Gangsta rap does absolutely nothing good for the African American community or for the hispanic community either.it further criminalizes the black male by constanly referring to him as a "thug" or "gangsta" and this artform is responsible for setting the civil rights movement 1000 years back, by bringing the scorn and disdain once associated with the word "nigger" back into popular culture. the word is now glorifed in hip- hop and rap. rap protaganists argue that by changing the spelling to "nigga" it's now okay.that is complete bullshit!! the spelling of the word does nothing to change the pain & suffering the use of that word has caused many generations.
The image of black women is now also corrupted thanks to this lovely artform. women are constantly refferrd to as "Bitches" & "hoes" and shows black women in videos who do nothing but shake their "bootys" and dance solaciously in night clubs with cold hardened criminals. the issue of female rapppers standing up for women and respect for women holds absolutely no merit when u have female rappers such as "Lil Kim", "Foxxy Brown" ,"Missy Elliot" & "Rah Digga" who themselves refer to other women in their records as 'Bitches & Hoes' and sometimes evem refer to themselves in such ways.
The gangsta rapper of today is many things; a criminal, an auto car collector , a specialist at naming the finest drinks & Desingers , a specialist at saying how much money they make and most inportantly a PIMP now, more than ever, the image of a pimp glorified to such a large extent that songs are even dedicated to it; such bedtime classics as "P.I.M.P" , "Im A PimP" , "Bitch Please" and who could forget nelly's "Pimp Juice". rappers don't even realize it but they influenece many ppl with actions. young black boys who listen to their records hear of a glamaorous lifestyle with luxury cars, plenty bitches & weed, the finest drinks and clothes and aspirie to be like them. could u imagine the fate of many young boys with people like "50 cent" & "Snoop Dog" for role models ??? i shudder to think.
all in all the "rap game" does nothing productive except sell records, while corrupting the view of the african american people either as a "ghetto ho" or a "Gangsta" even hip hop stars like destiny's child continue to corrupt peoples' minds with thier song "soldier" .it's lyrics elude that all black women want are
those street husslin-alcohol drinkin- drug sellin- thugs that hang around the corner-that dropped out o school- lookin like they gonna snacth ur jewellery when u pass- men and that initself is hjust ridiculos. the social and economic reppercutions of these actions are felt as ripple effects throuht the enitire african american community and do nothing good to raise the morale or help the black man or woman in any way if anything they set them back 1000 steps

I just wanted to be the first one to post on what will probably be a long and heated thread.

I disagree with you premise, but let me collect my thoughts.
[Edited 3/26/05 16:51pm]

that's a big paragraph.

hold on.
[Edited 3/26/05 16:51pm]

lilgish said:

I'm waiting

Rap was so much different 20 years ago. I could listen to it.

Now...

I agree with your basic premise - commercial mainstream rap largely presents 1 stereotypical image of each gender and that's all there is to it. These are not good images, either - maybe white America buys into this sort of stuff because it reinforces the stereotypes many of them have come to accept. More likely that it offers an escape for anyone of any race - into a glamorous world of high crime and sex that can easily be shut off at any time. It's sonic porn.

Xavier23 said:

very interesting...


I forget to say, I love gangsta rap...

VoicesCarry said:

you have an interesting point of view. I didn't think of a reason why white america is so much into the present hip hop state of mind.

Basically on the radio are only songs that would make into a club, when about 15 years ago, the club songs were just what they were, only played in a club, which made them "hot".

But now we have teenagers who look at these videos everyday after school trying to look like these "images" that the artists (who are controlled by the record companies) portray. They don't know that only the "rich" can afford these items they see in these videos, and the "rich" community isn't even the average person. The average person is at Hecht's or Macy's trying to find a sale so that they can use their extra 20% off coupon on merchandise to save money.

Another reason why is because for teenagers and young adults who are in still in the childish "immature" stage, they must be the first ones with the new album blasting out of their car. Its like when the Jordans come out every so often, they buy them so that they can be the "first" to sport them to school, work, the club, wherever, so that the next guy who can't afford it can say "damn he/she got them new Jordans on, they hot!" Well, when you are the first one with the 50 cent cd, the Chingy cd, the Cassidy cd, they you are considered "top notch". I know it sounds dumb, but thats how it is in some situations.

missfee said:

It's hard to say, because now teens have more money at their disposal than ever. With 50 Cent selling 1 million plus records in the first week, is there really that much cachet associated with "having" the album first anymore? Certainly back in the 60's you were golden if you were the first one on the block to afford the new Beatles LP. But things are different now, and kids are spending frivolously.

I think the status symbol is more the image, and the music is just an accessory to that image.

VoicesCarry said:

true.

I think what's worse is when a hip-hop star does try to move away from the *keeping it real* bull, people automatically condemn them for selling out.

Why?

That's always been my question.

Rap/hip-hop originally started out as being fun. It was party music.

procrastination101 said:

It was also beautiful message music. That still exists, but it is shunned by the mainstream. However, the exclusion of anything "deep" on the radio doesn't apply only to rap.

[/img]http://rds.yahoo.com/S=96062857/K=50+cent/v=2/SID=w/l=II/R=6/SS=i/OID=18661222b07103b8/SIG=1huvupej4/EXP=1111975061/*-http%3A//images.search.yahoo.com/search/images/view?back=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.search.yahoo.com%2Fsearch%2Fimages%3Fp%3D50%2Bcent%26sm%3DYahoo%2521%2BSearch%26fr%3DFP-tab-img-t%26toggle%3D1&h=500&w=348&imgcurl=www.poster.net%2F50-cent%2F50-cent-portrait-6500088.jpg[img]

First off, Gangsta Rap is a form of Hiphop, so there’s really no need to disassociate one from the other. I hope you understand many hip-hop artists have dealt with the issues you’ve mentioned; why that form of hip-hop is no longer successful is a conversation that probably merits a thread on the Politics and Religion forum.

Nigga’s, Thugs, Pimps, Hoes, and other assorted low life individuals have existed within the Black community for the last century and are basically a byproduct of the inequity of Jim Crow, and the failed promises of Reconstruction. In the past, the aforementioned individuals were shunned, an embarrassment to any family—the people who were drugged out on the street Sunday morning while decent families were going to church (yea, I’m lifting this from Baldwin, but so what.) Nowadays being a low life seems to be a badge of honor, a prerequisite to being Black. Has modern Hip-Hop created this? No, but I think it’s the number one reinforcer of this evil. Therefore, I agree with

your statement

The Self Deprecation and nihilism that is typified in modern hip-hop is of an unhealthy nature. I agree with you on this; Negative Hip-hop reinforces Black self-hatred, there’s no doubt about that, I feel that you’re overstating the importance of hip-hop music as it relates to the problems of Black life though. It would be laughable to suggest that G.G Allin or Marilyn Manson set back the advancement of European society (though some idiot might try to.) These issues go beyond music and will most likely be solved by people who aren’t commercial artist.
[Edited 3/26/05 18:15pm]

The future of black America lies before you

not all hip hop is bad though....you must point that out too.

i totally agree with this



i don't agree with this


the art form has NOTHING to do with how the image of black women is..it has more 2 do with the women themselves...noone is forcing them to do what they do..and this goes for hispanics, asians, and whites 2

i agree with this


i agree with this, but to certain extent. yea this all corrupts the image aof blacks/hispanics and makes people think certain things about us..BUT at the end of the day its their choice to think that..i can excuse a child for believin the hype, but only to a certain extent. but an adult with a fully formed and workin brain cannot be excused cuz they don't have 2 believe everything they see and hear.

Xavier23 said:

you are truly as ignorant as the title of the post if u actualy think that what hip-hop music represents is a true representation of African-Americans. if hip-hop does nothing good for blacks then i guess white people are screwed with that whole 'rock & roll' thing...

You forget that there's more to in Hip-Hop than all the gangsta and the bling-bling and the spinning rims. What about the rappers that are trying to say something positive and prfound like Outkast, Blackalicious, De La Soul, Q-tip, Common, A Tribe Called Quest, The Roots, etc.

There's taht kind of Hip-Hop that can enlighten and empower people, and then there's just the mainstream stuff that the "man" wants to impose on urban America to create negativity.

TheBoyfromtheBand said:

well that certainly is the image that is spread of african americans to any one who watches "bet" or "mtv". i don't live in the U.S and i can tell u for sure that all the images we get here in the caribbean are like the ones i described above. so call me ignorant if u wish, but neither my ignorance nor your perceived insight will change the perceptions of african americans caused by Gangsta Rap

It's a sad day when kids listen to music then go to school saying "Move, bitch, get out the way...".

Black girls watch the vids and just think they're nothing but hoes and baby machines. They need Prince to tell them they need Pussy Control. Gangsta rap makes black men feel like they need to live to prove their masculinity. That could mean impregnating as many women as possible or not allowing someone to say "yo mama" without catching a bullet in the face.

Everyone reading this thread needs to see Spike Lee's movie BAMBOOZLED. Rappers are just minstrels for everyone to laugh at. Look at Flava Flav on MTV.

This is why black people are so stagnant. The images young black kids see of other black people on TV is what they unconscious try to be. NBA stars and inmates.

In the ghetto, black men are more interested in souping up their Escalades than feeding their 4 kids and wife.

It's annoying how corporate it all is too. Everyone's got on a basketball jersey. Nelly's Air Force One video was just a Nike commercial. They can't go to any award ceremonies dressed like everyone else. JZ and P Diddy have sweatshops in South America.

Gangsta rap has so shaped the image of black men such that non-gangstas like me have no where to fit in. I'm not black enough for black people and I'm just a confusion to everyone else. And I'm not thug enough for the black girls either.

Gangsta rap undoes everything that Civil Rights leaders, feminists, progressives, environmentalists, and so many others have dedicated their lives for.

Fuck Tupac. Fuck Biggie. I'm glad they're dead.
[Edited 3/27/05 14:09pm]

Blame the record companies. They force artists to do that so they can sell the records. They have to now and days. The last real song that was a hit was probably Nas' "I Can". It made me think and appreciate him even more for making a commercial tune that was real.

One of the few commercial artists that is over-looked now and days, especailly this last album, very good.



But anyway...what du u feel about ROCK albums? WHAT ARE THEY TALKING ABOUT!!??


When I wash dishes at work and them boys be listening to that hard rock shit..im like (thinking to myself I gotta get out of here, or I cant wait until they leave).

paisleypark4 said:

I'm not too convinced by most of these rappers who do nice songs like "I Can". I'm not talking necessarily about Nas, but it appears to me like they take turns doing a nice socially conscious song so to impress the critics. Most of the time it isn't sincere. People buy the album expecting it all to be about change and positive messages, but then they buy it and it's really just the same old same old. Tupac is a classic example. For all the thoughtful songs he wrote, there are twice as many that are just regular rap about fucking bitches and loafing around wasting life with the other triflin niggas.

There's very little "rock" that I ever liked. It really isn't much different. Most of the music I like is non-lyrical. Pat Metheny, Paul Hardcastle and the Jazzmasters, Acoustic Alchemy, etc. and a few vocalists like Prince, Al Jarreau, and a few others.
[Edited 3/27/05 0:20am]

doctamario said:

I guess some of them try to have the best of both to appeal to different tastes. i do like some of both. Though like on Common's "Electric Circus" the track produced by the Neptunes where he was just talkin shit...I wasnt feelin that. Like he was trying too hard or something. Now like...the Game album. If he was talking all that trying to be positive stuff I'd be like "fool quit tryin so hard"...

I guess only certain artists can have a happy medium. Especially a rapper.

I'm not saying that rap needs to be all happy and uplifting, because that's bullshit. I just don't like gangsta rappers frontin like they actually give a damn when they really don't.

Hove is back, life stories told through rap
Niggaz actin' like I sold you crack
Like I told you sell drugs...no...
Hove did that so hopefully you won't have to go through that

-Jay-Z, "H To The Izzo"

it is disheartening 2 listen 2 kids as young as 5 years old (or younger) saying some stuff like what up nigga?...kids who dont know the differnece between ignorance and stupidity, but they know that the female they are trying 2 holla at is a ho or a bitch

it isnt entirely their fault though...its what they have learned, so it goes back 2 positive role models and positve imagery. however, the media does not want show minorities in a positive manner 4 the most part...by showing the negative images, negative stereotypes are perpetuated and the cycle continues. s change does need 2 happen, but it needs 2 happen on a higher level...untile then, it needs 2 start with u and me

and yes, there are artists who do do positive things with their music and send postive messages, but it doesnt show up mainstream as often it should...in my opinion

So you believe the images of black women, regardless if some women have decided that they will take on these images, is therefore ok and healthy? So its ok to criticize and analyze the images of black and hispanic men in these videos but not women? So they fact that most of the time the male artists, directors, etc. decide the treatment of the video and they decide the images of the women in the video, they get a pass because there are women who want to fill the role of the stripper, hoe, bitch? I'm not saying there is no responsiblity on the females part BUT to completely dismiss the negative images of women in videos is a little bit scary.


Interesting.

I have been telling folk this for years, but it seems that the majority of people are only interested in "fitting" in with society. Funny, because that used to be the opposite of what hip-hop stood for. The last thing we wanted to do was to fit-in with what the rest of the world was doing. But money is a cruel master. Why accept the terminology and ideology of this counterfeit "hip-hop" lifestyle? No pioneer of rap had ever envisioned hip-hop turning out this way. It's interesting to see how rich record label executives have taken over yet another form of black self-expression and have "pimped" its culture by using unintelligent artists to spearhead their propaganda. Making a lot of money does not make you an accomplished musician. It is the fruitage in which you bear as an artist that will identify you as to either being a positive or negative role model. Again, the visuals we see have eternal lasting images that hypnotize our youth into bad mannerism's. It is sad to see.

There have always been negative images and stereotypes but they did not dominate everything like they do today. Not only has hip hop taken over the music scene but it also is movies, sitcoms, and television commercials. The ones making real money of this mess are white men in business suits. They have made these thug idiots their clowns and they are laughing their asses all the way to the bank.

I used to wonder why white people were not offended by it because some of it has a lot of anger towards white people. When you really think about it, a white racist would love this anger and would be happy that they are angry. They also love to see black people calling each other "nigger" and as far as changing the spelling to "nigga", they love this even more because it's supposed to make the word "acceptable". White racists are also loving these thug images and crime glamorized. And as far as the fools "keeping it real", the white racists are really loving that. They see it as "the niggers staying in their place" in a crime infested ghetto and not daring to venture out of it into their world.

There are black men in business suits that cannot catch a cab. What do you think these thug images are doing for that? It is setting progress back.

These idiots need to wake up because they are the white racists' "clown" and they are being made fools of, being conned and ripped off, and are basically a fucking joke. This reminds me of the old days of "black face" entertainment. It's rediculous.