GrayKing said:

Translation: "I'm up against a wall, with nowhere to turn."

VoicesCarry said:

no, what i'm saying is that an album comprised of 70 minutes worth of love songs that all sound the same is pretty generic in 2004.

GrayKing said:

Glad we got away from the generalizations.

VoicesCarry said:

the album's a boring piece of shit, what else do you want from me?

GrayKing said:

I don't care, glad you're honest about that

JANFAN4L said:

Years ago... before Clear Channel was the Omipresent radio station,,, before Fox News... before MTV was just the Real World channel... before Britney... Before Nipplegate... there was a woman from Detroit Michaigan...

She felt like doing a book... that was going to be called X... but Spike Lee beat her to it... the book changed it's name to Sex.... in this book was images of lesbian sex gay sex straight sex SMBD rape masturbation interracial affairs shrimping water sports.... Than she went to work on an album... they came out within a few days of each other... the book flew off the shelves... the media declared all out war on this woman... She had gone to far... talk show after talk show... news magazine speicals on TV every magazine in the country it seems had her or her book on the cover saying she was bringing American Society to the shitter... some stations banned her...MTV stopped playing her lead single... the media declared her carear over... and that she was never coming back. but Madonna survived and laughed her way to the bank
Erotica peaked at number 2 and has sold 5million copies worldwide
Sex sold out its first and only printing of 1million copies
Erotica number 3 on singles chart number one on dance chart
Deeper and Deeper number 7 on singles chart number one on dance chart
Bad Girl number 36 US number 10 Uk singles chart
Fever number one on dance chart
Rain number 14 US number 7 UK Chart
1 sold out tour and 1 of the biggest cable concert speicals.

and today American Life has sold 3million worldwide and did a 55/56 sold out shows with no air support from MTV America or Clear Channel Raido.

I love me some good Janet... Damita JO wouldn't fall under that category for me... that might be why it didn't do that well... just isn't up to par with her past matieral

GrayKing said:

Well everyone is entitled to his/her opinion. I still say that you care about Janet or you wouldn't even be involved in this thread.
[Edited 12/5/04 18:46pm]

ehuffnsd said:

WOOP! WOOP! -- The Madonna Brigade. You're right, DavidEye.

From "Sex" book to "Ray of Light" --> Six Years.

+

From "Nipplegate" to Janet now --> 11 months.

=

Inequitable correlation.

You are entitled to your opinion concerning Damita Jo. I don't agree, but I respect your opinion.

However, in regard to Madonna, her "sex" book wasn't released during today's political climate. I have a feeling that if she released something like that today, Madonna would also have suffered the backlash from the "moral majority." And it's quite possible that her career may have never recovered from it. I mean, just look at the elections. Regardless of superficiality and hypocrisy, people seem to be more concern about morality than ever. To me, this is a very scary time for all us Americans. The sad thing is that the majority of the general public just doesn't recognize or acknowledge the threat to their civil rights.

ehuffnsd said:

Isel said:

oh, definitely. it's the high standard i hold janet to that makes DamitaJo an even worse album. i thought when All For You came out "well, that's nice enough, even though it's got a very been-there, done-that feel to it. but maybe she just wanted to put out a fun light-weight record this time. a lot of people have been doing that lately. next time she'll be back with something a little more meaty, something a little more interesting, something a little more cutting edge."

imagine my disappointment. Janet albums generally stick with me in heavy rotation for a good 6 months if not a year or more after they're first released. AFY lasted a month. DJ lasted a week.


i'd say "better luck next time Janet", but i said that after All For You. so i'll just let her do her thing and check back in with her next time to see if she's got anything on her mind or on her record to interest me. in 2004, she had neither.

JANFAN4L said:

JanFan I AM NOT DavidEye

Thanks to the efforts of a few....




[Edited 12/5/04 18:49pm]

all threads lead to Madonna

ehuffnsd said:

I know you're not. Was alluding to his post in the "And The Headliner for Super Bowl 2005" thread.

GrayKing said:

And let me go and do my thing.
I'll beat ya hard on the track, if you Know what I mean.
Hollywood and New York, Madonna is the Queen.

JANFAN4L said:

oh ok... i didn't read that far in the thread... after seeing Paul McCartney i was through

VoicesCarry said:

Let's be fair, most of the major reviews of the album didn't give the album terrible reviews because of the Superbowl (although most referenced it); the reviews were mediocre because the album is mediocre. Damita Jo's main fault is that it just isn't up to the standards of Control, Rhythm Nation 1814, janet., or even The Velvet Rope. All For You was a worse album overall, but it had a huge hit single.

TVR's less than enthusiastic reception must've been partly responsible for the overtly 'safe' sounding AFY. However, the reception of DJ might just force Janet to really go all out and try something new the next time around. I thought the most promising sounds on the album came from the BAG production team; an album along the lines of'(All Nite) Don't Stop', 'Slo Love', and 'Put Your Hands On' might have been an interesting direction for the album.

Janet can (and most likely will) rebound from the slump that her career found itself in in 2004; but she needs to exert a little more quality control (no more 20+ track albums, please), needs to stop trying to compete with Britney Spears (the Blender interview from 2004 was amazingly immature for a 36 year old), and needs to remember what made her earlier albums special was not only good music, but also a good message. Control and RN 1814 were era defining music not just because of the music itself, but because she actually had something to say.

I've really tried to get into Damita Jo (the record) but I just can't. I like a few tracks. But as a whole the album bores me to death. I must say, I found All For You to be much more enjoyable

GrayKing said:

Well, this is just a misguided "splintering" of a Janet thread. I wouldn't say it's a straight shot towards Madonna, that's for sure.

Getting back to the point, Esther, formerly know as Madonna, the current Bush administration, and the increasingly powerful moral majority would have definitely had some irreconcilable difference concerning the publication of her sex book, that's for sure. But still,there is no comparison between Madonna's "controversy" and Janet's crisis. Janet has had to deal with a backlash that Madonna has never experienced, nude street-corner photos or not. Compared to Janet's Super Bowl debacle, Madonna's sex book was...well... forgettable.



-

Isel said:

For a woman who lives, breathes and seethes in controversy, the "Sex" book sure didn't go down in the history books (to anyone other than Madonna's rabid fanbase) -- it lived and died in '93. Nipplegate, however, was felt by EVERYONE. Regardless of who you were, you knew how you felt when you saw Janet's breast that night. It changed television forever, albeit inadvertently. Janet's "controversy" is WAYYY more memorable than that fly-by-night "Sex" book (that's why it was quickly forgotten and her career rolled on). It's going to take a while (I dare say, years) before the fallout ceases.

I didn't read the Blender interview,but I'm not sure if Janet is overtly trying to compete with Britney. I just think that Janet may have matured more slowly than some of these other young artists. At Britney's age, for example, Janet was covering up her body in military type costumes. and singing socially conscious songs. The funny thing is that unlike other artists, Janet seemed to have matured more quickly in some respects and not in others. Maybe now Janet wants to explore her sexual side because she was too shy and less confident before. Obviously, I'm just speculating, but Janet does seem to be a bit different from the Britney's and the Beyonce's because she was so sheltered in her youth. So I would like to give Janet the freedom to be who she is regardless of age. She can't please everyone;that's for sure. But without a doubt, there were some people who DID appreciate Damita Jo in spite of "nipplegate" and other criticisms. So maybe the cd wasn't an bullseye "hit," but it wasn't a complete "miss" either.

Axchi696 said:

let's keep in mind that there's a difference between the Sex book and Janet's titty at the Super Bowl.


one was a book covered 100% by the First Amendment, freedom of the press, etc.

the other was a television broadcast, something which the federal government can and does regulate, because it is the property of the people.

that's where the difference in the controversies lies and whatever reactions the government can and can't have to them.

Axchi696 said:

Actually, "All For You" had several really big singles (AGY, STCML, and DRM) while DJ SHOULD have had at least one huge single ("All Nite").

I aggree whole heartedly that a full on dance album would have been amazing since the dance songs tend to the be strongest. The R&B sex and love songs slow the album down a lot and "My Baby" is just safe filler. The album is one third amazing, one third average and one third really bad (the interludes are terrible). I aggree that while DJ is one of my favorite albums right now, so was AFY until I realized how homogenized it is. In a very weak year for new albums, it's one of my favorites for sure. All that being said, I agree that Janet needs to lick her wounds and go back to the drawing board.

AFY and DJ had a few things in common and one of them was the weakness of being very shallow. Janet doesn't seem to acknowledge that other people exisit. What happened to "Rythm Nation", "The Knowledge", "New Agenda", "What About"...the songs on DJ didn't feel personal even. I don't think most people could relate to the album or even think that it had a autobiographical feel to it...it's all about flaunting. I'm not saying Janet needs to go to India but she needs to take a look at the news. Bush was President while she made this album, 9/11 happened, her brother's drama....nothing inspiried her?

Axchi696 said:

DJ is mediocre to RN1814, Control and TVR. "janet." while lauded by many, isn't my go-to Janet album. I'd return to DJ before janet. But, when you're an artist of Janet's caliber everything you do is going to be scrutinized more heavily because you're EXPECTED to yield high quality material. When you're that high on the pop totem pole -- there's no room to flourish or have errors. People will be quick to shoot you down.

I vividly remember TVR receiving its fair share of hatred. A few critics embraced it, but many casual people were like "what the hell is this? This album is too depressing? Where's the big dance videos? Where's the colorful stuff? Etc." Janet, in response, gave the public All For You. She could've easily moved in the same direction of TVR and took it to another level, but the same people who hated on DJ for being "too predictable" criticized her introspectiveness on TVR.

Andres Bagge definitely made DJ a treat for me. The BAG production team's work on DJ made it memorable. I hope she can keep enlisting more top production talent like that for her next effort. Dallas & Kanye were both lackluster. Jam & Lewis can still stay aboard because they haven't ran out of steam. This next album for Jan has to be of top quality and everyone needs to put 100% into it to make it successful. No more flavor of the month producers. She can't afford another Damita Jo or AFY on the pop map.

Isel said:

I think Janet saw many things many of us have never seen or done before we hit 16 or 17. Didn't she go to her brother's bday party in Studio 54?

She was married before she was 20.

She has been exploring her sexuality since the janet. album that came out in 93 11 years ago. I agree with the afore mentioned comment about being burt with the Velvet Rope Album and going to safe terriotry for A4U and trying to repeat with DJ.

JANFAN4L said:

JanFan you all ready stated the differnece it is 12 years + since Sex and not even 12 months since the SuperBowl. Regulations were tightened because of the election, but they will return to normal. TV won't be changed forever. Look at Desperate Housewives and Monday Night Football... It was discovered the thousands of complaints came from 3 form letters that weren't sent out by maybe 200 people. in time Nipplegate will fade and be like the sex book... a forgotten pop memory to all but rapid fanbase.

I've always liked the fact that Janet's albums tend to give you more bang for your buck with a lot of tracks but it might be interestesting to do a "Damita Jo" survivor so we can see what the tracks that people really have problems with are. I really hope that Janet's next album isn't short. Hell, if she chose better tracks ("I'm Here" would work, "Just Love Me" is really good, and "Put Your Hands On" is amazing) it would have been a better album.

ehuffnsd said:

In Janet's case, I hope and pray that Nipplegate can receive a swift casket and she can continue on with her career without it marring two full decades of remarkable achievements.

JANFAN4L said:

It takes time... almost 6 years before Evita wiped away the stigma of Sex