil Omarion watched you look better on your facebook page than you do in person  | |
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thesexofit said: I didn't pull the colour card. But saying she is more famous then Prince because of skin colour is silly. Her music is more radio friendly, this has been said. And i play guitar and was in bands. So u better take my name out ur mouth thesexofit: you can't take race completely out of any equation involving musical success. Much of Madonna's success has to do with her image and style. But one has to ask WHY her image and style was so provocative and successful. The fact she was a fair-haired, blue-eyed white female made her more of a sensation. I doubt America would have made her such an icon otherwise. One could make the argument that she's Elvis' true heir. No knock on Madonna, she's an indispensable part of 80's culture. In many ways she personified the 80's. She's a talented performer and she's played the game better than anyone in the rock era. I'm just stating what I believe to be facts. [Edited 8/1/05 13:18pm] Good night, sweet Prince | 7 June 1958 - 21 April 2016
Props will be withheld until the showing and proving has commenced. -- Aaron McGruder | |
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ElectricBlue said: Vanity 6 was around way before Madonna. But Madonna in 1985's MTV Music Awards wearing a Vanity 6/Prince Style Lingerie
Madonna was still wearing Breakdancer/Hip Hop Clothes when Prince & his ideas were into Lace. Both came out in '82.  | |
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meltwithu said: MsLegs said: She was her own greatest . You got to give her that. imagine the fallout if Michael Jackson french kissed Bow Wow on Live tv whil Omarion watched Better yet if R-Kelly kissed Omarion.  | |
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ElectricBlue said: WHY?
This is WHY. She is White! The White Media didn't want 2 Black Guys running MTV (Michael Jackson & Prince) so The Record Industry with the White Media promoted someone who did MJ's dancing & Prince sexual shock, like she was more or AS important then the 2 Black guys she was stealing from. 
This has been going on since Elvis & all the way up to now with Britney Spears.
They promote the "stealers" more then the creators.
Vanity 6 was around way before Madonna. But Madonna in 1985's MTV Music Awards wearing a Vanity 6/Prince Style Lingerie
Madonna was still wearing Breakdancer/Hip Hop Clothes when Prince & his ideas were into Lace. ----- Race is one part but, it is also because she is a woman. Tits and ass will always sell. | |
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namepeace said: thesexofit said: I didn't pull the colour card. But saying she is more famous then Prince because of skin colour is silly. Her music is more radio friendly, this has been said. And i play guitar and was in bands. So u better take my name out ur mouth thesexofit: you can't take race completely out of any equation involving musical success. Much of Madonna's success has to do with her image and style. But one has to ask WHY her image and style was so provocative and successful. The fact she was a fair-haired, blue-eyed white female made her more of a sensation. I doubt America would have made her such an icon otherwise. One could make the argument that she's Elvis' true heir. No knock on Madonna, I'm just stating what I believe to be facts.  | |
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laurarichardson said: ElectricBlue said: WHY?
This is WHY. She is White! The White Media didn't want 2 Black Guys running MTV (Michael Jackson & Prince) so The Record Industry with the White Media promoted someone who did MJ's dancing & Prince sexual shock, like she was more or AS important then the 2 Black guys she was stealing from.
This has been going on since Elvis & all the way up to now with Britney Spears.
They promote the "stealers" more then the creators.
Vanity 6 was around way before Madonna. But Madonna in 1985's MTV Music Awards wearing a Vanity 6/Prince Style Lingerie
Madonna was still wearing Breakdancer/Hip Hop Clothes when Prince & his ideas were into Lace. ----- Race is one part but, it is also because she is a woman. Tits and ass will always sell. As I said previouly in this thread, Madonna was her own . | |
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MsLegs said: thesexofit said: I didn't pull the colour card. But saying she is more famous then Prince because of skin colour is silly. Her music is more radio friendly, this has been said. And i play guitar and was in bands. So u better take my name out ur mouth Young Bloke, what's so comical is you've graduated from pampers and now on to ing into and think you know something when you know nothing and still learning. Just sit back and relax . Legs is here to be your teacher. There's no need to get uptight, it's only music.
[Edited 8/1/05 12:51pm]
I'm glad to see MsLegs give thesexofit a stern talking-to when he needs it (often). | |
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NouveauDance said: Saying it's soley an issue of race is ridiculous.
Comparing artists purely on sales shows nothing more than who sold most ("d'uh!" I hear you say). But they show nothing else - you can't compare an artist from the 60s to an artist now on sales figures, because the industry is a COMPLETELY different ball-game now as it was then - in terms of promotion, marketing, distribution, even socio-economic terms - EVERYTHING is completely different. So comparing artists based purely on sales figures, trying to acertain some sort of "quality of music" yardstick, it would be futile. Now as for why Madonna is more "famous" than Prince: Well, their careers run a parallel time-frame. I think what it comes down to is "fame". Prince wanted fame, but when he got it, he systematically hacked at it, and then when he'd hacked at it so much, he built it up again, and then he hacked at it all the more. The commercial success he had with Purple Rain, Prince could have rode that and even built on it by releasing record and record of crowd-pleasing/critic-pleasing records. We know this, because there was material from 1983/4/5 that he could have used to make a sort of Purple Rain II (an album of similar quality and sound). He CHOSE not to do this. He CHOSE to make ATWIAD, a record that is clearly at odds with the Rockstar Stadium guitar antics of Purple Rain, Let's Go Crazy - think of the energy of the first side of Purple Rain, and the energy of that of ATWIAD - completely different. Prince surely knew this record wouldn't be as well received by these new fans he'd picked up from the Purple Rain hype. He wanted no promotion for the record, no promo videos, just to slip it out. He released it VERY quickly after Purple Rain, and he could have rode the PR-hype for another year or two, release another single even with the promotion, and take the PR Tour around the world. He didn't. Why? I hazard an obvious guess that keeping that Purple Rain level of FAME was less important than what he could do with it (the freedom, the money, the success), now he had it. Releasing records with nude covers, building an expensive recording complex far away from the entertainment industry epicenters, changing his name to a kooky symbol, not giving interviews, battling his record company, dressing the way he does, writing lyrics about the things he does, not promoting a record till it's had 5/6 singles squeezed from it, releasing record after record every year. These aren't the actions of someone who solely wants fame and to be a popstar. Madonna is a VERY different artist. She has taken chances with her image, but those chances were gambles on FAME to gain more FAME. The Like A Prayer video is a great example, it's notoriety was due the controversy it created, but Madonna knew burning crosses and a Black Jesus would create such a reaction, so she used to get more fame and sell her records. Madonna's actions were geared towards selling records and keeping her fame status, not destroying it (although sometimes it's blown up her face, like the Sex Book, and the original American Life promo video). Comparisons can be made with Michael Jackson too (since those 3 are often compared against), and the same conclusion can be drawn - Michael wrang out his albums for all they were worth in terms of singles and videos, releasing records every few years, and capitalising, financially, on that one single album completely, before moving onto the next. Prince is the complete opposite, other than a couple of exceptions (PR and D&P) Prince has never really stuck with a project long enough to make it a huge commercial success, with 5 singles, a giant tour, professional looking promo videos, lots of TV appearances etc, etc. He has always got bored of a project and moved onto the next (often before the current one is even in the stores), under-promoted them, less physical singles, and less commercial singles (IIWYG for example). What is all this pontification getting at? 1) Fame is a meaningless yardstick for artistic or musical quality 2) Not comparing him to anyone else - Prince could have been A WHOLE LOT MORE commercially successful (and thus famous) than he was, but he, himself made sure this did not happen, for many reasons throughout his career, but it shows he has never considered commercial success his #1 priority. Phew! I can feel that coffee kicking in!
[Edited 8/1/05 1:06am] Excellent analysis.  
Some people tell me I've got great legs... | |
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VoicesCarry said: MsLegs said: Young Bloke, what's so comical is you've graduated from pampers and now on to ing into and think you know something when you know nothing and still learning. Just sit back and relax . Legs is here to be your teacher. There's no need to get uptight, it's only music.
[Edited 8/1/05 12:51pm]
I'm glad to see MsLegs give thesexofit a stern talking-to when he needs it (often).  | |
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meltwithu said: MsLegs said: She was her own greatest . You got to give her that. imagine the fallout if Michael Jackson french kissed Bow Wow on Live tv whil Omarion watched FUNNY AS HELL!!! :LOL:
Some people tell me I've got great legs... | |
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NouveauDance said: Prince wanted fame, but when he got it, he systematically hacked at it, and then when he'd hacked at it so much, he built it up again, and then he hacked at it all the more.
The commercial success he had with Purple Rain, Prince could have rode that and even built on it by releasing record and record of crowd-pleasing/critic-pleasing records. We know this, because there was material from 1983/4/5 that he could have used to make a sort of Purple Rain II (an album of similar quality and sound). Indeed. He admitted to such in an article that he could have made Purple Rain II if he'd chosen to do so. Only Prince has an ego such that he would do whatever he could to upstage himself at the peak of his fame. But I'm glad he did it. He CHOSE not to do this. He CHOSE to make ATWIAD, a record that is clearly at odds with the Rockstar Stadium guitar antics of Purple Rain, Let's Go Crazy - think of the energy of the first side of Purple Rain, and the energy of that of ATWIAD - completely different. Prince surely knew this record wouldn't be as well received by these new fans he'd picked up from the Purple Rain hype.
He wanted no promotion for the record, no promo videos, just to slip it out. He released it VERY quickly after Purple Rain, and he could have rode the PR-hype for another year or two, release another single even with the promotion, and take the PR Tour around the world. He didn't. Why? I hazard an obvious guess that keeping that Purple Rain level of FAME was less important than what he could do with it (the freedom, the money, the success), now he had it. Releasing records with nude covers, building an expensive recording complex far away from the entertainment industry epicenters, changing his name to a kooky symbol, not giving interviews, battling his record company, dressing the way he does, writing lyrics about the things he does, not promoting a record till it's had 5/6 singles squeezed from it, releasing record after record every year. These aren't the actions of someone who solely wants fame and to be a popstar. Tell it. Good night, sweet Prince | 7 June 1958 - 21 April 2016
Props will be withheld until the showing and proving has commenced. -- Aaron McGruder | |
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There's a lot of good points here, the main one being however that Prince did have the kind of success madonna did, with PR, he simply chose not to continue with it. Be it his own warped decision making, his conflicting instincts (how he craves success and hits, yet at the same time strives to put out music on his terms and follow his own path), or be it simply that he couldnt sustain the pace.
Look at madonna when she came out. That girl personified drive and ambition. Her whole is very much greater than the sum of her parts (no pun intended). She is not even half the musician or songwriter or performer prince is, yet in my opinion she is by far the greater star. I prefer prince's music on the whole, but again, i think she is by far the more iconic individual. Madonna is who she is because she always knows exactly where she's going. She makes a decision and goes with it. Sometimes its brilliant, othertimes it slaps her in the face, regardless she keeps on going. Money and fame are totally to do with it, but i do also think that she wants to make good pop art, and in that way i believe she has integrity as an artist. Not in the same sense as Prince, he is always about the music, but I believe madonna to be by far the more astute of the two, when it comes to making decisions. Both are instinctive but in different ways. In many ways they would compliment each other perfectly, Like a Lennon and McCartney for the 80's(although Love Song would totally contradict that statement) | |
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because Prince, at every turn, successfully manages to sabotage any lasting success he's able to scrape together.
Madonna, on the other hand, has masterfully built success upon success, and managed to build success out of her (relatively) few failues and mistakes. "I don't need your forgiveness, cos I've been saved by Jesus, so fuck you." | |
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Madonna one is the best pop music markerter out there. she's a genius and linger to much on her mistakes. AL fails she markets a GH tour but still plays 7 of the tracks from the album.
Madonna also writes some easy lyrics that people everywhere can relate to. that's what pop music is. fluff Madonna is a great producer. she can spot talent in others and bring it on board. she also has a great ear for pop music. she tones down alot of experintal stuff her producers might come up with and turns into pop. Madonna isn't afaird of her weaknesses and allows others to cover where she is lacking. Madonna gets out there and does the work... photoshoots, videos, interviews. award shows, parties, premiers. she keeps her name out there. Madonna has always wanted to be famous. it was her main goal. You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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Madonna is pop
Prince is music and we all know, the charts dont like real music Straight Jacket Funk Affair
Album plays and love for vinyl records. | |
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because she's smarter about marketing herself...duh! it's obvious. I'll leave it alone babe...just be me | |
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paisleypark4 said: Madonna is pop
Prince is music and we all know, the charts dont like real music  the best reply to a post ever!!!! | |
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better marketing....period.
Madonna is a part of the machine. | |
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squirrelgrease said: Who's this Madonna?
I was wondering the same thing! I keep seeing her name mentioned in this forum everyday,and yet I have no idea who she is | |
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DavidEye said: squirrelgrease said: Who's this Madonna?
I was wondering the same thing! I keep seeing her name mentioned in this forum everyday,and yet I have no idea who she is | |
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maddy is a great,powerful and strong woman,she deserve all she have, she have a difficult life when she was young ( her mother die when she was five) and she fight for be who she is.love or hated she don't let pepople indifferent. | |
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namepeace said:
I'd also add that Prince's prolific musical output saturated the market. He was not as calculating as Madonna or MJ as to "staggering" his releases, and proceeded to release an album a year, and as many as 3, in the 2 decades that followed. It was one thing to challenge your audience with new sounds. Add to that the fact that he bombarded the audience with new stuff at a dizzying pace, and the market simply got fatigued. It was amazing that he was able to have the kind of commercial success that he did. In the 1980s, the majority of the artists released an album a year. Even in Michael Jackson's case (before he became too damn big), if he didn't have an album of his own out, he was releasing one with his brothers. Almost everyone in those days released an album a year and Prince was no exception. If you took a year off, people started to wonder if you retired or they forgot about you. In Prince's year off in 1983, between "1999" and "Purple Rain", everyone was wondering where the hell Prince was because the magazines weren't reporting on the movie yet. Things were much different back then. Competion was much better and artists were constantly making new music. Also, albums were not milked for two and three years for every single to be released for as much money possible. If a song was released by the beginning of the school year in September, it was out of style by the time Christmas rolled around. In the 1990s, I remember hearing "Whomp There It Is" on the radio on a daily basis for three years. This would never have happened in the 1980s. As far as Prince releasing two and three album sets sometimes in the 1990s, if he didn't, I probably couldn't have made it through that decade because his music was the only thing to look forward to. Hell, I wish he had released an album a month in the 1990s. Andy is a four letter word. | |
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vainandy said: namepeace said:
I'd also add that Prince's prolific musical output saturated the market. He was not as calculating as Madonna or MJ as to "staggering" his releases, and proceeded to release an album a year, and as many as 3, in the 2 decades that followed. It was one thing to challenge your audience with new sounds. Add to that the fact that he bombarded the audience with new stuff at a dizzying pace, and the market simply got fatigued. It was amazing that he was able to have the kind of commercial success that he did. In the 1980s, the majority of the artists released an album a year. Even in Michael Jackson's case (before he became too damn big), if he didn't have an album of his own out, he was releasing one with his brothers. it was actually Michael Jackson and the success of Thriller that set off this trend. Gigantic album promoted with singles for 2 years straight, with a break to create demand. Madonna followed this formula (though in a much quicker cycle: a year's worth of singles, then a year off, after the first couple). much of the rest of the industry followed suit. seems to be settling back to the prior status quo, though. even with the big artists, it's 2 or 3 singles, and then it's over. unfortunately the megastars that thrived in the era of the 2-year mega-album formula haven't caught up with that fact, though. "I don't need your forgiveness, cos I've been saved by Jesus, so fuck you." | |
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Some o' u people r just so fooking anal
about the whole artist thing, playing 700 instruments & the flute with ur buttcheeks don't make u an artist it makes u a musician, there's a big difference. Prince doesn't have a fuck 2 say besides, whoo my ancestors were slaves, & now I got this 100 million dollars in the bank & all this mascara so I must b a slave 2. y'all act like Prince never wanted 2 b a star or famous. Man, that shit is seriously delusional. He played the whole fucking MTV & Radio game back in the day, & why did u think he made those fuck awful movies? The man wanted 2 b a star & acted every bit the part. Like, get real.. [Edited 8/3/05 3:48am] ...Your coochie gonna swell up and fall apart... | |
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crap , after Purple Rain he could've made the same kind of record , instead he chose not to | |
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paisleypark4 said: Madonna is pop
Prince is music and we all know, the charts dont like real music
so you're implying that Prince has never done "pop music"? | |
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Martinelli said: y'all act like Prince never wanted 2 b a star or famous.
Man, that shit is seriously delusional. He played the whole fucking MTV & Radio game back in the day, & why did u think he made those fuck awful movies? The man wanted 2 b a star & acted every bit the part. Like, get real..
So true.Prince is a musical genuis and all,but let's not pretend that he didn't want the fame and superstardom too. | |
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