The other thread was great, and you can still reference it here ... but it appears we need another thread cuz the first one got too damned long!

So let's continue the discussion on this one.

Thanks to all who made the other thread interesting and worthy of the sticky... let's keep it up.



(I thought this was worthy of listing it at the top.)


Michael Jackson Trial Cheat Sheet
Fri Feb 25, 8:45 PM ET Entertainment - E! Online Gossip/Celeb
By Joal Ryan

It's been two years in the making. Potential guest-star appearances by Elizabeth Taylor and Macaulay Culkin. A showdown between a pair of old foes.

Even in a media age flush with celebrity trials, and trials that make celebrities of its defendants, the Michael Jackson case stands alone.

Opening arguments are scheduled for Monday in Santa Maria, California, in the music legend's child-molestation trial.

Here's a synopsis of the drama and its players.

The Defendant: Michael Joseph Jackson, 46, father of three, ex-husband of two, winner of 13 Grammys, including one for Best Recording for Children in honor of his narration for the storybook album E.T. the Extra-Terrestrial.

The Accuser: A boy, identified in court documents as John Doe, now 15, from Los Angeles, who, at age 11, had his left kidney and spleen removed because of cancer.

The Charges: A 10-count grand-jury indictment was handed down against Jackson on Apr. 21, 2004. In it, the singer was accused of committing lewd acts with the boy, then 13 (five counts), serving him alcohol (four counts) and conspiring to hold the child and his family against their will (one count). The indictment superseded a nine-count criminal complaint filed against Jackson on Dec. 18, 2003.

Jackson's Charge Against the Charges: The singer and his team have branded the allegations a "big lie," "disgusting," "totally false" and the criminal probe the result of a D.A. "blinded by zeal." Jackson formally pleaded innocent to the indictment on Apr. 30, 2004, and pleaded innocent to the earlier criminal complaint on Jan. 16, 2004. He is free on $3 million bail.

Jackson's Most Metaphorical Charge Against the Charges: "Lies run sprints, but the truth runs marathons," as excerpted from a Jackson statement of Nov. 20, 2003.

The Stakes: If convicted on all 10 counts, Jackson faces upward of 20 years in prison.

The Prosecutor: Thomas W. Sneddon Jr., 63, married father of nine, district attorney of Santa Barbara County, California, since 1983. Known as "Mad Dog" to courtroom adversaries, "Snuffy" to friends and "Dom Sheldon" to Jackson, who serenaded the D.A. in the 1995 song, "D.S.," featuring the lyrics "Dom Sheldon is a cold man," although as sung, the refrain sounds suspiciously like, "Tom Sneddon is a cold man."

The Bad Blood Between Jackson and Sneddon Explained: Sneddon led the 1993-94 child-molestation investigation against Jackson. That case was based on allegations made by a 12-year-old boy. Sneddon dropped the case when the child stopped cooperating with his office.

The Defense Attorney: Thomas A. Mesereau Jr., 54, namesake partner in the Los Angeles law firm of Collins, Mesereau & Reddock. At Harvard, boxed and earned his undergraduate degree. Previously helped pugilist Mike Tyson fend off a 2001 rape allegation and represented murder defendant Robert Blake (news) for three months before parting ways with the actor in February 2004 and signing up with Jackson, who parted ways with Mark Geragos in April 2004.

The Judge: Rodney S. Melville, 63, presiding over Department SM2 in the Cook Division of the Santa Barbara County Superior Court in Santa Maria. The anti-Judge Ito, Melville has ordered all participants in the Jackson case to shut up or be held in contempt, banned cameras from the courtroom, sealed grand-jury testimony and resisted releasing documents to the public and press until they've been Sharpie'd beyond comprehension.

The Jury: Eight men, four women, ranging in age from 79 to 20. The majority of the jurors appear to be white and Hispanic. There is one Asian and no blacks, although an African-American man is among the eight alternates. (Santa Barbara County, where Jackson's Neverland Ranch is located, is predominately white, with just a five percent African-American population.) Work-wise, Jackson's designated peers include a pair of store clerks, a pair of retirees, a horse trainer, a wheelchair-bound man who once visited Neverland as a child and an employee with the county's Social Services Department.

The Guest Stars: Names broached as potential defense witnesses include: Elizabeth Taylor, Eddie Murphy, Chris Tucker, Rush Hour director Brett Ratner, Thriller producer Quincy Jones (news), Jay Leno, basketball star Kobe Bryant, illusionist David Blaine (news - web sites), 60 Minutes stalwart Ed Bradley and former child stars Macaulay (Home Alone) Culkin and Emmanuel (Webster) Lewis. Corey Feldman (news), a former child star in his own Goonies right, has been subpoenaed by the prosecution. Feldman told ABC News that Jackson showed him naked pictures of women when he was a teen. In the courtroom seats, look for a sizable number of Jacksons, from parents Joseph and Katherine to siblings Janet and Jermaine.

The Bystanders: The Santa Maria courthouse is flanked most days by reporters and a hard-core mix of Michael Jackson fans, Michael Jackson impersonators, Michael Jackson button-selling entrepreneurs and children's-book author and anti-child-abuse activist Diane Hansen, of Redondo Beach, California, who wears a yellow rain slicker and shouts, "Those are my private parts!" over and over again thereby vexing Michael Jackson fans, impersonators and button-selling entrepreneurs.

Trial Moment to Watch For: The day Jackson's accuser takes the stand. Per Judge Melville's ruling, the boy must testify in open court and face the man he once called "Daddy Michael."

Trial Moment to Possibly Skip Altogether: The day Jackson's accuser takes the stand. If his trial testimony is anything like the grand-jury testimony, it will be full of squirm-inducing details. According to documents posted by the Smoking Gun, the boy has said Jackson got him drunk, masturbated him and then showed him the hamper in which to deposit his stained Hanes.

The Comedy Club Connection: Jackson and his accuser were hooked up by Jamie Masada, owner of Los Angeles' Laugh Factory. Masada was trying to bolster the spirits of the then ill child by introducing him to celebrities. Jackson first spoke to the boy by telephone while the child was hospitalized and undergoing chemotherapy, the accuser told the grand jury.

The TV Special That Started It All: Living with Michael Jackson, a British-produced documentary by journalist Martin Bashir. The two-hour program aired on ABC on Feb. 6, 2003, and attracted an audience of 27.1 million. In it, Jackson holds hands with his future accuser and talks of how he sleeps with children--in an innocent and nonsexual way.

The Allegation Timeline: Within a week of its broadcast, social workers in Los Angeles launch a Jackson investigation. The case is closed and charges of sexual abuse declared "unfounded" when the boy and his family insist Jackson has done nothing wrong. The Santa Barbara Sheriff's Department, which later led the charge against Jackson, initially reaches a similar conclusion, according to Celebrity Justice. But then, per the indictment, the molestation and under-age-alcohol-imbibing occurs between Feb. 20 and Mar. 12, 2003--weeks after Living with Michael Jackson first aired. The conspiracy plot allegedly was carried out from Feb. 1 to Mar. 31, 2003.

The Day All Hell Broke Loose: On Nov. 18, 2003, police swarmed Jackson's Neverland Ranch, seizing 300 items. A day later, Santa Barbara County authorities issued a warrant for Jackson's arrest.

The Underpants Raid: Items reputedly seized at Neverland and other locations for potential use as evidence include: adult magazines, books and DVDs, which, per a ruling by Judge Melville, must be referred to as "sexually explicit" and not pornographic during trial; two pairs of Jackson-worn Calvin Klein briefs; and letters from Jackson to members of his Rubberhead Club for boys.

The Porn, Sorry, Sexually-Explicit Connection: The prosecution is expected to argue that Jackson enticed the boy at the center of the case by showing him pictures of naked women.

The Libation Allegation: According to the accuser's grand-jury testimony, Jackson got him woozy on "Jesus Juice" (white wine in a Diet Coke can), Skyy vodka and Jim Beam. A former Jackson flight attendant told the grand jury that the entertainer indeed preferred his vino served in soda cans and his vineyard of choice was "yucky Kendall Jackson."

The Mugshot: After flying in from Las Vegas (a chartered excursion that resulted in lawsuits and a criminal probe when it was discovered a hidden video camera had been rolling), Jackson surrendered to police on Nov. 20, 2003. He was handcuffed, fingerprinted and seated for a booking photo that quickly proved itself a must-click and helped crash the Santa Barbara County Sheriff's Department's Website.

The Matter of "Doo-Doo": In a Dec. 28, 2003, interview on 60 Minutes, Jackson told Ed Bradley he was "manhandled" by sheriff's deputies and locked in a "doo-doo"-smeared restroom on the day of his arrest. Later, California's attorney general's office said Jackson's claims couldn't be proved.

The Distinction Between "Doo-Doo" and "Doo-Doo Head": Per Jackson, "doo-doo" is bad when smeared on walls. According to his accuser's grand-jury testimony, "doo-doo head" is a term of endearment as used by Jackson toward the boy and others. The phrase was coined by Macaulay Culkin.

The Arraignment-a-Go-Go: Jackson's first courtroom appearance, on Jan. 16, 2004, was more party-like than procedural. In rock-star fashion, Jackson arrived 20 minutes late and, after pleading innocent to the original criminal complaint, boogied atop his stretch SUV. Later, he bussed fans to Neverland for "refreshments."

Something You Didn't Know About the Santa Maria Courthouse: It's adjacent to a children's ball field.

Potential Prosecution Problem: The accuser, his family--and their credibility. The singer's camp has long portrayed the Does as being on the make for money. Items the defense seem certain to mention in court: the 1999 lawsuit against JC Penney in which the accuser's mother alleged she was fondled by a security guard while being investigated for shoplifting (the $3 million case was settled out of court); and the 1996 claim by the accuser, then seven, that his mother beat him--an allegation MSNBC reported later was recanted by the boy.

Potential Defense Problem: The $25 million Jackson paid out in the 1990s to "buy peace" and settle two molestation claims. Under California law, jurors can be informed of prior child-abuse allegations against a defendant, even if the allegations were never proved. Items the prosecution seem certain to mention in court: the $23 million settlement with the family of the boy from the 1993-94 case; and the $2 million offered to the family of a former Neverland worker whose son said Jackson touched him.

What Geraldo Thinks: Fox News correspondent Geraldo Rivera, who conducted a TV interview with Jackson this month, said he believes the entertainer is "innocent" and the case against him "fatally flawed." Rivera is so certain Jackson will be cleared that the fair and balanced telejournalist has vowed to shave his mustache if his pal is convicted.

Where LaToya Stands: Like Rivera, LaToya Jackson (news) thinks her sibling is "innocent." Per an interview with 20/20, she also thinks he's "sweet" and "misunderstood."

What the Former Mrs. Jacksons Have to Say: Ex-wife number one, Lisa Marie Presley (news), told an Australian talk show in 2004 that she ended their 1994-96 marriage because she was "seeing things going on that I couldn't do anything about." She later clarified her remarks, noting she was not referring to Jackson acting inappropriately with children. Meanwhile, ex-wife number two, Debbie Rowe, has declined all comment on the case. The mother of two of Jackson's three children, though, is said to be gearing up for a custody battle with her former husband and is on the list of potential prosecution witnesses.

Why R. Kelly Probably Won't Be Spotted in Court: In January 2004, R&B singer R. Kelly, facing his own child-pornography case, was granted court approval to go to Los Angeles for the Grammy Awards--provided he didn't meet up with Jackson while he was in town. Kelly and Jackson collaborated on a song for Jackson's Number Ones release, "One More Chance," but Kelly's attorney said his client had no intention of trading notes with the pop star at the awards show.

Why Edward Moss Will Be Spotted in Court: Moss is the 27-year-old actor and Michael Jackson stand-in hired by E! and British Sky Broadcasting to portray the entertainer in a series of trial reenactments, beginning with opening arguments. The Michael Jackson Trial, brought to you in part by Judge Melville's no-cameras-in-the-courtroom edict, is scheduled to air on E! on weeknights at 7:30 p.m. (ET/PT), with a weekend wrap-up show airing each Saturday. (E! Online is a division of E! Networks.)

Thanks June, the other one was taking 4ever to open

I heard that... and I have DSL!

So we are still in jury selection and we are already on a second thread???!

Obsessive!!!!

It's hard for me to read long threads, My browser won't take the time to open a large thread. Is there anyway to change the browser settings.
[Edited 2/20/05 16:28pm]

come on people, where's the pictures already?

I want to see some new pictures.

Is he still dressed in virgin white?

Did Latoya dance on top his limo to promote
her upcoming dance album?

share. share.

Great, it sure was wayyyyy too long!

PLEASE don't post any pictures, they take ages to load as the thread gets longer. Just give the links

I'm really not keeping up with this. I hope MJ (and everybody, for that matter) geta a fair trial, but everyone seems to have a made-up mind already.

I've been an MJ fan since I dropped from the womb, and I've heard and remember all the rumors (as far back as the first one that he takes hormone pills to keep his voice high), all the lies MJ himself told (which is why I don't listen to damned thing he ever says), the face butchering, etc. I don't care about any of this. All I've ever cared about is the voice, the moves, and the music. Guilty or innocent, that will never change for me.

Tomorrow there will be pictures again! (unless he has another emergency, of course )

its bout time Mods
but anywayz here we go

NamePeace looks like i owe you a COMPLETE APOLOGY
you where absolutely correct!

Prosecution Motion To Show Interviews

Michael Jackson's "admissions" in a pair of TV interviews that he shared his bedroom with young boys help prove him guilty of child molestation and should be shown to jurors at his trial, prosecutors argued in court papers released on Thursday.

Prosecutors say remarks Jackson made in the documentary and later on CBS' "60 Minutes" that he shared his bedroom with his young accuser -- identified in court as "John Doe" -- and the boy's brother amounts to evidence of his guilt.

"Defendant's statement that he has slept with young boys is admissible as corroboration of the Doe brothers' allegation that he slept with them," prosecutors argue in their 17-page motion, which was unsealed by the court on Thursday. "Certainly the admission that he has slept with many boys clearly shows his willingness to sleep with boys."

In the documentary, Jackson describes sharing his bedroom with his young accuser and adds: "I have slept in a bed with many children. I slept in the bed with all of them. When (actor) Macaulay Culkin was little (his brother) Kieran Culkin would sleep on this side, Macaulay Culkin was on this side, his sisters in there. We would all just jam in the bed."

In a December 2003 interview, Jackson says that "of course" it is acceptable for him to share his bed with children, adding that he is not a pedophile or murderer and that he does so only out of love.

- Reuters

This Whole Investigation is based on that damn interview
I thought, it went deeper than that,
Looks like im wrong...

Damn Uri Geller for convincing MJ to do that interview

In2 said:

Uri Geller Told MJ to Do the Interview With Bashir, He's a Key wittness
as for the rest
I believe they are character Wittnesses
People who's stayed with, friends with and know him personally

MJ's Famous, he knows alot of famous people,
It would be no different, if you where on trial and needed your own friends to describe you, and to be charachter wittnesses

Molestation Cases, When their is no evidence, to prove by either side,
using relies on Charachter

Even JAY LENO IS THERE!
who is nooooo friend of jackson, in fact he's quick to make a joke about him every chance he gets( thats mostly all his material)

He's going to probably be used as an example on how Jacksons bad name has lasted throughout the years

Sorry if this so obvious but what could he of seen? Good they still hang out sometimes though.

Maybe Stevie will say that gavin and Mike were "just good friends"
[Edited 2/21/05 15:43pm]
[Edited 2/22/05 3:19am]

In2 said:

Nah, Macaulay wouldn't make a good witness, would he? Makes ya wonder...



"Don't abuse children, or else they turn out like me."
[Edited 2/21/05 16:29pm]

Snap said:[quote]

In2 said:

lol
I don't think that was mj who did that
I think Divorcing your parent equals to that

I think a Child Abuse Victim of MJ, would grow up to be something like this :
http://www.kinoweb.de/fil...ix/ln6.jpg

[oversized pic edit - June7]

I don't mind pictures per se, but irrelevant and oversized pictures in a thread that will be 100+ posts in no time, show some restraint people!

What pedophile would admit to have shared a bed with a child? To me that fact that he´s not afraid to admit it shows quite the contrary and that is that he has NOTHING to hide.

Judge Refuses to Cite Gag Order Violation Against Martin Bashir


Created: Monday, 21 February 2005

Judge Melville denied the request for a contempt citation against journalist Martin Bashir, who produced the documentary "Living With Michael Jackson" in 2003 and in the past week followed up with two more TV specials which clearly seems to violate the gag order imposed by the judge to assure Michael Jackson a fair trial.
Court documents released Friday do not give a reason for the judge’s decision on the defense request, which argued that Bashir violated the court's gag order prohibiting him, as a witness, from making public statements in the 46-year-old pop star's child molestation case.

In the documentary, Martin Bashir spoke to key witnesses about subject matter that pertains to this case. Additionally, Martin Bashir uses video tape and audio tape from the 1993 case, which the judge has suspended making a decision upon using in this trial. The audio tape includes the 1993 accuser talking to a psychologist about the specifics of the case.

Bashir had argued that he was exempt from the gag order as a journalist, even though he is a witness in the case. However, in the American ideal of aspiring to give every citizen a fair trial, it would be reasonable to assume that this did not include the permission for Bashir to attempt to ‘try’ the case in the public forum, including interviewing key witnesses and presenting evidence still under consideration.

Also circumspect, is Martin Bashir’s and ABC’s decision to include paid interviews from a British TV documentary mixed with its own original reporting in the prime-time special about Michael Jackson.

In an unusual disclaimer run twice during Thursday's two-hour special, ABC said its program contained "excerpts from a documentary made by a British production company" and that "some of the individuals who appeared in that documentary received compensation for their participation." ABC-produced segments were interspersed with the British footage throughout the special and the program did not specify which interviews had been paid for and which had not.

The disclaimer added: "No payment was made for any of the interviews conducted by (ABC News correspondent) Martin Bashir or ABC News."

Some observers suggested that ABC was trying to have it both ways by assuring the public that it adheres to more stringent standards of American journalism while disclosing its inclusion of interviews paid for by others.

Bryce Nelson, a journalism professor at the University of Southern California, said "The reason ABC ... has a policy of not paying (for interviews) is they think it changes the content of the material," Nelson said. "If people are being paid, there's always the incentive to exaggerate to make it a better story, or to make it more clear than it actually is."

The defense request noted that Jackson has obeyed the gag order. "Other witnesses should show the court the same respect," it said.

The defense also accused Bashir of inducing another witness, actor Corey Feldman, to violate the gag order for a TV program presented by Bashir. It asked for sanctions against Bashir.

Other documents released Friday show the prosecution also filed a motion opposing a defense bid to "balance" the effect of the Bashir video by showing jurors a compilation of early Jackson performances, interviews with him and his family and scenes of children frolicking at Neverland.

The prosecution said the "fawning tribute" does not contain any discussion of Jackson allowing boys to sleep in his bed and is not relevant.

Jackson has pleaded not guilty to the charges.

Jury selection is scheduled to resume Tuesday, February 22, 2005.


Source: MJJsource / AP / Reuters

This is NOT FAIR!!! Cause noone can deny that MJ has actually RESPECTED that gag order! All the prosecution transcripts always get leaked etc.! This is NOT FAIR!!

dag said:

...
its 93 all over again
Defense is losing all their motions
if prosecution wins motion to use the interviews,and mj's finances i'll shout foul play...
[Edited 2/22/05 8:26am]

First pictures of today (mondag 22/02).
He's still looking a bit pale

SpcMs said:

You know he wouldn't look so bad if his chin didn't make him look like a reject from planet of the apes

he needs to EAT BETTER, fill in those cheek bones
Damn Deepak Chopra for convincing mike to go Vegan

then he needs to get a hair cut!
then he needs to fix his eyebrows or whatever they are
they make him look Japanese,

And if you think he looks pale now, imagine him without all that make-up

THE HORROR!!!!!


but he's dressing better, glad to see he got rid of that f*cking arm band
thats actually a very nice suit

but that smile has got to go,
is it me or does he look like The Joker?
its really creeping me out

Luv4oneanotha said:

Much of the damage is irreversible. Barring a guilty verdict, his self-mutilation is the most tragic thing he's done, IMHO.

namepeace said:

No i think it can be reversed, im not sure about his nose...
but im pretty sure they can reconstruct his face... if he wanted it...
The skeletol Structure is stll entact, so his face can be reconstructed,
the only thing im not sure is the nose, which could be extremely fragile

Luv4oneanotha said:

U know more than I, so that sounds reasonable.

Unfortunately, I think he may have irreversibly damaged his health with the skin lightening, et al.

namepeace said:

Well if he indeed Chemically "Lightened His skin color" it can always be reversed

Modern Skin Lighteners have to be taken periodically over a span of say 2 monthes

Every two monthes he needs to get shot up with skin lightner
its never permanent

That would mean he would still be on skin lighteners

When he stops using them they then he will return to his born color,
after 6 monthes of non usage


If he where to destroy his skin cells by his own volition, it would be chemically toxic, and kill him

because the skin is a livinga breathing entity, if you remove the color permanently it is very volatile to your own health, and you could very well die from the toxic poison needed to destroy the pigment

Thats why i was a firm believer that he has Vitiligo, its the only Logical Explanation that i could come up with, He had vitiligo and underwent a process of De-pigmentation , to speed up the process

Vitiligo leads to a pale like skin color, which is what he has
Conventional skin lighteners can never do that much damage


If he did "bleach" his skin color, im curious to know how he did it
because that would indeed arouse my medical curiousity

dag said:

What sinner doesn't want to be understood and have their actions justified?
[Edited 2/22/05 20:18pm]

Snap said:

wtf does that mean!
don't get all biblical now!

This isnt NAMBLA, he's not saying its ok to engage in sexual acts with children

he merely said it was fine to share the same bed, 2 very different things

i don't wtf was that you came up with...

-Tao

SpcMs said:

He will always look pale,i dont even think a tanning bed would help him! LoL

I am not sure if he can tan because of vitiligo. He sure can´t tan outside,but if they can use tanning bed, I don´t know.

dag said:

He's a Preverbial vampire
Ultraviolet rays can kill him, thus the umbrella man is always by his side(it isn't because of pure laziness, that would be P-diddy)

Sun rays can also damage more of his skin and cause to have a higher risk of skin cancer

he def needs a high prescription of sun block